Trashfire The BetterHelp, CreatorHealth, InfluenceLogic Rabbit Hole - Candid 2.0, brought to you by Joel Robbinson

While looking into this, most of her articles are related to mental health, but then there are a few articles attached to her name that a little weird (compared to a vast majority of her usual work)
On a related note, up until her association with BetterHelp, this has been her "about me" section for every article she has written for various websites.
View attachment 559776
It's a little weird that they keep using the same picture for her or a slightly modified version of the same black and white, edited photo. (There could be earlier pictures of her, but this is the one attached to articles from as early as 2017 to this year)

Edit: And this "person" is getting a lot more strange.
View attachment 559794
It's really weird how she keeps saying how much she wants to contribute "unique content" and the wording on it is really weird for someone who claims to write topics related to mental health.
And the link that is attached to her name is digital marketing website that's been around since 2003, called "noreazon"
And that reply is just a copy/paste of a comment she made two minutes before
View attachment 559796
Looks like she forgot to add the creepy profile pic and link to the marketing site.

The article she's begging on | archive of article
Her face is clearly photoshopped. That pic is fabricated. She is not a real person.

I dont see why people should be forced into doing all this research on somebody when the site should be doing it for them. This isn't Tinder, it's a site where people should be able to find as much help as they can possibly get at an affordable price.

Ive had my own fair share of experiences with therapist, psychologist, and all the like. The work they do does not qualify for me to be paying more than 100 dollars a month to tell me things I only want to hear. Ive had a few wake ups but nothing has ever been because of a therapist and their advice.

BetterHelp shouldnt have people go out of their way to verify people. They should instead be going ahead and setting up some expectations and what kind of people they'll allow on their site. I saw PhillyD's response and it doesn't really do any justice in maling the situation better.

Not only did he neglect to mention other complaints like the extra billings, but the CEO saying that many companies use this strategy should not be an excuse for why you are too fucking lazy to write up your own application and set your own standards for what kind of therapist should be allowed on your site.

This whole thing is just about greed. The site, the youtubers, the therapist, the whole industry behind mental health and illness in general. It makes me fucking disgusted and sick to my stomach.
They claim to have staff, yet all the work falls on the customers. So, what exactly does the staff of Silicon Valley teenagers do? (the ones on the pictures of their site)

I found something really interesting.

Kati Morton states she is the CEO of HAPPYABLE, INC.
HAPPYABLE, INC. is located in Delaware according to the information here:
https://opencorporates.com/companies/us_de/6002711
Company Number
6002711
Incorporation Date
29 March 2016 (over 2 years ago)
Company Type
Corporation
Jurisdiction
Delaware (US)
Agent Name
UNITED STATES CORPORATION AGENTS, INC
Agent Address
300 DELAWARE AVE STE 210-A, WILMINGTON, New Castle, DE, 19801

Coincidentially enough, BetterHelp's TOS are also based on Delaware.
https://www.betterhelp.com/terms/
Important notes about our Agreement
  • This Agreement and our relationship with you shall both be interpreted solely in accordance with the laws of the State of Delaware excluding any rules governing choice of laws.
Now, Kati Morton's Linkedin profile also includes an undisclosed business from 2011.
Co Founder
Undisclosed
diciembre de 2011 – 6 years and 11 months ago
Santa Monica, CA
We're an early stage healthcare startup that delivers professional mental health knowledge to a global audience.

High Fidelity Wireframe
MVP
We have strong traction
We're scalable
TAM: 450,000,000

This business is health related. With BetterHelp ''officialy'' starting on 2013, could this undisclosed business she has be BetterHelp in its infancy? Remember that she was one of the first if not the first to get sponsored by BetterHelp back in 2013.
This undisclosed business is also located in California just as BetterHelp's headquarters.
And her HAPPYABLE, INC came to be a year later after Teladoc acquired BetterHelp.

Just some info to keep in mind.
 
