I definitely do not see the current genital butchery techniques ever improving to any appreciable degree.
Maybe in the far future they might be able to do some crazy sci-fi shit like take a sample of someones genetic material, convert it to the opposite sex and then use it to grow new genitals on the patient.
But even that is assuming that in the far future humans still have an intact technological civilization. My current view is that massive deindustrialization is more likely and that future humanity won't even have access to much of the tech we have today. But thats an argument outside the bounds of this thread.
Also a question: do you guys think that the more surgeries get done, the more they'll improve? Obviously what's being documented here are extremely new and even experimental procedures,
You have 1809 pages and years of content showing you they will not.
Experimental, yes absolutely, but at this point I wouldn’t say the surgeries are new. “Top surgery” is just a double mastectomy for crazy women and you can see how awful the results are every single time. Now compare them to mastectomy results.
If anything is truly experimental it is most likely the after effects of the surgeries and what medicines are needed, or what other surgeries are needed to correct the trauma to the body. I highly believe that is the actual experiment being done and then that knowledge is used to enhance medical procedures in general, just not for them. They know these surgeries don’t work but the guinea pigs keep lining up at the door with cash in hand.
No, but I'm starting to think you have a humiliation fetish as well as a pooner fetish. If you want to ask more questions along these lines, can you please either start an off-topic thread for general SRS debate or start posting thread tax? Thanks.
I apologize for not following my own advice, but I'm away from my computer since it's New Year's. When I get back, I have a nice antibiotic-resistant pseudomonas infection that I don't think anyone's posted yet. Happy 2026!
“Top surgery” is just a double mastectomy for crazy women and you can see how awful the results are every single time. Now compare them to mastectomy results.
This is what pisses me off the most about troon surgeons. They're frauds and openly deliver substandard results that normal people would not find acceptable. If my tits got cancer and had to be hacked off and I ended up looking like a pooner's zippertits, I would sue! I would consider it disfiguring!
Your nerves are just reallyconfused after genital mutilation, not damaged/severed and traumatized, it takes time for things to settle down into the constant of pain/numbness that is to be your new lot in life.
Half of these autists probably consider shitting themselves to be a positive thing, assuming they weren't doing it already as part of the exhaustive list of grotesque fetishes all these losers drag along behind them like the tail of a comet.
I experienced that(except for the incontinence) after having a vericocele removed. I got a fever, likely due to a minor infection, as well as numbness and pain which lasted for like two years. If a relatively minor genital surgery thats actually necessary is that unpleasant imagine what SRS must be like.
Yes, this arguably may have already happened with the invention of PPT, but "improved" doesn't mean "good", and the process always involves a lot of test subjects and a lot of failures before figuring out something that is an improvement on the last thing. Usually the point of comparison for surgery is some kind of dysfunction or disease state, as in "are patients doing better medically than before the surgery?" the bar for SRS is going to be incredibly high because they are replacing a healthy and otherwise functional reproductive system with something that can only have sexual function in the best case scenario.
You are indeed a fool. Of course it could serve them to lie about that. As I have already said, Pooners lie about that topic because other women are credulous and will believe them in total absence of evidence or even likelihood.
you have a very warped and unrealistic view of how women treat each other. The idea that women just automatically believe any claim of molestation is easy enough to test, as many famous women have expressed skepticism or disbelief in specific claims of sexual violence without being forced out of their positions. It happens across the political spectrum as well. Whoopi goldberg thought roman polanski didn't do anything too wrong, naomi wolf thought the julian assange accuser was a liar. On the right candace owens has said she doesn't think that harvey weinstein, michael jackson, or the tates are sexual abusers. Ann coulter has also flat out said when she thinks other women are lying. When lauren southern said andrew tate raped her a bunch of female influencers piled onto her to call her a liar and a whore. It isn't weird or unexpected that someone might doubt a person's story, it happens all the time. I've seen it happen IRL with non-famous women, and pooners would be aware that women don't have a secret pass code that lets you get away with anything. Now that you have a bunch of cases of you being 100% objectively incorrect about this, perhaps the thread can be about surgery again.
