Greer v. Moon, No. 20-cv-00647 (D. Utah Sep. 16, 2020)

Will the Magistrate grant Greer's request to post bond?

  • Yes

    Votes: 96 24.6%
  • No

    Votes: 141 36.1%
  • The Magistrate will set a higher bond than Greer asked

    Votes: 98 25.1%
  • The Magistrate will deny the motion, and threaten jail time

    Votes: 56 14.3%

  • Total voters
    391
Remember, Hardin tried to compel Russ to amend his complaint, Russ whined and the Judge said no, probably to protect him from this very thing, then when the scheduling conference happened at long last and the Judge finally told Russ in as many words that everything else is dismissed, this is only a copyright case now, Russ himself asked for leave to amend!

It was a hail Mary reset button attempt from Hardin Russ successfully fought off, but of his own accord, asked to do to himself anyway! So he doesn't even have the excuse "Hardin made me do it!"
 
We don't want a dismissal for jurisdiction anyway. As I read FRCP 41(b), dismissal for jurisdiction would NOT count as adjudication on the merits:



(Emphasis mine.) If it gets dismissed, we want it to be the good kind, like plaintiff's failure to prosecute, etc.
Pretty sure the statute of limitations has long since expired on this and any kind of dismissal would mean it's over for good. No?
 
Can't count the number of lawyers I've known who've never seen the inside of a courtroom, even on retirement.
There's literally nothing wrong with it either. Lots of law practice just goes on under the view of the public. You have research, transactional stuff, simply advisory matters. None of this ends up in court.

Law is not Denny Crane. At least not mostly. It's more motion practice guys like the literally autistic Jerry Espenson.

(Boston Legal got so many things right.)
 
Even if Russ could somehow unamend the complaint back to the original version, wouldn't that technically count as ANOTHER amendment, and thus version #3 of the lawsuit filed on that date NOT the version the 10th circuit ruled on?

So basically, there's no way for Russ to ever unfuck this back into the "muh 1oth circuit" version, is there?
 
Law is not Denny Crane. At least not mostly. It's more motion practice guys like the literally autistic Jerry Espenson.

(Boston Legal got so many things right.)
"The executives say people just don't want to watch a series about mature professionals."

Only show I've seen that warned viewers, in a show scene, that it was their final season. Classy en sheet.
 
I'm spoilering anything not about Russ bc I hate getting deleted. And also don't want deletion bc think it's an interesting (maybe...) convo/comparison for people who might like following legal things.

Yeah, I know. But what you've gotta understand is that attorneys who do litigation commonly look down on attorneys who don't as being busch-league or pretenders.
If they do, they're short-sightedly risking biting the hand that feeds. A yuuuuuge portion of litigators in firms are living on what happens when deals their partners put together go bad. Depends on the place, ofc. Some firms are primarily litigation but will have corporate types (maybe generators, maybe service) largely there to try to spin the lit relationship to a more rounded one.

I'd also say that that is just an intellectually stupid perspective to have, and I have to believe that most grow out of it. Being a litigator isn't the ne plus ultra of lawyerin' for everyone. And litigators - even good ones - have no idea how to set up a regulated investment fund, lead a syndication, structure a multi-continent leveraged acquisition, negotiate a deal with regulators to whittle down a 9-figure fine to 8, or even negotiate angel or venture investments on behalf of any key party.

And as for the last one, although negotiating for board seats and redemption rights, etc., is not especially complex, the hint of a litigator's involvement or style can kill deals...even though obviously every lawyer involved is trying to plan for the worst.

The difference btw corp and lit lawyers vis-à-vis clients often is that before it all goes to hell, the client is ready to bet the farm or give it away (or the reverse, is obstinate about stupid shit), certain of their own acumen and their relationships with their new best friend or tasty company that will definitely be the next Amazon. Once it goes south, business people are often in unknown or uncomfortable waters and out money already, and so can be more deferential to their lawyers' advice.

If you ask the guy corporate counsel hands it off to in an off the record conversation there's like a 9/10 chance he's going to say his contact counsel isn't a real lawyer because he doesn't do any litigation.
Lame if true. I don't think many corporate lawyers spend any time thinking litigators are idiots just because they haven't secured outrageously preferential rights or subtlely ground down the other side on covenant default triggers without the immediate weight of court costs and money burn in their bag of tricks. They tend to respect lanes.

He's probably also really unhappy with some of the decision that got made before the file was handed off to him.
Lol, everyone's a critic. Fair enough - but it's kind of funny and weird sad how the minute the guy - in any kind of role - that everyone loved leaves the job, people start carping about the mess he left behind. I do always check myself on that kind of criticism or thinking I'm doing such a better job than a predecessor (in any situation, whether work or being the PTA treasurer*), even if I am, bc the person coming behind me could very well and probably will do the same about me.

*I'm not the PTA treasurer.

If you're doing plaintiffs litigation one of the dream scenarios is to extensively deal with in-house counsel because they are notorious for either giving away the farm to just get rid of stuff, or doing things that they think are being tough but are actually just goong to damage their side later.
There are a lot of bad legal minds out there. And some companies hire litigation managers more as shepherds and minders rather than managers. But they may also have the budget for go-away dollars so dgaf, in which case it's not so much that the plaintiffs attorney was so great, but that they just didn't rate more attention than they got.

But yeah, quality varies - some companies have an "if Legal says it then it is the Word of God" culture - and there are few of any checks of poor advice given.

