Tabletop Roleplaying Games (D&D, Pathfinder, CoC, ETC.)

[Sayer of the N-Word]

Does anyone have any ideas for encouraging players to be more creative? The players in a game I'm running just refuse to take advantage of the narrative aspect of TTRPGs to drive events.

For example, they were fighting a robot in a recent session. I was careful to mention that most of its case was off. Loose wires were hanging from its arms, and it had an exposed battery pack. Instead of announcing that they would try to cut the wires with a knife or target the battery with a heat ray they had, or just use their burning torch to melt the wires, they opted for round after round of "I attack again". They also made comments about not having good equipment after ignoring things like a broken gumball machine that I added to be used like a spiked mace, or the metal and plastic panels scattered in a few locations in the "dungeon" which could fashioned into shields.

I could announce that they severed a wire or melted the battery or something, or I could say, "Hey, that thing could be used as a weapon." When I've done that in earlier sessions, they react as if they're being railroaded, which they sort of are, but what am I supposed to do? I can't have useful items floating in the air above a glowing circle like in a video game. There rarely ask questions about their environment, and when they do ask questions they seem annoyed if they get a negative answer and shut down for a while. They also don't retreat from dangerous encounters, even when I tell them that retreat is an option, because they are so linear with their playing that they can't imagine doing something else.

They signed up for a hexcrawl, by the way, but resource management and random encounters seem to annoy them. Now I'm afraid to introduce ideas like smaller parties of related characters that could do things when a player can't attend, because I worry that they will struggle with the idea of not staying on the railroad that they've built for themselves.

This is the fourth time I've tried to start a game online in the last twelve months. It's always the same shit: distracted players, video game mentalities, players getting annoyed when things don't go their way, players getting annoyed when things do go their way, players getting annoyed because we aren't playing 5e D&D, people showing up to promote their own games or become backseat DMs. Online gaming is awful.

 

[The Spoils of War]

This is the fourth time I've tried to start a game online in the last twelve months. It's always the same shit: distracted players, video game mentalities, players getting annoyed when things don't go their way, players getting annoyed when things do go their way, players getting annoyed because we aren't playing 5e D&D, people showing up to promote their own games or become backseat DMs. Online gaming is awful.

Find better players and use a system that focuses on roleplaying rather than rollplaying (e.g., Fudge). I just don't have a system and use a d20 that I add bonuses or penalties to.

 

[Corn Flakes]

Does anyone have any ideas for encouraging players to be more creative? The players in a game I'm running just refuse to take advantage of the narrative aspect of TTRPGs to drive events.

Get yourself a stooge. Bring in a player who's not there to play the game, per se, but whose purpose is to come up with those ideas and show that they work. People don't usually think outside the box unless they either have to, or they see the advantages of it. So if you've got a bunch of videogame players, you're gonna need to train them. And having a peer doing it works better than trying to pass on the idea as the GM.

 

[p1138]

Does anyone have any ideas for encouraging players to be more creative? The players in a game I'm running just refuse to take advantage of the narrative aspect of TTRPGs to drive events.

For example, they were fighting a robot in a recent session. I was careful to mention that most of its case was off. Loose wires were hanging from its arms, and it had an exposed battery pack. Instead of announcing that they would try to cut the wires with a knife or target the battery with a heat ray they had, or just use their burning torch to melt the wires, they opted for round after round of "I attack again". They also made comments about not having good equipment after ignoring things like a broken gumball machine that I added to be used like a spiked mace, or the metal and plastic panels scattered in a few locations in the "dungeon" which could fashioned into shields.

I could announce that they severed a wire or melted the battery or something, or I could say, "Hey, that thing could be used as a weapon." When I've done that in earlier sessions, they react as if they're being railroaded, which they sort of are, but what am I supposed to do? I can't have useful items floating in the air above a glowing circle like in a video game. There rarely ask questions about their environment, and when they do ask questions they seem annoyed if they get a negative answer and shut down for a while. They also don't retreat from dangerous encounters, even when I tell them that retreat is an option, because they are so linear with their playing that they can't imagine doing something else.

They signed up for a hexcrawl, by the way, but resource management and random encounters seem to annoy them. Now I'm afraid to introduce ideas like smaller parties of related characters that could do things when a player can't attend, because I worry that they will struggle with the idea of not staying on the railroad that they've built for themselves.