This is going to be a long post. Rate me MATI if you wish to, but I'm sick of the notion that we must consider these surgeries as anything but revolting crimes against the stupid and the insane.
I'm not a doctor, nor do I purport myself to be more intelligent than doctors, but I've done a lot of reading and research into the various kinds of tranny surgeries because I've a personal interest in medicine and anatomy. My verdict is that this is ultimately a pointless question because these surgeries are not reasonable and should not be performed at all in the first place. No amount of experimentation will ever make an inverted penis lined with bowel tissue into a proper vagina, and no matter how many girls get hacked up Frankenstein-style they will never be able to turn the flesh of an arm or leg into an actual penis.
Nobody actually believes that breast implants are legitimate breast tissue or that silicone asses are the same as actual fat and muscle, but TiFs and TiMs are being told that these surgeries are providing them actual penises and vulvas, and it's somehow considered ethical to lie to them about the reality of their anatomies because otherwise they will kill themselves. These surgeons are putting fragile, delusional people at risk of permanent sexual and urinary dysfunction, chronic pain, infertility and a lifetime of complications because the alternative is that these people will commit suicide. When you boil it down to "these are crazy and retarded people who are detached from reality and are threatening to hurt themselves if they don't get their way, so obviously the right thing to do is to hurt them ourselves," it is baffling that this is even available in otherwise civilized societies. No amount of innovation will ever make it morally correct to do this to people.
Personally, while I think troons 'n' poons are pretty universally end-stage sexists and perverts and therefore I generally couldn't care less what happens to them, they are human being at the end of the day and therefore it is not right or acceptable that we allow these procedures to take place. And any doctor, sworn to do no harm, who endorses this as a "treatment" should be ground into fertilizer.
Since this is relevant to the subject at hand, here's a fakepussy that I personally consider to be quite "good" in the sense that it looks somewhat akin to an actual vulva. But "looks like" is not "is," and telling patients that this is the same as a biological vulva is complete and utter madness. Other-Ad-9710 (Dr. Bank; vaginoplasty) Link | Archive
The majora scars are clocky because there is a lot of excess scrotal tissue that appears darker because it‘s not stretched. I will tighten it in a couple months once the anterior (clitoral hood area and further above) is more healed to avoid stretching of the scar.
In my previous posts you can see more information but you have to search in the community search bar using my title because my post history is private.
I can‘t comfortably open my minoras yet to show the inside, i tried carefully to see for myself a couple days ago and i can tell that my clitoris is much harder to find now that my clitoral hood got extended and my clitoral frenulum was joined together.
Once i get my majora lipofilling and tightening of the majora scars i think i will be eventually satisfied. But its already better than my primary result.
veravendetta is another great example of why these surgeries are essentially demonic, because there's no possible way you can argue that getting a handle of human flesh crafted onto her pelvis is better for her than, say, intensive therapy and a cocktail of drugs to snap her out of her lunacy. Look at this stupid thing! How is increased risk of suicide worse for a patient than this? Last Post Link | Archive
And to properly drive my point home, have some text posts where people talk about their surgical outcomes.
Metoidioplasties are described by John Hopkins Medicine as a procedure that "uses tissue from a hormone-enlarged clitoris to create a penis about 4 to 6 centimeters (up to 2 1/3 inches) long." But upon getting this surgery done, a li'l dood realizes that she did not, in fact, get a penis created and is now banking on another surgery to make her a real boy instead of accepting herself as she is. majorzhan (metoidioplasty) Link | Archive
I had my surgery back in September, and from the first time I saw it I knew I was not pleased. I tried telling myself it’s just swelling but it’s clearly not the case. This is still my first step towards phallo, but I figured maybe this would hold me over until I finally get the chance to go further. It won’t — to me, it only looks as if nothing was done other than getting my front hole removed, when this was supposed to be the full works. I am holding regrets getting this procedure done because it was all that time, all that money, the recovery, the infection I got for what I consider to be essentially nothing. I was really looking forward to having less dysphoria and being able to finally have romantic/sexual relationships, but that won’t be happening until I get phallo now it seems.
