Greer v. Moon, No. 20-cv-00647 (D. Utah Sep. 16, 2020)

[jerkstore]

correct me if i’m wrong, but i feel this case currently has more things pending/needing to be addressed by a judge than it ever has in its 5-fucking year long history.

“tort reform” used to be a very popular thing electoral candidates for state representative, state senator, governor, even president, would include as something on their campaign agenda, because the courts have been broken for an extremely long time. it’s been noticeably absent in recent electoral cycles, even locally. thus the federal courts essentially have an “open checkbook” to allow shit like this to continue.

edit: the judges get paid regardless of what they do, how they rule, what happens after those rulings, etc. judges at the federal level have exceptionally little liability.

 

[AnOminous]

Even if nothing changes regarding the case, I'd wager 100 quatloos that the CoC just might give RG and his filings more scrutiny moving forward because he tried be duplicitous in filing for subpoenas when he shouldn't have.

He's turned something that is generally an automatic process (a pro se simply asking the clerk's office to issue a subpoena) into something that is going to get attention every time he does it. The clerk's subordinates have almost certainly also been told.

So any time Russ tries to file some bullshit, there's a high likelihood the judge(s) also get a heads-up before it's even allowed, as opposed to simply being filed in a timely fashion automatically.

It's not like the clerk will be spitefully taking revenge against an asshole. They deal with assholes all day long and are some of the calmest people you could ever meet. However, they recognize patterns and you guarantee scrutiny with stunts like this.

 

[Debbie Macomber]

I think RG focuses on the hac in pro hac and has the erroneous belief the word equates to the slang definition of hack meaning mediocre

And "vice" as in evil, so Hardin's a pro evil hack!

Though, in all seriousness, Russell has shown that he at least knows what a pro hac vice status is because he's talked about wanting to revoke it so Hardin can't practice in Utah anymore and about wanting to file bar complaints in Virginia where he's admitted. According to Russ, pro hac vice is a privilege and Hardin's risking losing it every time he does something he doesn't like

Greer fucked up by leaving info on his favorite hookers specifically where to find them, if he was thin-skinned and intelligent, rather than a thin-skinned retard (among many other negative traits he has.) then he would realize broadcasting who his favorite whores and female celebrities is could come back to haunt him

If Hardin wanted to be especially cruel, he'd say "I heard there's this nice girl named Anika!"

The hooker Russell calls a kind and amazing person he had an immediate connection with before Sybil Stallone slandered him!

Didn't he mention her in THIS LAWSUIT for some reason when he was explaining?

 

[HackerX]

the dance just begins with the dismissal of the original suit

View attachment 7468415

the payquasi saga was what, 3 years long?

I vaguely recall Null and/or Hardin's stated intent wasn't just to win the case, but to claw back costs. How likely is that? Sanctions are one thing (and ongoing), but is it feasible or a pipe dream? Obv, it doesn't particularly matter all that much since it's not like Russ has the money, or even willfully pay anything without a battle that spans decades.

I'm old. I can't remember that far back into the dark ages anymore

So much, yet so little, happens that it's hard to remember details. I'd like to surf through all the filings one day just to spot random tidbits with present context. Or even just highlight through the thread.

correct me if i’m wrong, but i feel this case currently has more things pending/needing to be addressed by a judge than it ever has in its 5-fucking year long history.

IMO, if the court isn't going to dismiss the case, the next smartest thing they could do is schedule a reoccurring motions hearing like that of May 6. Quarterly at the very least. I imagine that'd be highly irregular but it's seemingly the only way this shit can move forward.

He's turned something that is generally an automatic process (a pro se simply asking the clerk's office to issue a subpoena) into something that is going to get attention every time he does it. The clerk's subordinates have almost certainly also been told.

So any time Russ tries to file some bullshit, there's a high likelihood the judge(s) also get a heads-up before it's even allowed, as opposed to simply being filed in a timely fashion automatically.

It's not like the clerk will be spitefully taking revenge against an asshole. They deal with assholes all day long and are some of the calmest people you could ever meet. However, they recognize patterns and you guarantee scrutiny with stunts like this.

One would think you don't want the courthouse (judge, clerks, etc) to recognize your name unless you're there on a regular basis. What are the potential ramifications that go along with the increased scrutiny?

