Russian Special Military Operation in the Ukraine - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

So, internal copium has begun. Sorry in advance for rough telegram's translation
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Gregis said:
I'm sure everyone here is most interested in discussing recent diplomatic developments, but I'm wondering about the context in which they're taking place, in terms of concrete facts of how the war is going on the ground. I'd be grateful if anyone would be willing to give a rundown of how things stand for someone who has not been following closely for a while.
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The same way they had for the last six months plus: Russia slowly continues its advances all along the front.

Ukraine keeps wasting men holding a village in Kursk.

Russia keeps hitting strategically and tactically important targets every night. Ukrainian AA is mostly 404.
 
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biglurker said:
Ukraine needs HUGE backing if it can hope to survive the coming decades. He knows they want the war to end, but insults them to their faces for daring to not continue the hopeless meatgrinder. Zelensky is both retarded and high off his own propaganda. Before today, I thought this war would end with Ukraine retaining land and not being reduced to a rump state. Unless something changes quickly, I doubt the entire country will even exist within 2 years max.
Hell, if I were Trump I would not just end weapon shipments but also pause all sanctions on Russia over this shit.
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Trump even said during his campaign trail, his support for Russia or Ukraine in the conflict would be based on their willingness to make good faith negotiations. The facts on the ground show clearly that even with strong western support for years Ukraine cannot hold on to all of its territory militarily, so any truly good faith negotiation offer from Zelensky is going to have to have official territorial concessions.
 
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Gregis said:
Hm, given the attrition balance do you think that opening another front with the Kursk offensive was not conducive to Ukrainian war aims, in that it shortens their timelines? Or perhaps maintaining it gives some leverage in negotiations when it comes to territory?
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Sorry for the late reply but I'll try to add some info the other repliers have left out.

To start off with the premise that the area, which is largely made up of rural towns and wilderness, could be used to trade more valuable land was never going to happen, even if they did capture the Kursk nuclear power plant. Legally speaking the Kursk salient is considered just as Russian as Kherson oblast is, and rather than being a worthless talking point this is a sentiment genuinely believed by the Russian government, so trying to do it would be as pointless as Hitler negotiating with the British in 1944 by dangling the occupied Channel Islands.

From a military point of view however it was a colossal mistake. I have said before here that if they left as soon as they were pushed back from the plant they would have succeeded in gaining good PR, but the fact they stayed has turned it against them. The area they took can only be described as logistics hell. There is only 1 major road from Ukraine to the salient and it has always been in range of Russian drones. The terrain is filled with forests and rivers which has complicated defences rather than helped them. And now that the recent Russian incursion into Sumy has established direct fire control over the main road its going to be a million times more painful to get supplies and men through...

And that is by far the biggest problem. This is a war of attrition. Ukraine has fortified the Donbass for the past decade and the Southern front for the past 3 years. The tens of thousands of men and irreplaceable western equipment lost would have been able to inflict heavier losses on the Russians if they were used to defend far better and fortified positions instead of forced to dig new trenches in the middle of nowhere. Not enough to change the outcome of the war, but certainly enough to buy them more time.
 
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Krokodil Overdose said:
View attachment 7039150

Just saw this on Telegram. If true, it would explain why things went to pot so fast.
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on one hand I understand that the military get up is Zelensky's shtick on the other hand, how does Zelensky not realize that Trump is that kind of old man who finds formalities like suits very important to him?



Who the fuck is the advisor for Zelensky? It's really telling that when Bibi goes to America he puts on a suit and tie but when talking to the Israeli public he's either tie-less or not wearing a suit at all (Israeli's tend not to wear suits to formal things instead choosing to wear button ups or polos, it's a culture/weather thing).


How are the Ukrainans so out of touch? Trump is not Obama or Biden, he takes professionalism (or at least business professionalism) seriously. The only reason why Elon is able to run around dressed like that is because he is the richest guy in America.
 
