Greer v. Moon, No. 20-cv-00647 (D. Utah Sep. 16, 2020)

[Thomas Talus]

Anyone can figure out how to file a motion (which thread are we in, after all?). Being able to know WHEN (substantively, judiciously, and procedurally, not merely technically) and WHAT to file (or not file) is the greater skill/ art. I mean, sure, those comments are pretentious in the way presented - which is why it's funny, but it isn't wrong (and that's the whole tension of the book/ movie/ show).

Why should professors need to litigate day-to-day? They're academics (for the most part), and don't need to know minutiae of local rules - they, like they expect of their students, could figure those out if need be. Their job and proficiencies are elsewhere. And given there are always local rules, useless to teach hyper-specifics in a (national) law school.

I think that the public would be better served by law faculty abandoning their self-image as a priestly caste, and embracing the fact that they are fundamentally a trade school.

The best professors were always the ones that came from a practice background, and especially the ones who still had ties with firms and corporations. But they tended to get passed over for higher positions because the pure academics are a clique who require students to buy each other's books at ridiculous markups.

 

[Swole McPole]

"Anyone can figure how how to file motions. We teach you how to think."

"Anyone can drive an ambulance. We teach you how to chase them."

 

[waffle]

Anyone can figure out how to file a motion (which thread are we in, after all?). Being able to know WHEN (substantively, judiciously, and procedurally, not merely technically) and WHAT to file (or not file) is the greater skill/ art. I mean, sure, those comments are pretentious in the way presented - which is why it's funny, but it isn't wrong (and that's the whole tension of the book/ movie/ show).

Why should professors need to litigate day-to-day? They're academics (for the most part), and don't need to know minutiae of local rules - they, like they expect of their students, could figure those out if need be. Their job and proficiencies are elsewhere. And given there are always local rules, useless to teach hyper-specifics in a (national) law school.

But the problem is that the skills law professors tend to have is that they impressed their law professors when they were in law school. The majority of them did a few years at a big firm and burned out with little to no courtroom experience and having never seen a case from beginning to end as lead counsel.

 

[RodgerDodger]

"Anyone can drive an ambulance. We teach you how to chase them."

They may teach them to chase the Ambulance, but they sure as shit don't teach those morons how to think. On the annoyingly large number of them that I used to have to deal with, not a single one ever bothered to read the paperwork, or in the rare cases that they looked at it, had no idea what they were looking at. It's a field where should Russ ever actually become a lawyer, he would only be moderately more stupid and incompetent than his compatriots. They are that fucking stupid.

 

[WelperHelper99]

This read like a orbital MAC strike. Precise and with enough power to level Detroit. Rusty, why? You could have given up ages ago. But now it's come to this. The buckbreaking.

And yeah the judge is going to be pissed. Hardin just unrolled the case like a scroll. He will have to do something though. I don't think ignoring this is in the cards.

 

[Swole McPole]

They may teach them to chase the Ambulance, but they sure as shit don't teach those morons how to think.

I think it's a bell curve. You've got a tiny number who are absolutely stellar. Completely talented in their ability to read, comprehend and explain or act on an issue. A great big functionally competent lump in the middle who aren't doing the quality of work they're capable of because they're doing ridiculous hours keeping those billable hours up to cover their salary/pay off law school loans. Then you've got the ones who are hiding their case files at the back of the desk and hoping nobody notices that they haven't been coping for months before they disappear and move on to another job in a different part of the country.

Problem is, most people have no idea which type they're paying for until it's too late and they've lost your case.

 

[Iron Hamster]

I feel like we need some sort of gif of a nuclear bomb exploding over bikini atholl.

Hardin fell upon Greer like a thunderbolt.

I'm a little sad there isn't a Thunderbolt Ross to Red Hulk gif to insert here.

 

[AnOminous]

He did in his motion to screen the complaint:

Ordinarily you can't use settlement negotiations as part of an argument, as a matter of policy to encourage such negotiations, since people would tend to refuse to negotiate if doing so could be used against them.

