Official Kiwi forums Catholic hate thread because we needed one

[Rekieta’s Broken Penis]

So here's my rant.

The only mildly problematic thing in that entire rant is the guy who somewhat tactlessly remonstrated that your grandparents died outside of the Church.

 

[Peepeepoopoo Witch]

The only mildly problematic thing in that entire rant is the guy who somewhat tactlessly remonstrated that your grandparents died outside of the Church.

The Papist church is just another human institution that plays no role in salvation nor is it the one true church, so it doesn't matter. God doesn't obey or heed the Vatican.

 

[Justice Tony]

God doesn't obey or heed the Vatican.

We never claimed, nor would we ever claim, that He does. It's quite the opposite actually. The Vatican obeys and heeds God.

"NO! NO! PROTESTANTS ARE IDOLATROUS PAGAN DEMON WORSHIPPERS!!!" *lights a candle with the face of some schizo saint who tried to teach birds about Christianity*

Don't you dare mock St. Francis. He was great and it's that kind of childlike wonder that makes people holy.

 

[Peepeepoopoo Witch]

We never claimed, nor would we ever claim, that He does. It's quite the opposite actually. The Vatican obeys and heeds God.

They would not have the long history of committing and enabling evil while boasting that their church has never erred. If the Pope truly were equal to Peter he would've smote all those pedophiles and everyone in the hierarchy complicit in covering it up. Paul made himself very clear about not tolerating church members who do things that are evil even by "worldly" standards.

I do really like St. Francis even though I don't agree with him on everything.

 

[The Poopsmith]

Arius was right, and I'm tired of pretending he wasn't

 

[Justice Tony]

They would not have the long history of committing and enabling evil while boasting that their church has never erred.

Yeah, theologically inerrent. Not morally. We never claimed that.

 

[Sargon's wife's son]

Guess what the subhuman Catholic Porch monkey pet worshiper Just screwed over Donald J Trump probably because all of that money was being handed off to a pedophile trafficking network known as the Catholic Church god hates Catholicism and may Allah awaken the people to the evil doing of the Catholics and the state of Israel

 

[Derrick]

Yeah, theologically inerrent.

While I think the Catholic Church is largely a good organization it is a bit dishonest to call them, "theologically inerrent" when it isn't, perhaps the most obvious example is the Church arresting and sentencing Galileo to house arrest for publishing a book favorable to Heliocentrism (the idea the Earth revolves around the sun) in 1633, something the church has largely walked back in the 19th and 20th centuries unbanning his book and quietly dropping its geocentrism in favor Heliocentrism. Of course this puts those in favor of an innerrent Catholic Church in a bit of bad spot, either they were in error when they taught Heliocentrism was heretical in the 17th century, or they are in error now by dropping their support for a stationary Earth at the center of the Solar System. Since these are two contradictionary points the Church had to be wrong at some point during this fiasco.

Beyond this I can think of a few ways the Catholic Church is in error in comparison to God's word even today, their position's on Creationsim, Mary's perputal virginity, and purgatory (something even the Orthodox reject) for example have them out of step with the Bible. That's not to say the Catholic Church isn't a good organization that gets things "mostly right" but it is to say they can't be called "theologically inerrent".

 

[Justice Tony]

While I think the Catholic Church is largely a good organization it is a bit dishonest to call them, "theologically inerrent" when it isn't, perhaps the most obvious example is the Church arresting and sentencing Galileo to house arrest for publishing a book favorable to Heliocentrism (the idea the Earth revolves around the sun) in 1633, something the church has largely walked back in the 19th and 20th centuries unbanning his book and quietly dropping its geocentrism in favor Heliocentrism. Of course this puts those in favor of an innerrent Catholic Church in a bit of bad spot, either they were in error when they taught Heliocentrism was heretical in the 17th century, or they are in error now by dropping their support for a stationary Earth at the center of the Solar System. Since these are two contradictionary points the Church had to be wrong at some point during this fiasco.

The Church is inerrant in matters of faith and morals, not science. Galileo never should have been tried as a heretic because the Faith has nothing to do with whether the sun revolves around the earth or vice versa.

Beyond this I can think of a few ways the Catholic Church is in error in comparison to God's word even today, their position's on Creationsim, Mary's perputal virginity, and purgatory (something even the Orthodox reject) for example have them out of step with the Bible. That's not to say the Catholic Church isn't a good organization that gets things "mostly right" but it is to say they can't be called "theologically inerrent".

The Church is right about all those things. You are anathema.

