Megathread SRS and GRS surgeons and associated horrors - the medical community of experimental surgeons, the secret community of home butchers

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I was looking for new history podcast to listen to the other day and got really excited when I found one about the Middle Ages, only to find an episode called "Medieval Trans Saints and Sex Workers" when I was doing my perfuntory scan for exactly that kind of shit. *sigh*

This is probably Marina the Monk. She was not, in fact, transgender. It's more or less equivalent of claiming that Mrs. Doubtfire was a trans icon. Marina's story focuses pretty strongly on aspects of motherhood so It's pretty disingenuous to claim any sort of trans link, that doesn't stop troons from trying!
 
I was looking for new history podcast to listen to the other day and got really excited when I found one about the Middle Ages, only to find an episode called "Medieval Trans Saints and Sex Workers" when I was doing my perfuntory scan for exactly that kind of shit. *sigh*
The worst podcast I ever heard for that shit was a really popular one about piracy. In every single episode, the cuck narrator would mention how pirates must have been gay because they didn't have women aboard ship. He also did a lot of grovelling about pronouns etc.
 
The worst podcast I ever heard for that shit was a really popular one about piracy. In every single episode, the cuck narrator would mention how pirates must have been gay because they didn't have women aboard ship. He also did a lot of grovelling about pronouns etc.
I’m not gonna doubt that pirate ships probably had a lot of homosexual/bisexual men on them. Being out at sea away from general society with a bunch of guys would be the ultimate fantasy for a gay man coming from a mainland society with harsh punishments for being a homosexual. What bothers me though is people think that people “turn” gay because they’re constantly in an enclosed space with their own sex. This kind of thinking is a combination of excessive porn consumption and thinking that human sexuality can be bent on a whim.
 
I’m not gonna doubt that pirate ships probably had a lot of homosexual/bisexual men on them. Being out at sea away from general society with a bunch of guys would be the ultimate fantasy for a gay man coming from a mainland society with harsh punishments for being a homosexual. What bothers me though is people think that people “turn” gay because they’re constantly in an enclosed space with their own sex. This kind of thinking is a combination of excessive porn consumption and thinking that human sexuality can be bent on a whim.
The modern construction of the gay identity does not match what people in other time periods would have understood though. Same-sex sexual contact with both women and men is recorded many time in historical records, but it doesn't mean that they would have understood themselves as exclusively lesbians, gay men or even bisexual. Hell, it's pretty common across history to see same-sex sexual activity in sex segregated or single sex spaces, like most ship crews were for a large chunk of history, the "prison gay" effect is real. That specific phenomenon does not make them rainbow glitter fags. Nor does it mean that removed from that particular environment they would continue to have those contacts.

At its core, the problem is even framing these historical relationships and constructions as gay or trans. That act is a political meta context for the modern day. Theoretically, the point of bringing this stuff up is to correct historical distortion that censors these elements for political reasons, but it's become its own extremely political practice of "queering" narratives of history as a leftie hot take generating machine for digital content. Why does a podcast about pirates need to mention that they were gay every time? Because the author is making a point in the modern day that has nothing to do with any historical narrative about pirates. These things were gay, therefore they are cool, therefore I am cool for talking about them.

No framing or narrative of histories entirely without bias, but these superficial queer readings are really bad for actually informing on how same-sex sexual contact and relationships were understood in societies prior to our own.
 
I’m not gonna doubt that pirate ships probably had a lot of homosexual/bisexual men on them.
Sure, just like I won’t doubt prison rapists were fags all long.

If man wants to get off on something, he will. By his own choice.
If you left one of those pirates stranded on board with nothing but gaping fish, I can assure you he’ll be singing Unda Da Sea in no time.
 
Sure, I believe that 16th century trans surgeries happened.
Just like I believe that Joan of Arc was a nonbinary two spirit, George Eliot was expressing her true masculine identity.....and all the other revisionist bullshit that the troons spout off at every opportunity to rationalize their delusions.
I really want to hear them explain how a person whose medical knowledge is founded on "imbalanced humors" and has little to zero knowledge of things like the circulatory and urinary systen can perform majorly invasive surgery without anaesthesia or blood transfusions on an extremely delicate area, one thats extremely prone to infections and have it heal without antibiotics.
 