I live very far away from any surgeons that do this procedure, have no additional money or time off from work to be able to get anything revised. I might as well just wait until I get phallo, but I have no idea when I’ll be able to pursue that because everyone requires in person consultations and wait lists seem like they’re really long. There isn’t anything I can do and it feels so hopeless.…
This man was convinced that having his dick torn off and shoved up into his body would give him a true and honest vulva and is now disappointed and depressed when comparing himself to actual women because he's forced to contend with all of the ways his expectations around surgery were rooted in magical thinking. But surely if we do this to enough crazy and stupid men, then it'll have all been worth it in the end! Miss_Mocktail (vaginoplasty) Link | Archive
I really appreciate the advice people give me when dealing with something like this. But at this point, the way my genitalia look right now, I‘ve fallen into a bit of a spiral. They look nothing like mine, none of them, my labia don’t exist, the anatomy is nowhere near cis…
I swore I would avoid ever looking up trans surgeries ever again after this. But I did, and can‘t rid myself of the thought of regret of not waiting and getting a really good surgeon instead of the one that was most available to me.
Don’t ever rush your SRS folks
Here's another reason why we shouldn't do these surgeries: because some people, like this rapist in the making, dream of being able to have sex with people without disclosing that they are sapient slime molds in the shape of people. We should not be enabling these antisocial malcontents to pursue their desires to trick and deceive others because it "affirms" them. tempohclock (metoidioplasty, future phalloplasty) Link | Archive
By “forgetting” I mean sometimes people in my life who know I am trans sometimes seem to forget I am trans bc Ive been lucky to pass well. Id like to feel cis during sex even when they know I am trans. Ik disclosing youre trans even post op is widely considered the most ethical and safe decision and im not saying i wont be disclosing, but does your dick “look cis” enough to “pass”?
Trans dicks are inherently different and thats ok, i want to emphasize, and ik this may not align with everyones desires for themselves or views on themselves
nyu1000days is another now-emasculated man who has had to learn the hard way that dicklessness is not the same as being bepussied and was apparently not alerted by his doctor that men who get their dicks torn off generally do not experience arousal the same way they would unaltered. The fact that "getting your crotch chopped up can interfere with arousal and orgasm" is somehow news to many of these patients is a horrific failure on the part of their providers to set realistic expectations for them. Last Post Link | Archive
does anyone else have this problem? my libido is incredibly high, but my body has no physical response to arousal. pre-op I'd, yknow, get hard or really wet, but post-op I don't get anything like that. it's like the arousal is all in my head and my body has no response whatsoever. it's really killed my enjoyment of even just flirting or any sexual activity, that my body doesn't feel turned on anymore. my surgeon insists they thoroughly removed all erectile tissue for dysphoria reasons, but this honestly seems insane to me? cis women have erectile tissue as well, and lacking it seems to cause problems with sensitivity and arousal like I'm experiencing now pre-op the phantom vagina feelings I had even lined up with the erectile tissue in the perineum, so it's kind of wild that I feel less arousal in my "vulva" post-op. any tips or similar experiences...?
Lastly, have some people talking earnestly about the fact that they experienced horror and revulsion towards their own bodies after getting these allegedly life-saving procedures done. Yeah, I can see how this was the ethical thing to do instead of just lettng them rope themselves! Link | Archive
(I’m asking this specifically about phalloplasty, but it can apply to any surgery really. All my posts keep getting auto-removed on r/phallo for some reason.) One of the things I’m afraid of is waking up after surgery (in the earlier stages, where they create the phallus but don’t do anything for aesthetics) and freaking out from seeing that my body is all messed up (like, a chunk of my body is missing, a new piece of flesh is stuck on my body that looks nothing like I want it to yet, and there’s tubes coming out of me). I’m scared to feel that way. I really need this surgery, but I’m worried I’ll wake up feeling like Frankenstein.
I’m not at all trying to imply that certain results are tantamount to “body horror,” just concerned that I’ll feel this way about my own body before the process is completely done. I’ve also seen some complications on here that, while usually fixable, look pretty horrifying (necrosis, open gashes, etc.), but I never see people talking about how it feels to look at your body in that condition. I’m curious if this has been a big problem for people who’ve gotten bottom surgery.