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Did you happen upon the other bloggers that exhibit the same behavior? I just reverse image searched that pic, and everything was there. I'm sure you did that already. Thanks for the deeper dive!
Not yet, but they will be next. There was something interesting about Marie in a weird, creepy way. For some reason there are three images connected to this "person"
picture-914773-1495578050.jpg
upload_2018-10-5_23-51-8.jpeg
Marie-Miguel_avatar_1488229827-100x100.jpg

Her face is clearly photoshopped. That pic is fabricated. She is not a real person.
At this point, it wouldn't be surprising if "Marie" was really an elaborate bot or someone who's claiming the name and/or background of a real person, but changed a few details around while using an uncanny manipulated photo.
 
I haven't scrubbed through all 24 pages of this thread, but wanted to share my concerns on their privacy policy, which basically states they can share your data for "analysis and research" purposes, as well as selling "some of their assets including your personal information"

Sounds me like there is a high likelihood of this data being used to train AI. Even if they aren't using it to train AI though, they are at least trying to aggregate data to detect trends or correlations. EVEN IF this isn't the case RIGHT NOW, they could still turn around in 3 months, and sell their data or company to some big company which in turn then uses that data to train an AI. No matter what, user data is, without a doubt, being logged and recorded for some unknown, undisclosed reason.

I'll just give a few excerpts from their privacy policy:

all communications transmitted through the Platform, may be recorded or monitored for [...] training purposes and become part of your file and records.​

We may share aggregated information that does not include any Personal Information with third parties for any purpose, including but not limited to industry analysis, research, business transactions and public relations.

Basically they can share any information for any reason with anyone.

We may sell or transfer some or all of our assets, including your Personal Information, in connection with a merger, acquisition, consolidation, joint venture, reorganization or sale of assets. Such transactions would be covered by a confidentiality agreement.​

This does not lay out ANY terms for such "confidentiality agreement", so you're guaranteed nothing if/when they sell your data. Most likely they'd just anonymize the data and feed it to an AI.

Your information may be transferred [...] outside of your state, province, country or other governmental jurisdiction where the privacy laws may not be as protective as those in your jurisdiction. If you are located in the United States and choose to provide information to us, we may also transfer some Personal Information outside of the US and processes it there. Your consent to this Privacy Policy followed by your submission of such information represents your agreement to such transfers.​

US privacy laws too strict? No problem, they'll just transfer the data outside the US and do what they want with the data. No problems there! /sneed

we may retain an archived copy of your records as required by law for legitimate business purposes or for recordkeeping purposes. There may also be residual information that will remain within our databases and other records, including, without limitation, some data may that may be still archived and stored offline.​

Want data deleted? Ok. But we're gunna keep a copy of it offline. Why? Oh we can train our AI offline, so doesn't really matter if someone asks for their data to be deleted.

We are not responsible for removing information from the third parties that we have already legitimately shared Personal Information about you.​

I don't know if this is trying to say 'from third parties that have already shared...' or 'from third parties that we we have shared info with...'
But this could mean that if they transfer your data to someone else, they aren't responsible for deleting it, and since you don't know who they share data with, you can't ask for your information to be deleted. This seems sketchy and could be a another way for them to record and keep data without violating the privacy policy and GDPR.

They also acknowledge that they may receive health related data. So then how / why can they then share and sell this data in the US?

In some cases, some of the Personal Information that you give to us may be considered health related data.

It really seems like this is just a HPAA lawsuit just waiting to happen.

source: https://www.betterhelp.com/privacy/

Accessed on: October 5th, 2018
Last Update: August 7, 2013 - Privacy Policy / September 14, 2018 - GDPR
 
View attachment 560288

Apparently BetterHelp has/had a LOT of money to spend... With over 1 million per month on Facebook alone.


I work in marketing. It's not unheard of for companies to spend that much. For example, if some Marvel film has a 300M budget you can put 2-300M on top for global marketing alone. Mind you that is just one 3-4 month campaign for one movie.

Influencer marketing is the same depending on the celebrity status, you put down 500K or 1M alone for a few postspon instagram. Beyoncé's praising of the AppleWatch in it's infancy allegedly cost apple 3M.