Totally normal, at least in the US. Even abdominoplasty (tummy tuck) is often a day surgery. The plastic surgeon just stitches the wound up (with a couple of drains placed at each hip, slaps some hyper fix over the cut for strength and sends you home with a tiny opioid script and a page or two of instructions.
In America for a lot of surgeries they sent you home immediately while in other countries they keep you at least one day, and I think that's fucked up.

For example, I was watching some septum deviation surgery vlogs. Really easy surgery, takes like 30 mins, easy recovery, and still in my country they give you Xanax before the surgery and keep you in the hospital one day + until you pee. I've watched several american vlogs and they all went home the same day, they even let one of them drive themselves home. That's fucking insane.
 
Sure, just like I won’t doubt prison rapists were fags all long.

That's been my take on prison fags. Two fags likely got caught fucking once, quick lie about "showing who's boss" or whatever bullshit they use as an excuse now and it's snowballed in to this.

Refraining from fucking another guy isn't hard to do, unless you're a degenerate fag.
 
In America for a lot of surgeries they sent you home immediately while in other countries they keep you at least one day, and I think that's fucked up.

For example, I was watching some septum deviation surgery vlogs. Really easy surgery, takes like 30 mins, easy recovery, and still in my country they give you Xanax before the surgery and keep you in the hospital one day + until you pee. I've watched several american vlogs and they all went home the same day, they even let one of them drive themselves home. That's fucking insane.
A lot of the time you want to be out the same day if you can. Depending on whats happening, Hospitals ain't cheap here, another night you don't need can mean money you can't afford.
Even if you got a good plan its more shit eating your out of pocket. Its why folk who maybe ain't that well off will try to avoid Hospitals all together.
 
In my country you have to stay in overnight after minor surgery. Really they want to make sure you can pee. I had minor surgery last year and my bladder didn't wake back up until 2am after getting anesthetic at 1pm the previous day so that's an over night stay.

Anyhoo.

7 weeks post OP ditch:

Screenshot 2024-04-28 at 13.05.47.png

How many weeks my labia minora will subside, it's 7 weeks post op thanks for your help, and what can i do to subside it faster


I have no idea what he is talking about.

Screenshot 2024-04-28 at 13.10.52.png

Ohhhhh. LOL
 
I really want to hear them explain how a person whose medical knowledge is founded on "imbalanced humors" and has little to zero knowledge of things like the circulatory and urinary systen can perform majorly invasive surgery without anaesthesia or blood transfusions on an extremely delicate area, one thats extremely prone to infections and have it heal without antibiotics.
These are the same sort of people who used to shrewishly tell us about how "all those witches who were burnt were really just midwives!"
 
A lot of the time you want to be out the same day if you can. Depending on whats happening, Hospitals ain't cheap here, another night you don't need can mean money you can't afford.
Even if you got a good plan its more shit eating your out of pocket. Its why folk who maybe ain't that well off will try to avoid Hospitals all together.
Ironically the americans in the vlogs did not seem poor, they seemed upper class. So I think it was just standard procedure to send them home, not that they discharged themselves voluntarily. Someone who had surgery in america please enlighten me, do doctors really not give a fuck in general there?

I do think if you go under general anesthesia, no matter how small the surgery, you should stay overnight. Most of the time nothing bad happens but when it does it's an emergency, like a cardiac arrest, thrombosis, your stitches coming apart, random blindness, etc and you'll want to skip the ambulance ride + triage when that happens.
 
I do think if you go under general anesthesia, no matter how small the surgery, you should stay overnight.
Nah, here in Australia certain procedures permit healthy patients to go home same day even if they've had GA.

