Tabletop Roleplaying Games (D&D, Pathfinder, CoC, ETC.)

That's not a OSR mindset.
that's not OSR. I wonder if Mr. "OSR" DM's school of thought sprung up in response to wanting a low-lethality, long-interactive-story type game
I think that mindset comes from the idea from OSR that players should improvise and not lean on their character sheet, but taking that advice to the extreme. For combat, I've heard OSR advice that players should NOT charge in as 5e promotes, but that players should be setting traps, setting up ambushes, have cut off escape routs, make unorthodox use of items, and generally do everything they can to make the fight go their way before a single die is rolled.

From that base, it's a short hop to the often derided "theater kid" mindset of RPGs being a writing workshop. It's like horseshoe theory for RPGs.

Also, dying laughing at the implication that rolling dice to add chance to an outcome and not rely on consensus to resolve every single task or conflict = precursor to gambling addiction.
Same. That's why I have to assume he was joking. Why would you even play DnD if you believed that.

He's written some pretty good 5e supplements, like Kingdoms & Strongholds, that do some things WotC isn't interested in for expanding the breadth of the game. He's also a woke, troon-loving retard, but that's par for the course for anyone with a public face in this hobby.
He also wrote "Flee mortals", which I heard good things about because it 4e-ised the 5e monsters. I talked about that a few pages back. I assume Kingdoms and Strongholds is about city building?
 
For combat, I've heard OSR advice that players should NOT charge in as 5e promotes, but that players should be setting traps, setting up ambushes, have cut off escape routs, make unorthodox use of items, and generally do everything they can to make the fight go their way before a single die is rolled.
Sounds like a powergaming faggot with cargo cultist knowledge then.

Planning ahead is mainly because in OSR games, combat burned resources that can be a pain to regain. It's also because monsters as a whole tend to be smarter than you think they are. So committing to a fight can be risky, since that's resources you won't have if you run into an obligatory one.

However sometimes you know you can gank some fucking goblins with no issue, and those resources can be regained if you're just smart about setting your camp and keeping watches. If every fight requires this level of planning, then you should probably change games to ones that actually reward this better; like Shadowrun.
 
I think that mindset comes from the idea from OSR that players should improvise and not lean on their character sheet, but taking that advice to the extreme. For combat, I've heard OSR advice that players should NOT charge in as 5e promotes, but that players should be setting traps, setting up ambushes, have cut off escape routs, make unorthodox use of items, and generally do everything they can to make the fight go their way before a single die is rolled.

From that base, it's a short hop to the often derided "theater kid" mindset of RPGs being a writing workshop. It's like horseshoe theory for RPGs.


Same. That's why I have to assume he was joking. Why would you even play DnD if you believed that.


He also wrote "Flee mortals", which I heard good things about because it 4e-ised the 5e monsters. I talked about that a few pages back. I assume Kingdoms and Strongholds is about city building?
Strongholds and Followers adds in hirelings and stronghold building mechanics (castles, thief's guild, wizard tower, etc)
Kingdoms and Warfare adds kingdom management and large-scale army battle mechanics
Both are interesting things that make sense to be included in higher-level play as players become established in the world and make a name for themselves.
Most of what he puts out is mining older editions for good ideas and repackaging them, and bitching incessantly about conservatives/trump/whoever.
 
I think that mindset comes from the idea from OSR that players should improvise and not lean on their character sheet, but taking that advice to the extreme. For combat, I've heard OSR advice that players should NOT charge in as 5e promotes, but that players should be setting traps, setting up ambushes, have cut off escape routs, make unorthodox use of items, and generally do everything they can to make the fight go their way before a single die is rolled.
The maxim for OSR is usually "a fair combat encounter is a failure state for the players". Fair fights are for suckers, after all.

Looks like that retard thought getting into combat at all was a failure state, even though combat is going to be the default method for conflict resolution when stealth or diplomacy fails. Trying to claim combat is a "failure state" in a game about killing dragons in dungeons is beyond retarded.
 
Also I'm going to be blunt: if you are trying to tweak the magic in DnD because you do not like how wizards work... the game already does that. Sorcerers and Wizards can only pick x amount of spells to select from to represent their blood gift or their studies, and your build is based on that. Same with Clerics, Druids, and Bards, based on what they gain based on devotion, focus, and how their charm plays off.

