Megathread Insane Parents of "Transgender" Kids - Parents who push a transgender identity on their children

[Ctrl+Alt+Rt]

also didn't know their family was Jewish. Is it just me, or does Jazz look kind of...dark? Grandma looks like stereotypical Jewish grandma to me, but I thought Jazz was Hispanic.

You're right they could very well be hispanic – Sephardic Jews (Southern Europe) tend to be darker skinned than Ashkenazi Jews (generally Central/Western Europe), and then there are the darker skinned Arab Jews (like Iraqis), and the very dark-skinned Ethiopian 'lost tribe', Beta Israel.

What would happen if he stopped be on blockers right now (or hormones, if he's on them)? Would he go through male puberty naturally? Could they induce it with testosterone shots? There are conditions where they have to do that, but I'm not sure how comparable it is.

The answer is a qualified yes. It's supposed to be entirely reversible, in that you will go through puberty if you stop using them. Histrelin is one of the common GnRH used as a puberty blocker (treats "precocious puberty" generally).

Quoting UCSF:

GnRH analogues offer a reversible intervention that allows youth temporary relief from an undesired, and potentially traumatic endogenous puberty. While data are sparse, preliminary results from the Netherlands indicate that behavioral problems and general psychological functioning improve while youth (age 12 and older) are undergoing puberty suppression.[10]

In order to avoid the development of undesired secondary sexual characteristics, GnRH analogues ideally are initiated at the earliest stages of puberty (Tanner 2-3).[11]

Youth cannot remain on GnRH analogues alone indefinitely, as bone mineralization relies on the presence of sex steroids. While clinically becoming increasingly common, the impact of GnRH analogues administered to transgender youth in early puberty and <12 years of age has not been published. While rare, reported side effects from the use GnRH analogues may include diminished bone mineral density acquisition, weight gain, abscesses at the site of injection (if injectable form is used), irregular vaginal bleeding, and emotional lability.

Also a cursory search I did found studies where GnRH intervention for prostate cancer treatment (in adult men) produced reversible results, as well as in other animals. Many studies are for cancer because the drugs are primarily used to treat hormone-sensitive cancers for short time periods. But of course all of these were in adults who had already sexually matured. Interestingly, there was a study in mature female horses that found the time to reversal was more delayed the younger the horse was.

GnRH treatment isn't supposed to be for long periods of time and like stated above, there aren't comprehensive studies on the effects yet. The ideal is to have GnRH only until the gonads can be removed:

No consensus exists on the length of time GnRH analogues should continue after youth begin gender-affirming hormones. The Dutch Model follows a protocol in which simultaneous GnRH analogues and gender-affirming hormones continues until transgender individuals have their gonads removed. This model is appropriate in the Netherlands, where gonadectomy is easier to access at the age of 18 years old [...] gonadectomy is not necessarily desirable for all transgender persons, especially if future fertility is desired.

There's also this warning about the potential negative effects on mental health for delaying puberty:

Experiencing puberty in the last years of high school or early college years presents multiple potential challenges. The emotional upheaval that occurs for youth undergoing puberty happens normally at 11 or 12 years of age. For those youth who struggle with emotional lability at that age, they do so in a relatively protected environment, regulated by parents/caregivers, and without access to potential dangers such as motor vehicles, drugs, alcohol and adult (or almost adult) peers and sexual partners. Having the physical appearance of a sexually immature 11 year old in high school can present emotional and social challenges that are amplified by gender dysphoria.

So yes it's supposed to be reversible but:

- longer time periods of treatment aren't well studied and their effects aren't well understood

- the younger the individual is when they start GnRH treatment, the harder it might be and longer it might take for reversal of effects

- even if effects can be reversed, the onset of delayed puberty might have a much worse outcome

- starting GnRH along with hormone treatment might cause genital atrophy so that even when allowed to go through puberty, the child might not regain um... their total potential size and function

- stopping GnRH once gonads are removed as recommended still won't give them true puberty of the opposite sex because they lack the opposite sex's organs that are highly involved in hormone production and signalling (e.g. ovaries, testes)

 

[sperginity]

The parents in this thread are liberal and collecting asspats, but there are families that are conservative Christians who usually move to a new community in order to transition their kids. The involvement of medicine and doctors makes it easier for them to think they have a straight kid with a disorder that other people wouldn't understand. This is typically after years of trying to force their sons to seem less gay. There's groups of them on facebook mostly, but I've read and few articles written with names with held.

