KR North Korean troops will become 'cannon fodder' if they aid Russia in Ukraine, Pentagon says - 영광스러운 지도자를 위해 죽으라.

Sinéad Baker Article
Jun 26, 2024, 6:24 AM CDT
North Korean troops that are sent to Ukraine to aid in Russia's war would become "cannon fodder," the Pentagon said.

Pentagon Press Secretary Maj. Gen. Pat Ryder said on Tuesday that "I think that if I were North Korean military personnel management, I would be questioning my choices on sending my forces to be cannon fodder in an illegal war against Ukraine."

Ryder was responding to a question about North Korea potentially dispatching army engineering units to Ukraine's eastern Donetsk region, which is occupied by Russia.
According to South Korea's TV Chosun, citing a South Korean government official and referenced by Reuters, North Korea is planning to send construction and engineering forces to occupied Ukraine as soon as next month for rebuilding work.

Earlier this month, Russia and North Korea signed a pact agreeing to give each other military assistance if the other is attacked.

Countries including the US and Japan condemned the move, with South Korea saying it was considering sending weapons to Ukraine as a result. South Korea's president described the pact as a threat to his nation's security.

Ryder described North Korea potentially sending military forces to Russia as "certainly something to keep an eye on," and hinted at the high number of Russian casualties throughout the war.

The UK Ministry of Defence said at the end of May that the total number of killed or wounded Russian soldiers since February 2022 was around 500,000.

It also said that the average daily number of Russian personnel casualties in May was over 1,200.

Russia is known for treating its own troops as highly disposable.

This includes through using "meat wave" tactics, where it sends waves of poorly trained and unsupported soldiers toward Ukrainian positions to try to overwhelm them.

A Russian soldier who plans offensives said this month that he has to send men forward knowing they will likely die, but doesn't tell them how low their chances of survival are.

"I can't tell the men, otherwise they wouldn't fight with the hope of winning," he said.

 

[TETRABAX]

Falklands and Northern Ireland were both not economical. Northern Ireland was a net drain for decades - it was ideological.

Economical warfare is not always about profiting. A lot of the time is about spending money to make your enemy spend money

The whole reason we armed and trained a bunch of brown people in the middle east was so that the Russians would have to spend resources to fight them... Then we fell into our own trap because reasons

 

[Doctor Love]

The whole reason we armed and trained a bunch of brown people in the middle east was so that the Russians would have to spend resources to fight them... Then we feel into our own trap because reasons

Not the Russians...

The British and the French. Infact, the first time the USA actually did anything was to help brown people in the Middle East fight Europeans as a proxy.

 

[Ghost of Biden]

Kind-of, but nobody is looking at "war crimes" by American soldiers. Nobody is concerned they'll misbehave. The concern is that they won't show up.

It's not illicit money, it's in the fine print - the entire plan during the Cold War was to nuke the Germans. The Germans would have been correct, morally, to surrender immediately to the USSR. They would have lost millions if they didn't.

Nobody would mind, if the role of the USA was to sit back and keep your mouths shut. If you didn't instigate shit, nobody would mind and NATO would work. But it isn't like that - the country which profits the most is the one which starts the fights in the first place. The USA is under the impression that if a war between the EU and Russia starts, both of them will bleed and the USA will come out on top.

It's more likely that the EU will side with Russia at the first opportunity to do so. Russia is telegraphing this, and have stopped even referring to Europe by name. They now say "Ukraine and the USA, and the USA's satellites" - they are pointing guns directly at the USA, because even they can see what's going on.


Also, I know my medical state isn't great, and that you only noticed it because you happened to understand how serious HE is - it's kind of you, but there's no reason I can't argue over dumb shit on the internet, though. Feel free to go back to the usual way, don't treat it any differently than you would anyone else.

War crimes don’t show up because there is nobody there to see them, what we heard from Iraq was personal account of a guilty conscious. Unless if you embed a reporter into a local village you’re not hearing squat.

The plan for Germany was to ally with them against the Russians. There was never a real intention to nuke them even if we did have the manhattan project. It’s easier to tell the public that we’re going to annihilate the Nazis instead of incorporate them into our global sphere of influence. There were much more former German nazis that were breaking away from Hitler in the end stages than there were those willing to burn for the Vaterland.

Both sides instigated each other for territorial domain, the Cold War never ended it merely heated up.

The major proportion of Europe seeks to cripple Russia and China rather than join them, the issue is that balkanization leads to global security issues as a weakened Russian government cannot control their Muslim extremists which is what we’re seeing now on the southern border of Russia.