You don't like the current system? There's another one you can play just fine that was mentioned in chat. Simple as.
Ummmm… was this meant for me?
 
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That's the most retarded take I've ever heard, and I know for a fact a decent majority of OSR guys would state upfront "Characters die. It will happen either due to misfortune or foolishness, but it will inevitably happen at a table.".
It's fucking imbecilic and a complete rejection of the entire concept of TTRPG. I've had games and even entire campaigns where even rolling a d20 was a rare event, but it was always possible, combat was always possible, and if there is no risk, it isn't even a game, it's just some fags pretending to be actors, and all of them have Main Character Syndrome.

These are the kinds I'd personally kill first, just to get them out of there, because their whining when they died would make them repellent to all the real players.
If you kill your enemies, they win.
Shut up Trudeau.

I know you know this, but when you kill your enemies, they DIE!
For combat, I've heard OSR advice that players should NOT charge in as 5e promotes, but that players should be setting traps, setting up ambushes, have cut off escape routs, make unorthodox use of items, and generally do everything they can to make the fight go their way before a single die is rolled.
But this actually IS a good idea. It's not to pretend the deadly dice aren't going to get rolled. It's knowing what the results could be if they are, and to have contingency plans aready, and when the worst case scenario shows up (it DOES), how do you respond?

Just like in a roguelike, whining about the RNG will not stop you from losing. DEALING with the absolute unfairness of the dice rolls (the RNG) is how you win. Can you cope with completely predictable bullshit? Congragulations, you're a loser.

Can you cope with the absolute worst possible shit the RNG spits out at you?

THAT is when you are a winner.
 
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If every fight requires this level of planning, then you should probably change games to ones that actually reward this better; like Shadowrun.
Fuck keebs. Cyberpunk 2020 is closer to d20 systematically, and doesn't have buttfucking elfs and pseudonigger trolls unless the character pays to be a knife-eared fruitcake or be-tusked yard ape.
Plus its firearms and melee combat can keep up with each other for the most part, and there's a time and place for each without needing a bigger bucket o' dice than Warhammer.

Now, to the actual point of planning.
The core 2020 rules(fuck RED, fuck 203X, they're both gay and retarded,) do have some helpful hints and tricks to make things go your way(find out where the guy sleeps, hit & fade, etc), though the system is over 30 years old, so some tweaking and adjustment might be in order for a modern table.
 
Apologies for just barging in like this, but can I mind asking you all a question? I see people talking about actual games here (which is far more than /tg/ nowadays can say for itself) which is why I thought it'd be a good idea to ask how you guys find players for games/games to join. I've been in this hobby for almost 5 years now, played pretty much everything under the sun with my friends, but now one table is practically dead (:_( and the other table I'm stuck as the forever DM of. And I've gotten pretty tired of forever DM'ing in the latter, so I've told my players that once this current game wraps up, I'm gonna be doing other things for a bit.

There's two major problems with that, though: 1) I've only ever played with friends and friends of friends, so I'm kind of at a loss on how people do this stuff "in the wild," so to speak, and 2) Local games and the very concept of an FLGS just don't exist where I live, which confines me to pursuing this hobby online. So, if I may ask, where do you guys usually go looking and how do you do it (if anyone has experience with that)?
 
So, if I may ask, where do you guys usually go looking and how do you do it (if anyone has experience with that)?
I also mostly play online. I've honestly had the most success in finding games on the dedicated discords for particular games. Especially LFG listings that have you fill out a questionnaire to apply since that usually filters out the flakes and retards.

It also helps when you have DMs that put their foot down and go "This is a space for this game and nothing else". The one game I'm a player in has a thembie but because the DM's lack of tolerance of bring up unrelated shit I wouldn't have even known if I hadn't made the mistake of clicking on their profile.

Do not ever use r/LFG. I made that mistake twice and its all troons, autists with negative social skills and 13 year olds who watched too much Critical Role.

Also never use the Roll20 forums. They are flakiest niggers I've ever met in my fucking life. Many years ago before Discord I used that to recruit and it took accepting something crazy like 15 people before I got 3 to actually show up to even 1 session.
 