Russtard, in his lofty level of legal acumen, chose to open that door by using it himself, even though all it did was make him look bad and undermine his own case.

It's like in basic training when you get to unload the full power of your entire team's arsenal and then the sergeant says "enjoy it, you're never going to get to do this in the sandbox."

Master, forgive me, but I'll have to go all out .... just this once.

There's actually a Canada Judge who did the equivalent, in a nuclear-tier lolocaust against a sovcit retard and against sovcit retardation in general.

https://www.canlii.org/en/ab/abqb/doc/2012/2012abqb571/2012abqb571.html

It's a masterpiece and has even been cited by American courts, a rarity for a Canadian decision.

Like Sun Tzu once said: “Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”

Dark and impenetrable to Russtard at least. I'll note (feather in my cap) that I called there was a reason "or possibly many reasons" that he'd waived the right to object to a four years late amended complaint (mere hours before this dropped). I think everyone knows now what those were.

Another appeal begs the question if the guys who saved his ass the first time would make a second appearance

While I'm not a mindreader, and this is like, just my opinion, man, I believe those two buffoons only took the case in the first place because they wanted to set a precedent to make a reputation for their firm. And they did set a precedent, a widely unpopular one that was criticized as nonsensical even outside our little bubble here.

A dismissal on procedural grounds because of typical Russtardation wouldn't interest them.

 

[Friend of Dorothy Parker]

But the problem is that the skills law professors tend to have is that they impressed their law professors when they were in law school. The majority of them did a few years at a big firm and burned out with little to no courtroom experience and having never seen a case from beginning to end as lead counsel.

I personally have no problem with that. They're teaching fundamentals of substantive law (and general or sometimes specific civ/ crim procedure), not how to practice, or to make partner, or to hang out a shingle, or whatever. And again, there are loads of corporate attorneys (and a bunch of other types) who have never litigated a case, much less as lead counsel, who are exceptional lawyers.

They may teach them to chase the Ambulance,

They* don't actually. Well, some schools are more practically oriented than others, and most have clinical opportunities, but elective.

*the vast majority, anyway, couldn't say 100%.

but they sure as shit don't teach those morons how to think.

Different schools have different emphases, but in general, they should.

And you can lead a horse to water, etc. Some people (say, a certain non-eligible-to-practice, non-practicing lawyer LOTY, for example).

On the annoyingly large number of them that I used to have to deal with, not a single one ever bothered to read the paperwork, or in the rare cases that they looked at it, had no idea what they were looking at. It's a field where should Russ ever actually become a lawyer, he would only be moderately more stupid and incompetent than his compatriots. They are that fucking stupid.

That's why they're chasing ambulances.

And I don't think a law school in the country could help Russell Greer.

 

[waffle]

there are loads of corporate attorneys (and a bunch of other types) who have never litigated a case, much less as lead counsel, who are exceptional lawyers.

If you can do your job with zero litigation experience then you are a risk manager or a compliance office and not a lawyer. Yes I mean this about drafting contracts and documents. People who have never tried to enforce a contract write dogshit unenforceable contracts.

 

[reptile baht spaniard rid]

Some insane percentage of legal work is never tested, never even comes close. The vast majority of it is telling retards (your clients) to just do the same fucking thing everyone else always does, and if they make you write some bullshit, it's 99% chance it never sees court anyway.

Hardin's now extrememely rare in having actual pro se retard experience, the vast majority couldn't get it if they tried.

 

[Himedall All-seeing Waifu]

View attachment 7220298
Jeshur Mun? Mum?
I'm not sure what he's trying to say here.

But really, let's queue up all the shit for next month, it should be epic. Or funny, at least I hope it's funny, in a good way to Josh, Lolcow LLC and KiwiFarms, a website.

Aha! We move closer to the beast's TRUE NAME: Johm Potter! JESU MON was but the first of his identities to be un-masked!

How do we feel about these filings prior to the omnibus?

I get the feeling that Hardin is giving the magistrate all the chances he can to avoid the shitstorm that the omnibus it is bound to be by dismissing it outright. I read it as a 'Are you REALLY sure you want to go through with this?'

