Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

While we're on the topic of Star Trek adjacent media franchises, any Farscape fans ITT?
I’m gonna be real with you, I’m not a Farscape guy, I’m more of a Claudia Black guy.

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Strictly in terms of production value, Farscape could match whatever Star Trek brought the table. I'm even putting it above the Doctor Who revival. I don't trust Doctor Who to handle a concept like planet of lawyers.

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I stopped watching after season 3 or 4 when it stopped being about 'monster of the week' episodes and started being about angels and demons so I'll never know.
Shame. You should have at least watched to S5 which finished out the original creator's vision. It was a good end to it all. (And also the season 10 episode "Baby", it's quality.)

And then there were 10 more seasons after that...
 
No, it was his son, but the Henson company itself did do the animatronics/makeup/puppets for the shows entire run, which I would say is one of the biggest highlight of the show itself.
Issue was the animatronics/makeup/puppets and CGI was expensive as hell to do. Before Sci-Fi had canceled Farscrape, the Henson company had offered to do the work at cost as part of the attempt to keep the show going.
 
I was about to start my annual rewatch of DS9, but I might just go for that instead.
It's a great watch, honestly one of my favorite shows of all time. It's a nice departure from tone and aesthetic of Star Trek, it's a lot grittier and grimier but in a way that's really fun when you get ahold of what they're going for tonally. It takes a while to find its footing but once it does it manages to do a lot with its premise: Star Trek style ethical dilemmas and space encounters, but instead of a Starfleet crew dealing with the problem, it's a band of violent, morally dubious, drug/sex addicted transient freaks dealing with it.

Beyond the Henson quality makeup/puppets, the aesthetics and tone of the show are probably my favorite things about it, especially in direct comparison to Star Trek. Farscape was filmed in Australia, which I think helps tremendously when every other science fiction show was being shot in the greater California area, and unlike Star Trek, I think Farscape's alien worlds manage to feel more alien more often than not. There's a really strong through line of brutalist and tribalist aesthetics throughout the show, if it's not a concrete and metal brutalist megastructure it's a tribal village or junk favella. They also have this weird contrast of feeling both empty and lived-in at the same time in a way that I can only really summarize as 'Garry's Mod Map-esque'. Unreal Tournament is the closest thing that comes to mind that I'd say is comparable in terms of the breadth of different settings in Farscape.

I think the main cast is really unique and well done, like I said, these aren't Starfleet officers, they're borderline anarchistic freaks living out of their van while on the run from the state troopers. If the crew of the enterprise or command staff of ds9 supposed to be coastal elite intellectuals, the cast of Farscape is Portland Oregon hipster hillbillies. The main cast is really unlikable and annoying at times but in ways that feel shockingly realistic. If you have been around the blue city druggie musician hicklib punk scene at all, you have met the main cast of Farscape probably a dozen times over. Chiana is probably the most realistically written BPD hoe in all of fiction. They cause their own problems more often than not, most episodes are the result of a bad/selfish/idiotic/drunk/high decision by one character, and even when it's not evidently someone's fault they still manage to make things worse through their own terminal self interest. I can understand why some might find it annoying or hard to watch but I enjoy seeing how petty and pissed off at each other they all can get. When the character conflict is at its best and they're all each others throats and split into groups working against each others' interests it really does feel like It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia or Trailer Park Boys in space, and at times things just get so weird and retarded and the characters become such assholes to each other it borderline feels comparable Aqua Teen Hunger Force. Not to say they never have their competent or badass or heartfelt moments, there are episodes with plenty of that, but I do enjoy the episodes where it's them effectively getting into a white trash fight outside an intergalactic gas station.

Apologies for the effort post, I just really Farscape and haven't had a chance to share my thoughts in a non-tranny occupied space. Jool best girl btw.
 
Apologies for the effort post, I just really Farscape and haven't had a chance to share my thoughts in a non-tranny occupied space. Jool best girl btw.
I always appreciate an effort post with paragraph breaks.
❤️

Strictly in terms of production value, Farscape could match whatever Star Trek brought the table. I'm even putting it above the Doctor Who revival. I don't trust Doctor Who to handle a concept like planet of lawyers.
Reminds me of that one episode of Sliders.
 
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Late shit, but the discourse (And crashouts) surrounding SF:A/SNW and so on being cancelled and iced has been glorious to see, as a player of STO as well I witness it as a stream of consciousness a lot and jesus.