For this situation, companies tend to approach youtubers, because they are cheap und often don't know how to negotiate, due to a lack of business experience and an agent.

Here' s my estimate how they pay out:

2k$ for low level influencers with under 50k subs + a small referral cut
20k$ for mid tier influencers above 50k subs + slightly bigger cut
100k-200k$ for partners like PhillyD + a personal referral link that is combined with all the youtubers he set up with the deal. I would also estimate that they paid in this range for shane dawsons fear mongering documentary.

The thing about all of this, is that it pays. You get cash from the therapists, the patients, the reach from the influencers... Like the guy/team behind this marketing plan maybe is no genius, but certainly knows his craft (despite working for such a shady company)
 
So NoReazon is "owned" or claimed by Marie Miguel in Sacramento. Nothing more on her. However, Nomvo and No Reazon have a connection. This is at the bottom of NoReazon's site:
Screenshot_2018-10-06-03-00-52.png
Here is something in the About of Nomvo:
Screenshot_2018-10-06-02-58-08.png
Screenshot_2018-10-06-02-58-17.png
Googling msj484 brings along an interesting backstory...

Screenshot_2018-10-06-02-55-07.png
There are more interactions on forums over the years regarding blogging and SEO-related questions Googling msj484. Here's a blog "he" contributed to:
Screenshot_2018-10-06-03-44-53.png
Here's more recent developments:
Screenshot_2018-10-06-03-02-17.png
Other Google posts locate him in Sacramento.
Screenshot_2018-10-06-02-58-52.png
This came up about another domain he owns, if anyone else wants to investigate:
Screenshot_2018-10-06-03-38-51.png
And for the grand finale:
Screenshot_2018-10-06-03-02-32.png

Update edit:
The phone number Murris Johnson used to register that domain (CaliforniaCertificationBoard.Org) earlier this year is the same number for No Reazon. Some Google listings name Marie Miguel as the main contact for No Reazon, as previously mentioned, with that same number:
Screenshot_2018-10-06-04-04-55.png
Screenshot_2018-10-06-04-04-32.png
No Reazon started in 2003, allegedly.

Murris also says he's been at this since 2003 as well:
Screenshot_2018-10-06-04-10-34.png
But Nomvo was founded by him in 2016, per his LinkedIn, and it was soon a success:
Screenshot_2018-10-06-04-12-38.png
 
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I found something really interesting.

Kati Morton states she is the CEO of HAPPYABLE, INC.
HAPPYABLE, INC. is located in Delaware according to the information here:
https://opencorporates.com/companies/us_de/6002711
Company Number
6002711
Incorporation Date
29 March 2016 (over 2 years ago)
Company Type
Corporation
Jurisdiction
Delaware (US)
Agent Name
UNITED STATES CORPORATION AGENTS, INC
Agent Address
300 DELAWARE AVE STE 210-A, WILMINGTON, New Castle, DE, 19801

Coincidentially enough, BetterHelp's TOS are also based on Delaware.
https://www.betterhelp.com/terms/
Important notes about our Agreement
  • This Agreement and our relationship with you shall both be interpreted solely in accordance with the laws of the State of Delaware excluding any rules governing choice of laws.
Now, Kati Morton's Linkedin profile also includes an undisclosed business from 2011.
Co Founder
Undisclosed
diciembre de 2011 – 6 years and 11 months ago
Santa Monica, CA
We're an early stage healthcare startup that delivers professional mental health knowledge to a global audience.

High Fidelity Wireframe
MVP
We have strong traction
We're scalable
TAM: 450,000,000

This business is health related. With BetterHelp ''officialy'' starting on 2013, could this undisclosed business she has be BetterHelp in its infancy? Remember that she was one of the first if not the first to get sponsored by BetterHelp back in 2013.
This undisclosed business is also located in California just as BetterHelp's headquarters.
And her HAPPYABLE, INC came to be a year later after Teladoc acquired BetterHelp.

Just some info to keep in mind.

