Off-Topic Transgender Legislation and Litigation

[Caesar]

I'm looking for the problem and can't find one, even when I tilt my head and squint the worst outcome is that there might be issues with single sex spaces + government records nobody cares about.

the problem is they can't read unless it's been filtered through a member of the culture to make it alarmist and phobic sounding

 

[Hoi Polloi]

So just to be clear:
1) This ruling does not and cannot impact legal recognition of marriages because the UK has allowed same sex marriage since the 2010s.
2) Gender Recognition Certificates are still a thing.
3) Men are still free to call themselves lesbians.
4) This ruling appears to be entirely independent of the debate over NHS coverage for gender treatments, which is instead being driven by the Cass review.

I'm looking for the problem and can't find one, even when I tilt my head and squint the worst outcome is that there might be issues with single sex spaces + government records nobody cares about.

I'm sure this has been said before, but as a supreme court ruling on an existing law there is no intrinsic "problem" generated by the ruling itself. No laws have been added, removed, or amended - rather they've clarified that specifically in the context of the equality act that men are men and women are women. This changes almost nothing in real terms other than pointing out that the EA has been followed incorrectly by a number of institutions. On top of that, ill-advice has been undeniably been given by secondary organisations/NGOs such as Stonewall that ostensibly advised institutions how to follow the EA correctly.

This hasn't actually changed anything going forward although may have ramifications in a number of previous and ongoing tribunals etc. that relate to EA issues. As much as I'd like to see this as an epic win for the TERF isles the primary benefit (outside of aforementioned tribunals) of it is troons misunderstanding what it means and losing their shit. This does however clear a lot up about what the spirit of the law is regarding single sex anything within the purview of the EA.

To reiterate, this ruling relates only to the Equality Act with no relevance outside of.

 

[LaughJoke2.0]

I don't want them invading Canada. This country is already too infested with troons and handmaidens.

This is a serious threat. If the Liberals win the upcoming election we'll have a PM with a daughter who's a they/them. We'll be run by troon and jeets and I don't know which is worse.

If the Dying people thread has taught me anything start putting Jeet Neighbors near trains the problem will solve itself.

 

[Not Dr. Evil]

Kicking Alex out of the ladies room is the beginning of the end of civilized society. Or at least that is is groveling talking point for the day.

 

[Nero Fiddled]

Kicking Alex out of the ladies room is the beginning of the end of civilized society. Or at least that is is groveling talking point for the day.

What seems to be conveniently overlooked here is that we have had a sane and civilized society all the way up to the point where this bunch of pervy men decided to force their fetish onto everyone else.

 

[Hunter Hearst Helmsley]

Kicking Alex out of the ladies room is the beginning of the end of civilized society. Or at least that is is groveling talking point for the day.

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I'll write down, "The slippery slope is real."

 

[Not Dr. Evil]

Reality decared that you are not a lesbian. The UK court merely concurred with reality.

 

[Écho Öwl]

To reiterate, this ruling relates only to the Equality Act with no relevance outside of.

Other than being a quotable judgement that others will use accordingly.

This judgement and the cass report are on brand for terf island .

 

[monstrous bubo]

I'll write down, "The slippery slope is real."

True. The slippery slope is how we got into this mess in the first place.

 

[Not Dr. Evil]

We are nearing peak self delusion.

 

[diroama]

I'm looking for the problem and can't find one, even when I tilt my head and squint the worst outcome is that there might be issues with single sex spaces + government records nobody cares about.

(I think) it was in this thread that I said that the law had, until last week, been a bit murky. Case law had developed in such a way that the transwomen had the expectation of being able to use womens spaces and services unless that service provider excluded them as a "proportionate means to a legitimate aim" - essentially, they had to be prepared to argue in court why a troon shouldnt be able to use or access their space or service like any other woman.

This isnt what the equality act actually says but it is how it had been interpreted, leaving businesses and HR departments preferring to allow troons to shit with the real women unless they were prepared to make a political statement about keeping them out.

This ruling flips that on its head. They've said for the purposes of the equality act, transwomen are men. That means that if you run a single sex space or service you only have to be prepared to justify why any man should not use it - which frankly isn't hard to do at all. Men aren't taking pub chains to court because they cant piss in the ladies toilet and if they tried it would go nowhere.

And so the supreme court ruling leaves all the troons with all the other fellas tryign to avoid standing next to someone at the urinals. They can still take legal action for discrimination - but because they were being discriminated against because of their gender reassignment, not because they're being treated the same as anyone else of the same sex.