For example, would the court more stringently enforce bureaucratic standards and processes? Fat chance it would accomplish much since this is Russell Greee they're working with, but I'd have a long giggle if they start aloggin' him over his formatting and shit like that.

 

[reptile baht spaniard rid]

I vaguely recall Null and/or Hardin's stated intent wasn't just to win the case, but to claw back costs. How likely is that? Sanctions are one thing (and ongoing), but is it feasible or a pipe dream? Obv, it doesn't particularly matter all that much since it's not like Russ has the money, or even willfully pay anything without a battle that spans decades.

Costs are usually rare in the USA - unless there's fuckery afoot.

Rick somehow got costs and fees slammed on him before anything much happened (though not before Null had extricated himself). And I would have said Greee would have easily slipped out - until he started frauding the court obviously, pissed off the Clerk o'Court, and got sanctioned. And he's been hit with costs before, iirc.

 

[mindlessobserver]

At this point, Greee being a broke retard shouldn't stop Null from pursuing the maximum possible penalties from him. If his 14 bucks an hour cleaning the toilets at a strip club have to be garnished for the next 50 years, so be it. Make an example out of him to deter future retards like him.

 

[DragoonSierra]

Edit:
Thinking about that last statement:
We laugh at a retard who abuses the legal system in an attempt to get dates; the retard sues Null and the site.
We laugh at a retard who abuses the legal system in an attempt to extort Microsoft and the State of Texas for billions of dollars with a stupid scheme; the retard sues Null and the site.
We laugh at a retard who abuses the legal system and sues her local government agencies; the retard sues Null and the site.

I think every lolcow who files multiple lolsuits is going to end up suing Null and the site at some point. Which means we will inevitably get Rackets v. Null eventually.

Who that second one? That doesn't sound like Acerthorn

 

[Irene and 22 others]

I vaguely recall Null and/or Hardin's stated intent wasn't just to win the case, but to claw back costs. How likely is that? Sanctions are one thing (and ongoing), but is it feasible or a pipe dream? Obv, it doesn't particularly matter all that much since it's not like Russ has the money, or even willfully pay anything without a battle that spans decades.

I expect there to be a multi-year arc involving collecting from Russ entailing multiple trauma lumps as Hardin starts digging into Greer's finances and Russ finds out that they're not just reserved for business. It's unlikely that Null is even awarded even a quarter of his costs for this case, but he can certainly have Greer's wages garnished so that for every dollar shitlips earns, a portion of it goes to paying Null. It may not be worth much from a financial perspective, but seeing Greer suffer may dissuade the next idiot from filing a lawsuit. That itself is well worth it.

 

[Supplemental Authority]

I vaguely recall Null and/or Hardin's stated intent wasn't just to win the case, but to claw back costs. How likely is that? Sanctions are one thing (and ongoing), but is it feasible or a pipe dream?

Under the "American rule," parties are generally required to pay their own attorney's fees regardless of the outcome of the case. Null won't be able to recover attorney's fees just because he (ultimately) wins.

There are various exceptions to this rule. Of relevance, the Court can award attorney's fees to rectify a party's misconduct. E.g., if Hardin has to waste time because Greer is filing frivolous motions, is hiding evidence, is intentionally delaying proceedings, etc., then the Court may award Null the incurred costs.

In this context, the award of attorney's fees is a kind of sanction. (They're not mutually exclusive.) The current money Greer owes Null is the result of such a sanction. As best I can tell, though, the amount of attorney's fees Null might be awarded pales in comparison to the actual attorney's fees Null has to pay.

 

[LOWERCASE LETTERS]

Pretty sure Null has been paying all along. Lawyers don't just hand you a big bill at the end of the case, or at least not usually.

 

[LurchinUrchin]

Even if Null were afforded costs somehow, it's doubtful he'd ever actually get them. Greer is probably judgement proof because of how broke he is. I think that's part of the court's reasoning for not sanctioning him much - they probably don't think he has any money that isn't exempt.

 

[AnOminous]

Costs are usually rare in the USA - unless there's fuckery afoot.

Costs are automatic. It's fees that are rare.

Pretty sure Null has been paying all along. Lawyers don't just hand you a big bill at the end of the case, or at least not usually.

