🌟 Internet Famous David Steel / LazerPig / Ricewynd / Malquistion - Pathological Liar, Reddit Historian, Femboy Thirster, and Vore Connoisseur

[Dead Lion]

I mean saying the soviet union sucked is kinda the bare minimum. A lot of commies admit that.

Tankies by definition don’t. The swine is bad enough as is there’s no reason to make shit up about him.

All of that is scoring on an undefended goal my man. No one but literal retards actually believe any of those things to be true.

I probably spent too much time arguing with communists and it warped my perception of what the average leftists believes.

 

[WelperHelper99]

Tankies by definition don’t. The swine is bad enough as is there’s no reason to make shit up about him.

Well I mean there is a tankie, and then there is a tankie lol. Usually the online variety that defend the commie tranny revolution to the death. Fuck commies btw

 

[ZTZ-99A]

saying the soviet union sucked is kinda the bare minimum. A lot of commies admit that.

Sucked politically, or militarily?

 

[Dead Lion]

Sucked politically, or militarily?

Both obviously.

 

[Sleazy Car Salesman]

Both obviously.

The Soviet military was pretty good up until they started their death spiral in the eighties. And even then their equipment and training was still solid overall even if their doctrine was somewhat lacking.

 

[Dead Lion]

The Soviet military was pretty good up until they started their death spiral in the eighties. And even then their equipment and training was still solid overall even if their doctrine was somewhat lacking.

I disagree. They lost to Poland in 1920, achieved a pyrrhic victory against Finland in 1940, they only started winning ww2 after it was clear Germany was fucked and still managed to sustain heavy losses. Proceeded to roll over uprisings in the eastern block for thirty years before Afganistan where they also lost.

They have a repeating history of loosing or at best barely winning against on paper weaker nations. Not a good look for an alleged superpower.

 

[The Foxtrot]

They lost to Poland in 1920

Which happened right after the Russian Revolution, 3 years after they signed an armistice with Germany, and the USSR wouldn't even be formed properly until 1922. Not a sign whatsoever that the Soviets "sucked" at fighting.

achieved a pyrrhic victory against Finland in 1940

You mean the Winter War, which the USSR won? And then the Continuation War after that, which the USSR also won, and that time it was utterly lopsided in favor of the USSR?

they only started winning ww2 after it was clear Germany was fucked and still managed to sustain heavy losses.

They were the ones fucking Germany like a $2 whore on payday, and the majority of the fighting was being done on the Eastern Front which no shit will result in heavy casualties for both sides.

Proceeded to roll over uprisings in the eastern block for thirty years before Afganistan where they also lost.

The Soviets didn't lose in Afghanistan at all. If anything they had more success in Afghanistan than the USA did.

 

[Smashed & Slamed]

Eh, not really. The T-72 is the very definition of "good enough" and in 9/10 of all cases that's all you ever need to be. It's outright better than any of its non-Soviet contemporaries and won't cost you your first born to purchase like any of its superior non-Soviet competitors will, it's small and lightweight and so it works fine with just about any road, bridge, or rail system in the world, and it's legitimately dangerous if used to its strengths even against modern hardware.

It isn't the T-72's fault that most of its operators don't know their asses from their elbows, that most of its conflicts were fought by downgrade export models, and that it's a tank from the early seventies that frequently finds itself up against technology from the 2010s or newer in the modern day (most of which was designed specifically to kill the T-72, might I add).

The T-72 is a pile of shit. And not for whatever piggy sperged about. The 3kmph reverse speed is shit and while it is cheaper than a T-64 and T-80 it's not T-62 levels of cheap and ease of manufacture, the tank it was meant to replace. It got scope and feature creeped and ended up as the generic tank of the modern age.

 

[Just Some Other Guy]

they only started winning ww2 after it was clear Germany was fucked

Wow didn't know Germany was fucked by 1942. Someone should have told the rest of the Allies who were still barely catching strays compared to what the Soviets were fighting off.

 

[WelperHelper99]

The Soviets didn't lose in Afghanistan at all. If anything they had more success in Afghanistan than the USA did.

They pulled out like everyone else, come on broski.

You mean the Winter War, which the USSR won? And then the Continuation War after that, which the USSR also won, and that time it was utterly lopsided in favor of the USSR?

For a sliver of Finland they got, they took immense fucking casualties to guys with skis and hand me downs

 

[Smashed & Slamed]

You mean the Winter War, which the USSR won? And then the Continuation War after that, which the USSR also won, and that time it was utterly lopsided in favor of the USSR?

Do you understand what the term phyric means?

 

[The Grognard]

The Soviet military was pretty good up until they started their death spiral in the eighties. And even then their equipment and training was still solid overall even if their doctrine was somewhat lacking.

The actual weakness of the Soviet model is an excessive reliance on the commander having to handle everything, and not trusting or developing proper NCOs who can be relied on to find whatever solution has to be solved. Then again, they did develop a lot of aids and standard procedures for the commanders to use if they are in situation X or Y. As for Deep Battle, I do think it's still a very solid basis for a large military to use.

