Jonathan Yaniv / Jessica Yaniv / @trustednerd / trustednerd.com / JY Knows It / JY British Columbia - Canada's Best Argument Against Transgender Self-Identification

[Yellow Yam Scam]

I must say, while I appreciate the Justice Centre for Constitutional Freedoms' efforts defending the respondents in these cases, I can't say that I'm impressed with what is coming out about their supposed arguments. They are getting bogged down sparring over way too many irrelevant or barely relevant details and just validating the perception that they are a social conservative fringe group. That's an especially bad tactic before the BCHRT, as could be seen with how they took umbrage with the counsel for Laser Cut drawing attention to Yaniv's own inconsistent pronoun and name usage in that case (when it was far more material than the stuff the JCCF is bringing up). While I hate the idea of legitimizing the BCHRT by pandering to them, good legal advocacy does require consideration of how one's arguments and presentation are going to be received by the decision-maker.

Regarding the JCCF, if anyone is interested, here's a relevant thing I noticed on their wikipedia page: https://kiwifarms.net/threads/dumb-shit-on-wikipedia.17498/page-53#post-4956972

You're right, but the real mistake is fighting on their battlefield anyway. Common sense was out of the window when the HRT was brought into existence so all that's left to argue the fringe bullshit and hope that the dice roll your way. The truth is, the way the rules are written, Jonathan's complaints are probably technically legitimate - he is a trans woman and he is being denied services offered to women. Should there be a "You're obviously a pervert" clause? Probably, but there isn't so...

Sun Tzu said: Whoever is first in the field and awaits the coming of the enemy, will be fresh for the fight; whoever is second in the field and has to hasten to battle will arrive exhausted.

 

[Cato]

You're right, but the real mistake is fighting on their battlefield anyway. Common sense was out of the window when the HRT was brought into existence so all that's left to argue the fringe bullshit and hope that the dice roll your way. The truth is, the way the rules are written, Jonathan's complaints are probably technically legitimate - he is a trans woman and he is being denied services offered to women. Should there be a "You're obviously a pervert" clause? Probably, but there isn't so...

Sun Tzu said: Whoever is first in the field and awaits the coming of the enemy, will be fresh for the fight; whoever is second in the field and has to hasten to battle will arrive exhausted.

I agree with you that (unfortunately) Yaniv almost certainly can prove a prima facie case of discrimination. I disagree that all the respondents can do is try to argue fringe bullshit about Yaniv going to strippers in Vegas years ago and not menstruating. There is a proper and legitimate argument for a defence of bona fide and reasonable justification here (which, in fact, various respondents to Yaniv have argued), although legally it's actually a very non-obvious case with said defence invoked and could go either way.

I'm all for advocacy in the political sphere to try to disband Canada's human rights tribunals entirely, but in the meantime they exist, the alternative to responding competently to complaints is surrender on that front, and doing this culture warrior stuff in the hearings is just going to piss off the tribunal members. There is certainly a place for these broader cultural arguments but it's not at the hearings, where one has a duty to their client first and foremost and this runs the risk of screwing them over by having the tribunal take out their annoyance on them.

 

[MG 620]

Too bad I'm not Canadian or I could report Jonathan for discriminating legit wheelchair users.

 

[RetardedCat]

Apparently, the 15 minute period of paralysis has passed, and Jessie is now able to straighten out the paper before taking a picture:

View attachment 829986
(Link) (Archive)

So, there we have it - PROOF that Jessie has complained about symptoms. So what if investigations haven't been able to diagnose anything actually wrong? Take that, haters!

PROOF
View attachment 830065

Thank god I thought I was the only one who expected that he'd just type this up himself.

 

[Kiwi Lime Pie]

I can't say that I'm impressed with what is coming out about their supposed arguments. They are getting bogged down sparring over way too many irrelevant or barely relevant details and just validating the perception that they are a social conservative fringe group. That's an especially bad tactic before the BCHRT, as could be seen with how they took umbrage with the counsel for Laser Cut drawing attention to Yaniv's own inconsistent pronoun and name usage in that case (when it was far more material than the stuff the JCCF is bringing up). While I hate the idea of legitimizing the BCHRT by pandering to them, good legal advocacy does require consideration of how one's arguments and presentation are going to be received by the decision-maker.

The JCCF folks seem to be more bogged down in the extraneous stuff such as the question as to whether JY menstruates. There are women, infertile ones for example, that don't -- making this seemingly irrelevant in a case about genital waxing.

Sadly, this isn't the first time I've seen defense counsel choose to use the weakest or worst-prepared arguments in a case.

You're right, but the real mistake is fighting on their battlefield anyway. Common sense was out of the window when the HRT was brought into existence so all that's left to argue the fringe bullshit and hope that the dice roll your way.

These tribunals seem more focused on social justice than legal justice. And that's the scary part. The tribunal system seems more apt for bullying critics into silence or submission and not for seeking legitimate redress for wrongs.

In JY's BCHRT cases, however, the fact JY has an apparent ex parte relationship with tribunal member Devyn Cousineau definitely calls to question the impartiality of both Devyn and the process as a whole.

