The Legend of Heroes Series - Possibly The Most Underrated JRPG Series

Uh, wow. That's insanely generous.

Pretty much every one of these games should be above an 8. Of course this is subjective, but have you seen the competition?

I liked every cold steel game (outside of changing the harem to an actual set in stone romance) and don't have a problem with rean so I know my opinion is slop.

The Sky trilogy is still objectively the best of the series so my opinions aren't all bad at least.

I like Rean. He is a character archetype that most people older than 14 hate, but I feel as though Falcom did a good job of elevating him above that. Trails in general has always been about taking a bunch of anime tropes, cliches and archetypes and going all in on them and giving them more depth.
 
Pretty much every one of these games should be above an 8. Of course this is subjective, but have you seen the competition?

I don't think I would score any game in the area of 8 or 9 outside of some of my favourite games of all times in my 30 years of playing video games. I don't know, maybe my standards are just really high, but Trails games hover between 5 and 7 for me, and this is coming from someone who prioritises gameplay over story, and I really enjoy the gameplay and music of the Trails games, but the story and writing had just been getting worse and worse, and that really sours the experience for me, espeically considering the writing quality of the Sky trilogy, I know what they're capable of.

I think the main reason why Rean is disliked isn't because of the cliché Shonen tropes, but because of how this fucker barely changes and grows throughout the course of five games. It's like the writers are too scared to commit to anything serious, so they revert him back to a sad sack bitch who needs his ass wiped and dick sucked by everyone around him.
 
  • Feels
Reactions: Slap47
Erebonia is hyped up as a place where life is cheaper and rules are more arbitrary, and that just does not pan out as much. Its still the case, but not really.
I think it's funny as hell that more people croaked in the first two chapters of Kuro 1 than in the entire Coldsteel tetralogy.

The Sky trilogy is still objectively the best of the series so my opinions aren't all bad at least.
That's a funny way of spelling "Crossbell duology".
53b751b5a611f322ad94e61dc89e3529.gif
 
I like Rean. He is a character archetype that most people older than 14 hate, but I feel as though Falcom did a good job of elevating him above that. Trails in general has always been about taking a bunch of anime tropes, cliches and archetypes and going all in on them and giving them more depth.
It's fair to say that Rean ends up as a fairly bog standard "light novel style every man" kind of character. The setup was definitely there for something more interesting. But, the follow through left a lot to be desired. I think it's cool that Rean was made to drop out of the 8 leaves school because his fundamental outlook was incompatible with the school's philosopy. I wish I knew anything about that story beat beyond describing it in broad strokes though. I also wish that the plot point was developed beyond vague off handed remarks. That's the sort of thing that, if focused on, can lead to some pretty cathartic story moments. But, Rean just keeps practicing as he was with no further mention of his teacher until he's recognized as a master. And that's just one thing.
 
  • Feels
Reactions: Slap47
I think the main reason why Rean is disliked isn't because of the cliché Shonen tropes, but because of how this fucker barely changes and grows throughout the course of five games. It's like the writers are too scared to commit to anything serious, so they revert him back to a sad sack bitch who needs his ass wiped and dick sucked by everyone around him.
I dislike Rean because he is a classic mary sue. He won every superpower lottery in the setting, everybody sucks his cock figuratively and literally, and the fucker still acts like he is a giant victim that doesn't doesn't deserve anything. It's just aggrevating and, worse, makes everyone else fade into the background.

Which is bad enough on its own, but up until then the main characters were down to earth (at beat related to famous figures), which made them very endearing and in turn let the side characters shine with their crazy backstory.

Even in Reverie he basically takes over the entire plot despite being the conclusion to Crossbell as well.
 
  • Feels
Reactions: Slap47
makes everyone else fade into the background.

I brought this up whilst discussing Rean with someone else in DMs before. Class VII is already a bloated cast to shove into the players' face right off the bat, compared to the Liberl crew and the SSS. But if done right, you could make it work.

But everything has to center around this guy that the other members barely feel like they know each other besides from "being classmates", sure we get interactions between Jusis and Machias, Emma and Fie, etc. but it's not enough, I barely know what some of these fuckers think of each other - across five games, can you name a single interaction between say, Gaius and Machias? What about Fie and Jusis? Laura and Elliot?

With the previous arcs, it wasn't just about Estelle, it wasn't just about Lloyd; the other characters had their moments to shine, some moreso than others, sure, but I never really got the impression C7 showed that family dynamic besides just outright telling it to us, and "a lot of time has passed, and now here's their reunion in CS3".
 