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I haven't had this good of a time laughing at a junkie loser since Nick Rekieta did the Cokestream. This is just glorious, the absolute inverse of the years and years of western propaganda and knowledge all my money was going to this clown just crashing down all at once. I finally know how all those Trump fanboys in that thread feel 24/7, and it's glorious. Keep it up, Z-Man!
 
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Jump said:
This is basic bitch Good cop/Bad cop stuff. Zman completely screwed it up. Even if Vance was being completely out of line the only correct move for Zman would have been to shut the fuck up. Zman's coked up mind somehow thought he could get Trump to side with him over his VP. It was completely over after that.

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That's kinda my point, If you're going to someone's place to ask for help you don't start a fight in public. Idk what make Z talk like that IN FRONT OF THE PRESS. I can understand talking like that behind closed doors but wtf man America is the largest arms supplier in the world and you have the US public's support all you had to do was play nice for the cameras. This isn't the UN retard
 
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Lmao, this coked out nigger declared that he doesn't owe Trump an apology and that he's 'not sure' he did something bad on Fox. He also consneeds that yes, he was actually supposed to just be there to sign the damn mineral deal, but insisted on sperging out anyway because it's 'not enough'. Furthermore the ingrate outright says he wouldn't even return to the White House & sign said deal if he was given a second chance right now, he's absolutely insistent that if Ukraine can't get into NATO he still really fucking wants NATO boots in Ukraine (doesn't articulate it too well but he makes it sound like he wants commitments on that level on top of signing the deal before he will grace the Orange Imperator with his presence again?), etc.




Are we actually going to end up witnessing the dawn of a Russo-American alliance against globohomo neomarxist-neolib faggotry by the end of spring, 2025? Because it feels like Zelensky, people like Nuland and the Eurocuck leaders are striving mightily and straight up speedrunning to make it happen.

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Chuckwagon said:
Lmao, this coked out nigger declared that he doesn't owe Trump an apology and that he's 'not sure' he did something bad on Fox. He also consneeds that yes, he was actually supposed to just be there to sign the damn mineral deal, but insisted on sperging out anyway because it's 'not enough'.
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Turbo based, somebody needs to push orangenigger back, he's used to everyone around him being a limpwristed pushover, he's surprised when met with the barest minimum resistance.
 
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Gregis said:
Please do not apologize, I am very grateful for your input! I essentially strolled in and asked to be spoonfed the understanding I could have gained by simply reading the last 100 pages of both threads, or doing other research.
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A good comparison I've heard is that this war currently resembles the Eastern Front of WW2 after Stalingrad and Citadel. We know the outcome, but there's still a lot of ground to cover between the present and the end of the war.
 
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Chuckwagon said:
he still really fucking wants NATO boots in Ukraine (doesn't articulate it too well but he makes it sound like he wants commitments on that level on top of signing the deal before he will grace the Orange Imperator with his presence again?)
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More like to "new NATO with Ukraine in it", "new NATO based around Ukraine", something along these lines, he said it before
 
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So, in the last couple of weeks or so Z has had an agreement with Trump and walked it back, twice.

First it was the very sudden 180 when Trump made those angry tweets, because Z had refused to sign the deal that they had agreed on when his folks went over to Kiev to have shit signed.
Z suddenly walked it back wanted to re-negotiate. Trump got very mad when someone broke an agreement they had and made those tweeks.

Macron sweet talks Trump and Trump then is open to a new signing of the deal. Rubio negotiates with Z, rubio tells Trump they have a solid agreement and Trump invites Z to the whitehouse. The formality to sign the deal and nothing else.

Z arrives at whitehouse and for a second time refuses to sign the deal they agreed on. Then starts sperging on tv wanting to re-negotiate in front of the camera and tells the VP he is a "fucking bitch". Trump gets pissed and sends Z away without a lunchbox and no cheese-burgers.


EDIT: to be honest, Z is probably the only person in the world that has managed to break the same agreement with trump, twice. Will he go for a hat-trick? I mean, letting Z fool him the same way twice surely must hurt Trumps ego as being the "great negotiator". You let the same guy fool you in a business deal, TWICE. That does not sound like you are a very good negotiator or businessman at all.
 
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