Grace Lavery / Joseph Lavery & Daniel M. Lavery / Mallory Ortberg - "Straight with extra steps" couple trooning out to avoid "dwindling into mere heterosexuality"

[Allo Vera]

“Sweetest and mildest child to have ever sucked a tit”? As much as people try to desexualise the act of breastfeeding, you just know that Joe thinks this is very smutty and arch.

 

[mrae]

The article is stunning in that no one - not the Lavery's or their good pal writer - sees how bad it makes them look. Mal looks like a pathetic cuck, Lily a legit lunatic, and Joe is, well, Joe. Lily's for sure not paying a 1/3 of the rent, right? That's the only way Mal should even tolerate an argument about recycling.

I believe that everything--her weight loss, the sexual energy towards a super morbidly obese troon, forgetting a Diva Cup in her vagina, her delusions of the Diva Cup migrating to her uterus--can all be explained by a manic episode.

I'm so curious about how she ended it with Gretchen, though it was probably a mutual ghosting. Whatever it was, they're both clearly embarrassed enough by the whole episode to never mention it again.

 

[dedspeaker]

The article is stunning in that no one - not the Lavery's or their good pal writer - sees how bad it makes them look. Mal looks like a pathetic cuck, Lily a legit lunatic, and Joe is, well, Joe. Lily's for sure not paying a 1/3 of the rent, right? That's the only way Mal should even tolerate an argument about recycling.

I think the throuple is blinded by the fact that a legit writer profiled them in The Cut to see that Choire thinks they're sex nerd theater kids who aren't funny enough to get invited to NY media parties.

 

[Larry David's Opera Cape]

"The Pedophile's Complaint: Hoax News in the Neoliberal Decade."

I admit I'm no urban sophisticate but what's going on with all the pedo references in his latest er, oeuvre?

 

[Trianon]

What WAS that bit about her sleeping with a t shirt tied over her head or something to that effect? It sounded like something a lunatic would do. I guess they were trying to make her sound like some kind of fussbudget dandy, a Poirot type character with the mustache wax and white gloves. It's the lowest low budget knockoff of that, at the very best.

Apparently it's some sensory-deprivation tard strategy.

There's a huge r/blogsnark post (archive) about the article, notable because the Laverys were banned from being discussed on the subreddit after the Ortberg scandal due to frequent transphobia. In reality, most of the sub just hates them because of their insufferable dramabaiting.

Features some testimonials about how Mallory was always a dick.


The comments section also got Yoko-pilled. The original comment was deleted, but it referenced the Yoko essay.


Detransition is too dangerous for kiddos.


Joe seeks songwriter.

 

[Bookwork]

I admit I'm no urban sophisticate but what's going on with all the pedo references in his latest er, oeuvre?

His maternal instincts must be flowing.

 

[Prescription Bugs]

“Sweetest and mildest child to have ever sucked a tit”? As much as people try to desexualise the act of breastfeeding, you just know that Joe thinks this is very smutty and arch.

This turned my stomach. This is how you know Joe isn’t a real woman. I mean besides the penis. Also you think either Joe or Mallory will notice how labor intensive and sweet it is to nurse a newborn, and think oh wait maybe this is why women get upset when transwomen play the “I’m the best woman” game or attempt to degender mothering?

Now they get to see from the front row. Will they get it or continue to see this poor child as another one of their puppies or props?

Also I cringe at some of my old photos where I put babies in stupid props when they are small. You don’t get how really sacred babyhood is until later and then it hits you they probably didn’t want full size shades jammed on their face. They don’t enjoy wearing a full mini suit before one. They aren’t little props to balance in windowsills or schlep around everywhere. You realize you weren’t wearing them correctly and didn’t use the car seat right.

But the thing is most normal moms are in communities with other normal moms who will gently (or not so gently if they are short of sleep or grace) correct you and model how to do it. They will share diagrams and research about spinal compression and hip dysplasia and keeping airways open.

I worry these nutties are too far out of the loop of normal that no one will be around to tell them how to do it and doctors don’t know a lot of this stuff actually. Many doctors do not do all the primary care for their kids and they don’t teach a lot of this stuff in med school. This how to do it information is in the realm of lactation consultants, nannies, moms, grandmas and grandpas, sisters, sometimes nurses or midwives. Social media has taken over some of this education but you have to obviously be in those groups and have lots of contacts. If your contacts are all uterus less natural born women, trans women, and academic weirdos, you won’t be in the caregiving info algorithm.

 

[behindyourightnow]

I knew a woman who glommed on to a polyamorous married couple and was their "third" while the wife went through pregnancy and childbirth. Nice for the husband to not have to worry his sex supply would be disrupted, I suppose.

A year or so later, after she'd well and truly maternally imprinted on the baby, the couple kicked her out of the relationship and she never saw the baby again, even after being the person who'd been there for more of the baby's milestones than the kid's actual parents. It was devastating. She never got involved again with polyamorous people, but what a hellish way to learn that lesson.