 

[Derrick]

The Church is inerrant in matters of faith and morals, not science. Galileo never should have been tried as a heretic because the Faith has nothing to do with whether the sun revolves around the earth or vice versa.

I think you're making an argument in semantics here. The Church declared Heliocentrism as heretical (a term literally used by the Church). Since they had declared it heretical it was a matter of Faith and theology, an official part of Church teachings. If you agree official Church positions on certain issues can be wrong you're halfway there to admitting it's not an infallible body.

The Church is right about all those things.

I guess I should have explained why the Catholic Church's positions are out of step with the Bible (I'm making the claim after all, so the burden of proof is on me).

On Creationism the Church, since the time of Pope John Paul II, while not explicitly endorsing Evolution has allowed it as an acceptable theory on Creation. This of course contradicts Genesis in several ways in that, it suggests life took Millions of years to come into it's final form while Genesis 1:4-31 suggests it took place over 6 days. Additionally most models of Evolution contradicts Genesis by suggesting stars and planets formed before vegetation on Earth, whereas Genesis 1:11-19 claims Plant life began on Earth the day before the stars were formed. Finally the theory of Evolution contradicts the Bible by suggesting Adam and Eve weren't the real literal first people while Luke 3:23-38 traces Jesus back, generation by generation, directly to Adam and Eve, implying he viewed them as literal people. By allowing for Evolution the Catholic Church is cosigning a theory which is at odds with Genesis.



On Mary the Catholic Church contradicts the Bible in that it suggests Mary was perputally a Virgin, a claim that is not only absent from the Bible, but contradicts it. At several points in the Bible Jesus was referred to have brothers and sisters, Brothers and Sisters who were absent during his birth story (meaning they can't have come from a first marriage). In fact there are two verses in Matthew that pretty much kill the idea Mary was a perpetual virgin. The First, Matthew 1:25 literally states that Joseph, "and did not know her till she had brought forth her firstborn Son. And he called His name Jesus". The word till here implying the pair became sexually active after his Jesus's birth. Additionally in a second verse, Matthew 2:20, God tells Joseph to, “Arise, take the young Child and His mother, and go to the land of Israel, for those who sought the young Child’s life are dead.” As you'll notice God fails to tell Joseph to take any of his supposed previous children with him away from the incoming slaughter by Herods men to Egypt, killing the idea Jesus's brothers and sisters were half-siblings from any previous marriage. Basically if Mary was perpetually a virgin Matthew never knew about it

If you're curious about where the idea of Mary being a perpetual virgin comes from there's actually a pretty mundane answer. During the 2nd century AD Jesus's detractors, having heard the story of the Virgin birth, started a rumor that Mary conceived Jesus with a Roman soldier called Panthera, this rumor can be found in the writings of the two earliest Christian detractors, anti-Christian writer Celsus (170 AD) and in the Talmud (200 AD), but presumably they got it from earlier Christ Haters. Given that the earliest definetive mention of Mary's perpetual virginity comes from around this time in, the Infancy Gospel of James, 150 AD, (though Papias may have made an indirect reference to it in 100 AD) Mary's perpetual was likely, therefor, to be a response to the rumors, the early Church was basically saying, "No, no Mary didn't commit Adulty, she was too pure for that, in fact she was so pure she never had sex ever!), though the Bible insinutates that she and Joseph did have some children after Jesus's birth, an inconvient fact for the Catholic Church.



On Purgatory the Catholic Church errs because... well just because it's nowhere in the Bible. The Bible mentions two destinations you may go to for an eternity after you die (Matthew 25:46) but neither is purgatory, in fact not even the Eastern Orthodox recognize Puragtory, the Catholic Church standing alone in this seemingly a-Biblical position.

 

[Fuck Bankers]

I was born and raised Catholic, and I have little to no tolerance for Catholics anymore.

Catholics have become such spineless faggots over the years.

And the Pope is a pedophile commie.

Thought about joining the Orthodox Church?

 

[Sargon's wife's son]

Thought about joining the Orthodox Church?

Don't join the Russian or Greek church you're going to be very very disturbed on how weirdly poor Russia and Greek they are join the American Orthodox Church

 

[Fuck Bankers]

Don't join the Russian or Greek church you're going to be very very disturbed on how weirdly poor Russia and Greek they are join the American Orthodox Church

I'm just going to the Church closest to me. I went to an Antiochian, which was from 2,000 evangelicals that converted in the 70s. Really great church, it was an hour 45 away. The closest one is Serbian so I go to the Serbian one now.