So, if I may ask, where do you guys usually go looking and how do you do it (if anyone has experience with that)?
Based on what I've read in the gamefinder threads I'd avoid the /tg/ gamefinder discords like the plague. I have pulled a good player off one of the threads, but I only left an email contact.

There have also been groups that formed here, but if you were to try to recruit/join games off KF I'd encourage a greater degree of caution. You never know what kind of skibidi schizos will try to get in.
 
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You say that like it is a good thing.
It is, when it's not d20 exactly. d20 itself is a shitheap, especially for anything but mindless dungeon-diving fun.
Interlock(which uses a d10) is a decrepit shitheap, too, but with some marked differences;
Stat Bonuses. They only apply to a few specific things, like Bodytype's Bodytype Modifier for soaking up pain, or dishing out goodnight punches. Everything else is raw stat score + raw skill score + 1d10, against fairly reasonable Difficulties. This is where WotC's 3e got it the most wrong when they were cribbing off of Cyberpunk's homework in the late 90s, while they were publishing the Netrunner CCG. WotC just straight up doubled the values without checking the balance.

Health. It doesn't go up, unless you get chromed out, and even then, you still gotta get it fixed after it gets shot up or chopped up. Your tailored antibodies and healgood juice ain't doing shit for the Black & Decker jack-o-tron you call an arm. Hell, it can actually go down, if you did something stupid like caught cancer from radiation or bad genesplicing. Also, each increment of damage impacts your capabilities negatively. Sometimes, though, you're beefy enough where some stuff doesn't hurt you as badly as it does the average person, and real wimps get hurt by everything.

Luck points. Antsy about a roll? Spend a little luck. At the least, it'll save you from a critical failure.

Armor. It doesn't magically make you harder to hit. It just puts itself between you and the bullet, knife, punch, whatever, if that's where you got hit. You can protect your head, torso, arms, and legs, and some finicky sub-locations might have listed protection or lack of protection. Sucks to be you if you got hit by a critical or a carefully-targeted shot, though.

Difficulties(DC). From 10 to 30+. You only see 30+ on really impossible shit, like if you're trying to program some giga-program or cook up some hypermeth.
To-hit. If it's archery or hth/melee, you get to roll Dodge or a Martial Arts check against your attacker. If it's gunfire other than trying to get through a suppressive fire zone, the gunman checks against a range bracket's difficulty, modified by the target's size and movement. Trying to get through a suppressive fire zone? Divide the Rate of Fire by the area's width; that's your Acrobatics difficulty.

HtH/Melee vs Firearms. If you're just Brawling or using a chair leg, you're just brawling or using a chairleg. Just straight weapon/attack damage plus your melee damage bonus. If you're a trained boxer, or a trained swordsman, you get to add some of that skill's value to your damage output. Firearms? Each bullet hits for its damage, but each bullet also has to contend with the armor it hits, if any.

HtH/Melee, specifically Knives vs Baseball Bats. Knives have their own specific Armor Penetration type against Soft Armors.

Firearms, specifically ammo types. Hollow Points do shitloads against unarmored targets, Armor Piercing punches through armor, but also punches through meat without doing a whole lot, Incindiary burns, and then you get in to the wacky shit like Flechettes and combined types.

Firearms, specifically shotguns. Close in, it does a lot in a little space. Further out, it spreads its love across several yards. Beyond that, you're just annoying people.

Firearms, specifically automatic fire. Each one has a Rate of Fire attribute, based on cyclic rate and trigger squeeze. Sure, an M60 might have 600 rounds per minute cyclic, but that's per minute. Expect something more like 20-30 on its in-game rate of fire, over 3 seconds.

Boomex. Explody things. The first brick does what you expect. Additional bricks, barrels, etc, of boomy stuffs in the same area have diminishing returns.

What makes it a decrepit shitheap?
The second printing was printed of 2020 was when I was chasing my classmates with slugs I found in the playground.

Reflexes are the godstat. This can be adjusted/fixed easily. Spread the love over some of the less-utilized stats, like Bodytype for Brawling and strength-based Martial Arts(Boxing, Sambo, etc) or Movement Allowance for Dodging. Maybe even situational uses of other stats. Quick reflexive fire? Reflexes. Sniping? Technical Ability.