Oddly enough, I once knew a "throuple" that went through almost the exact same thing (although thankfully the kid was older when the extra woman was brought in, so it probably wasn't as emotionally devastating). She lived with them and they all played house for a few years, and then they suddenly decided she was an extra unwanted roommate and asked her to leave. The extra woman was a FtM, and the bio mom was a they/them, but the behavior pattern was exactly the same.

And this is exactly why people need to push back against douchebags like the guy in the article comments who was saying: "What does it matter what genitals every person in this group has? Why do you care?"

It matters because speaking truthfully allows people to recognize patterns (such us the pattern which reveals that "throuples" like this are inevitably one male and two females and not vice versa, and that it's inevitably the female with no biological link to the baby who gets kicked out). If people are not allowed to recognize those patterns, they cannot use the warning signals that might otherwise keep them away from situations where they are going to be exploited and abused.

Which, of course, is exactly why people like Joe want truth-telling to remain taboo.

 

[Diana Moon Glampers]

Most mom group "information" is bullshit, though. If I see another hilariously stupid post about car seat safety ever again, it'll be too soon. Just so that you're gentler with yourself @Prescription Bugs : there's no evidence for anything about car seats other than "being in a car seat is safer than not being in one." Period.

There's no evidence rear-facing car seats are safer and the study indicating they were was retracted because they did their calculations wrong. There's no evidence for any of the other standard mom group myths, either ("never wear a puffy coat in a car seat!" "the belt clip not being at chest height will make your baby's organs explode in an accident!"). It's all just Princess and the Pea type shit where the most sensitive mommy wins. They do this with everything.

Unlike the baby at the Gerber-Klein household on another thread, I doubt this baby will be neglected. I think he will be overparented and the last thing these people need is to find new neuroses based in safetyism.

 

[Marvin]

Yesterday, Joe was to present his rescheduled Johns Hopkins U summer fellows talk for the Women, Gender, and Sexuality program, "The Pedophile's Complaint: Hoax News in the Neoliberal Decade." https://krieger.jhu.edu/wgs/event/grace-lavery/ Perhaps he Zoomed it? Or perhaps "NEW DATE" means re-rescheduled.
View attachment 5898180
No sign of an audio or text version being available. I have dutifully inquired of the program's spox as to where I may seek this fine example of erudition.

He said the baby was on a trip to Baltimore, so that checks out. Don't think he Zoomed in.

Goddamn.

I was thinking about checking it out, but decided against as I was kinda busy with work that day. I remembered it later, and then thought "well, I probably didn't miss anything, surely he wouldn't have abandoned his newborn son so soon to go sperg about tranny shit in Baltimore".

Silly me.

 

[MirnaMinkoff]

This turned my stomach. This is how you know Joe isn’t a real woman. I mean besides the penis. Also you think either Joe or Mallory will notice how labor intensive and sweet it is to nurse a newborn, and think oh wait maybe this is why women get upset when transwomen play the “I’m the best woman” game or attempt to degender mothering?

I don’t have the stomach to read Joe’s tweets but is Not-the-mom Lilly actually nursing her son? Or did she just give it a go the first 24 hours? I do not foresee her nursing that child. Nursing is a lot of work and means she will have to be the one getting up three times a night with the baby. I remember feeling bitter many a nights at 3 am while my husband blissfully slept, but there was no reason on earth for him to get up for a baby who only wanted to nurse.

I had the icky thought she might breastfeed just to give Joe, and other creeps, cheap thrills by finding places to breastfeed in publicly around NYC…or breastfeeding Joe. Gag.

Lilly will quickly tire of how the baby, and its needs, tie her to it and the home, instead of Joe, the first few months. Joe might go start sleeping in Mallory’s bed to get some sleep and leave Lilly to deal with the crying infant all night. Joe will not want to bring baby along on any travels, he will travel to escape Lilly and baby.

I think Lilly really thought this baby would bind her to Joe, but it will in fact drive him away faster. I’ve never understood the “band aid baby” or women believing a baby will solidify a shaky relationship. I guess the premise is the father is presumed to be a moral, responsible, good man who will do everything to support his wife and child, but that’s usually never the case in these situations.

We know Joe is selfish and amoral. Every case of “band aid baby” I’ve ever seen play out IRL (or in my mom’s group online) has always ended in the father leaving when the child was anywhere between 3 months and two years old. No exceptions.

It’s usually inexperienced younger women who have delusions about baby trapping or solidifying a relationship by having a baby. Older women should know better, even one who was a card carrying lesbian into her late 30’s.

 

[Bookwork]

breastfeeding Joe

Oh yes. If not by now then soon. Selfies. Probably Mal doing the cam work.