It depends on the health of the patient, the type of procedure, whether or not they have someone at home who can monitor them etc
 
Ironically the americans in the vlogs did not seem poor, they seemed upper class. So I think it was just standard procedure to send them home, not that they discharged themselves voluntarily. Someone who had surgery in america please enlighten me, do doctors really not give a fuck in general there?

I do think if you go under general anesthesia, no matter how small the surgery, you should stay overnight. Most of the time nothing bad happens but when it does it's an emergency, like a cardiac arrest, thrombosis, your stitches coming apart, random blindness, etc and you'll want to skip the ambulance ride + triage when that happens.
I've never had major surgery, and I can't say if theres any one common practice, but when I had surgery to put a plate in my jaw when I broke it I went in the morning, they did the surgery mid afternoon and then they kept me in overnight until the next morning and then told me I could go around mid day.
I suppose it depends where you are and what you're in for.
 
Someone who had surgery in america please enlighten me, do doctors really not give a fuck in general there?
It really depends. People who don't live in America can forget how big it is, and there's even going to be variation between different hospitals in the same area. In general, more invasive procedures will at least require a stay overnight. I was put under general anesthesia for a laparoscopic procedure in the morning. After I woke up and regained most of my senses and peed, I was sent home the same day late afternoon (someone was there to drive me though). Got a kick out of my small incisions being glued shut instead of stitched at the time.
 
Absolutely agree with @Mellow Malevolent here, historical instances of people attracted to/having sexual contact with people of the same sex are certainly interesting to look at and it doesn't really register to your average person that the whole LGBT thing is a very recent construction. One of the really important things to understand when it comes to these identity labels is that the whole thing (lesbian, gay, transgender, bisexual, queer) is an anachronism, one that's very difficult to resolve in historical writing. Some authors have taken to using the word "queer" and "queering", a term that I despise because it's just as anachronistic as anything else and yet they pretend that it isn't. Some authors use the labels in a qualified sense, stressing to the reader that these things do not mean what they mean today, it's simply for the sake of readability that they use these terms. A good author will stress that, so that when you read the rest of their article, or book, or whatever, you are constantly bearing in mind the discourse surrounding the terms used.

Another thing I came across was that it's incredibly difficult to prove that two people had sex. You can tell that a woman has had sex when she's had children, but a man? No such indications on the skeleton unlike there is on a woman. Of course we can make the assumption that plenty of men have had sex throughout history for obvious reasons. This makes the difficulty of identifying sexual activity between two members of the same sex even more cumbersome. Reddit likes to meme on the whole "historians say they were friends" thing, but really, they don't understand what historians mean by that. Take the example of the Ladies of LLangollen, two women who lived together, shared a bed and one of them was consistently reported to on occasion wear more masculine outfits. If they had sex in that bed, historians simply cannot prove it for definite. As far as I know, the two of them never wrote anything about themselves, no diaries and they were reclusive, just wanting to be left alone. But historically illiterate "queer" historians of today (or trans bias bullshit artists like Erin Reed) might try and posit this as, ackshually, being a heterosexual relationship, because one of the women in the relationship was actually a man.

Not that it needs to be said, but I call just as much bullshit on the "gender surgeries in the 16th century" as everyone else here.
 
I've never had major surgery, and I can't say if theres any one common practice, but when I had surgery to put a plate in my jaw when I broke it I went in the morning, they did the surgery mid afternoon and then they kept me in overnight until the next morning and then told me I could go around mid day.
I suppose it depends where you are and what you're in for.
UK will try to kick you out asap. Day surgery is common for low risk procedures, and you’ll get sent home as soon as you’re conscious, coherent, and can stand. I’ve only had one op, laparoscopic cholecystectomy, and was glued up and sent home before dinner time with a strip of codeine lol. Back on my feet and doing chores within a week. They don’t always send you away with antibiotics either.

Even with child birth they want you to leave- having epidural is exception & you’re in overnight to make sure your legs work and you can poop. Painkillers? You get told to buy paracetamol.