The answer is a qualified yes. It's supposed to be entirely reversible, in that you will go through puberty if you stop using them. Histrelin is one of the common GnRH used as a puberty blocker (treats "precocious puberty" generally).

Quoting UCSF:


Also a cursory search I did found studies where GnRH intervention for prostate cancer treatment (in adult men) produced reversible results, as well as in other animals. Many studies are for cancer because the drugs are primarily used to treat hormone-sensitive cancers for short time periods. But of course all of these were in adults who had already sexually matured. Interestingly, there was a study in mature female horses that found the time to reversal was more delayed the younger the horse was.

GnRH treatment isn't supposed to be for long periods of time and like stated above, there aren't comprehensive studies on the effects yet. The ideal is to have GnRH only until the gonads can be removed:


There's also this warning about the potential negative effects on mental health for delaying puberty:


So yes it's supposed to be reversible but:

- longer time periods of treatment aren't well studied and their effects aren't well understood

- the younger the individual is when they start GnRH treatment, the harder it might be and longer it might take for reversal of effects

- even if effects can be reversed, the onset of delayed puberty might have a much worse outcome

- starting GnRH along with hormone treatment might cause genital atrophy so that even when allowed to go through puberty, the child might not regain um... their total potential size and function

- stopping GnRH once gonads are removed as recommended still won't give them true puberty of the opposite sex because they lack the opposite sex's organs that are highly involved in hormone production and signalling (e.g. ovaries, testes)

Puberty resuming in children that have already begun puberty and have a disorder that expedites the process does not mean it is reversible in physically normal children who take it to suppress puberty before it starts. Those are two completely different patient populations. The truth is that no one knows the outcome of trying to resume puberty in these cases because more than 99 percent of dysphoric puberty blocked kids go on to cross sex hormones. Cross sex hormones after blockers irreversibly sterilizes patients, the gonads are damaged. Jazz has taken cross sex hormones before his gonads matured. I don't know if testis would produce testosterone after that, but they will never produce sperm. If you don't puberty block less than half identify as trans post puberty.

 

[Ctrl+Alt+Rt]

Puberty resuming in children that have already begun puberty and have a disorder that expedites the process does not mean it is reversible in physically normal children who take it to suppress puberty before it starts. Those are two completely different patient populations. The truth is that no one knows the outcome of trying to resume puberty in these cases because more than 99 percent of dysphoric puberty blocked kids go on to cross sex hormones. Cross sex hormones after blockers irreversibly sterilizes patients, the gonads are damaged. Jazz has taken cross sex hormones before his gonads matured. I don't know if testis would produce testosterone after that, but they will never produce sperm. If you don't puberty block less than half identify as trans post puberty.

Yeah the article talks about children who take it to suppress puberty before it starts. It also talks about it for peri-pubertal children, which can mean as young as 7 (signs of starting to develop, but not what we would think of as puberty.)

And yes like I said, GnRH with hormone treatment *can* cause irreversible damage to function and size. This page lists expected outcomes if treatment is ceased. So for example it says permanent changes are breast development, while changes that *can* become permanent are infertility and atrophy of the testes (but also they can reverse). Other changes (e.g. body fat redistribution, reduced muscle mass, skin softening) are not permanent.

But GnRH is supposed to be administered alone at first with the intention of giving children more time to 'decide' before getting hormone treatments that might cause permanent changes.

The point is that there isn't a lot of published material on the effects of early GnRH treatment and of long-term GnRH treatment. I think it's a mistake to be 100% certain in either direction: that they can resume puberty with no ill effects, or, that a period of treatment will permanently prevent them from going through puberty.