 

[Diana Moon Glampers]

I think we already saw that Joe had one of those rigs they use to pretend to breastfeed babies with donor milk. I'm sure the fetish quotient is very high in their household. I think Joe will love having a newborn, because they're just not very difficult to take care of if you can split up the sleep schedules and have a lot of work flexibility. It'll be when the kid is a toddler or around potty training...that's when he'll figure out how much a kid really crimps your style.

A lot of hipsters love taking their newborn everywhere. Newborns are surprisingly quiet and sweet, and generally only cry if something is wrong (yes, there are exceptions, I've had one and it was a different ballgame). Since most people in this socioeconomic sliver don't have a lot of experience with babies and their friends have had one at most, they usually think their baby is the calmest sweetest baby to ever live.

The toddler years hit these ones hard. Newborns can go to brunch. They can fall asleep in the carrier while you listen to a concert in the park. They sit politely in the stroller and smile beatifically at passers-by when you take them to the store. They don't need to be entertained in order to stay happy and calm. As long as you've only got one little baby and they're not a particularly difficult one, you can maintain some semblance of your pre-parent daytime lifestyle for some time.

But that doesn't last forever, and the timeline aligns very closely with when Joe already gets tired of women.

 

[Friend of Dorothy Parker]

But the thing is most normal moms are in communities with other normal moms who will gently (or not so gently if they are short of sleep or grace) correct you and model how to do it. They will share diagrams and research about spinal compression and hip dysplasia and keeping airways open.

Do it information is in the realm of lactation consultants, nannies, moms, grandmas and grandpas, sisters, sometimes nurses or midwives. Social media and other now have taken over some of this education but you have to obviously be in those groups and have lots of contacts.

OT - Many women manage to figure out how to mother and nurse and not kill their kid just fine, even without some divine feminine community fluttering and bustling around them. Is it nice to have helpful hands and kind wisdom handed down through ages? Sure, but not everyone needs or wants or has that.

On other thoughts/ comments -
I don't agree with the handwringing about taking a baby out of the house. If a baby is healthy, they can go a lot of places if there are people willing to take good care of it. Yes, "take good care of it" is the key, and it sometimes means not hauling it to exhaustion, but in general babies do OK if they're tended to.

As for "the Laverys" -

Spoiler: Side note

(love that the natal man's name remains the primary for both his marriage and for the family. Guess you can up-end "cis-heteronormativity," and try every single way to shout "look how many extra steps we took!", but apparently nothing compares 2 U the patriarchy when it comes down to things of permanence, record, and concept of the organization, and literal orientation arranged around the male center (except for the pregnant/post-birth featuring of Lily as the Madonna in her special woman time of proving the fecundity of her male head). Sure, they hyphenated poor Rochester's last name, but that's at best a convenient inconvenience, as it allowed them to saddle the child with layers of absurdity, the better to point out their edgy unusualness (lol, yes, so unusual to cheat on your wife and make her live with the consequences; it's just literal in this case)....ugh, God, these people always make me go on tangents).

As for "the Laverys" -

Hard to say whether they'll be technically poor as parents, at least for an infant. There's the benefit of 3 people, so when Joe inevitably becomes burdened by and hysterical about having to focus on something other than his own asshole, he can get back to it and there are still two people to remember the kid. (He'll be sure to be too busy/ occupied/ existential-crisis-ing/ battling on X/ showing off his wattle/ shopping for wife #3 to participate by the time the kid is walking, though, except for performative efforts.)

I suspect the issue with their parenting will be the fact of one child vs 3 giant egos.

And being one child with 3 very changeable adult people - willing to change gender (or unwilling to concede having one in particular), change identity (same), change orientation (same), drastically change residences/locations (same), jeopardize (or lose) jobs, and who make a point to court controversy wherever possible.

And being one child in a house/ arrangement that already has tension of a dozen types - sexual, role-based, hierarchical, competitive for status both in the house and in the world, etc. [can't wait until Joe & lily join a mommy & me group and a) exclude Mallory, and b) alienate the other Carroll Gardens mommies] The likelihood of the arrangement lasting seamlessly to Roquefort's adulthood is...questionable, and whether there is a final split or not, there will always be tensions to be navigated, which is a lot for a kid. The home/ family is chaos personified, no matter how blissful it feels or they portray it right now.

 

[Bookwork]

I have been thwarted. JHU Graduate Liaisons write: "Unfortunately the event has passed, and was in person only! April 10th was the new date."

Exclusionary anti-intellectual elitism! But Joe will recycle the content if he hasn't already. His staggering penis is too lazy not to.

 

[AMHOLIO]

We know Joe is selfish and amoral. Every case of “band aid baby” I’ve ever seen play out IRL (or in my mom’s group online) has always ended in the father leaving when the child was anywhere between 3 months and two years old. No exceptions.