[–]madnathrowaway
I had this, it was the worst in the first 2 weeks. Got gradually better from week 2-4. Now at 12 weeks post, it's completely gone.
[–]illegally_dog
(5 weeks postop today) I didn't see my arm for the first week and after they took of the VAC, it was okay looking at my arm. It got a bit worse 17 days in because I could see my tendons underneath and it made me feel dizzy. Got better a week after, they're hard to see now and now it is all smooth and okay. My dick was scary to look at but I also were very curious and amazed and high on opioids the two weeks. I liked him but the staples made it difficult. Once they removed them, I was very nice. I had some light necrotic tissue on my tip that formed a large blood scrub and this made me scared but it got better once I got on antibiotics and ten days after it started healing normally. I had two drains on my leg and stomach when waking up. My thigh graft looked scary afterbthey removed the 2nd skin foil, very bloody and it hurt a lot changing the bandages. Took around three weeks for the scrubs to disappear and while its pretty red, it doesn't hurt anymore. It's just itchy.
The first week was pretty ok looking at my body because everything scary was under bandages and I slowly got used to seeing all of it
[–]ThrowawayOfACutie
MTF, But I had this worry before my bottom surgery too.
Turned out to be a non issue for me, that being said I think my results already looked quite good immediately post op.
There was some degree of "Ew, it's so bruised, swollen" but the euphoria of it all very much outweighed the ickiness. Before going into surgery my line of thought was "I hope it looks nice, but realistically if it doesn't I don't care, because I hate what I have now anyway", I think that helped a lot.
[–]basicgagafag I’ve had vaginoplasty two months ago and I honestly have to say that I struggled a lot. The first time I saw myself with a hand mirror on a gynecologist chair after all the packing was removed I mostly felt disgust. I’d be lying if I said I felt any meaningful amount of euphoria outside of the visual confirmation that it was finally done. Everything just looked so bloody and bruised and the anxious part of my brain just constantly spun all the worst case scenarios that could play out in my head. On top of that I was in a shit ton of pain and I fell into a sort of existential despair over how I needed to do all this invasive work just in the hope of ever feeling ok in my body. I kept feeling envious of cis women and had this feeling I would never heal and live in a mutilated state of inferiority forever. None of this is rational, and the fact that I already dealt with a lot of depression and internalized transphobia didn’t help. I’m also generally quite sensitive and had continuous problems with sudden urethral bleeding weeks after the initial procedure that required another hospitalization and two emergency surgeries.
The whole process has been traumatic honestly, but I just tried to maintain hope. As I kept healing and the pain subsided it started to look and feel like a real body part and I’m starting to not feel like I’m in survival mode anymore now that the bleeding tissue was fixed. I suspect that after half a year I won’t even think about this anymore, but right now I am content, just still paranoid about something horrible going wrong again.
What was the most mentally taxing I think was that I could never mentally "ignore" the wound the way you could other surgery sites. Every time you sit down, change position, pee, have a bowel movement, change clothes, shower, hook your catheter somewhere, do aftercare and especially when you dilate 2-3 times a day (not applicable to you obviously) you are mentally and physically forced to confront it over and over again. Even if everything goes well, it completely takes over every waking thought your first 3-4 weeks and it’s very intense.
[–]justalilsadwhore
yeah i’m mtf but im convinced ill feel like that right after i don’t even plan to really look at it before it’s healed as much as possible cause the fresh results look horrifying like its really giving the substance with a messed up hole
[–]nyu1000days am post op mtf but i can reaaally relate to this. unfortunately it's been a long term issue and can't really speak to solutions it's freaky just having a part you cant feel correctly, or that you feel too much of at the wrong times. itches you cant scratch, urges you cant fulfill, etc etc
[–]Intelligent-Tea-2058 My baseline was body horror and I could feel where my parts were supposed to be. Surgery got as much of me as possible back into the correct spots, and alleviated the proprioceptive desynchronization in the targeted areas. The blood and swelling and complications were still much more correct versus what I had before, and have basically worked out in the end. Even at my lowest point, i.e. up to 30% blood loss, in hypovolemic shock, and looking more dead than some deceased people I've handled, I was comfortable with my decision process, and still felt better having made it that far and being more whole.