 

[Sinner's Sandwich]

Grnh don't let children decide - PUBERTY DOES.

99% of children on puberty blockers decide to go on gross sex hormones. Without puberty blockers - more than 80% decided NOT TO TRANSITION and grew up to be lesbian/gay/bisexual adults also a few were heterosexual. There are many studies about this.

 

[Ctrl+Alt+Rt]

Yes I know. I cited the 80% statistic myself just earlier. I'm very wary of how these drugs are being administered to children, but I'm trying to stick to what's known in literature and from clinical data.

The major reason that the vast majority of children diagnosed with gender dysphoria desist by adulthood is because their dysphoria was caused by issues other than being trans (childhood trauma, fear of loss, ocd, anxiety disorder, autism is a huge one - iirc the autism rate is 7x higher in youth with dysphoria). When those issues are addressed and they get support, the symptoms of dysphoria go away. The major problem right now is that exploration of any other potential causes of dysphoria is being labeled as transphobic by activists, who are politicising what are supposed to be evidence-based treatments.

 

[MarissaXD]

The parents in this thread are liberal and collecting asspats, but there are families that are conservative Christians who usually move to a new community in order to transition their kids. The involvement of medicine and doctors makes it easier for them to think they have a straight kid with a disorder that other people wouldn't understand. This is typically after years of trying to force their sons to seem less gay. There's groups of them on facebook mostly, but I've read and few articles written with names with held.

I think that is more disturbing as to force their gay son to transition because Leviticus only approves of straight sex.

 

[sperginity]

Jazz Jennings did past life regression therapy and regressed to his own life of being a gay dude who isn't acceptable to his family, this is really pretty fucked up and sad rather than lulzy

http://people.com/tv/jazz-jennings-past-life-regression-therapy-hungry-accepted/

 

[Sinner's Sandwich]

Jazz Jennings did past life regression therapy and regressed to his own life of being a gay dude who isn't acceptable to his family, this is really pretty fucked up and sad rather than lulzy

He is bisexual tho since he dates a girl and the recent episode and said he is attracted to her (I don't know what "attracted" means for someone who is castrated and never went through puberty.).

It's interesting that although he always claimed wanting to date boys - he never showed any interest in them at dates (at least on tv). But 1 girl comes a long and he develops feelings for her (ironically it seems she didn't LOL). I guess that his parents pressured him into dating boys and he is more like a 2 or 3 on the Kinsey scale.

Anyway: "Past life" my ass. It's more like these are his CURRENT feelings. He is a victim of horrible child abuse.

 

[Crunchy Leaf]

I do recall him saying he wanted to date boys, but they weren't interested in him, since he isn't biologically female. Fucked up either way really.

 

[sperginity]

He is bisexual tho since he dates a girl and the recent episode and said he is attracted to her (I don't know what "attracted" means for someone who is castrated and never went through puberty.).

It's interesting that although he always claimed wanting to date boys - he never showed any interest in them at dates (at least on tv). But 1 girl comes a long and he develops feelings for her (ironically it seems she didn't LOL). I guess that his parents pressured him into dating boys and he is more like a 2 or 3 on the Kinsey scale.

Anyway: "Past life" my ass. It's more like these are his CURRENT feelings. He is a victim of horrible child abuse.

Jazz isn't anything sexual, when talking with Dr Bowers jazz said they have never had an erection or masturbated. Gender atypical behavior in children is correlated with homosexuality in adults. He could be bisexual I guess. When you're a trans activist you more or less have to say you're pan or it's discriminatory.

 

[Wallace]

Jazz Jennings did past life regression therapy and regressed to his own life of being a gay dude who isn't acceptable to his family, this is really pretty fucked up and sad rather than lulzy

http://people.com/tv/jazz-jennings-past-life-regression-therapy-hungry-accepted/

That is some weapons-grade horseshit right there. Why not Kirlian photography, if we're giving money and publicity to quacks?

