Culture Why We Shouldn’t Say ‘Men Are Trash’ — A Radical Feminist Perspective - No, it’s not because it’s “not all men”. 20 year old has this gender shit all figured out yo.

L/A
“The personal is political,” Carol Hanisch wrote, in challenge to nuclear family values. This phrase has later broadened its applications to being used on topics regarding abortion, domestic abuse, spousal rape, and women’s sexual liberation.

“Revolution does not begin in the streets. Revolution begins in the head, and in the heart,” Laurie Penny wrote in Sexual Revolution, effectively encapsulating why the phrase “Men are trash” has been so successful. Women, all around the world, are becoming more conscious of the political nature of their personal experiences.

Women begin to frame their body-image issues as a byproduct of patriarchal and capitalist socialization of the commodification of the self for male-consumption. She learns to embrace her desires without feeling like she is “disgusting” or “overtly sexual”. She realizes that she does not owe men her body and emotional energy in exchange for security and protection.

“Men are trash” functions as exactly that: not an attack on all men, but as a tool for mental liberation. A woman decides that she would no longer be the person men label her as, because by devaluing the judgment of the audience, the performer decides the quality of their own performance.

But despite feminist awareness, men still contribute to our self-conception

As Hegel writes in the Phenomenology of Spirit, “Self-consciousness exists in itself and for itself, in that, and by the fact that it exists for another self-consciousness; that is to say, it is only by being acknowledged or ‘recognized’.” In other words, self-conception does not exist in a vacuum.

But the result of this is that people have a disproportionate amount of power over our self-worth. This leads people to want to objectify others — to negate their selfhood so that they would have no power to dictate others.

In The Politics of Recognition, Charles Taylor argues that recognition is a necessary condition for positive self-esteem. “Within these perspectives, misrecognition shows not just a lack of due respect. It can inflict a grievous wound, saddling its victims with a crippling self-hatred. Due recognition is not just a courtesy we owe people. It is a vital human need,” he asserts.

The idea of other people viewing us differently from the way we view ourselves is so jarring exactly because self-esteem is contingent on social recognition. The need for recognition is not a vanity play, but a prerequisite of being able to function normally in society.

The patriarchy is hell — but so is the craving for social acceptance

Sartre’s famous saying, “Hell is other people!” was popularized by his play, No Exit. In his play, three characters go to hell. To their surprise, hell is just an empty room. There are no Catherine wheels, brazen bulls, or torture racks. But in fact, hell is other people. The three characters — Joseph, Inez, and Estelle — all need validation from one another and deny another person’s validation.

Inez sees Joseph as a coward for betraying the political resistance group he was a part of before he died, but begs for Estelle’s attention due to her affections towards her. Estelle thinks Inez is overbearing but begs for Joseph’s love. Joseph begs for Inez’s validation that he is not a coward, while mistreating Estelle and using her for sex.

The point Sartre is trying to illustrate is that we derive our self-conception via the lens of others. In the play, Inez constantly tries to look at herself from Estelle’s eyes — literally. Estelle thinks that Inez is admiring her beautiful eyes, but in reality she is fixated by her distorted reflection on her pupils.

Do you see me the way I view myself? Is a question everyone secretly asks during the rawest, intimate moments.

As much as we try to deny it — and I certainly have, having spent my preteen years worshiping Germaine Greer’s The Female Eunuch and Valerie Solanas’ SCUM Manifesto (SCUM standing for ‘Society for Cutting Up Men’) — there exists a “pick me girl” within every heterosexual woman. Some women just recognize and isolate this instinct, while others are not yet aware of how social constructions contribute to their desires.

Nonetheless, desires are still desires. And the only way to get rid of a desire is to indulge in it. Just like how Joseph begs for Inez’s validation while disregarding Estelle’s — because he has already discredited her under the assumption that she is just promiscuous — we also beg for validation, which could not be fulfilled because we have already discredited the person we desired it from.

Are we using #NotAllMen politically or personally?

“Though we adore men individually, we agree that as a group they are rather stupid,” Mrs. Banks for Mary Poppins astutely noted. It baffles me how I, myself, can hate men so much yet crave for their affection. Right before writing this essay, I was just reading romance novels written by women, for women.

The popularity of romance novels is a testament to how reality falls short of expectations. It’s a craving for something real, amidst a “real” world inundated with woman-hating pornography, perfunctory romantic gestures, reluctant submission, painful diets, and fake orgasms.

I don’t know whether the fact that fictional characters can have more depth than the men who tried to romance me says more about the author’s capabilities or the bleak state of the love economy dictated by swipe-rights and heavily edited thirst traps.

