Live updates: Brush fire burns in Pacific Palisades as Santa Ana winds blast Southern California - Live video at link

You will notice this "Southwestern culture" is not the South. They do not say "y'all" if they are white unless they are emulating negros.

Anyways, your bait is shit. No one with a genuine Southren accent types that way online. Cope and sneed.
You forgot option three, people who can't sort the difference between you, your, and you're so they just go with "ya'll" instead.
 
The dog, canary, parrots, and turtle one is the saddest. What an absolute waste. Those poor animals, if only she evacuated before her car was on fire. I also feel bad for all the disabled old people who couldn't leave at a moment's notice. As for the man with the hose in his hand, he died a man's death.
That part of the story nearly broke me. Jesus Christ I cannot imagine the horror those old people and animals felt.

Hose man deserves a spot in Val Halla for going down swinging.
 
I won't lie and say it didn't cross my mind that LA got what it deserved. But the empathy in me makes me regret those thoughts because of the friends I have who live out in LA, or near it and thus are impacted by the fires.
I also remember that the voting process has been subverted into permanent one-party rule. Even when they try to do the right thing their government fucks them out of a voice. Who knows if they truly are dem +30 anymore?
Does anyone else find it strange that the more religious a person is the more callous they tend to be? Or do they just stick out more since they're expected to be more compassionate?
They tend to be more callous because they tend to have first-hand experience with people in need. They have personally witnessed every lie, grift and sob story used to manipulate them into giving gibs. It may not be right but it's human nature to get bitter after awhile.
 
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This kind of attitude is why California codified gay marriage into its state constitution last year.
Part of asking forgiveness is stopping the sin they’re asking forgiveness for.

If they ask for forgiveness but continue to sin, it doesn’t count.

Don’t pretend that anyone is beyond redemption, literal incarcerated murderers accept Christ and are forgiven.
 
Something I'm curious about is if anybody is going to install an anti-fire sprinkler system of some sort in their home rebuild, like if the house catches fire it'll spray itself with sodium bicarbonate powder to snuff out the flames. I'm really surprised nobody seems to have thought of this. We have sprinkler systems in commercial buildings for snuffing a fire indoors, why not one for a house that sprays outside too?
 
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Come on, man. This is twice now I've had cause to post this here.
I never got that interpretation from @MarvinTheParanoidAndroid. I think there is a more nuanced discussion to be had. It’s possible to feel compassion for the people losing their homes in the fire, but also want accountability for the (lack of) leadership at the top, and want people to ultimately learn from this. I don’t know if that will happen for some, and they’ll keep wondering why the cities they live in deteriorate, but others will know why. Also, in addition to displaced people, you have lots of displaced animals, and no matter who is living there, the animals definitely don’t deserve to suffer from this preventable disaster. Christ’s teachings often get misinterpreted as needing to be a pushover, but that is a false interpretation. You can very well acknowledge the follies that led to this issue, and want the people in charge to receive punishment, but extend compassion towards people going through things like losing homes and loved ones.
 
Something I'm curious about is if anybody is going to install an anti-fire sprinkler system of some sort in their home rebuild, like if the house catches fire it'll spray itself with sodium bicarbonate powder to snuff out the flames. I'm really surprised nobody seems to have thought of this. We have sprinkler systems in commercial buildings for snuffing a fire indoors, why not one for a house that sprays outside too?
Because it's expensive and if it goes off by mistake it's also expensive. Both to clean up and reinstall. Why would you want one for an event that may or may not happen in the 50 year life of the structure?
 

Mike Johnson Vows to Hold Aid to California Hostage After Deadly Fires​

What a scummy way to rephrase "we are investigating how funds previously allocated for fire prevention and water maintenance have seemingly gone missing before we blindly give money to those responsible for the failure"
 
In the charred remnants of Altadena, a slow and painful search for victims
The Washington Post (archive.ph)
By Joshua Partlow and María Luisa Paúl
2025-01-14 00:53:43GMT
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FEMA Urban Search and Rescue personnel are working with Los Angeles County firefighters to search for the remains of victims after the Eaton Fire devastated Altadena, California. (Barbara Davidson for The Washington Post)

ALTADENA, Calif. — The air has cleared, embers have gone cold, and the slow work of recovering the dead from the Eaton Fire has entered its third day.