[–]latrlzrs
I was pretty fine for the most part. I do remember having a hard time looking at my scrotum the first time they showed it to me, it was crusted in blood and oozing serous fluid, but it got easier to look at pretty quickly (especially after starting to clean it)
Anyway, TL;DR: even if the techniques become standardized and perfected, "gender affirming" surgeries are ultimately being presented dishonestly and inaccurately, and it's evil to trick and swindle the mentally ill and the cognitively impotent just because they are willing to pay for the privilege. Call me a bleeding heart, but it's really just not nice.
Specifically, she said "it wasn't rape-rape". He drugged and sodomized a 13 year old, at 43. Whoopi was almost certainly dismissing the statutory part, and possibly the drugs (as opposed to forcible rape). In the Urban Community (she grew up in NYC projects), it is common for girls to be having sex by 12-13, and probably given drugs/alcohol too.
Personally, while I think troons 'n' poons are pretty universally end-stage sexists and perverts and therefore I generally couldn't care less what happens to them, they are human being at the end of the day and therefore it is not right or acceptable that we allow these procedures to take place
I think this is a mature position to land on: most are or were victims of something beyond their control (molestering, mental illness), but that doesn't absolve them of their predatory actions, or make them any less dangerous to children.
Personally, while I think troons 'n' poons are pretty universally end-stage sexists and perverts and therefore I generally couldn't care less what happens to them, they are human being at the end of the day and therefore it is not right or acceptable that we allow these procedures to take place. And any doctor, sworn to do no harm, who endorses this as a "treatment" should be ground into fertilizer.
To be fair, a lot of pooners and troons were not fully-capable of making these sorts of decisions or they were not informed of the full reality of what HRT, "top" and "bottom" surgery entails. Many of them have been groomed by "trans-supportive" parents, teachers, and egg-hatchers in their friend groups or online as seen with Jazz Jennings.
This is why I am somewhat sympathetic to to the plights of some troons or pooners because of how they have been led down the primrose path by affirming mental-health "professionals", physicians, and plastic surgeons. In many cases, not one person in these various consultation visits has ever pointed out what the realistic expectations are despite it being the purpose of these consultation visits in the first place.
Somewhere on the Farms, we have an article by a woman who went undercover as a prospective teenage pooner, and did an exposé on how ridiculously easy it was for somebody who was posing as somebody under 18 to get hormones and even schedule surgery as she was basically rubber-stamped and sped-ran through the entire process.
Not just for them, but for the rest of us. No one has the right to be a sexual impersonator. No one has the right to be an abominable role model who's influencing other people's kids either.* And really, the more "advanced" the biotech becomes, the more critical it becomes to push back and stop this shit. For all our sakes. I personally do not believe that we're going to have the resources or the social permission to keep the trans R&D going until flawless facsimile perfection is achieved. Finite planet and all that. But if somehow I'm wrong on that... we really do not want Deep Fakes wandering about in our midst. Everyone will go nuts trying to deal with the uncertainty and the unintended consequences of that.
Exactly. Human society runs on a shared, objective reality. Based on sex. The majority has a right to believe that what they're seeing is true and honest. Anything less is unacceptable.
*No one talks about this, and it's just mystifying to me. I guess I missed the period where we dropped the notion of being positive role models for kids altogether?
Also a question: do you guys think that the more surgeries get done, the more they'll improve? Obviously what's being documented here are extremely new and even experimental procedures, but considering how far we've come since say Stonewall it is kind of amazing how far trans surgeries have gotten
I still think trying to replicate a vagina on a trans woman will take decades
I say this after perusing detrans reddit for a while, and noticing a lot of people had gripes about how their top surgeries looked "unnatural" (both ways I guess, since fake boobs also look odd) which to me seems like a surgical issue first and foremost. People would probably detransition less if they were more confident in the results?
Based ICS enjoyer. To answer your question, probably not. These surgeries are performed by plastic surgeons rather than doctors who specialize in those particular subsystems like a urologist for instance. Theres also the reality that there is no safe way to mutilate your genitals.
Only when the surgical techniques and protocols are shared, criticized, and studied with clinical trials. Butchers keep their trade secrets to themselves.
