🥝 Community Kiwi Space Station 13 Server (2024 edition) - Space Station 13

[geckogoy]

Yes, and that's the issue here - they need something else to do that's NOT relying on others

Request for single-player cargo denied, however:

You're thinking of "reverse" contracts for Cargo that require you ship crates to the crew instead of shipping them to CentCom?

Is that what you were thinking? If yes then sounds great

"Reverse contracts" are acceptable to me. I may do the engineering thing soon, we will see, its going to be fairly complicated but I want to give engineering stuff to do anyway and in particular establish a system for doing that.

One problem that exists right now that could benefit from community input is: how to deliver goods to a department? I put some thought into it in the past and these are the current ideas:

• Someone comes and baps the crates or an invoice to 'accept delivery'. I kindof like the invoice idea because then a cargo guy can show up with a clipboard and you 'accept' the delivery from that which seems amusing to me. The problem is its harder for the deliverery person (imagine a future where departments order things from eachother, not just the current idea) and especially for reverse contracts the department didn't ask for it may be hard to get someone to come take delivery.
• Another option is to just 'accept delivery' when the goods make it into a particular area or areas of the station. This is a lot less secure but it would be almost impossible to be stuck unable to deliver.
• Could also use the MULE delivery stuff but that has the problem that it can only do one crate at a time and if the department leaves it full there is no way to finish even another single crate contract until they come clear it out on their own.
• I guess could also come up with some custom delivery thing like an airlock or something where you shove the goods in then it closes and calls it 'delivered' and opens up to the department, but it seems weird and awkward to use, would be way more complicated to cood and as such take way longer to show up, and may be unnecessary.

It doesn't matter which way it goes as long as people can live with it so as such I would like to hear feedback. Also if anyone has other ideas although I'm not sure what those would be.

edit: to be honest really warming up to that invoice clipboard idea now that ive typed them all out together so I guess get your feedback in while you can

 

[xXEddie.DurellXx]

does cargo not get out going orders for the station to full fill like from setcom or anything

 

[HahaYes]

I guess could also come up with some custom delivery thing like an airlock or something where you shove the goods in then it closes and calls it 'delivered' and opens up to the department, but it seems weird and awkward to use, would be way more complicated to cood and as such take way longer to show up, and may be unnecessary.

/vg/ do have something kind of similar, I played a round a few months ago in cargonia and there's a system you could set up with telepads and Rapid Crate Senders across the departments which could work for Riviera if you're keen on the concept. You'd setup said telepads wherever you felt like in each department then use the RCS on a crate once it's ready to go in order to teleport it over to the department. The telepads and RCS could be both built by R&D or ordered through supply requests, it was pretty nifty

 

[xXEddie.DurellXx]

more experiments but found an existing crab in the textures so i just stretched its texture over this and use the in game coloring to change its colors. I just need a second opinion on this because i think it looks strange but interesting.

 

[geckogoy]

more experiments but found an existing crab in the textures so i just stretched its texture over this and use the in game coloring to change its colors. I just need a second opinion on this because i think it looks strange but interesting.
View attachment 6431355View attachment 6431356View attachment 6431357View attachment 6431358

First of all hot pink crabs are forbidden, second of all that actually looks a lot better maybe change color and soften the outline a bit?

 

[xXEddie.DurellXx]

i picked a dark purple and that is the color it gave me so it might just be the coloring system not allowing dark colors

 

[geckogoy]

i picked a dark purple and that is the color it gave me so it might just be the coloring system not allowing dark colors

Must be the mixing algorithm, base sprite is still red I take it? I honestly think probably any colors available should just be pre-colored, that way you can have a uniquely colored midsection and so on, not be stuck with shades of only one color.

 

[xXEddie.DurellXx]

the base is a black/gray color the mid section is tan

 

[MAAAD]

One problem that exists right now that could benefit from community input is: how to deliver goods to a department?

What's the problem here exactly? You can already:

• drag them yourself and hand a crate to the person directly;
• ride a cargo tug train and drop the crate off in front of the guy;
• put the crate on a MULEbot and yell at a person to accept the delivery over radio once it arrives;
• use disposals to mail the crate into the person's department (I'm not sure if we have this system implemented);

Unless we don't have a mailing system (could be ported from /vg/, I'm not so sure about porting Rapid Crate Sender like HahaYes suggested though), there're already enough ways to deliver crates IMHO.

• Another option is to just 'accept delivery' when the goods make it into a particular area or areas of the station. This is a lot less secure but it would be almost impossible to be stuck unable to deliver.
• Could also use the MULE delivery stuff but that has the problem that it can only do one crate at a time and if the department leaves it full there is no way to finish even another single crate contract until they come clear it out on their own.
• I guess could also come up with some custom delivery thing like an airlock or something where you shove the goods in then it closes and calls it 'delivered' and opens up to the department, but it seems weird and awkward to use, would be way more complicated to cood and as such take way longer to show up, and may be unnecessary.

All of this seems unneccessary when you have this -

Someone comes and baps the crates or an invoice to 'accept delivery'. I kindof like the invoice idea because then a cargo guy can show up with a clipboard and you 'accept' the delivery from that which seems amusing to me. The problem is its harder for the deliverery person (imagine a future where departments order things from eachother, not just the current idea) and especially for reverse contracts the department didn't ask for it may be hard to get someone to come take delivery.

Just make the receiver scan the crate with a crate scanner (this is already implemented) or stamp it with the head of department's stamp. Invoice idea could work if the invoice was simply stuck to the crate and the delivery is deemed fulfilled if you tear it off of a crate.