Search and rescue teams are arrayed across the charred remnants of Altadena, a Los Angeles suburb devastated by last week’s fire, going block to block, house to house.

The town is hushed and somber, residents kept out by a cordon of National Guard troops. The searchers have worked through about a quarter of the town. About 7,000 structures have burned, and authorities expect the search will continue for at least four more days.

At least 16 bodies have been found, making it the fifth-deadliest blaze in state history, according to Cal Fire data. An additional eight people have been confirmed dead in the Palisades Fire, which swept through Pacific Palisades.

Authorities expect they will not be the last.

“Unfortunately, it’s probably going to be a lot more,” said Reserve Deputy Sheriff Dan Paige, a search and rescue operations leader at the Altadena station of the Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department.

Searching for the dead in the ruins of Altadena is slow, methodical work. It can be difficult to identify human remains amid the ash and wreckage of a burned out home, much of it coated in a uniform gray.

“Drywall looks almost identical to bone fragments,” Paige said. “It can be very deceiving.”

The search in Altadena is being conducted by at least 100 people led by California Regional Urban Search and Rescue teams, made up of firefighters and others from throughout the state, plus FEMA officials, medical doctors, structural specialists to inspect buildings, roads, and bridges, and anthropologists to help identify human remains.

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FEMA personnel and Los Angeles County firefighters are also checking the stability of structures and checking for hazards. (Barbara Davidson for The Washington Post)

They begin their day with a morning briefing and end it with a decontamination wash. Some are veterans of other disasters, such as the 2018 Camp Fire in Paradise, California, but even so, they are astonished by the scope of destruction here.

When they arrived, one said, “It felt a tad bit overwhelming how much we were going to need to search.”

The teams wear hard hats and respirators. They carry shovels, picks and hoes. At each destroyed home and business, they first determine whether the structure is safe, and look for hazards such as gas leaks. Then they step gingerly through the wreckage, examining it closely, sifting through metal and ash, tamping down spots, kneeling for a closer look.

“As soon as we identify something that looks like human, we immediately stop and call in an anthropologist and our coroner’s office, our homicide bureau,” Paige said. “Everything just slows down. And they treat this whole thing like a big crime scene.”

Some of the personnel focused on search and rescue are based at the Altadena station handling new search missions as they come up; others are out in the neighborhoods, doing a house-to-house grid search. One group working with the Humane Society is rescuing animals. Sheriff’s deputies have collected chickens, goats, cats and other animals, to try to reunite them with owners or feed those left behind.

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A FEMA Urban Search and Rescue worker logs details about a damaged home. (Barbara Davidson for The Washington Post)

Before this fire, the search and rescue needs of Altadena primarily related to hikers in the San Gabriel Mountains. The trails through the hills attract thousands of residents and tourists and the sheriff’s station here gets regular calls about people missing in that environment.

They have never encountered anything like this. They must look in many places: houses and cars, shops and sheds, churches and schools. The devastation goes on for block after block.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna told reporters Monday that every day of searching yields more human remains.

“That is not easy work — it’s very sad to report. And I believe that work is not only going to continue, but I believe we’ll continue to find remains,” he said.

Some residents have been frustrated by the inability to return to their homes within the security perimeters set up in Altadena and the Pacific Palisades. Luna acknowledged that and asked for patience from the community.

“People are saying, ‘I just want to go look at my house and I want to see what’s left,’” Luna said. “We know that, but we have people literally looking for the remains of your neighbors. Please be patient with us. There’s a lot of hazards in the area.”

There are still fallen trees and downed power lines across the roads. Burned out bridges. Utility trucks blocking roads doing repairs.

But as the recovery effort continued, the prospect of strong winds focused attention on the possible spread of new fires. A red flag warning is in place for parts of Los Angeles and Ventura counties, with wind gusts of up to 70 mph forecast between 4 a.m. Tuesday and noon Wednesday — strong enough to potentially cause “explosive fire growth,” according to the National Weather Service.

The Weather Service on Monday widened the area facing a “particularly dangerous situation” red flag warning, which the agency reserves for “the extreme of the extreme fire weather scenarios.”