And in the end, you have to contend with brute biological facts, such as the cell types unique to each sex (you can't somehow magically conjure vagina mucosa cells in a man), their different endocrine systems, and their different pelvic geometry.
Since this is relevant to the subject at hand, here's a fakepussy that I personally consider to be quite "good" in the sense that it looks somewhat akin to an actual vulva. But "looks like" is not "is," and telling patients that this is the same as a biological vulva is complete and utter madness. Other-Ad-9710 (Dr. Bank; vaginoplasty)
I would want to remind the class that the "wet and glistening" photo is 100% not the fauxgina doing that for itself. It's just a layer of lubricant the OP added so they can dilate the thing. (Or maybe just to take a picture of it...) I think some troons like to post these photos with lube on after a dilation session to imply there's a level of self-lubricating function there that just isn't to other coombrained troons who want to believe "it's just like a natal vagina."
veravendetta is another great example of why these surgeries are essentially demonic, because there's no possible way you can argue that getting a handle of human flesh crafted onto her pelvis is better for her than, say, intensive therapy and a cocktail of drugs to snap her out of her lunacy.
Did everyone notice the tattoo she has on her left thigh? JFC. It's of two headless bodies having sex, who were presumably beheaded during sex, because there is blood flowing from the necks. I'm sorry to shout, but NOBODY WHO GETS A TATTOO LIKE THAT SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO MAKE ANY PERMANENT LIFE-ALTERING DECISIONS. Give me all the tophats you want: she should be under care.
This is a pretty good analogy. Even if they do find a way to install a stinkditch without complications(unlikely) its still just a stinkditch, not a vagina.
It’s probably just a skill issue on the part of the trepanner, I’m three years post op and I’m doing great, Dr Grug is a true miracle workekekekrheh *has epileptic seizure*
…
*gets up from floor wipes foam from mouth* no…. Regrets…
veravendetta is another great example of why these surgeries are essentially demonic, because there's no possible way you can argue that getting a handle of human flesh crafted onto her pelvis is better for her than, say, intensive therapy and a cocktail of drugs to snap her out of her lunacy. Look at this stupid thing! How is increased risk of suicide worse for a patient than this? Last Post Link | Archive
Is... is the tube connected from the groin and back up into the abdomen? What??
Funny that this sort of thing has become borderline mundane in the U.S. I think if I'd been shown some of these images and read some of these posts a few decades ago, when I was a young person, it would have put me in a cold sweat.
It’s probably just a skill issue on the part of the trepanner, I’m three years post op and I’m doing great, Dr Grug is a true miracle workekekekrheh *has epileptic seizure*
…
*gets up from floor wipes foam from mouth* no…. Regrets…
Joking aside, drilling holes in head has SOME good medical backing, unlike trans surgery BS. Namely, if the serious issue is brain swelling, it can relieve it somewhat and be life saving. Now it IS inferior to most medical approaches, in MOST scenarios, fringe, and probably not used much anymore, but its STILL more valid than trans bottom surgery.
Now you could call that dumb luck that doctors thought this would work at first and it somehow did, or say its antiquated, but still, its not 100% BS. Please don't insult it by comparing it to tranny surgeries.
Did everyone notice the tattoo she has on her left thigh? JFC. It's of two headless bodies having sex, who were presumably beheaded during sex, because there is blood flowing from the necks. I'm sorry to shout, but NOBODY WHO GETS A TATTOO LIKE THAT SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO MAKE ANY PERMANENT LIFE-ALTERING DECISIONS. Give me all the tophats you want: she should be under care.
pre-op the phantom vagina feelings I had even lined up with the erectile tissue in the perineum, so it's kind of wild that I feel less arousal in my "vulva" post-op. any tips or similar experiences...?
like its really giving the substance with a messed up hole
it's freaky just having a part you cant feel correctly, or that you feel too much of at the wrong times. itches you cant scratch, urges you cant fulfill, etc etc
It’s probably just a skill issue on the part of the trepanner, I’m three years post op and I’m doing great, Dr Grug is a true miracle workekekekrheh *has epileptic seizure*