 

[Rekieta’s Broken Penis]

the most obvious example is the Church arresting and sentencing Galileo to house arrest for publishing a book favorable to Heliocentrism (the idea the Earth revolves around the sun) in 1633, something the church has largely walked back in the 19th and 20th centuries unbanning his book and quietly dropping its geocentrism in favor Heliocentrism

I think the Galileo thing is overblown. The accepted scientific consensus had been geocentrism since the time of Aristotle. Galileo was a bit of a sperg for going around asserting that what was at the time an unproven theory was correct (not just that it was a working mathematical model of the universe), getting into arguments with priests about scripture, and then writing a book calling the Pope a retard. There also was never really any claims that the church was infallible as regards this topic - his verdict wasn’t even unanimous.

 

[Derrick]

I think the Galileo thing is overblown. The accepted scientific consensus had been geocentrism since the time of Aristotle. Galileo was a bit of a sperg for going around asserting that what was at the time an unproven theory was correct (not just that it was a working mathematical model of the universe), getting into arguments with priests about scripture, and then writing a book calling the Pope a retard.

You're right that both scientists and theologians alike opposed Galileo's theory (there were, under the existing theories of the time real scientific principles heliocentrism seemed to violated). My point is that the church declared Galileo, and his teachings on the sun heretical, they cited Psalms indicating the Earth's foundation was unmoving as their evidence, geocentrism was the Church's official position, which I believe they dropped in the 19th and 20th century however.

The problem is these are two contradictory positions, either the Earth rotates the sun or the sun rotates around the Earth, since they both can't be true at the same time we can conclude the Church was either wrong then or wrong now, it's official positions bunk.

There also was never really any claims that the church was infallible

This really cuts to the heart of the matter. Catholics will say, "The Church is infallible". And then you can press them with things like Galileo and they will say, "Well, ok but only on religious matters," (as if that can be seperated) and then you press them on that and they say, "OK well, what I really mean is the Church is infalliable when the Pope invokes Papal Infallibility" which has only happened like a handful of times (outside of canonizing saints) since being defined in the 1870s. And it's like, at what point do you just go, "OK it's can be very fallible".

I don't mean this to demean or dispariage Catholics, I think Roman Catholicism is a mostly good Religion and as a Christian if somebody told me they converted to from Atheist to Catholic I'd be happy. I just think Catholics are being a bit dishonest when they claim to be 100% infallible 100% of the time (like their God or something) as if their church hasn't made a single mistake or wrong declaration in 2,000 years. If they had a truely flawless track record of zero mistakes in their 2,000 year history it'd make a compelling case for the Catholic Church, but as we saw with the Galileo incident, they do not, because human beings do occasionally make mistakes, and given a couple thousands years anyone short of Christ lible to slip up once in a while.

 

[Gregis]

The problem is these are two contradictory positions, either the Earth rotates the sun or the sun rotates around the Earth, since they both can't be true at the same time

This is exactly incorrect; the Sun and Earth each orbit a point in between the center of each; this point is within the volume of the Sun.

 

[Sargon's wife's son]

This really cuts to the heart of the matter. Catholics will say, "The Church is infallible". And then you can press them with things like Galileo and they will say, "Well, ok but only on religious matters," (as if that can be seperated) and then you press them on that and they say, "OK well, what I really mean is the Church is infalliable when the Pope invokes Papal Infallibility" which has only happened like a handful of times (outside of canonizing saints) since being defined in the 1870s. And it's like, at what point do you just go, "OK it's can be very fallible".

Catholics don't believe in what they're saying they just need to be put to the soy because they are heretics who make **** up and are basically running an international criminal conspiracy attending to be a religion every single Catholic church and every single Protestant orthodox country should be put to the torch and its members should be asked to leave same thing with Muslims and Jews actually I've had less issues with Jews than I have with Catholics the Jews can at least defend their positions somewhat Catholics they cannot

 

[ChromaQuack]

More like CAT-holics am I right? har-de-har.

 

[Ughubughughughughughghlug]

I recently had the displeasure at being at an academic (so everybody there was turbo-autistic already) event with a ton of C*tholics. During Ash Wednesday, actually. I got a sense of what really drives my dislike of them, which is much more vivid online but comes through even in person. There's this extreme arrogance that they act like they're more important, not just correct - it's a tautology that a person believes their beliefs are correct - but are in some sort of favored class that they can loudly show off their Catholicism, make cracks about other sects/theologies and expect everyone to know about/be deferential to their shit even when they wander into a place that is most definitely not their country (the South).