This is the fourth time I've tried to start a game online in the last twelve months. It's always the same shit: distracted players, video game mentalities, players getting annoyed when things don't go their way, players getting annoyed when things do go their way, players getting annoyed because we aren't playing 5e D&D, people showing up to promote their own games or become backseat DMs. Online gaming is awful.

So a few things to keep in mind. Even ignoring the multitudes of idiots that just want to "play 5e"(they just want to be saying they're playing 5e), most people in the ttrpg space are fucking morons and it can take years to build up a decent table of players. Although I do blame part of it on WotC not actually teaching players(or DMs for that matter) how to actually play the games in their core rulebooks anymore.

It is kind of funny though that you mentioned video game mentalities, because the scenarios you described in this post are honestly idiots doing the opposite. You're telling them the obvious glowing weak spot, they aren't even bothering to try and hit it, if they do have a video game mentality, it's more like DSP.

That said, have you ever described an NPC picking up a gumball machine and using it like a mace? Have you described an NPC having a shield made out of random materials the party comes across? Not wanting to explain the whole scenario(it would take forever), I had a party I was DM'ng pathfinder for, they were new to the system but not new to me DM'ng so they'd actually pay attention if I started describing shit. But for whatever reason they just weren't doing things that they could do. One day I had some monsters kick their ass, and one of the players threw a fit claiming that rules don't work this way and I was doing shit wrong blah blah blah. Before I could open my mouth two of the other players called him an idiot and pointed out that if I was making rulings for allowing to monsters to do "crazy shit" and I've never been inconsistent about what PCs could do vs NPCs then that meant I was demonstrating things to them. It immediately shut up the one idiot while I just sat back and listened, next session people actually started using their imaginations and treating shit as if it were that old MacGuyver TV show.

Or you could do like @Corn Flakes said and bring yourself in a ringer, who can demonstrate to them that the PCs can use their brains to do something other than state "my character walks forward and hits the thing".

 

[Reverend]

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Nope not at my table.

My party has decided "Weddings" are the theme of the campaign. They went from absolute rampaging murder hoboes to Hallmark Wine Moms over the course of a campaign. I will never understand them, however I will encourage their creativity as bachelor/bachlorette parties are a fun way to do RP events that don't involve combat...mostly.

80% of my table is male/20% female and it's the men who think this is a GREAT IDEA more than the women.
It's a geat change of pace and since my players are all adults we can roleplay all this out and have memories for years to come from it.

 

[Brain Problems]

Does anyone have any ideas for encouraging players to be more creative? The players in a game I'm running just refuse to take advantage of the narrative aspect of TTRPGs to drive events.

It's kinda tough to do but don't strangle creativity because you're being autistic with rules. If someone comes up with an idea (assuming it isn't just turbo-retard stuff) instead of saying no, think of some skillchecks to perform, challenges etc. If they want to do something crazy difficult let them know it's tricky and will take some extreme luck/ability. It's kinda tough with spellcasters/magic-fags though because I am constantly telling the druid in my party that he can't do something because it literally breaks the rules of the game and it hurts me because he's trying to be creative but he's literally just making shit up and this isn't Vietnam, there are rules.

You can't force players to be creative but you can, like others have mentioned, gently remind them that this isn't a rigid programmed computer game. We're playing grown-uppretend, get crazy nigga.

 

[The Ugly One]

Does anyone have any ideas for encouraging players to be more creative? The players in a game I'm running just refuse to take advantage of the narrative aspect of TTRPGs to drive events.

Players will always be biased toward things they have rules for, because this lets them intuit success. If you want to have bosses with special area damage, give them a house rule, e.g. "Certain monsters will have weak areas that when targeted appropriate can make them easier to take down. Roll an attack at -4 to hit, etc."

They also don't retreat from dangerous encounters, even when I tell them that retreat is an option, because they are so linear with their playing that they can't imagine doing something else.

Players never really know if "dangerous" means "2 levels above you, you can win if you're clever" or "lmao no, just run." If it's "lmao no, just run," the way I handle it is to have the monster almost TPK the party, but somehow let them escape. And frankly, I don't have much problem breaking the 4th wall. "The Fighter assesses the three-headed ogre and figures that on a difficulty scale of 1 to 20, he's about a 12."