However, different jobs require different skills, and people should remember that rather than getting mentally snobbish about some aspect of it. Someone might give easily (or be stupidly obstinate) not because they're unskilled or inexperienced, but bc that's how the role is structured, and they're actually being personally very canny in how they deal with you, and their career. Plus, you never know how things might change or who might wind up holding your income in their hand. "He's such a moronic idiot LINO" kind of falls flat when that idiot can effectively decide where your kids get to go to school. Or when that dolt litigation manager parlays his job to DGC at Megacorp and then negotiates a cush deal and is brought in to head your department.

All that aside, imagine representing Russell. The combination of belief he knows better about law, strategy, and execution; the constant battle to keep irrelevant plights and lumps out of filings; trying fruitlessly to keep him on topic; desperately trying to persuade him to keep his damn mouth shut; having to explain over and over without insulting him how his arguments are retarded and his shit's all fucked up...and at the end of the day never getting paid, plus having to go through a wrenching discussion over every bill, in which he constantly tries to renegotiate or EXPLAIN why this can't happen**.

And at the end of the day, all you wind up with is unpaid and uncollectible bills and the possibility of ethics filings, civil suits, and bad Google reviews.

** I'll bet he argues with grocery-store cashiers over the price of apples applesauce by trying to litigate the validity of a coupon from 1986.
 
I was wondering why the judge didn’t grant Hardin a stay until after the May hearing to file an answer to the amended complaint.

I am no longer wondering.
That's the one cause for optimism. There is a very real chance the Judges have gotten tired of dealing with this. So they dismiss without prejudice for a somewhat procedural error, but of course due to the statute of limitations Greer cannot refile. Since it is without prejudice there would be no reason for the 10th to even review it.

If it goes this way there will be no possible action Greer can take that would save his retarded lawsuit. The only question is if the Judges are thinking this way or not. Let us hope they are tired and pissed off by this lawsuit as Null is.
 
I find it funny how Russ default position is "Let me EXPLAIN"
But when he talks about court, it's all "I ignored the buzzing of insects unless they told me what I wanted to hear"

Buzz buzz Droop maw, buzz buzz.

It's not even self centered, it's self defeating.

Russ lit this fucking money fire, and he should have to clean up after himself.

Thank you again Napoleon III, you answered a question I had before I even asked it. I could see Hardin filing to dismiss the case with prejudice, Judge says "No, but hold my beer and watch this", dismisses the case without prejudice, Droop Maw thinks this means he gets a do over, then gets lectured on statutes.
 
It would be nice if judge just dismissed the suit after this latest filing, but I think that's being too optimistic. It could happen at the hearing, though.
I will sue the judge for violating promissory estoppel if he dismisses now and denies us a Greer reaming on Zoom. I demand sanctions, on top of more sanctions, on top of denied bonds, on top of retarded explanations, live in 4k 1080p 360p.

More seriously: I still think the optimal outcome is more sanctions or fees on Russ, even if the case stays active longer. He'll just appeal a dismissal, or re-file with some bullshit excuse to try avoiding statute of limitations. But he's racking up violations and sanctions every step of the way now, and making himself look worse while just waiting for a hearing.

He needs to quit because it's too painful to sue Josh, not because a mean ol' judge just doesn't understand and dismisses on a "technicality".
 
I rember during the Rittenhouse trial the judge seemed to be ready to dismiss on a freedom-of speech issue where the prosecution implied speaking to the press was proof of a lie and a coverup on the defendent's part(?). He was really pissed. The judge then let decided to let the trial go and even resisted the temporarily hung jury a few days. He seemed to believe a jury trial verdict was superior to a procedural ruling.

This is likely redundant to many user's previous opinions, but I really do speculate that the courts here had the same philosophy and may have just wanted a quick and retarded bench trial to say, "No, you haven't been able to prove your case and you had your fair day in court."

Some users may see maliciousness in the courts favoring a poor innocent bullying victim but I am leaning towards them trying to do things with the "correct process" rather than the "just process". The defendent in this case is just a continuing victim of the court's procedural philosophy rather than a victim of specific hatred.

It's just that the Greer is so intellectually disabled (in that way where they can write well but have no common sense) and so cruel/spiteful in a stupid way that he can't even stop violently thrashing trying to hurt other people and himself in the process while the court is desperately trying to carry him to his own trial.

Funny as hell to see the "Vibe Shift" in the filings, though.
 
I rember during the Rittenhouse trial the judge seemed to be ready to dismiss on a freedom-of speech issue where the prosecution implied speaking to the press was proof of a lie and a coverup on the defendent's part(?). He was really pissed. The judge then let decided to let the trial go and even resisted the temporarily hung jury a few days. He seemed to believe a jury trial verdict was superior to a procedural ruling.

As I recall it was over the prosecutor making statements implying guilt due to Rittenhouse not talking to police after he was taken into custody or something to that effect. Whatever the specifics, it was over violation of a person's fifth amendment rights. Judges try to make sure that juries understand the importance of this, because there is a very natural inclination to believe that not testifying in your own defense or refusing to speak with law enforcement must be some clear sign of guilt. The prosecutor implying guilt over it is an affront to justice.

The judge reamed out the prosecutor over it and I think he still could have used it as an excuse to toss the verdict if it did come back guilty. It almost certainly would be used as a point of appeal and for a new trial. There was also some speculation that the prosecutor was doing it intentionally to get a mistrial since things were going poorly for them by that point in the case. Whether the judge saw it that way or not, I don't know. I think it was probably mooted in the mind of the jury since Rittenhouse did eventually take the stand.

In the end, it was the right call from the judge to keep the trial going. Dismissing the trial on a procedural ruling, especially before any verdict came in would not have allowed Rittenhouse the not guilty verdict that he deserved.
 
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