There's asshole Evangelicals out there, but really most of the time when they get showy in public it's either at a dedicated event (like a protest or something) or is presented in an ecumenical fashion so broad ("Juedo-" Christian) that it's welcoming to 99% of the population. And I think a huge part of it is that while Protestants may be the majority, there is no Protestant culture to speak of, it is a broad coalition of churches. They're split up among countless churches with different practices and attitudes and what not, and so they tend to keep that shit to themselves and be more thoughtful. But a C*tholic doesn't think that way, because there's always other Catholics around (big enough share of the population) to give them an exaggerated sense of how numerous they are, not to mention the Jewish media cartel promoting that too.

There's other problems with them. It's a religion for bootlickers, same kind of niggercattle that defer to government agencies or mass media for all their opinions. To them, because their religion is very old and has the kind of infrastructure of wealth and power, they think that proves their case and walk around overstuffed. Exact opposite attitude of Jesus' bunch. And this then bleeds into cultural and political values too, love a big government, love more authoritarianism. And when there's a church that has a similar shtick, you see the fangs come out on both sides, is why Catholics (and an Orthodox at the thing) are the most rabid Mormon haters I see, because somebody else claiming to be the One True Church takes the piss out of their own pretensions. They'll jab at Protestants for claiming their particular theology is true (missing the point that Protestants don't consider "the Church" to be some manmade institution, but the Christian body of believers collectively), but deep down inside they know there's a difference because Restorationists (Jehovah's Witnesses are another) make them feel threatened.

Bootlickers. Ought to fuck off back to Europe. Shame it didn't get wiped out back in the Reformation.

tl;dr fuck these assholes, John Calvin and the KKK were right about them.

I'm real conflicted about the KKK because I've come to realize that their basic worldview was essentially correct, but they were also massive degenerates and nuisances. It's the 2nd KKK (Wilson era) that I'm interested in. The irony is that the only group they had beef with that I don't is the Blacks, but their attitude towards specific immigrant groups, religions and socialists was all rock solid. Problem, these shits were running around terrorizing White Protestants too, terrorizing unions that were socialist but had valid grievances, they were thugs lead by killers and rapists. Wound up doing a lot of damage to their own cause.

 

[Bonesjones]

This really cuts to the heart of the matter. Catholics will say, "The Church is infallible". And then you can press them with things like Galileo and they will say, "Well, ok but only on religious matters," (as if that can be seperated) and then you press them on that and they say, "OK well, what I really mean is the Church is infalliable when the Pope invokes Papal Infallibility" which has only happened like a handful of times (outside of canonizing saints) since being defined in the 1870s. And it's like, at what point do you just go, "OK it's can be very fallible".

It's just motte and Bailey arguments, they will say anything to protect the Catholic church, so you end up in circular conversations about how all the stuff they are wrong about doesn't actually count because they can't face criticism of their real god, the catholic church.

I just think Catholics are being a bit dishonest when they claim to be 100% infallible 100% of the time (like their God or something) as if their church hasn't made a single mistake or wrong declaration in 2,000 years.

They either know they are being dishonest or it's massive cognitive dissonance. Remember they side with the Pope even when he directly contradicts the Bible itself.

If they had a truely flawless track record of zero mistakes in their 2,000 year history it'd make a compelling case for the Catholic Church, but as we saw with the Galileo incident, they do not, because human beings do occasionally make mistakes, and given a couple thousands years anyone short of Christ lible to slip up once in a while.

The Bible only says you have to look at what fruit a tree gives to tell you if it's good or bad. Christianity is the simplest religion there is.

There's other problems with them. It's a religion for bootlickers, same kind of niggercattle that defer to government agencies or mass media for all their opinions.

Just look at any time Preacher gets ran into a corner. He complains no one is smart enough to talk about religion besides his clergy. What a coward faggot.

when there's a church that has a similar shtick, you see the fangs come out on both sides, is why Catholics (and an Orthodox at the thing) are the most rabid Mormon haters I see, because somebody else claiming to be the One True Church takes the piss out of their own pretensions.

It's because they aren't protecting the religion, they are protecting the church. It's never been about religion at all for Catholics, just the business.

They'll jab at Protestants for claiming their particular theology is true (missing the point that Protestants don't consider "the Church" to be some manmade institution, but the Christian body of believers collectively)

They don't care because prots either work together in their Jewish hegemonic wealth schemes or aren't in threat of overthrowing the business of stealing money. That's why they stopped fighting jews and Muslims centuries ago.

I'm real conflicted about the KKK because I've come to realize that their basic worldview was essentially correct, but they were also massive degenerates and nuisances.

There's multiple distinct versions of the KKK, that are only similar in name.