 

[The Bogwater Rises]

I don't have much problem breaking the 4th wall. "The Fighter assesses the three-headed ogre and figures that on a difficulty scale of 1 to 20, he's about a 12."

This is excellent advice. Do not be afraid to tell your party things. Don't hold their hand at all times, but sometimes you do just need to flat out tell people things.

 

[Ghostse]

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Nope not at my table.

Pathfinder 1e: D&D killer
Pathfinder 2e: FATAL killer

 

[LovisXVI]

Get yourself a stooge. Bring in a player who's not there to play the game, per se, but whose purpose is to come up with those ideas and show that they work. People don't usually think outside the box unless they either have to, or they see the advantages of it. So if you've got a bunch of videogame players, you're gonna need to train them. And having a peer doing it works better than trying to pass on the idea as the GM.

Having one is a good way to encouraging players to do anything. It's how I've got my players to use metacurrencies, by asking an experienced player to regularly and often declare that they will use the metacurrency to improve a check, you can get the other players to remember to use it and know what contexts to use it in. Worked for Shadowrun and Star Wars FFG when I wanted people to use them.

 

[Henri Barbusse]

It's kinda tough with spellcasters/magic-fags though because I am constantly telling the druid in my party that he can't do something because it literally breaks the rules of the game and it hurts me because he's trying to be creative but he's literally just making shit up and this isn't Vietnam, there are rules.

Sounds like he wants to play Ars Magica.

 

[Ghostse]

It's kinda tough with spellcasters/magic-fags though because I am constantly telling the druid in my party that he can't do something because it literally breaks the rules of the game and it hurts me because he's trying to be creative but he's literally just making shit up and this isn't Vietnam, there are rules.

This is the downside I run into: there is a difference between being creative and randumb retarded.

Players trying to hoodwink intelligent NPCs with ploys THEY wouldn't fall for in a million years, "I attack it with the room", "Can't I just roll to come up with a good idea"?

 

[Mr. Manchester]

"Can't I just roll to come up with a good idea"?

I hate this question so much. My answer is always no but it ruins some of the best moments you could have which is rolling with an awful idea. That's when fights turn nasty because you ran in, that's when half the town gets lit on fire because the party stole wanted to smoke an enemy out, that's when the party accidentally kills a prince because they waved a sword around while threatening him and he defended himself (poorly).

That's the kind of shit everyone talks about years later, not "your character came up with the idea to hide in the perfectly positioned hiding spot the DM pointed out to them".

 

[Adamska]

It's kinda tough to do but don't strangle creativity because you're being autistic with rules. If someone comes up with an idea (assuming it isn't just turbo-retard stuff) instead of saying no, think of some skillchecks to perform, challenges etc. If they want to do something crazy difficult let them know it's tricky and will take some extreme luck/ability.

I rewarded a player during my Shadowrun two-shot for asking if he could abuse video game logic and Puppeteer on the Agent in the Matrix he was fighting to make him "throw the game" so to speak. This was because said Agent was loosely based on a video game that its designer made that was a puzzle game, and its IC was fluffed to be like said puzzle game since it built the firewall up more.

That was creative, and he got more than enough net hits to do it.

The stubbornness of another player with paying back a Decker by geeking him was also rewarded due to good usage of skills and contacts to do so. He also very smartly used an item to ensure that what happened last time can't happen now.

If they come up with a decent solution or through grit have the tenacity, it's okay to reward them so long as you make them work for it.

 

[Revelator]

So I'm running Mutants and Masterminds, and I have a couple younglings in the game (14 and 17 respectively, but mentally they're about the same age). In the Pathfinder game that preceded it, they lost some characters to some really bad ideas and now they seem scared to try anything. I've been trying to directly ask them if they want to do anything, but they usually just shrug or attack. Any ideas to get them more involved?

 

[LovisXVI]

So I'm running Mutants and Masterminds, and I have a couple younglings in the game (14 and 17 respectively, but mentally they're about the same age). In the Pathfinder game that preceded it, they lost some characters to some really bad ideas and now they seem scared to try anything. I've been trying to directly ask them if they want to do anything, but they usually just shrug or attack. Any ideas to get them more involved?