The amount of coping surrounding it all is amazing, the amount of people just going "You didn't like/watch SFA? Must be a racist/transphobe/bigot (etc)!", the attacks on the fanbase from both the journos and the actors (some well loved) has been outstanding and it really fuels my belief this entire show needs to be on ice for another 10 years, which immediately sparks a bunch of people freaking out.

At this point the fanbase is fucked, you can't move for people getting divisive over this shit, listening to people go "Well Lower Decks was really good!" and having to debate how it was CLEARLY, so fucking glass-house PLAINLY an obvious "Rick and Morty is popular, best cash grab the FUCK out of that!!" is exhausting and being pointed to "well Prodigy is really good" isn't a fucking win. Being told the Nickelodeon show they've supposedly memory holed bits of is "The best of the bunch" isn't inspiring, it's downright disheartening.

I don't get Kurtzman's shit, "Let me retcon a ton of lore, shove in a strong diverse woman who's also space jesus, oh yeah also future space is completely fucked because a child cried and blew up the galaxy which also somehow meant everything fell to pieces within a minute in a society with advanced communications and replication technology, oh yeah when people mention Omega Molecules would've been better let's just throw in 'There's a minefield of Omega Molecules around shit which is the equivalent of keeping North Korea contained by laying thermo-nuclear warhead mines in the DMZ' - Like holy fuck it baffles me. I dont' get WHY Discovery was put where it was in the lore, I spent the first 5 episodes actively questioning "WHY is this not set post Voyager? It just serves to be a jerk off power fanfiction jesus", I can get behind "whacky space mushroom propulsion system", I can get behind it when it's some desperate measure by Starfleet to forego warp travel after the revelation in TNG that "Oh yeah warp will fuck up all of space, so we have to change now", but I don't get it when it's put around the time warp travel was still untapped in potential.

I can spend forever like we all can picking this shit apart. But holy fuck it upsets me, I shouldn't have to rely on The Orville to be my liferaft or the repeatitive writing of STO which is thoroughly bogged down in "Borg go brrrrrrr" story writing as of late.
 
Yeah, back in the 90s I was a member of the official Star Trek fan club and subscribed to the magazine and had all the toys, bought all the tapes, but now I completely avoid the show because the quality is too low and there is so much drama, you can't say what you honestly think of a new episode or people will start stalking you online and threaten your life.

Being s Star Trek fan now is stressful and not fun, so I just watch my old discs from time to time but I don't count myself as a fan and will never watch any new content ever again.
 
"You didn't like/watch SFA? Must be a racist/transphobe/bigot (etc)!"
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If someone calls you racist or whatever never deny it. Gabriel Bell deserved it because he was breaking the law plus he was high on fent. Benny Russel was a shit writer that was only remembered because he put a nigger in charge of a space station. The Sisko started the Dominion War because he was too violent to negotiate with the Dominion. Who wouldn't want to join the Dominion?
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The Sisko, being a negro, was an ass man so he couldn't appreciate a fine pair of Vorta Milkers.
 
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If someone calls you racist or whatever never deny it. Gabriel Bell deserved it because he was breaking the law plus he was high on fent. Benny Russel was a shit writer that was only remembered because he put a nigger in charge of a space station. The Sisko started the Dominion War because he was too violent to negotiate with the Dominion. Who wouldn't want to join the Dominion?
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The Sisko, being a negro, was an ass man so he couldn't appreciate a fine pair of Vorta Milkers.
To be fair the shapeshifter were utter cunts.

Wanna live in luxury forever being the plaything of any race till you amass power and fortunes in a bloodless coup?

No?

Ok wanna bio engineer monstrosities and nightmare plague to make everyone everywhere your enemy? Undoubtedly more based but not nearly as effective.
 
To be fair the shapeshifter were utter cunts.

Wanna live in luxury forever being the plaything of any race till you amass power and fortunes in a bloodless coup?

No?

Ok wanna bio engineer monstrosities and nightmare plague to make everyone everywhere your enemy? Undoubtedly more based but not nearly as effective.
Sounds like something a Solid would say. Enjoy the Jem'hadar raid, Solid.
 

Is it just me or would this speech about how everyone who chooses to serve on the Enterprise has to live by the same rules be considered alt right by today's standards?

This is why I don't take it seriously when people tell me I have to like new Trek because Star Trek has always been progressive, because what was progressive 35 years ago is now seen as neon nazi today.
 