There are isekai Light Novels (and a lot of other genres, it's basically YA novellas). And Rean is actually bordering on an Isekai protagonist levels of mary sue than the somewhat more balanced LNs battle couples (that at least had a group of protagonists and villains at around the same strength).

Reminds me, watching old video game OPs on a flight I forgot how Rean is so generic he looks the same as the Tears to Tiara 2 protagonist (recommended game):
Does the main character of that game also have a super special awesome ogre move that is totes tragic for incredibly softball reasons?
I don't think I would score any game in the area of 8 or 9 outside of some of my favourite games of all times in my 30 years of playing video games. I don't know, maybe my standards are just really high, but Trails games hover between 5 and 7 for me, and this is coming from someone who prioritises gameplay over story, and I really enjoy the gameplay and music of the Trails games, but the story and writing had just been getting worse and worse, and that really sours the experience for me, espeically considering the writing quality of the Sky trilogy, I know what they're capable of.
I'm not that harsh on them, I do legitimately think the Sky trilogy and crossbell duology are above 8s in my book, but they really hit that classic 32bit rpg hitch that I used to really enjoy Xenogears for example is probably one of my top JRPGs along with Grandia or Lunar, I see the first 5 games at that level more or less.

Cold Steel it's between 6 and 8 for the most part... And Kuro is a 7. Perfectly serviceable, but kind of suffering from the sins of the past. To me a 5 is something that I actively have to force myself to play when I actively dislike it... can't think of any example right now though from the stories I'd heard, decent odds that FFXIII would have probably been here. And below that it's shit that I will just drop with zero regrets, which ain't the same as stopping playing something for one reason or another. FFIX is a fantastic game, I'd give it like an 8.5, but never finished it due to real life kind of fucking with my flow and now my emulator save files are lost to time.
I think it's funny as hell that more people croaked in the first two chapters of Kuro 1 than in the entire Coldsteel tetralogy.
LOL, holy shit, yes. You would expect that the Ironblood military dictatorship that we were sold would be a lot more ruthless. But Cold Steel is when the candy canes started to really sprout hard. Calvard being "darker and edgier", feels kind of dumb to me, specially since it's not for the reasons I would have expected since the biggest local mafia are saints involved in the community for example.
It's fair to say that Rean ends up as a fairly bog standard "light novel style every man" kind of character. The setup was definitely there for something more interesting. But, the follow through left a lot to be desired. I think it's cool that Rean was made to drop out of the 8 leaves school because his fundamental outlook was incompatible with the school's philosopy. I wish I knew anything about that story beat beyond describing it in broad strokes though. I also wish that the plot point was developed beyond vague off handed remarks. That's the sort of thing that, if focused on, can lead to some pretty cathartic story moments. But, Rean just keeps practicing as he was with no further mention of his teacher until he's recognized as a master. And that's just one thing.
Ugh, his whole "blade master" arc feels like such a copout. It's literally "you get this because you are somebody's self insert in the office". Why would a dropout and snot nosed runt that is barely 18 get to be on the same levels as fucking Cassius and Arios? Richard wasn't considered anywhere near a Divine Blade and seemed like a beast. It was just another "You are so fucking cool Rean, we all are gnats compared to how fucking cool you are!" and another 5 poor women get dragged into the harem. Joshua and Lloyd must have been swatting harem flies like hawks to protect their territories.
Even in Reverie he basically takes over the entire plot despite being the conclusion to Crossbell as well.
That's another thing that worries me about Kai, fucking Rean is back. I'm through the moon with Kevin and of course Van is a given, but there are so many characters that could have been put there instead to give them a nice pick me up from just Erebonia alone. Could have been anybody from new class 7 if you wanted someone from Tors for example, all grown up and with new responsabilities and a faggy pep talk from their teacher to go fuck off in the general area.
With the previous arcs, it wasn't just about Estelle, it wasn't just about Lloyd; the other characters had their moments to shine, some moreso than others, sure, but I never really got the impression C7 showed that family dynamic besides just outright telling it to us, and "a lot of time has passed, and now here's their reunion in CS3".
It was pure tell, don't show. New class 7 improved a lot with that till the plot devoured them and made them background characters. I really think something like the Skit system from the Tales games would do wonders to flesh interactions between secondary characters. Van's group does bounce a bit better between each other, specially after Aaron, but Rissete, Quattro and specially Judith and Bergard just feel kind of along for the ride. The crossbell people on the other hand feel like a family even with Noel and Wazzy coming in later and the Sky people though it was always Joshua and Estelle, the rest felt welcome.
 