Jazz is going to wind up as the poster child for why troonery is harmful in the long run. This kid's childhood is being sacrificed on the altar of pop culture even worse than Michael Jackson.

 

[Hummingbird]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't she unable to orgasm or something like that?

 

[Sinner's Sandwich]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't she unable to orgasm or something like that?

Yep HE can't but parents and his genital surgeon tell him to figure out how to get orgasms. It's really fucked up.

 

[Martys_not_smarty]

Anyone else feel like what's happening now is going to be looked at in the future like how we look at the Tuskegee Experiment and Stanford Prison Study today?

 

[Incredible Crisis]

Anyone else feel like what's happening now is going to be looked at in the future like how we look at the Tuskegee Study and Stanford Prison Study today?

I think that the current gender craze is both a good and a bad thing.

On the one hand, those who are truly dysphoric now have better awareness from the public as to their condition and could have an easier time reaching their desired state and living a normal life as their chosen gender.

Unfortunately, the vast majority of cases, at least those observed on this forum (which may or may not be a bias) seem to be individuals who use the snowballing series of noncisgender expression, hormone treatment, and invasive surgery as a means to escape other, more pressing psychological issues.

The rush for anyone of any age to transition and join the proverbial "gender euphoria" espoused by lolcows is dangerous and should not be encouraged. Anything so drastic as a complete identity change should be supported by a long process of self-discovery and psychological support.

I hope that the medical community comes to weed out the trenders so that the entirety of the actual transgender community doesn't suffer any more than they already have.

 

[MarissaXD]

That is some weapons-grade horseshit right there. Why not Kirlian photography, if we're giving money and publicity to quacks?

Jazz is going to wind up as the poster child for why troonery is harmful in the long run. This kid's childhood is being sacrificed on the altar of pop culture even worse than Michael Jackson.

I'd say it'd take a Pepsi commercial gone wrong for this to end up worse than Michael Jackson. Don't see Pepsi putting Jazz in an ad.

 

[Martys_not_smarty]

Pepsi already shot itself in the foot when they did that one ad with one of those plastic coolie bitches handing a can of Pepsi to a riot police officer.

 

[Sissy Galvez]

I’m disgusted by Jazz, his parents, the doctors, TLC, and our society for condoning this child abuse/train wreck and displaying it on national television. This is one of the many reasons why I don’t pay for tv and torrent.

 

[Martys_not_smarty]

I think that the current gender craze is both a good and a bad thing.

On the one hand, those who are truly dysphoric now have better awareness from the public as to their condition and could have an easier time reaching their desired state and living a normal life as their chosen gender.

Unfortunately, the vast majority of cases, at least those observed on this forum (which may or may not be a bias) seem to be individuals who use the snowballing series of noncisgender expression, hormone treatment, and invasive surgery as a means to escape other, more pressing psychological issues.

The rush for anyone of any age to transition and join the proverbial "gender euphoria" espoused by lolcows is dangerous and should not be encouraged. Anything so drastic as a complete identity change should be supported by a long process of self-discovery and psychological support.

I hope that the medical community comes to weed out the trenders so that the entirety of the actual transgender community doesn't suffer any more than they already have.

I see something of a reformation coming, the medical field really needs to sit down and hash out some definitions and terms and guidelines for this new era on par with what happened at the beginning of the 20th century where common practices involved electrocuting your genitals, tapeworms for weightloss and "medicine" that was nothing but heroin, cocaine or opium.

 

[MarissaXD]

I see something of a reformation coming, the medical field really needs to sit down and hash out some definitions and terms and guidelines for this new era on par with what happened at the beginning of the 20th century where common practices involved electrocuting your genitals, tapeworms for weightloss and "medicine" that was nothing but heroin, cocaine or opium.

And the last time that the standards for transitioning were written was back in 1979. Minor updates have been done every so often, but most of it is still stuck in 1979. Back before Blanchard's theory, before informed consent HRT, and written in a time where there were far fewer transgender people. In other words, there's been a lot of changes since when the standards of care were established for gender dysphoria.