The forecast prompted Los Angeles Mayor Karen Bass to urge residents to heed any new evacuation orders.

“My top priority, and that of everyone involved, is to protect lives as these winds approach our city,” Bass said during a news conference.

Paige, who has lived in Altadena for 25 years, responded to the Eaton Fire shortly after it was reported around 6:15 p.m. Jan. 7. He said he had been driving across Los Angeles toward the Palisades Fire when the dispatcher reported another small blaze in Eaton Canyon, next to Altadena. He heard it had covered about 10 acres, moving quickly through heavy fuel, fanned by roaring winds. Paige was by Universal Studios in Hollywood when he sighed and told one of his partners he had to turn around.

“I’m sorry,” he said. “This sounds like this could be bad.”

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Houses along Palisades Drive in Altadena. (Melina Mara/The Washington Post)

All through the evening and into the next day, Paige and his colleagues from the Altadena station raced around trying to get people to evacuate, amid flames and falling trees, downed power lines and almost impenetrable smoke. Thirty to 40 ambulances, he estimated, were also driving around Altadena trying to help get residents to safety.

Even though he’d been a patrol officer in Altadena for a decade, and knew every street, he got lost several times, as did many of the residents he came across, people fleeing for their lives in the wrong direction.

“So many other people were lost, too,” he said. “Imagine shaking a hornet’s nest. People were going in every direction.”

In between rescue missions, he evacuated his 60-pound tortoise, Speedy. His own home survived but his brother’s house burned down.

On the streets, he encountered residents in broken-down cars. People on foot frantically waving down police. Animals roaming around.

Police vehicles were broadcasting announcements urging people to evacuate. As the situation deteriorated, Paige recalled urging people to leave in the most extreme way he could.

“I was screaming at them, you’re going to die if you don’t leave right now,” he recalled.

He feared for his own life several times. And the realization that many people did not make it out has been devastating for him and the rest of his colleagues in Altadena. Eating and sleeping have been difficult, he said, but there is so much work left to do.

“That’s the hardest part,” he said. “Just knowing that we left people behind.”
Could better brush clearance have helped slow the spread of the Palisades fire?
Los Angeles Times (archive.ph)
By Alex Wigglesworth
2025-01-13 15:31:37GMT
The allegations flew as fast as the flames. The Palisades fire raging through the coastal mountains of Los Angeles, rich and powerful critics said, wouldn’t have been quite so devastating had authorities done a better job of clearing hillside brush.

“We knew the winds were coming. We knew that there was brush that needed to be cleared 20 years ago,” Rick Caruso, the developer and former Los Angeles mayoral candidate, told The Times. “This fire could have been mitigated — maybe not prevented.”

Elon Musk wrote on X that the “biggest factor, in my opinion, is that crazy environmental regulations prevent building firebreaks and clearing brush near houses.” And actress-producer Sara Foster chimed in with an X post saying “our vegetation was overgrown, brush not cleared.”

Did these and other second-guessers have a point? Scientists, wildfire specialists and firefighting officials had differing viewpoints. But several of these experts — including strong proponents of brush clearance — said that the winds fanning the flames were so fierce, and ground conditions so dry, that clearing more shrubs wouldn’t have had a significant effect.

“All of the brush clearance, fuel breaks — they’re very effective on what we would consider a normal day,” said Chief Brian Fennessy of the Orange County Fire Authority. “But what you’re talking about here is probably less than 1% of all the fires that we respond to in Southern California.”

The Palisades fire ignited Jan. 7 amid hurricane-force winds, with gusts of up to 100 mph recorded in some areas.

“You could have put a 10-lane freeway in front of that fire and it would not have slowed it one bit,” Fennessy said.

Vegetation management efforts are typically most effective when firefighters are able to take advantage of the reduced fire intensity they provide to snuff out flames.

In this case, Fennessy said, fire was blowing sideways from house to house, with the structures themselves serving as fuel. The winds grounded firefighting aircraft. And firefighters on the ground were focused on getting people out of the path of the fast-moving inferno as it burned deeply into communities.