In reality if Russia just stopped right now we’d be chill. The status quo has been a comfortable barrier between Western Europe and Russia that is East Europe, which in includes the entirety of Ukrainian territorial integrity aka pre invasion borders. We honestly don’t even give a shit about Crimea personally. This entire war has been Russia further isolating itself from NATO countries and European economics than it has been anything else.

My personal guess is Putin might’ve went insane and is reliving his vendetta against the Nazi invasion during WW2, a time Putin grew up in and experienced first hand. Putin’s personal isolation from everyone else in his government by sitting across the metaphorical big table has accelerated any dementia that would’ve already been latent. A proportion of dementia patients also tend to relive their childhood experiences and environments as they’re not able to store and process new cognition or in a better term relativistic processing of living in the now.

 

[Ghost of Biden]

Not the Russians...

The British and the French. Infact, the first time the USA actually did anything was to help brown people in the Middle East fight Europeans as a proxy.

I believe he’s referring to operation cyclone.

 

[National Defense Advocate]

North Korea wave attacks almost won the Korean War. It was enough for United nation and United states forces to back off invading the north.

Extremely low IQ take, Norks were pretty much knocked out of the war in like 1952, it was mostly the US against China.

 

[Doctor Love]

The plan for Germany was to ally with them against the Russians. There was never a real intention to nuke them even if we did have the manhattan project. It’s easier to tell the public that we’re going to annihilate the Nazis instead of incorporate them into our global sphere of influence. There were much more former German nazis that were breaking away from Hitler in the end stages than there were those willing to burn for the Vaterland.

No - the plan, in case of the Russians breaking through the wall during the Cold War, was to nuke the fuck out of Germany to kill the Soviets while they were there.

This wasn't "1940" - this was the plan until the 90s. Germany has not forgotten this.

The major proportion of Europe seeks to cripple Russia and China rather than join them, the issue is that balkanization leads to global security issues as a weakened Russian government cannot control their Muslim extremists which is what we’re seeing now on the southern border of Russia.

The major portion of Europe wants stability and prosperity - we see Russia as a "troubled cousin" with bad blood, but not an existential enemy.

In reality if Russia just stopped right now we’d be chill. The status quo has been a comfortable barrier between Western Europe and Russia that is East Europe, which in includes the entirety of Ukrainian territorial integrity aka pre invasion borders. We honestly don’t even give a shit about Crimea personally. This entire war has been Russia further isolating itself from NATO countries and European economics than it has been anything else.

The status quo was broken by Ukraine - not Russia. The Ukrainians pushed an offensive into Donbass, after a stagnation in the conflict. The reason why the West blocked Russia Today was because, during their invasion, they had a solemn show of all of the shellings that had occurred during that offensive.

The Ukrainians had built up a force of 125,000 at the border with the Luhansk Oblast - Russia was responding to that, on the other side of the region.

My personal guess is Putin might’ve went insane and is reliving his vendetta against the Nazi invasion during WW2, a time Putin grew up in and experienced first hand. Putin’s personal isolation from everyone else in his government by sitting across the metaphorical big table has accelerated any dementia that would’ve already been latent. A proportion of dementia patients also tend to relive their childhood experiences and environments as they’re not able to store and process new cognition or in a better term relativistic processing of living in the now.

How old do you think Putin is, exactly?

Putin's exaggerating the political motive, but Ukraine has been radicalising for ten years, now. They were noticeably Nazifying, even in 2014 - essentially, the current government looks fondly at the collaborationist government. Ukraine was ~25% Russian, and has been for a very long time. It was a sinister creep, which was also being pushed in the Baltics. It didn't work as well, there.

 

[A Cardboard Box]

Even in the wildly unlikely event that this is actually true, it doesn't actually change anything. The point is that they are slavishly supporting an "ally" that committed the world's largest act of industrial terrorism against them. To an actual sovereign nation, the Nordstream bombing would be at least cause for severing relations, and could be reasonably regarded as an act of war. The fact that Germany hasn't declared neutrality or flipped to Russia's side in light of the crimes committed against it demonstrates that its not a true sovereign state, just a satrap that doesn't have a choice in the matter.

Retarded and wrong. Your opinions are stupid.

 

[JosephStalin]

Extremely low IQ take, Norks were pretty much knocked out of the war in like 1952, it was mostly the US against China.

We were already at the Yalu in several places in autumn 1950. Only thing that saved NK was the Chinese intervention.

We bombed P'yongyang so hard during the war that the NKs built a landing strip downtown.

The thing that's most appalling - we could have forestalled the war. All we needed to do was tell my namesake to stay out of Korea, we're dropping paratroops near the Yalu. But some supposedly bright young officers at the Pentagon actually believed Stalin would have pulled out of the north after the Japanese surrender.