Indeed, as a group, men are trash. But there is a thin line between the personal and political, and more often than not they blur into one another, and we can’t tell which is which. Or maybe they are both fundamentally inseparable concepts, regardless of the application. Or perhaps they are one and the same, with the latter constituting personal grudges and desires applied to the science of organizing society as a whole.

But as a person who has internalized “men are trash” for as long as I can remember, it is genuinely difficult to remember that there are good men out there, no matter how statistically improbable they are.

After enough responses against “not all men” Tweets, it does take genuine effort to recall that there is a distinction between, “Not all men; I feel offended at #MenAreTrash and therefore I will not listen to your legitimate concerns about how the patriarchy affects your lives,” and “Not all men; this one is a good one.”

The semicolon makes a difference.

Men are not trash — the concept of masculinity is

Another reason why we shouldn’t use #MenAreTrash, is that it is a cop out. Too often, I hear men excuse their bad behavior as something biologically determined. “Men are by nature sexual creatures,” he says, “so it makes sense that it is the woman’s responsibility to regulate the way she dresses.”

Arguments of this nature appeal to biological determinism. The idea is that men are biologically determined to be of a certain sort, and therefore it removes all accountability to improve their behavior. Sociobiology also states that societal norms are a result of biological factors instead of arbitrary social constructs — but how true is this?

I find it amusing how misogynists readily self-flagellate, essentially agreeing with the idea that men are animals with a propensity towards dominance, violence, and sexual perversion. In such contexts, they will wholeheartedly agree that men are trash. According to them, biology dictates that they cannot change their fundamentally rotten nature.

It was such a commonly touted argument that I believed it for a long time. I was convinced that I would abstain from marriage because the conclusion of this argument would be that all men are secretly horrible; some just hide it better than others.

It’s also the easiest thing to believe, just to fall into hopeless nihilism: Nothing can ever change and all we could do is learn how to accept the way things are. Accepting this belief, I would no longer have to exert effort trying to change the way my male peers think, which was indeed an exhausting and tedious effort.

But as Laurie Penny wrote in Sexual Revolution, “When men do shitty things to women, they don’t do it because that’s the way men are, but because that’s the way men feel, and men have been permitted very few ways to manage their emotions that are non-violent.”

She adds, “If the behaviors commonly understood as masculine were really so natural, they would not have to be enforced with violence.” In other words, men would not have to grow up being told to ‘man up’, to have to ‘get’ girls, or to ‘stop being a sissy’.

Modern masculinity is a wreck. It assumes that violence and dominance are imperative in male sexuality, and therefore must be a substantial part of male identity. It teaches young boys that to get girls they need to be the type of man that can bully a girl into submission — so that she will open her legs for his ‘access’, as if sexuality is a resource to plunder.

It’s Social Darwinism applied to the fundamental human craving for intimacy. It’s another way of saying, be a man — a certain type of man — or else no one will choose you. Anyone growing up with this imperative will reasonably throw away instincts more biologically entrenched than dominance and violence, that is: empathy, compassion, love, and sincerity.

As Laurie Penny perspicaciously noted,

“The personal is not only political. It is also historical, economic, and material.”
 
“Men are trash” functions as exactly that: not an attack on all men, but as a tool for mental liberation.
"Words don't mean what they mean, but only what the woman who says them wants them to mean in the moment in which she says them, after which they could mean something else entirely."

"What do you mean you don't take what women say seriously?"
 
men have been permitted very few ways to manage their emotions that are non-violent.”
Bullshit. Just because men don't often talk about their feelings in a direct manner with women doesn't mean that they don't express these feelings verbally or non-verbally amongst other men. Most outlets for venting off emotions are not violent.
 
Reminds me of this gem: Through the Looking Glass, and an interesting quote.
“When I use a word,’ Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, ‘it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.’

’The question is,’ said Alice, ‘whether you can make words mean so many different things.’

’The question is,’ said Humpty Dumpty, ‘which is to be master — that’s all.”
 
Lmao by Celine Hosea, Indonesian "neurodivergent" feminist...aka neurotic BPD chick.

“Men are trash” functions as exactly that: not an attack on all men, but as a tool for mental liberation
Oh sweet, kind of like how BLM dinduishas chanting "Kill White Babies!" in the town square need to be taken in context, and when billion dollar Media and BigTech Corps host "Eliminating Whiteness" seminars those are just political metaphors, right?

But saying "Trans Women are Men" is litrul genocidal violence and Huwite supremist hate-terrism?
 