Several experts noted that the intense gusts lofted embers miles from the fire front, essentially spreading flames through the air — not by brush. They also pointed out that landscape-level fuel reduction, in which brush is cut back over large swaths of land, is controversial in Southern California’s sensitive coastal ecosystems.

In the forests of Northern California and the Sierra Nevada, large blazes are often stoked by a buildup of trees and brush that accumulated due to decades of fire suppression. Removing some of that vegetation can help make those forests both more fire-resilient and healthier, since an abundance of plants competing for finite resources makes the ecosystem more sensitive to drought, said Patrick T. Brown, co-director of the climate and energy team at the Breakthrough Institute, an environmental think tank.

Modeling by the nonprofit suggests that clearing brush — and thus eliminating fuel — can reduce the intensity of wildfires in the Los Angeles Basin even during extreme weather, Brown said, although it’s not likely to have prevented the kind of destruction Pacific Palisades is experiencing now.

At the same time, he said, unlike in forested areas, fuel reduction in the region’s chaparral shrublands risks harming the ecosystem rather than making it healthier.

That’s because the Santa Monica mountains, Malibu canyons and other wildland areas near coastal Los Angeles generally burn too frequently, said Alexandra Syphard, senior research ecologist at the nonprofit Conservation Biology Institute and adjunct professor at San Diego State University.

That’s caused native evergreen chaparral shrubs, which take several years to mature and make new seeds, to be replaced by invasive annual grasses that die in the early summer and catch fire more easily, said Helen Holmlund, biology professor at Pepperdine University.

“That promotes more frequent fires which, in turn, leads to more loss of chaparral shrubs and more invasive species,” she said.

Large-scale attempts to preemptively thin or burn these coastal areas could therefore actually make the landscape more flammable in the long run, said Max Moritz, a cooperative extension wildfire specialist at UC Santa Barbara.

“Those are trade-offs that, as a society, you have to think about if they’re worthwhile,” Moritz said.

Given the weather conditions, Moritz is skeptical that more landscape-level brush clearance would have done much to slow the fire’s initial spread. He also noted that landscape-level brush management is distinct from brush clearance around individual homes, which is typically the responsibility of the property owner and can help give firefighters opportunities to protect structures.

Still, Joe Ten Eyck, who coordinates wildfire and urban interface programs for the International Assn. of Firefighters, said extreme weather conditions can make brush clearance even more important.

“The more we take away the fuel for a fire to burn, the more we’re going to lessen the risk and make individual residences and communities resilient,” said Ten Eyck, who is also a retired operations chief with the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection.

In fact, the Getty Villa credited its pruned landscaping and irrigated grounds with helping to save the museum’s structures from the Palisades fire.

Ventura County fire officials also said that residents’ compliance with a strictly enforced county ordinance requiring 100 feet of brush clearance around buildings, as well as other fire-resistant construction features, helped firefighters defend homes from the Kenneth fire that spread through the West Hills area Jan. 9.

Although the winds weren’t as fierce as in previous days, they were still strong, said Scott Dettorre, public information officer for the Ventura County Fire Department.

Los Angeles has similar rules for homes in fire-prone areas, although Fire Chief Kristin Crowley wrote in a Dec. 4 memo to the Board of Fire Commissioners that a $7-million reduction in overtime funding had hindered her department’s ability to carry out inspections ensuring residents were complying, among other tasks.

But even those efforts can only help so much during the most extreme events, said Jason Moghaddas, fire ecologist and registered professional forester for think tank Spatial Informatics Group, and his colleague, Carrie Levine, co-lead of the group’s forest and agriculture domain.

Once a fire reaches clusters of buildings, the structures themselves become the fuel, they said. Moghaddas pointed to the Sunset Boulevard area, where the Palisades fire burned fire-hardened buildings like concrete commercial structures surrounded by pavement.

“It’s all these cascading probabilities — you can improve your chances of survivability, improve the chance that firefighters will protect your home, improve the chance that flame lengths will be lower … but somewhere all those probabilities show up on the ground in real life and the fire tests them,” he said. “And you can see, ‘well, there wasn’t enough there to change the outcome.’”

Times staff writers Matt Hamilton and David Zahniser contributed to this report
 
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