It’s usually inexperienced younger women who have delusions about baby trapping or solidifying a relationship by having a baby.

The only justification I can think of is "You may have his heart, but I have his DNA," and "I will always own ONE piece of you." Which even then, the first one will leave the woman bitter after years of trying to get the man coming back to her. The second matters little to a pump and dump type tard. Women need to stop getting pregnant and start cutting off men's fingers or limbs if they want to hold part of him hostage.

The likelihood of the arrangement lasting seamlessly to Roquefort's adulthood is...questionable, and whether there is a final split or not, there will always be tensions to be navigated, which is a lot for a kid. The home/ family is chaos personified, no matter how blissful it feels or they portray it right now

What do you think Rocko will grow up to be like? Will he be extra nervous as well as overly pretentious? Will he be withdrawn or demanding attention from any and everyone like his parents?

 

[behindyourightnow]

Apparently it's some sensory-deprivation tard strategy.

There's a huge r/blogsnark post (archive) about the article, notable because the Laverys were banned from being discussed on the subreddit after the Ortberg scandal due to frequent transphobia. In reality, most of the sub just hates them because of their insufferable dramabaiting.

Man, the twee faux-friendly Redditor language in that comment section is insufferable:



It's particularly grating since you can tell that at least 1/3 of the commenters follow this thread. Enjoy sucking off the tranny jannies, you fucking cowards.

LMAO:

One thing the Redditors do get right is a few comments pointing out that they'd be better off living in the PNW. I don't know how I never thought of this before, but Portland would be perfect for them. Cheaper, less of a commute to Berkeley, and they'd fit right in with the locals. Shame that Joe as an Englishman is so fixated on NYC.

 

[Zemblan Physics]

”Sneaking ‘perhaps she’s not for me to get’ into my emotional lexicon, thank you for that”.

The fuck? I wish death upon that person.

 

[MirnaMinkoff]

The only justification I can think of is "You may have his heart, but I have his DNA," and "I will always own ONE piece of you." Which even then, the first one will leave the woman bitter after years of trying to get the man coming back to her. The second matters little to a pump and dump type tard. Women need to stop getting pregnant and start cutting off men's fingers or limbs if they want to hold part of him hostage.

This might hold true for a certain type of man. The type of men who actually have some deep concerns and feelings for his offspring and be committed to raising them, but that man is not Joe.

However, plenty of men are perfectly fine waltzing away from their child forever, and without hesitation, esp if they’ve decided they don’t like the mother anymore. Joe is definitely that type of man.

Joe is the type of guy that will happily skip away when he tires of playing house with Rocco and/or Lilly. He will be resentful of any form of parenthood foisted upon him after the novelty has worn off. I definitely get the vibe that Joe will fuck off for ten years and then start taking an interest in Rocco once he’s nearing adolescence and Joe is more lonely and decrepit. Once Rocco is old enough to be semi-independent and susceptible to narc manipulation Joe will take an interest. He will be very keen once Rocco has teen friends he can hang out and creep out.

On the upside for Lilly, she will at least be able to get his Berkeley paycheck docked for CSP.

One thing the Redditors do get right is a few comments pointing out that they'd be better off living in the PNW. I don't know how I never thought of this before, but Portland would be perfect for them. Cheaper, less of a commute to Berkeley, and they'd fit right in with the locals. Shame that Joe as an Englishman is so fixated on NYC.

Almost any place would be better than NYC to raise a small child. I predict Joe will stick to his “need” to be in NYC as a way to explain why he doesn’t go with Lilly and Rocco when they move. A small child in a cramped apart is miserable and makes everyone else miserable.

I’ve known many people who live or are from NYC. This includes families that had lived in Brooklyn or Manhattan continuously over generations since 1905. In the modern era (2004-2024) even the natives, with family blocks away, left the city after they had children. (Ironically several children moved back after college for work.) Some of these families had much better, bigger homes/apartments than the throuple. NYC currently is ideal for young professionals, high earning adults, single adults trying to climb a career ladder and rich empty nesters. It’s a terrible place for non-millionaire couples with kid(s) and the elderly. Non-POC New Yorkers with kids that want to stay in NYC, end up in Queens or Staten Island, but LI or Jersey is better bang for the buck.

But those are the ones that stay in the metro area due to work and family, none of which apply to Joe and Lilly, in fact the exact opposite. Joe and Lilly have jobs in California and Michigan. It’s absolutely retarded for them to pay the exorbitant cost of living and commuting from NYC. It’s common for people to work in NYC and commute to cheaper places to live, but these retards work in cheaper areas and commute to live in NYC.

 

[Friend of Dorothy Parker]

What do you think Rocko will grow up to be like? Will he be extra nervous as well as overly pretentious? Will he be withdrawn or demanding attention from any and everyone like his parents?

He'll scrape a living as a club-level boxer/ fight clubber, in between stints as a disco king.