“Though we adore men individually, we agree that as a group they are rather stupid,” Mrs. Banks for Mary Poppins astutely noted. It baffles me how I, myself, can hate men so much yet crave for their affection. Right before writing this essay, I was just reading romance novels written by women, for women.

I have found that the more radical an individual feminist is, the more she craves validation from men. She just won't say it, but in some other avenue of her life it pokes out five-fold.
 
As much as we try to deny it — and I certainly have, having spent my preteen years worshiping Germaine Greer’s The Female Eunuch and Valerie Solanas’ SCUM Manifesto (SCUM standing for ‘Society for Cutting Up Men’) — there exists a “pick me girl” within every heterosexual woman. Some women just recognize and isolate this instinct, while others are not yet aware of how social constructions contribute to their desires.
She was reading this nonsense as a "preteen?" I find that difficult to believe.

As Hegel writes in the Phenomenology of Spirit, “Self-consciousness exists in itself and for itself, in that, and by the fact that it exists for another self-consciousness; that is to say, it is only by being acknowledged or ‘recognized’.” In other words, self-conception does not exist in a vacuum.
My nigga Schopenhauer loathed Hegel and I've never seen any reason to doubt his opinion in this area.

In this particular instance, how can something exist "in itself and for itself," if the whole point of its existence is to exist for something else?
 
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Women should refuse to have children, period. Men want to exterminate use for robotics after they dehumanize us in law.

well to be fair women are barely human after all. They do need careful guardianship by a man lest they turn into these crazy feminists, we all seen how woman act when they have the freedom to do what they want.

IMHO If a women doesn't get the proper kind and correct amount of sex from a male they can go...wonky.

It's for their own good in the long run.
 
Besides, most men today see "feminism" as "women who demand to be treated with human decency and some respect.
Is that really why only half of men identify as feminist?


And it's not much better for women. About only 60% of women identify as feminist.

It's because there's a significant amount of the population holds the rational belief that feminism is a losers' game and its adherents are morons at best, killjoys in the middle, and hateful assholes at worst.
 
Women begin to frame their body-image issues as a byproduct of patriarchal and capitalist socialization of the commodification of the self for male-consumption.
Word salad.
And the only way to get rid of a desire is to indulge in it.
Really? That’s very telling. The way to get rid of an unwanted desire is to understand the negative that would happen if you DO indulge in it. That is not the same as indulging in it
Indeed, as a group, men are trash.
Oh for goodness sake
Men are not trash — the concept of masculinity is
No it isn’t. Masculine men got us to the moon. Masculinity is not negative any more than femininity is negative.
men have been permitted very few ways to manage their emotions that are non-violent.”
I dont think this is true. But what I think IS true is that both sexes are no longer allowed the single sex spaces that are important to talk about and share/experience things unique to that sex. Neither men nor women are allowed to simply BE men or women without it being some kind of political statement. Our dads could go to work and play five a side football and have a laugh with their mates without being told they are misogynists and our mums could have a cup of tea and a gossip without having trannies come in and stink the place up.
I read this article and I just come away with a sense of what’s the point here? I dont get what she’s trying to even say. Other than the kind of smug word salad . no alternatives offered, no solutions offered. The writer isn’t working with victims of trafficking or abuse and setting out solutions - she’s just regurgitating what she’s been told at college
 
I read this article and I just come away with a sense of what’s the point here? I dont get what she’s trying to even say.
She's saying that she's incredibly lonely and needs a big, strong man to make her feel protected and loved.

Most men seem to be enamored with the idea of enslaving preteen girls to rape.
You need to get off the internet for a while.
 
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Bullshit. Just because men don't often talk about their feelings in a direct manner with women doesn't mean that they don't express these feelings verbally or non-verbally amongst other men. Most outlets for venting off emotions are not violent.
Case in point, where we are right now. Yeah, some of the shit many of us say on here is violent as shit, but at the end of the day, it's only words and not allowing somewhere to vent that shit off is how you end up radicalizing people with no outlet towards actual violence.


Sometimes you just gotta shout how much you want to twist niggers heads off to make it through the rest of the day.
 
Case in point, where we are right now. Yeah, some of the shit many of us say on here is violent as shit, but at the end of the day, it's only words and not allowing somewhere to vent that shit off is how you end up radicalizing people with no outlet towards actual violence.


Sometimes you just gotta shout how much you want to twist niggers heads off to make it through the rest of the day.
Wait, you guys don’t have a backyard mass grave of dead trannies and niggers you dissolved in acid to thwart identification?

Well. this is awkward.
 
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