All the skills. You have about 44-60 skill points in RAW, plus whatever your Lifepath grants you(yeah, Lifepath, like Traveller, but with less risk of dying in character generation. It can just make you WISH you had died in prison from the plague and experiences that gave you a chihuahua's chill, while your off-and-on tries to kill you at every turn with the full backing of the Military Intelligence Community,) against about a hundred different skills that can get you into trouble if you try them with only a few points in them. Consider paring down the pointless ones and making all the really important ones into Traits or something that cost about the same as 1-4 ranks of a normal skill, but tied to their 'parent' skills(Pharmaceuticals tied to Chemistry, Accounting and Physics tied to Mathematics, etc,)

Skill points. As said before, in RAW, you have 44-60 skill points(40 from Career Package, INT + REF in pick-up skills), plus whatever you lucked into in Lifepath. Instead, consider just blanket-granting 60 skill points, especially if you're doing the Traits suggestion.

Humanity Loss and starting cyberware. I like the idea of cyberware having a psychological and a physiological impact. Imagine the junk electronics today, screaming into your nervous system, and the roid rage/troon rage of modern weirdos being granted access to powerfantasy-fulfilling augmentations and hormone-disrupting novel organs. That said, if choomba got his arm blowed off in the SouAm brushfire wars and got himself a chrome replacement, maybe he's had time to come to terms with it. Offer newly-rolled characters a bit of a buffer if the player can come up with some good storytelling on how and why they got their chrome. Maybe base it off their Cool, like how Bodytype grants a bit of damage reduction. Maybe include it as a Lifepath option, or a Trait; Coming to Grips with your Chrome.
 
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Interlock(which uses a d10) is a decrepit shitheap, too, but with some marked differences;
I know how Interlock works (in fact I have recommended Interlock unlimited to someone looking for info to run Cyberpunk as it is both free and superior to the garbage that is RED), I simply do not care for flat probability systems as a rule.
 
I simply do not care for flat probability systems as a rule.
Fair. I myself have a frothing contempt for dicepool systems above about 5-6 dice, and doubly so for anything like GURPS' additive or old Storyteller's 1s-cancel-successes, for chaining people to the tyranny of the bell curve.
 
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how you guys find players for games/games to join
Local games and the very concept of an FLGS just don't exist where I live
I know the feeling, and I'm largely in the same boat. I don't know how long you've been lurking, but I'll go off on my usual rant at the end of the post.

As for advice. Currently I don't have anything to go off of. Like @Acrid Alchemist said, game specific discords seem to be the best option. I'd advise against broader RPG discords as they tend to be bad. For example, one server demanded I DM for the mods in order to get the DM role, and I'd have to run my campaign on their discord server so they could moderate it. I noped out immediately and privately messaged a few users that might be interested in the concept.

I've had limited success asking about RPGs in other, non-RPG discords. So if you're in a server where a bunch of people are Star Trek fans, you might get a few bites for a Star Trek TTRPG. But this ties into my rant.


Now my often repeated rant. Not copy pasted because it's fun for me to go off.

The current TTRPG landscape, and hobby landscape in general, is in shambles atm. A lot of people that got into TTRPGs in the last decade seem to have grown bored and have moved on, leaving empty tables. The few who do remain tend to not be people you really want to play with. "That guy"s, power gamers, furries (I don't mind furries tbh), and the like. Playing anything that wasn't 5e was a challenge before, but almost impossible now. Not helped by everyone having their own prefered house rules and setting bullshit. The only other game that seems to get players now-a-days is Gorgeworld, which I'm told is a furry fat fetish game.

Even the model of the "FLGS" is obsolette. As I discovered recently. Dice are hard to come by, and shops are interested in selling and not playing. The logic being that if you aren't buying, you're wasting their time. So things are more available than ever with any book you could want available via PDF or even print-on-demand, but there's noone to play with. "Nerd shops" that once sold comic books, board games, and manga now sell Funko Pops, Gunpla, and pride flags. Gaming clubs don't exist in my area and the one that does is prohibitively expensive.

I don't mind being the forever DM. But there's only so much a can-do attitude can get you. Part of me is tempted to throw my hands up and give up. After my current campaign wraps up, that might be the case. I'm hesitent to put money down on more books if they'll never get used.
 
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