Last edited:
Does the main character of that game also have a super special awesome ogre move that is totes tragic for incredibly softball reasons?
Nah, he lets a War God posses him which is infinitely more metal. The game is loosely based on the Punic Wars so the hero is more of a tactician.

Ugh, his whole "blade master" arc feels like such a copout. It's literally "you get this because you are somebody's self insert in the office". Why would a dropout and snot nosed runt that is barely 18 get to be on the same levels as fucking Cassius and Arios? Richard wasn't considered anywhere near a Divine Blade and seemed like a beast. It was just another "You are so fucking cool Rean, we all are gnats compared to how fucking cool you are!" and another 5 poor women get dragged into the harem. Joshua and Lloyd must have been swatting harem flies like hawks to protect their territories.
I always called bullshit on it. Like Rean wasn't Japanese appealing enough so they made him have a Katana with somehow being near master level in it from the get go despite being level 1.
It's also fucking bullshit after both Estelle and Lloyd used blunt weapons to prevent accidentally killing people but it never comes up with Rean.

That's another thing that worries me about Kai, fucking Rean is back.
Oh god no
 
Nah, he lets a War God posses him which is infinitely more metal. The game is loosely based on the Punic Wars so the hero is more of a tactician.
Guess I'll add it to the bucket.
I always called bullshit on it. Like Rean wasn't Japanese appealing enough so they made him have a Katana with somehow being near master level in it from the get go despite being level 1.
It's also fucking bullshit after both Estelle and Lloyd used blunt weapons to prevent accidentally killing people but it never comes up with Rean.
RPG logic really kills any sort of "lethal not lethal" angle. When the least threatening thing you can face is a machine gun, shit is already busted beyond belief.

As for the whole blunt to protect and Cassius following that, it really adds to the chuuniness of Rean (of course he wields a Katana!), it's also just another strike against how Cold Steel should have been just colder and more ruthless in general. Also to give a contrast with Bracers, the town rowdies get a telling and a 5 minute time out in Liberl, in glorious Erebonia they get gutted like dogs and hanged to serve as examples!
Oh god no
Sorry for the spoiler.
 
Actually I'm mad about something now. How is Guy Bannings dead? Guns don't do shit in Trails.
Plot bullets. You have to remember that bullets automatically suck when used in gameplay - when Machias pumps human enemies full of shotgun shells, it's only a minor inconvenience to them.
 
I dislike Rean because he is a classic mary sue.
One of the most horrifying facts to realize is that Mary Sues are actually pretty popular characters in anime-based stuff.

The line between fanfiction and official products is very thin indeed.
 
Sorry for the spoiler.
I was iffy on Kuro anyways. I'm waiting until it's over to know if it's work the 100+ hours investment. Learning Falcom was a black company was a hard blackpill to digest.
Plot bullets. You have to remember that bullets automatically suck when used in gameplay - when Machias pumps human enemies full of shotgun shells, it's only a minor inconvenience to them.
Yep, during cutscenes weapon lethality jumps 10000% and it's either dodge or die. I think the only game that did guns well in gameplay as in story is Library of Ruina.
One of the most horrifying facts to realize is that Mary Sues are actually pretty popular characters in anime-based stuff.

The line between fanfiction and official products is very thin indeed.
I'm not sure about it. There's a good reason why the term is primarily about female characters. Male characters will usually go through the hero's journey which is by definition anti-Mary sue as it requires going over conflict and improving. The deluge of mary sue characters in media is very recent and seems to be due to a recent shift of the viewer putting itself as a character rather than aspire to be it.
 
Actually I'm mad about something now. How is Guy Bannings dead? Guns don't do shit in Trails.
The bullets were imbued with bear chakra. Or guy got sucker shot in such a way that his animu antibullet chi shield wasn't up.
One of the most horrifying facts to realize is that Mary Sues are actually pretty popular characters in anime-based stuff.

The line between fanfiction and official products is very thin indeed.
Might be pedantic, but Rean is not a Mary sue. He is pure chuuni fantasy though. Like wtf says
I'm not sure about it. There's a good reason why the term is primarily about female characters. Male characters will usually go through the hero's journey which is by definition anti-Mary sue as it requires going over conflict and improving. The deluge of mary sue characters in media is very recent and seems to be due to a recent shift of the viewer putting itself as a character rather than aspire to be it.
He goes through a hero's journey. It's just a very shitty one since it's chuuni tropes to a T. Darkly handsome, mysterious past, has a great power but it's a curse! He is incredibly important and tormented by it!?!? He wishes a tranquil life but MUST step up to be the hero of all! And he gets all the pussy because he's such a noce and down to earth guy.