Sounds like something a Solid would say. Enjoy the Jem'hadar raid, Solid.
I wanna like the changlings more but its just space communism. Without the ferengi they would of been zoned out by mines. I just wish they were more... I don't want to say powerful but less reliant on others?

There is a real sense that maybe 5 changlings bothered to get off their asses throughout the entire war.
 
Paris is basically the only person on Voyager with a brain.
And he's supposed to be the hotheaded ex-con.
Somebody should clip the end of Year of Hell where Janeway crashes Voyager into the timeship with a scene of Kitty walking over to Red with margaritas
Or cut to his son teaching him about Star Wars.
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It's an interesting contrast with Garak, who is conceptually a similar character. In a way, they do kind of downplay Garak's past actions for a lot of show, but it's always intentionally vague what he's actually done, and includes him pretending to have committed a war crime that he actually hadn't (or did he?) For a lot of the show, he's almost more of a comic relief character.
It's also implied that Garak mellowed out and doesn't agree with everything that happened to Cardassia. We don't really get that with Georgiou because she ran the entire empire

There's a scene in "Terra Firma" where Georgiou chooses to subject Mirror Burnham to torture in order to condition her into reforming. You don't see any remorse on Georgiou's face. She sees it as "tough love". It's supposed to show how much Georgiou has changed, but it doesn't work as well as it should.

Compare this to Garak torturing Odo in "The Die is Cast", where you can see how Garak is visibly uncomfortable with what he does, outright begging Odo to lie so he'll have an excuse to end the torture. It shows that while Garak is capable of doing awful things, he still has morals that separate him from sadists like Dukat.
That, and "Unscheduled off-world activation!"
 
I don't get Kurtzman's shit, "Let me retcon a ton of lore, shove in a strong diverse woman who's also space jesus, oh yeah also future space is completely fucked because a child cried and blew up the galaxy which also somehow meant everything fell to pieces within a minute in a society with advanced communications and replication technology, oh yeah when people mention Omega Molecules would've been better let's just throw in 'There's a minefield of Omega Molecules around shit which is the equivalent of keeping North Korea contained by laying thermo-nuclear warhead mines in the DMZ' - Like holy fuck it baffles me. I dont' get WHY Discovery was put where it was in the lore, I spent the first 5 episodes actively questioning "WHY is this not set post Voyager? It just serves to be a jerk off power fanfiction jesus", I can get behind "whacky space mushroom propulsion system", I can get behind it when it's some desperate measure by Starfleet to forego warp travel after the revelation in TNG that "Oh yeah warp will fuck up all of space, so we have to change now", but I don't get it when it's put around the time warp travel was still untapped in potential.
The show Lost ruined television forever by making writers think that a super-complicated storyline is somehow better. What really happened with Lost is it didn't get super screwy until the later seasons and, by then, people were already committed and wanted to see the conclusion.
 
Wasn't JJ Abrams literally making shit up as he went along for the entirety of Lost?

Like that's where he introduced his gay mystery box theory and never bothered to plan ahead in regards of any of his plotlines?
 
No, it was his son, but the Henson company itself did do the animatronics/makeup/puppets for the shows entire run, which I would say is one of the biggest highlight of the show itself. Not to say the Henson company's involvement carries the show, but it is nice when an alien that would've just been a guy with some tattoos on the side of his head at best in ST gets full lucasfilms level makeup and prosthesis if not an entire animatronic rig in FS. Standouts include Pilot, Namtar from Season 1, and the Bug Merchant from the pilot episode.
It's amazing how realistic and lifelike a well-done puppet can look.

Like Audry II from Little Shop of Horrors:


I remeber reading it took like 50+ puppeteers to control him, but it was worth it.

Steven Spielberg did it right too in the first Jurassic Park with a combination of puppets and CGI.
 
It's amazing how realistic and lifelike a well-done puppet can look.

Like Audry II from Little Shop of Horrors:
The funniest part about Farscape is realizing every time you see a new puppet, some poor technician hasn’t slept in days and is trying to make a foam ballsack look like a sentient alien.

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They’re on the commentary like, “we had to finish this puppet with minutes to go."

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The Tak episode is the worst.The puppet looks like shit, quick, deploy horny nonsense:


Originally they wanted a whole race of horse-face monsters walking around.

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So then suddenly it’s like, Actually the horse-face ones are a special caste. We cannot afford twelve horses yelling at Ben Browder.

 
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