For a great example of what the Soviets could do when they did eventually get everything sorted out, you can look at their invasion of Manchuria in 1945, where they for once got to actually have real prep time and had the necessary experience from the fight against Germany to sort out all the bugs of their military model.

 

[Sargon's wife's son]

Just the propellant bags is enough to blow the turret off, but yeah the HESH in the turret bustle is probably what shattered the turret (HESH is fucking dogshit too btw, absolutely awful, outdated ammo type). Ukraine got shafted with western tank anti infantry ammo in general.

The Best Anti infantry? Ammunition is still flushed rounds. Look, it's highly. Demoralizing watching, uh? Squad mates get turned to chunky salsa by. By a bunch of tiny dots.
Also seeing how they have very low penetration on. Armored vehicles you can literally just shoot them at. O'neill your friendly tanks.

 

[The Foxtrot]

They pulled out like everyone else, come on broski.

The difference being the USSR pulled out militarily after successfully establishing a satellite state, and don't forget the DRA survived 3 more years after that with zero further aid from the USSR or COMECON while the mujahedeen got a lot more funding and arms from the CIA and bodies from Pakistan.

For a sliver of Finland they got, they took immense fucking casualties to guys with skis and hand me downs

For the Winter War, they got 9% of Finland's territory and put a damn naval base up in Finnish territory just like we got Guantanamo, and while Soviet casualties were high, Finland's casualties amounted to about a fifth of their entire military strength. Already not a good sign.

Then during the Continuation War, Finland lost even more troops (about a THIRD of their total strength), had to cede more territory to the USSR, pay the USSR reparations, and admit that they were a Nazi ally...which then forced Finland to fight a third war, in a row, against the Reich.

This still doesn't prove the USSR "sucks", if anything, it just proves that the USSR didn't have much of an issue sending its troops into a meat grinder.

 

[Just Some Other Guy]

if anything, it just proves that the USSR didn't have much of an issue sending its troops into a meat grinder.

And even then, neither did anyone else. The US mauled themselves through battles. The Brits did. The Germans did, etc etc.

People just talk about "Soviet meatgrinder" as if nobody else did it.

 

[WelperHelper99]

The difference being the USSR pulled out militarily after successfully establishing a satellite state, and don't forget the DRA survived 3 more years after that with zero further aid from the USSR or COMECON while the mujahedeen got a lot more funding and arms from the CIA and bodies from Pakistan.

So the Vietnam pullout part 2: Soviet edition.

For the Winter War, they got 9% of Finland's territory and put a damn naval base up in Finnish territory just like we got Guantanamo, and while Soviet casualties were high, Finland's casualties amounted to about a fifth of their entire military strength. Already not a good sign.

Then during the Continuation War, Finland lost even more troops (about a THIRD of their total strength), had to cede more territory to the USSR, pay the USSR reparations, and admit that they were a Nazi ally...which then forced Finland to fight a third war, in a row, against the Reich.

This still doesn't prove the USSR "sucks", if anything, it just proves that the USSR didn't have much of an issue sending its troops into a meat grinder.

So you're saying they got a fraction of what they wanted at a immense cost. Yeah thats not great.

Also the Soviets are dead, so objectively, they did suck, they don't exist

 

[The Foxtrot]

So you're saying they got a fraction of what they wanted at a immense cost. Yeah thats not great.

They got more than what they originally wanted, actually. It's not just the territories, either, Finland didn't join NATO during the Cold War or stray too far into the Western sphere of influence, which was a good thing for the USSR.

Also the Soviets are dead, so objectively, they did suck, they don't exist

Militarily, no, the USSR was pretty damn good.

Politically and economically...yeah let's not try Communism ever fucking again.

 

[WelperHelper99]

They got more than what they originally wanted, actually. It's not just the territories, either, Finland didn't join NATO during the Cold War or stray too far into the Western sphere of influence, which was a good thing for the USSR.

Militarily, no, the USSR was pretty damn good.

Fair enough

Politically and economically...yeah let's not try Communism ever fucking again.

Agreed

 

[ZTZ-99A]

The T-72 is a pile of shit. And not for whatever piggy sperged about. The 3kmph reverse speed is shit and while it is cheaper than a T-64 and T-80 it's not T-62 levels of cheap and ease of manufacture, the tank it was meant to replace. It got scope and feature creeped and ended up as the generic tank of the modern age.

Yeah the reverse speed is terrible, but I wouldn't go as far as to call it a pile of shit, especially for the time. It was very well armed, and armoured.

The Best Anti infantry? Ammunition is still flushed rounds. Look, it's highly. Demoralizing watching, uh? Squad mates get turned to chunky salsa by. By a bunch of tiny dots.
Also seeing how they have very low penetration on. Armored vehicles you can literally just shoot them at. O'neill your friendly tanks.

HE-FRAG is the best anti infantry round, and it's not even close.

 

[The Foxtrot]

Yeah the reverse speed is terrible, but I wouldn't go as far as to call it a pile of shit, especially for the time. It was very well armed, and armoured.

Bolded emphasis mine. People keep overlooking the fact that the T-72 is a design that was conceived in 1967 and put into service in 1973.