 

["Controlled Demolition"]

I don't get the objection to single-player cargo when, currently, most rounds are essentially single-player for cargo already. You're not the one who decides whether it's single-player or not, it's the amount of players online. You're just punishing players for wanting to play a role by giving them nothing they can do by themselves. I'd understand if we could get 20+ crew (not just players) on consistently, and if that crew had good incentive to actively use cargo (say they also act as the actual financial department of the station, and wages go through them/some automatic server they maintain), but we don't. Every department, every job should have a purpose even without other people around, otherwise there's no reason to join it in the first place, completing the negative feedback loop of no-one playing a job. With cargo it's even worse, as no-one playing cargo means people don't expect cargo to be manned, therefore not ordering anything; and people not ordering anything leads to people not playing cargo. Cargo needs something to do without other people.
There's also the idea of low-pop allowances. A station with fewer than 20 crew could get more access on each job, could get a stimulus from NanoTrasen to get them going, etc. which is what some other servers do already. It's not about balance – you should never, ever think in the terms of balance for these kinds of party games – it's about getting the ball rolling. If a player can have fun by himself, he's more likely to stick around despite no-one else being on, therefore adding to the player count, therefore making others more likely to stick around due to player count, and so on and so on. Speaking of, it would be nice to have some kind of updating banner for the server with player/round stats.

Also, dragging 4+ bodies from the Intrepid medical shuttle to medbay to be properly treated is a pain and can only be done with cheese like bodybags.

use disposals to mail the crate into the person's department (I'm not sure if we have this system implemented);

I can confirm it works. It's a fairly ancient system, every codebase should have it. I do like the idea of a semi-automated delivery acceptance system that only awards you goodboy points when someone picks up the crate, however, I've never experienced cargo not delivering shit properly. There's either cargo and they deliver well to everyone 99% of the time, or there isn't a cargo, and right now, it's solidly the latter.

There's also the matter of selecting for longer-term rounds versus short and spiffy rounds, but that's a whole different discussion. Thus far, most rounds have been too short to actually experience all the intended mechanics (and I prefer them fairly short), so the focus should be simplifying and streamlining processes, not making shit more complicated (because no-one will use it if it takes too long).

 

[MAAAD]

I couldn't have said it better myself @"Controlled Demolition", although it appears that with the introduction of new reverse contracts Cargo will have shit to do every time there're people playing any other department so the issue should be resolved when they get implemented (because if there's nobody playing any other department, that means you're probably one of the 1-3 people online so you might as well go do some mining).

 

[KonradCruise]

If you are cargo and nobody is ordering anything then your role is to order stuff yourself and enjoy time as the most self reliant department other than engineering on the station.
No chef? become Bargonia and grill.
No sec? Arm yourself.
No power? Build your own engine in all that cargo space you are not using and then cut the lines to the rest of the station, making you Texas on your own independent grid.

Thumbnails related, its what cargonians should get up to when left unattended

 

[Figger Nucker]

No power? Build your own engine in all that cargo space you are not using and then cut the lines to the rest of the station, making you Texas on your own independent grid.

"What do you mean don't set up a singularity engine in Cargo? This is tyranny!"
Proceed to order guns and legally secede from the station.

 

[MAAAD]

If you are cargo and nobody is ordering anything then your role is to order stuff yourself and enjoy time as the most self reliant department other than engineering on the station.

Exactly, but on Riviera Cargo starts with $0 and only has enough crates in their storage for $350 more, so it needs to somehow make more money first before ordering goodies for themselves and that's exactly what we're debating here.

 

["Controlled Demolition"]

... so you might as well go do some mining).

Unfortunately, QM doesn't have mining access. In other words, cargo may as well go break in everywhere. (not that it's much of a problem, 3 people is "everyone gets all access" territory regardless)

If you are cargo and nobody is ordering anything then your role is to order stuff yourself and enjoy time as the most self reliant department other than engineering on the station.
No chef? become Bargonia and grill.
No sec? Arm yourself.
No power? Build your own engine in all that cargo space you are not using and then cut the lines to the rest of the station, making you Texas on your own independent grid.
View attachment 6432512 View attachment 6432525
Thumbnails related, its what cargonians should get up to when left unattended

All examples from (shit) stations that allow cargo to act on its own, and have starter money. On Riviera, starter money is $0, there are no periodical wages or automatic contracts (yet), you get $50 per empty crate with no other real options for income (other than siphoning your own very limited account), and (I believe) you need $450 just for an Electrician's crate. Not to harp on the fact too much, but they may as well be a pure roleplay role with how little agency they get.

 

[xXEddie.DurellXx]

darkened the core crab texture same color of purple to what think

 

[geckogoy]

Updates

• detective fixed
  • evidence computer now works
  • fingerprint cards improved a bit, also turns out you can get cards by hitting mobs with the forensic scanner
  • gets .38 revolver again instead of 1911, and real bullets
• whoever 'pastelwoodchipper' is fixed beepsky pathfinding (navbeacon indentation was messed up apparently)
• broker-o-mat is now sheet based instead of stack based, so for instance you can order 15 sheets of uranium as robotics or whatever instead of having to buy a full stack edit: this is by @MAAAD

 

[HahaYes]

Idk exactly when this happened, but it looks like we got dehubbed. Rip

 

[xXEddie.DurellXx]

what fucking faggots any ways here is more crabs

 

[MAAAD]

Idk exactly when this happened, but it looks like we got dehubbed. Rip
View attachment 6438836View attachment 6438838
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You can't get dehubbed because not even Lummox himself has access to BYOND SS13 hub, or else all of the 18+ ERP furfag servers would've been nuked long time ago (18+ content is forbidden on BYOND as per its ToS). Also old /vm/station had a hub entry that looked like picrel and never got dehubbed. It most likely an issue in the codebase or something, gecko should investigate what's wrong.