There's generally an up front retainer to get the ball rolling. This goes into a trust account which accrues interest (this interest usually goes to things like legal aid and malpractice payouts against bankrupt lawyers). This money does not belong to the lawyer and it is basically a death penalty level offense to your license to take it for any reason other than services performed or costs incurred.

Lawyers have been disbarred for even mixing client funds with their own, that is, commingling, even in the absence of any ill intent or actual misappropriation. When funds are depleted, the parties can negotiate among themselves whether to bill on an ongoing basis, whether just to put up another retainer, or whether to wait until the end of the case (for obvious reasons the latter is something reserved for trustworthy clients).

Hardin isn't pro bono and I assume he's making some degree of (richly deserved) profit from this, but according to all accounts he has been declining to bill for a lot of things almost any other lawyer would bill, as well as billing at a substantially discounted rate for someone of his level of skill and experience.

That could actually bite Russ hard if this court ever does its job and actually does a quantum meruit analysis on the value of his services instead of just pulling random numbers out of its ass.

 

[facepalm]

Even if Null were afforded costs somehow, it's doubtful he'd ever actually get them. Greer is probably judgement proof because of how broke he is. I think that's part of the court's reasoning for not sanctioning him much - they probably don't think he has any money that isn't exempt.

The point is the judgement hovering over his head forever. Greer has to brag about hookers. Hooker funds are not judgement proof. Is there a better definition of discretionary funds?

 

[306h4Ge5eJUJ]

Even if Null were afforded costs somehow, it's doubtful he'd ever actually get them. Greer is probably judgement proof because of how broke he is. I think that's part of the court's reasoning for not sanctioning him much - they probably don't think he has any money that isn't exempt.

He has a job, however shitty, and apparently a few k in the hooker fund bank, which makes him much less sanction-proof than the other retards on tismbux who've tried to sue this site.

 

[reptile baht spaniard rid]

Costs are automatic. It's fees that are rare.

i will never get this correct. To me "fees" sound like things that you HAVE to pay (like to file a motion, etc) and costs are things you pay to do the things that require fees (like hire the lawyer) - but it's ass backwards. Fuckin' lawyers.

The point is the judgement hovering over his head forever. Greer has to brag about hookers. Hooker funds are not judgement proof. Is there a better definition of discretionary funds?

Apparently in some states "entertainment" is a valid allocation of funds, but at a certain level. I believe Nevada/Utah is not one of them.

 

[Swole McPole]

Lawyers have been disbarred for even mixing client funds with their own, that is, commingling, even in the absence of any ill intent or actual misappropriation.

This is always a disciplinary matter here in the UK. Client funds go into a client account. Touch them at your peril.

 

[Gorton Colu]

This goes into a trust account which accrues interest (this interest usually goes to things like legal aid and malpractice payouts against bankrupt lawyers). This money does not belong to the lawyer and it is basically a death penalty level offense to your license to take it for any reason other than services performed or costs incurred.

I've had a couple of attorneys call me, freaking out, because they had deposited or wired funds into the wrong IOLTA account.
It was confusing cause some attorneys would just have the one, but some would have one per client. Not sure how thats supposed to work.

Unlike Rusty though, these funds were actually earmarked.

 

[LOWERCASE LETTERS]

Either way, in entertainment value alone, Hardin has more than earned what Null is paying him. While this litigation certainly is pricy, it's not pricy in an all up front sense, and Null will have no trouble fundraising another hundred grand here or there to make sure people who want to sue us get fucked.

 

[AnOminous]

I've had a couple of attorneys call me, freaking out, because they had deposited or wired funds into the wrong IOLTA account.

This is literally the kind of thing lawyers will wake up in a cold sweat about, after DREAMING they did something like that. No joke.

Lawyers have a million different ways of jewing you, all of them legally approved, but this is one you will only find at the absolute bottom of a downward spiral.

 

[Gorton Colu]

This is literally the kind of thing lawyers will wake up in a cold sweat about, after DREAMING they did something like that. No joke.

Lawyers have a million different ways of jewing you, all of them legally approved, but this is one you will only find at the absolute bottom of a downward spiral.

Good to know, I needed a new way to mess with some of my attorney friends.

Normally I say, "Fuck you, John." But that is passe. It will now be, "I hope you commingle personal and client funds, John."

Im still surprised that Greee gets treated with such kids gloves even though he is ostensibly a paralegal. I guess court has mentally invalidated his educational and professional achievements.