Going further, we should have backed Ho Chi Minh in 1945 and told the French to stay the fuck home. Would have gotten a united nationalist Vietnam out of that without multiple wars and so much death and destruction.

Another thought - ANY troops NK would send to the Ukraine would need to be fed properly for some time beforehand and likely need either new equipment of their own or new Russian equipment. Living standards for the average NK soldier are very poor.

 

[Ghost of Biden]

@Doctor Love
We can agree to disagree but I don’t think there was ever a realistic expectation that Germany would ever be nuked in the case where Russia somehow pushed through Berlin after the wall was constructed. At best it’s a bluff at worst totally fictitious. I’m going to ask you to supply operation plans that can disprove this.

We agree on the same point, everyone wants a cooled environment with Russia. If they stopped right now dialogue could open up with the Kremlin. They either stop and keep some shred of dignity or this just gets worse for their national security they’ve been enjoying since the collapse.

I don’t want to hear cherry picked tit for tat events that’s lame and gay. The overall history is all this bullshit started secretly in 2014 because Ukraine prospected major oil reserves in the western region and offshore Crimea. It’s been a silent glownigger op to undermine western corporate influence in Ukraine and to secure an experto to undermine the petrodollar in the Levant and Strait of Hormuz. America doesn’t declare total invasive war on foreign nationalist/extremist groups anymore because we learned that’s a stupid idea. Russia has taken our bad example and is driving themselves into a wall. The “Nazification” is a naturally human response of nationalist and separatist modus when you’ve been threatened with little green men in your country for a decade.

Putin is 71, he was still alive during the reconstruction of Leningrad. I’ve seen plenty of 60-70 range dementia patients, it’s rare but it does occur in high distress and isolated individuals. I’m not going to argue Russian population because you and me know those numbers are worked through political migration.

 

[Doctor Love]

Putin is 71, he was still alive during the reconstruction of Leningrad. I’ve seen plenty of 60-70 range dementia patients, it’s rare but it does occur in high distress and isolated individuals. I’m not going to argue Russian population because you and me know those numbers are worked through political migration.

Recently, yes, but the population in Ukraine was split between Russian/Pro Russian and vehemently pro-Ukrainian. This wasn't an organic thing, Ukraine was being set up for failure over time. Other Russian diasporas were visibly concerned about it - people who had siblings in Ukraine were noticing a huge amount of racial abuse towards them, starting in 2013.

Russians aren't dumb, there's over a hundred million of them, and they could see it happening.

source: HS girlfriend was Baltic Russian. They were outright saying at the time - it was transparent, and most normal people rejected it. Imagine if a billboard went up saying "GAS THE KIKES, RACE WAR NOW" - most people would be a bit suspicious, and the average Ukrainian was rather suspicious since they had grown up with a lot of Russians around.

 

[SIMIΔN]

It's more likely that the EU will side with Russia at the first opportunity to do so. Russia is telegraphing this, and have stopped even referring to Europe by name. They now say "Ukraine and the USA, and the USA's satellites" - they are pointing guns directly at the USA, because even they can see what's going on.

Poland would probably side with the USA if the USA sided with Russia. They've got long grudges against Moscow.

No - the plan, in case of the Russians breaking through the wall during the Cold War, was to nuke the fuck out of Germany to kill the Soviets while they were there.

Are you aware of the difference between tactical nukes and city destroying nukes?
NATO intended to use nukes to block the invasion route and attack troop concentrations.
The bombarding of nuclear power plants by "Ukrainian" forces is far more atrocious, it has little military purpose but the potential to make real east Ukranians suffer.

people who had siblings in Ukraine were noticing a huge amount of racial abuse towards them, starting in 2013.

This! Never forgot European proles are equally vulnerable as Rwandan Hutus to hate propaganda when the right levers are pressed.

 

[The best and greatest]

Going further, we should have backed Ho Chi Minh in 1945 and told the French to stay the fuck home. Would have gotten a united nationalist Vietnam out of that without multiple wars and so much death and destruction.

We went to war in Veitnam to stop the spread of communism. While we didn't succeed, the hardened Veit kong flushed with left behind US equipment managed to do what we couldn't a short time after we left, ending the Khmer Ruge and effectively stopping the spread of communism in Indochina before eventually more or less liberalizing all on their own.