So the default is that troons need to stay out of womens spaces and services unless that service provider makes it clear it's actually a mixed sex service, at which point anyone could use it. New EHRC guidance will be out before long which will make it more clear.

There's an irony in all this in that GRCs have no impact on any of the above. The scottish government insisted that a GRC made no difference to the equality act, so having self id for GRCs would make no meaningful difference. This was cast into double by a ruling in a scottish court who ruled that a GRC does change legal sex under the EA, which is why it ended up at the high court who have actually agreed a GRC doesnt make much difference, but not in the way that troons were hoping.

 

[Écho Öwl]

We are nearing peak self delusion.

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In the language of terfier environments, 5 minute conversation with « Erin » will peak the most adamant handmaiden — yay alphabet soup — to radfem 100% of the time.

 

[billydero]

We are nearing peak self delusion.

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I’m surprised Tony hasn’t asphyxiated from sniffing his own farts.

 

[Jacques1194]

We are nearing peak self delusion.

Yes Tony, the backlash against TIPs isn't because people are starting to realize how insane you all are, but its all a secret last ditch effort by old reactionary bigots who are seeing a big culture shift towards trans acceptance. Once the hype around trans people ends will acceptance be around corner. Any day now, be ready!

 

[Not Dr. Evil]

Yes Tony, the backlash against TIPs isn't because people are starting to realize how insane you all are, but its all a secret last ditch effort by old reactionary bigots who are seeing a big culture shift towards trans acceptance. Once the hype around trans people ends will acceptance be around corner. Any day now, be ready!

Gap Tooth thinks that science and popular culture are both in his corner. He is confidently wrong about that.

 

[Hoi Polloi]

Gap Tooth thinks that science and popular culture are both in his corner. He is confidently wrong about that.

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I get so fucking annoyed by the assertion that anyone not accepting the borderline magical thinking that comprises troon biology must be a science denier. Troons and handmaidens - most often not being scientists themselves - smugly suggest that TERFs leave the science to "the biologists". I myself am a "biologist" (an extremely expansive field with a large variety of different knowledge spheres, so it is a flimsy label to try and throw around) and I entirely disagree with tranny science.

There's a microbiologist on instagram I enjoy because she posts fairly informative stuff about infectious disease and foodborne pathogens (two autistic interests of mine) but has recently made a string of exactly these sorts of comments while grossly overestimating her authority on the subject. I'm unsurprised she's a handmaiden but it still felt bad unfollowing her.

The troons are absolutely the ones waging a war on science, in the past they've attacked TERFs in the field for telling the truth. Science is on their side when it can be misconstrued in their favour, and a "politically captured institution" otherwise.

 

[Accidental Protege]

I’m surprised Tony hasn’t asphyxiated from sniffing his own farts.

Look at his face. He's obviously smelling his own farts 24/7 and has developed a resistance.

 

[Athena Save Us!]

I get so fucking annoyed by the assertion that anyone not accepting the borderline magical thinking that comprises troon biology must be a science denier. Troons and handmaidens - most often not being scientists themselves - smugly suggest that TERFs leave the science to "the biologists". I myself am a "biologist" (an extremely expansive field with a large variety of different knowledge spheres, so it is a flimsy label to try and throw around) and I entirely disagree with tranny science.

There's a microbiologist on instagram I enjoy because she posts fairly informative stuff about infectious disease and foodborne pathogens (two autistic interests of mine) but has recently made a string of exactly these sorts of comments while grossly overestimating her authority on the subject. I'm unsurprised she's a handmaiden but it still felt bad unfollowing her.

The troons are absolutely the ones waging a war on science, in the past they've attacked TERFs in the field for telling the truth. Science is on their side when it can be misconstrued in their favour, and a "politically captured institution" otherwise.

Absolutely. They wage war on biologists and neuroscientists all the time with their magical sexed brains (or brains that flip-flop between male and female) and amazing bodies that are totally identical to the sex they're transitioning into, but at the same time it's not like biologists can actually tell male and female apart since it's all just a spectrum anyway!

 

[Not Dr. Evil]

Big Al and Tony are praying for the first tranny Pope.

 

[Écho Öwl]

Big Al and Tony are praying for the first tranny Pope.

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Is there a topic in existence that can get an injection of trans?

The Cc took a risk with Francis. It didn’t plan out. I wouldn’t expect a repeat; but provided it’s all fun and games until the right colour smoke comes out of the chimney!