I find it fascinating that we have worked out how to perform surgeries without killing the patient. Organ removal? No problem. Amputation? No problem. Reattaching a severed limb? Keep it fresh and no problem. Create a penis or vagina on the opposite gender? Lol let’s use the patient to practise and see what happens.

I honestly can’t wait for the future documentaries- I imagine the titles to be like “A butchers paradise: the reality of GAC” “Beneath the sheets” “A hole to hell” “My penis fell off”

Not that it needs to be said, but I call just as much bullshit on the "gender surgeries in the 16th century" as everyone else here
Me too. They must be using eunuchs as their example. But they were known to be overly religious and using castration to free themselves of male urges, or to show themselves as different from other people. I’m pretty sure the majority of the trans community hates being associated with eunuchs too so it’s even weirder they’d want to use them as proof.

I also thought that it was taboo to force modern ideas into history?
 
I also thought that it was taboo to force modern ideas into history?
Generally speaking, it is. But you can find all sorts of instances of hypocrisy slipping through the net, even amongst academic historians. My example before, about the term "queer", is my personal bugbear when it comes to that. That being said, I haven't run into any occasions of eunuchs being classified as queer, if you do have an example I would absolutely love to read it so I can laugh at it.

There's a very commonly used phrase you can find in historical articles and books in the English speaking world: "The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there." It's somewhat debated and has been played around with to make various different points, but it's not a bad starting point for anyone who wants to start examining history in a more critical fashion. In essence, it's all about bearing in mind that, on a fundamental level, you cannot understand what it was like a hundred years ago, much less a thousand. Hell, you can barely understand what it was like a decade ago, not as if you were living in the moment. You might have been alive and sentient, but it's entirely possible you'd be transplanting your own thoughts and feelings of today on what you were doing that long ago, putting meaning where there wasn't, or spinning an entirely different series of events.

Same thing when you have the "queers" (e.g. mentally ill men in dresses or otherwise entirely heterosexual women who want to feel special) looking back in time and confirming their own biases. This predominant figure was trans, this one was gay, this one was super duper queer. They don't care about anything beyond that, no historical nuance or theory and if you tell them they're wrong or misguided, you're some flavour of -phobe.

Even when, say, a woman says "I wish I was a man" in a genuine record of hers, it simply doesn't have the same connotations it does now, something that I could've told you when I was <12 years old with a limited understanding of history.

Forgive the length of this post, but I decided to take a peek at the paper linked earlier after I'd written this and didn't want to double post and I find the 16th century argument so incredibly laughable. This is the extent of their proof in this regard, it's barely an argument. They're talking about historical fucking crossdressers, not even eunuchs, which has nothing to do with gender affirmation surgery. If you can't even tell if two people in history had sex, you certainly can't diagnose them with what we understand today as gender dysphoria. It's generally considered taboo to try and suggest what mental illnesses a historical figure might have had, yet here crossdressing is being used to provide legitimacy for butchering people's genitals in the modern day, from eras where methods of dress were much more strictly gendered.
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They're talking about historical fucking crossdressers
So cross dressing equals surgery. Got it. Better get the surgeons and doctors in on this to review and update their prescriptions 8)!

i was considering going down a rabbit hole researching “queer eunuchs” but i feel like this would cause a migraine… even a basic google threw up differing opinions on whether they were pure or sexual deviants or gay exiles. Eunuch has so many definitions according to what culture they are from; to say all eunuchs were trans would be wrong. To say any were trans would also be wrong as we simply do not know what they truly thought. I dislike how “queer” has become the term to describe variations in both sexuality and gender identity; and I really hate the transifying of historical, and fictional, figures. It’s like arguing foot binding was not a symbol of beauty but actually these girls and women did it to prove they were different to real women. I don’t doubt at all it has been brought up in bullshit arguments to support troonism.

I feel like very early castration was a ritual itself used to test one’s worth, not a symbol of “I hate my male body lol”. To endure such a thing, and survive! A real challenge of one’s body and spirit! You live and aren’t crippled, you must truly be blessed by god!
 
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