All's well that ends well if you ignore all the dead and maimed people and misshapen babies
Anyway its easy to say this in hindsight, but backing Ho Chi Minh would have meant creating serious rifts in the NATO alliance. Consider that our involvement in French Indochina came on the heels of the Suez Crisis

The French really don't get held accountable enough for creating this shit show to begin with with their post-war colonial policy

 

[Doctor Love]

Are you aware of the difference between tactical nukes and city destroying nukes?
NATO intended to use nukes to block the invasion route and attack troop concentrations.
The bombarding of nuclear power plants by "Ukrainian" forces is far more atrocious, it has little military purpose but the potential to make real east Ukranians suffer.

It's still setting off numerous nuclear devices in a densely-packed European country.

This is hundreds of thousands dead, millions displaced minimum.

Nuclear power plants are a bit more of a meme. They're not as bad, since they can actually be plugged up. There is a conscious effort to make nuclear weapons seem clean. They are not clean, not even remotely. Neither fission nor fusion - they're powerful enough that they destabilise the atoms of nearby molecules - once that reaction goes off, you end up with fallout.

Not only that, but particulate carcinogens from fire - the flash-pyrolisation of thousands of square kilometers of houses, trees, animals and foliage produces the sort of cyanides and shit which will never fucking decay.

Seriously - once that flash goes off, it starts chains of worse chemical reactions than you could dream of. The atmosphere is normally stable - O2 and N2 are pretty stable like that (O2 doesn't just split off into Ozone without good reason) - but for as far as the eye can see, billions of tonnes of air, water and earth get lifted up and combined into a toxic dreck. Cyanide, hydrazine, phosgene - shit which you will not usually come into contact with unless you really fucked with the wrong guy.

There's no "good side" to nuclear weapons.

We went to war in Veitnam to stop the spread of communism. While we didn't succeed, the hardened Veit kong flushed with left behind US equipment managed to do what we couldn't a short time after we left, ending the Khmer Ruge and effectively stopping the spread of communism in Indochina before eventually more or less liberalizing all on their own.

A Cambodian once told me exactly what I've been saying in this thread. Americans don't know how to fight. The Vietnamese were willing to start shooting, up-close-and-personal, en masse. Surprisingly, it works to keep war crimes surprisingly low - soldiers can't hide their actions from eachother (apparently)

 

[The best and greatest]

A Cambodian once told me exactly what I've been saying in this thread. Americans don't know how to fight. The Vietnamese were willing to start shooting, up-close-and-personal, en masse. Surprisingly, it works to keep war crimes surprisingly low - soldiers can't hide their actions from eachother (apparently)

The style of fighting you describe was only possible in an environment that permits the massing of men to attack, one where your enemy can't call Broken Arrow for example. We fight fine.

 

[Snekposter]

Because they were aided by chinese "volounteers". Before the chinks stepped in, the UN forces had pushed the norks almost to the chinese border.

Even after that things really didn't improve much. We got pushed back beyond Seoul because of the unexpected attack, but we pulled back mostly in good order. The Chinese were hoping to wage an asymmetrical war of fast moving light infantry, but they outran their supply lines and winter hit, and then the USA turned it into a set-piece war of drawn lines.

So you wind up with stuff like a forwards observation post that was surrounded on three sides holding off an entire division. Operations Killer and Ripper were one of the most successful military offensives ever. The Chinese commonly took 10:1 losses due to a lack of supplies, heavy artillery, and air cover.

The war started because Stalin finally gave in to Kim il-Sung pestering him. Both Rhee and Sung had been fighting along the border well before June 1950 as both wanted to start a war they both thought would end with the other guy losing and the peninsula being reunified. What you characterize as protesting was an armed communist rebellion with financial and material support from the north that both sides wanted to have happen. Sung because he believed it weakened Rhee's military forces and Rhee because it gave him an excuse to purge commies wholesale. *Some* Koreans in the south opposed the election that Rhee won because they wanted the election to be for the entire peninsula, which Sung rejected. Rhee was fine with it only happening in the south because he was sure to win then

The amazingly retarded shit you poltards believe

He's not a poltard. He's even worse: a pikey.

I don't disagree here, I only objected to the idea that the resistance the US met is comparable to the resistance it saw in Afghanistan decades later (Goat herders with AKs) where the technology and material gap is much more pronounced. The North Vietnamese were very well equipped for their time and managed to contest the US in the air for pretty much the whole war.

The Soviets were sending them their top-tier shit. Whenever we managed to counter the SA-2 Guideline they'd ship the NVA upgraded models right from the factory. Vietnam was also the combat debut of a lot of relatively new equipment like Malyutka and the PT-76. The MiG-21 was also the USSR's frontline interceptor at the time. "Rice farmers with AK's" the NVA was not.

No - the plan, in case of the Russians breaking through the wall during the Cold War, was to nuke the fuck out of Germany to kill the Soviets while they were there.