Thing is there is zero irony with Rean, it's honest to god catnip for edgy socially inept 13 year old boys. And it makes sense. A Mary Sue never changes, she is perfect from the outset it's just that everyone still needs to notice. Rean on the other hand is flawed and tormented but in the most self fellating way possible to be alluring and cool.

They both succeed with little practical effort mind you, so I'm not surprised they are seen as the same. But boys and girls still look for different things in their power fantasies.
 
Thing is there is zero irony with Rean, it's honest to god catnip for edgy socially inept 13 year old boys. And it makes sense. A Mary Sue never changes, she is perfect from the outset it's just that everyone still needs to notice. Rean on the other hand is flawed and tormented but in the most self fellating way possible to be alluring and cool.
I just do not see the functional difference, honestly. The end result is basically the same. If a "flaw" ends up having no practical negative effect on the character, it's not really a flaw at all. It's just a quirky character trait/interesting character fact.

It's like a tabletop munchkin taking disadvantages that they know will never come up for points, with a GM who they know won't screw them for it.
 
Might be pedantic, but Rean is not a Mary sue. He is pure chuuni fantasy though. Like wtf says
No no, he is a mary sue through and through. Like Chuni has the heroes be overpowered but they are usually still human and with allies the same power level. Rean is absolutely retardedly OP to the point he is only comparable to the top of Ouroboros and the Church, before you add OniMode and his personal mecha.

He goes through a hero's journey. It's just a very shitty one since it's chuuni tropes to a T. Darkly handsome, mysterious past, has a great power but it's a curse! He is incredibly important and tormented by it!?!? He wishes a tranquil life but MUST step up to be the hero of all! And he gets all the pussy because he's such a noce and down to earth guy.
I don't really think it counts, things just happen around him and he returns to the same person after moping for a couple of minutes. Him becoming a teacher and a veteran could have been the change needed but it's wasted.

I don't think even a 13 year old would like Rean. Someone too successful for no real effort usually antagonizes men, at least most Isekai start with the main character needing to climb up a few steps before they become OP.
 
I don't really think it counts, things just happen around him and he returns to the same person after moping for a couple of minutes. Him becoming a teacher and a veteran could have been the change needed but it's wasted.

I don't think even a 13 year old would like Rean. Someone too successful for no real effort usually antagonizes men, at least most Isekai start with the main character needing to climb up a few steps before they become OP.
That's kinda my issue with him too. His low moments aren't nearly low enough. End of CS2 was close. But, it's undermined by the fact that Crow just "plot contrivances" himself back to life. There's nothing like Lloyd's conversation with Ellie where he says "I still only see my brother's back in front of me" (this is a line that was utterly neutered in NISA's translation of Zero), or Joshua abandoning Estelle.

As a result, the emotionally high moments of Rean's story have no weight to them. Estelle tracking Joshua down just to hug him when they finally meet means nothing in terms of the grander plot of the story. But, it's a poignant moment because the entirety of Sky Second Chapter is about this exact thing. From there, the rest of the game is an after thought. CS4 Tries to set up a similar concept, but it falls totally flat because none of the circumstances leading up to that were a result of Rean's decisions.
 
That's kinda my issue with him too. His low moments aren't nearly low enough. End of CS2 was close. But, it's undermined by the fact that Crow just "plot contrivances" himself back to life.

Even without Crow coming back to life, what they did with Rean between CS2 and CS3 just reeked of cowardice, and unwillingness to commit.
Rean at the end of CS2 is more cynical and experienced, his childish optimism is gone and his self indulgent wallowing depression is replaced with a more quiet jaded anger, and it feels like he's grown up a lot and you're interested to see where it's gonna go in CS3. Rean at the start of CS3, he goes back to being a sad sack bitch desperate for everyone to like him like he was at the start of CS1, and goes back to being a naive retard and all character development is gone.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: wtfNeedSignUp
One of the most horrifying facts to realize is that Mary Sues are actually pretty popular characters in anime-based stuff.

The line between fanfiction and official products is very thin indeed.

To be fair, they are popular in every kind of media in pretty much every single culture in the world.
 
"I still only see my brother's back in front of me" (this is a line that was utterly neutered in NISA's translation of Zero)
God this line makes me love their brief reunion at the end of Azure even more.

I think the only game that did guns well in gameplay as in story is Library of Ruina.
How fucked would the Imperial Liberation Front be if he showed up?
blue reverb.png
 
  • Like
Reactions: Slap47
Back