 

[RodgerDodger]

"Anyone can drive an ambulance. We teach you how to chase them."

They may teach them to chase the Ambulance, but they sure as shit don't teach those morons how to think. On the annoyingly large number of them that I used to have to deal with, not a single one ever bothered to read the paperwork, or in the rare cases that they looked at it, had no idea what they were looking at. It's a field where should Russ ever actually become a lawyer, he would only be moderately more stupid and incompetent than his compatriots. They are that fucking stupid.

I think it's a bell curve. You've got a tiny number who are absolutely stellar. Completely talented in their ability to read, comprehend and explain or act on an issue. A great big functionally competent lump in the middle who aren't doing the quality of work they're capable of because they're doing ridiculous hours keeping those billable hours up to cover their salary/pay off law school loans. Then you've got the ones who are hiding their case files at the back of the desk and hoping nobody notices that they haven't been coping for months before they disappear and move on to another job in a different part of the country.

Problem is, most people have no idea which type they're paying for until it's too late and they've lost your case.

Due to a LOD injury I spent a lot of time working in the departments legal affairs office as their pet line officer. I must have encountered a few hundred professional Ambulance Chasers. I'm honestly surprised any of them finished high school. Or Junior High. They were as a species that fucking stupid. The competent malpractice lawyers went after Nursing Homes. They were for the most part almost human. Granted when I encountered them they were generally just seeking information to use against the care facilities, such as our Call Sheets. And to give them credit I would get follow up questions from them asking what the stuff on the paperwork meant. So they were at least reading it. But the actual Ambulance chasers? Fucking retards. Every one.

 

[Friend of Dorothy Parker]

If you can do your job with zero litigation experience then you are a risk manager or a compliance office and not a lawyer. Yes I mean this about drafting contracts and documents. People who have never tried to enforce a contract write dogshit unenforceable contracts.

Corporate/finance attorneys hand off the litigation to corporate litigators. Yes, they remain "involved," bc they know the client, but they don't run the litigation.

Same for corp finance, securities. PE, banking, real estate finance, admin, regulatory... and every other type of lawyer practicing with other lawyers, in house, or referring matters out. Can't count the number of lawyers I've known who've never seen the inside of a courtroom, even on retirement.

 

[teriyakiburns]

When this case get dismissed, we really should have a "Heroic Effigy" made of Mathew "The Hardship" Hardin that he could put in his office.

We should also appoint one of our number to sit in his RV with him, whispering in his ear "remember, thou art Hardin".

 

[The Dude]

We should also appoint one of our number to sit in his RV with him, whispering in his ear "remember, thou art Hardin".

Sic transit gloria mundi.

 

[teriyakiburns]

Sic transit gloria mundi.

I didn't know Gloria was sick!

 

[Kosher Dill]

When this case get dismissed, we really should have a "Heroic Effigy" made of Mathew "The Hardship" Hardin that he could put in his office.

If Ty Beard can get a tourist-trap Qin terracotta warrior replica, Hardin's good for at least a little squad of them with a horse.

 

[waffle]

Corporate/finance attorneys hand off the litigation to corporate litigators. Yes, they remain "involved," bc they know the client, but they don't run the litigation

Yeah, I know. But what you've gotta understand is that attorneys who do litigation commonly look down on attorneys who don't as being busch-league or pretenders. If you ask the guy corporate counsel hands it off to in an off the record conversation there's like a 9/10 chance he's going to say his contact counsel isn't a real lawyer because he doesn't do any litigation. He's probably also really unhappy with some of the decision that got made before the file was handed off to him. If you're doing plaintiffs litigation one of the dream scenarios is to extensively deal with in-house counsel because they are notorious for either giving away the farm to just get rid of stuff, or doing things that they think are being tough but are actually just goong to damage their side later.

 

[Bill Evans 45]

but he has nothing else but his plights to sue for and has already been told there is no basis for the court to grant relief.

That's never stopped him before.