Yeah, because it was either that or risk getting encircled. Fun fact: one of the West German defense ministers wanted Davy Crocketts to be handed out like candy in lieu of conventional artillery. But I guess its okay for the West Germans to nuke the shit out of things and not the USA?

Gotta love the Germans being stereotypical penny-pinchers.

The style of fighting you describe was only possible in an environment that permits the massing of men to attack, one where your enemy can't call Broken Arrow for example. We fight fine.

The USA actually does fight fine up close In fact, its a fucking terrible place to engage Americans. I inherited a book about some of the US Mountain Troops in Italy, including my own grandfather, and it focuses specifically on his regiment's combat actions. The minute the USA got close enough to start chucking hand grenades into German positions Germans just started surrendering en masse. Shit, its almost like the M1 Garand was explicitly designed to be used up close to just mag dump rounds right into the enemy's face. Hell, one of the combat actions it describes is a sergeant dashing 300 yards across open terrain to leap over the wall the Germans are using for cover to engage them directly in close combat all by himself. Turns out a Thompson works a hell of a lot better in CQC than a Kar 98k. Hilariously, despite it being 1945 the German PoW's are still shit talking the victorious Americans, claiming that they don't know how to fight and think war is just some sporting event. Naturally, the machine gunners are also pissed that we're sneaking around their firing angles to flank them instead of just running into their firing lines to get cut down.

 

[The best and greatest]

Even in the wildly unlikely event that this is actually true, it doesn't actually change anything. The point is that they are slavishly supporting an "ally" that committed the world's largest act of industrial terrorism against them. To an actual sovereign nation, the Nordstream bombing would be at least cause for severing relations, and could be reasonably regarded as an act of war. The fact that Germany hasn't declared neutrality or flipped to Russia's side in light of the crimes committed against it demonstrates that its not a true sovereign state, just a satrap that doesn't have a choice in the matter.

Or maybe they just dont care enough to make an issue of it given the present circumstances. Sort of like how the British scuttling the French fleet is sort of just a footnote now. Though frankly that was probably even more outrageous

Whatever, plausible deniability fuck-fuck games are hardly something Russia itself is unfamiliar with so let them prove it and ill just sit here smugly since its not so much a pot calling a kettle black as it is two black pots feebly arguing over which is blackest.

So you wind up with stuff like a forwards observation post that was surrounded on three sides holding off an entire division. Operations Killer and Ripper were one of the most successful military offensives ever. The Chinese commonly took 10:1 losses due to a lack of supplies, heavy artillery, and air cover.

A fun little excerpt from wikipedia:
When the codename chosen by Ridgway for the coming operation was discovered by officials in Washington, it drew protest from the Army Chief of Staff, General Collins, who told Ridgway that the word "killer" was difficult to deal with in public relations. Ridgway nevertheless kept the name, which he said fully described his main objective

Imagine if we still had people like this guy making decisions.

 

[Snekposter]

A fun little excerpt from wikipedia:
When the codename chosen by Ridgway for the coming operation was discovered by officials in Washington, it drew protest from the Army Chief of Staff, General Collins, who told Ridgway that the word "killer" was difficult to deal with in public relations. Ridgway nevertheless kept the name, which he said fully described his main objective

Imagine if we still had people like this guy making decisions.

If you think that's a gnarly, brutal name wait until you read up on Operation Starvation.

 

[Doctor Love]

Yeah, because it was either that or risk getting encircled. Fun fact: one of the West German defense ministers wanted Davy Crocketts to be handed out like candy in lieu of conventional artillery. But I guess its okay for the West Germans to nuke the shit out of things and not the USA?

No! The West German government was full of people who explicitly hated Germany and were okay with losing the war!

There's no such thing as an occupied government which has its people's best interests in mind!

The only good thing about the post-war Germans is that they've largely ditched the Sectarian/real-racist roots. They can beat as many Turks as they like, but they can't keep going after the Poles.

 

[Burning Bridge]

Falklands and Northern Ireland were both not economical. Northern Ireland was a net drain for decades - it was ideological.

France was purely nationalistic, in a literal sense - over a million white French lived in Algeria. It wasn't a "colony" - it was part of France, proper. Algeria's borders were where France's borders used to be.

BAHAHA. Fucking Eternal Anglo. "See, when Europeans colonize, IT'S A GOOD THING, unlike when those filthy, savage, obese, retarded Americans do it with their genocides and sacrificing of their allies."

 

[Doctor Love]

Fucking Eternal Anglo.

Which side of the Northern Ireland conflict do you think I'm on, exactly?