Getting a cool NPC mentor can be a good way to get people into the right mindset. I did that once with a Catachan commando in a Dark Heresy game.

 

[Mr. Manchester]

So I'm running Mutants and Masterminds, and I have a couple younglings in the game (14 and 17 respectively, but mentally they're about the same age). In the Pathfinder game that preceded it, they lost some characters to some really bad ideas and now they seem scared to try anything. I've been trying to directly ask them if they want to do anything, but they usually just shrug or attack. Any ideas to get them more involved?

You could give them an extra life or something. I had a DM run a campaign where the party was given a rod of resurrection, the goal being to make it to an ancient tomb of some legendary hero to raise from the dead and save the village. It had three charges and the party only needed the one, so the other two were ways to bring someone back. I specifically remember the DM raining gnolls down the party in the middle of the casting by the heavily injured group and ruining it. That was cruel of him... so maybe let them find some kind of time orb or something that lets them reverse a decision once.

 

[Revelator]

Getting a cool NPC mentor can be a good way to get people into the right mindset. I did that once with a Catachan commando in a Dark Heresy game.

This is probably my best bet. I'm introducing NPC heroes now, so that's a good route.

You could give them an extra life or something. I had a DM run a campaign where the party was given a rod of resurrection, the goal being to make it to an ancient tomb of some legendary hero to raise from the dead and save the village. It had three charges and the party only needed the one, so the other two were ways to bring someone back. I specifically remember the DM raining gnolls down the party in the middle of the casting by the heavily injured group and ruining it. That was cruel of him... so maybe let them find some kind of time orb or something that lets them reverse a decision once.

Great idea, but it's not necessary for a superhero game.

 

[Judge Dredd]

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Nope not at my table.

It might because I'm sick have the dazed and confused conditions, but I'm going to play devils advocate here. Don't get me wrong, I think they'll fuck it up, not commit to the bit, and are only doing this to pander to the "modern audience".

But... I could see a use for this kind of thing.

Having one is a good way to encouraging players to do anything. It's how I've got my players to use metacurrencies, by asking an experienced player to regularly and often declare that they will use the metacurrency to improve a check, you can get the other players to remember to use it and know what contexts to use it in. Worked for Shadowrun and Star Wars FFG when I wanted people to use them.

You can also give them out (and revoke them) a lot. Meta currency unspent is lost after the session. Gaining currency at the start of any non-stupid combat, etc.

 

[Ghostse]

So I'm running Mutants and Masterminds, and I have a couple younglings in the game (14 and 17 respectively, but mentally they're about the same age). In the Pathfinder game that preceded it, they lost some characters to some really bad ideas and now they seem scared to try anything. I've been trying to directly ask them if they want to do anything, but they usually just shrug or attack. Any ideas to get them more involved?

I will say I'm infinitely more patient and cut a lot more slack for literal children, though getting into highschool age that would be getting slid back.
I'm also much, much for likely to take something dumb "I'm going to go punch the mayor" and either redirect "Why do you think your character would do that? Do you think the rest of the party wants you to do that? Wouldn't it better if they went and talked to their friend the innkeeper instead? " or reinterpret "You want to go confront the mayor, is that right? Your character would see the big guards near the mayor and probably wouldn't want to start a fight yet. So in the middle of the speech you stand up and ask him why the Gnolls knew where the caravan was, roll for charisma."
Instead of delivering immediate negative consequences like do for dumb adults.

I will also say that's about the age you start being awkward and judged by adults for being 'kids'.

I don't have any great ideas but somethings to try.
- Give them a push start. Come up with some fun stuff for them to try, especially stuff their character would notice, and suggest it. They might start looking and thinking on their own.
- Talk to the rest of the adults and casually mention what you're doing and try to get them to help - come up with their own cool ideas, come up with things to suggest the kids do, etc. but also to be a little softer when things implode. Failure stings a lot less when no one minds. "That would have been pretty cool if the dice had come up different", etc.
- Find out if maybe, just ZIP! PAF! POW! is just what the kids want to do.

Also, be extremely gentle with consequences for even dumb ideas as long as they aren't doubling down or just being disruptive.

If they come up with a decent solution or through grit have the tenacity, it's okay to reward them so long as you make them work for it.

100% agree.
There is a dumb idea, and there is a dumb idea they put in the work on.