I also found a weird link between them earlier which shows they go back to at least 2013 near the start of betterhelp becoming public to users, seems like this is a good area to look more into. quoted my earlier post bellow

Earliest youtube video I found shilling this was Sep 23, 2013, and it was Kati Morton because of course it was. Really want to know what her true relationship with betterhelp is.

https://archive.is/d64me

edit: Just found this video of them launching the site

Aug 30, 2013, was the first day the site went public, so they got her to shill in less than a month
 
I haven't scrubbed through all 24 pages of this thread, but wanted to share my concerns on their privacy policy, which basically states they can share your data for "analysis and research" purposes, as well as selling "some of their assets including your personal information"

Sounds me like there is a high likelihood of this data being used to train AI. Even if they aren't using it to train AI though, they are at least trying to aggregate data to detect trends or correlations. EVEN IF this isn't the case RIGHT NOW, they could still turn around in 3 months, and sell their data or company to some big company which in turn then uses that data to train an AI. No matter what, user data is, without a doubt, being logged and recorded for some unknown, undisclosed reason.
So if I got this right, the plan is to let AI analyse conversations with depressed or otherwise mentally troubled people to find patterns in their writing and use these patterns to single out this demographic and market towards them in a more effective way? Someone in this thread said that this particular demographic are more vulnerable towards marketing, so that'd make sense. I can see some very shitty people gladly pay top dollar to have access to this data.
 
The fact that they offered "unlimited messages and live sessions" should have been an obvious red flag for everybody looking at this service. That kind of thing would not be good for patient-therapist boundaries or the therapist's mental health. But I guess it'd be appealing to the kind of crowd who feels they deserve all the attention at all times.
 
So if I got this right, the plan is to let AI analyse conversations with depressed
it looks like a bit more than that to me given better help is part of teladoc (angel invested by Jafco a cyber security and intelligence investment group ) and has links to google , the IDF and loads of other big tech /security groups (see loads of earlier posts) , better help is just one tentacle of it. what will all this health related data be used for .......could be used for lots of diffrent things .....depends on which groups are using it
 
better help is suddenly looking for a marketing SEO as of the 5th of october....... poor fuck
https://archive.is/gIYcn
https://www.indeed.com/viewjob?jk=19fbc42bb0705a25&tk=1cp4fi4ms5j5v800&from=company

SEO is search engine optimization - looking for a seo guy is nothing special, since it is very much integrated into digital marketing, especially since this is just a tech position. SEO has nothing to do with a corporate leadership role, so just a normal job listing for a digital company.
 
So if I got this right, the plan is to let AI analyse conversations with depressed or otherwise mentally troubled people to find patterns in their writing and use these patterns to single out this demographic and market towards them in a more effective way? Someone in this thread said that this particular demographic are more vulnerable towards marketing, so that'd make sense. I can see some very shitty people gladly pay top dollar to have access to this data.

[This is my speculation]
It's hard to say what an "end" goal may be, as access to an individual's health profile (provided by users of the service) and access to conversational data that can be used to train an AI to detect individuals who may exhibit signs of disorders like anxiety, depression, etc.

There seems to be a LOT of money in this company based on how much they spending on customer acquisition and growth. And when something seems "too good to be true" and you don't know what they are selling, then you're the product. It could even be that the $60/week fee is just a way to appear like a more "legit" company selling services and not data. (there are additional reason for charging such as a sunk cost fallacy encouraging users to use this service more often since they "already paid for it").

I would speculate that the data generated from this service could vary widely, from tracking mental disorders, to training AI algorithms that can detect fringe signs of depression in individuals. As you said, someone who would be showing signs of depressions are highly vulnerable and (IMO) targeted ads like this could convince someone they have a more serious issue and they can/should talk to a therapist. I think I heard CVS was involved here somehow, so in the future maybe they could then prescribe some medications.

I'm not saying this will happen, but "worst case scenario" type of thing, this data could be used in very malicious ways to expand the drug industry. BetterHealth is trying to switch thing from a scenario in which you have to find a therapist for help, to one in which the therapist service finds you, when you see an ad.

No matter what though, there is no doubt in my mind that data is being used for something right now. It's just a question of how deep this rabit hole goes.
 
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