So are subjects of complaint supposed to just let people like Yaniv get default judgments, then? What are you actually proposing as an alternative to representing respondents competently in the hearings?

Competency seems to be the operative word here. JY has claimed gender/identity discrimination and might have enough facts to establish a prima facie case for it. A competent defense might first try to establish the fact that JY has male genitalia. If JY admits to it on the record, the respondents can then offer into evidence any facts regarding the differences in training, supplies, and skills needed to wax male genitalia versus female genitalia and offer examples where salons or waxers might choose to focus exclusively on one set (female) over the other (male). With the current respondent arguing a religious objection, the counsel could try to argue that no person should be compelled to perform a service contrary to a sincere, closely-held religious belief. Alternatively, another broader argument could be raised that someone shouldn't be compelled to do something they are neither trained for (waxing male genitalia) nor comfortable with (a married woman waxer being alone with a male client in a situation contrary to the former's religious upbringing). In short, make it less abut JY's transgendered status and more about what all is necessary to wax JY's genitals and whether the respondent waxer meets those necessities.

E: Fixed late-night typos.

 

[deadcowcultist]

Has Jon jumped on the muh fibro band wagon yet?
he needs to up his game if he hasn't

 

[MG 620]

Has Jon jumped on the muh fibro band wagon yet?
he needs to up his game if he hasn't

I give it a week max. He's probably taking notes - on the phone that is attached to his scooter.

 

[Pony Horn]

This is totally the kind of letter a doctor's office writes to help a patient get a scooter or a parking space. They aren't going to deny patients those letters unless they have some really good evidence that the patient is faking, and that's hard to prove with claims like intermittent neurological problems. The doctor just signs that shit, usually it is a receptionist or a medical assistant that writes it.

He has a few different health problems for sure, but I really doubt that a rascal is the vehicle of choice when your legs go out on you for 15 minutes at a time. Imagine if your leg went numb and slipped out onto the floor on one of those things while you drove it, you would be fucked. Wheelchairs have more of a bucket type of seat and can come with seat belts to keep people from slipping out. They also have spots to secure legs so they don't fall out or catch on anything, and a rascal does not.

The scooter seat might be tall enough in the back for support. A bigger problem would be as you said, the knees and feet.



As you can see below, the scooter's seat is too high and the foot rests are too wide to be able to do a simple stand and pivot. The 1st photo has him standing next to it. The 2nd one is of him stepping on it. The 3rd is of him standing on it.

Spoiler: Photos

While he's putting on a bit of a performance he obviously can step up and down on it and do it safely enough that his neurotic mother isn't standing close by and ready to steady him in case he has trouble. His mother is actually on the opposite side of the scooter and not even in frame. So he doesn't seem like much of a fall risk.

There's no using a hoyer lift on that scooter. If he did suffer from temporary paralysis and had an episode while on it he would be stuck on it until he was able to move his legs again. That would be OK if he only had to go to the bathroom and he was wearing a diaper but it would be a large problem if there was a major medical emergency (like "a stroke").

I'm with you. I think he has something wrong with him but he's exaggerating.

 

[GethN7]

I for one am just amazed Canada has gotten to this point.

This deviant is blatantly abusing a bastardization of justice and public health services and because of some dumbasses writing even dumber laws, he's been getting away with being an indolent pedo munchie.

Thankfully, it seems he's been pushing his luck to the point even Canada at it's most cucked is reaching it's limit, but I'm still stunned he got this far already with the crap he's pulled.

 

[Ashenthorn]

The tribunal member ruled that since the waxing involved genitals, it was fair to ask about the outside of JY's body - but not the inside.

LadyWaxes-R-Us:
"On the rag? Yeast infection? Hoohah thrush? Open weeping herpes sores? NO PROBLEM! Come see us for your Brazilian wax today! What's on the inside doesn't matter!™"

 

[Yellow Yam Scam]

I agree with you that (unfortunately) Yaniv almost certainly can prove a prima facie case of discrimination. I disagree that all the respondents can do is try to argue fringe bullshit about Yaniv going to strippers in Vegas years ago and not menstruating. There is a proper and legitimate argument for a defence of bona fide and reasonable justification here (which, in fact, various respondents to Yaniv have argued), although legally it's actually a very non-obvious case with said defence invoked and could go either way.

I'm all for advocacy in the political sphere to try to disband Canada's human rights tribunals entirely, but in the meantime they exist, the alternative to responding competently to complaints is surrender on that front, and doing this culture warrior stuff in the hearings is just going to piss off the tribunal members. There is certainly a place for these broader cultural arguments but it's not at the hearings, where one has a duty to their client first and foremost and this runs the risk of screwing them over by having the tribunal take out their annoyance on them.

But we saw the report of the hearing and they steamrolled all over any legitimate arguments and went straight to a discussion of if vagina waxing is "gender affirming" and if it mattered that the victims were "racialized." There's no amount of clown chess that you can play to ever figure out what it is they're looking for. I think the practical result of the HRT is that it's a showtrial for both sides to attempt to demonize the other with the understanding that the HRT won't find in favor of anyone that is made to look sufficiently disgusting in the eyes of the public, lest they be (rightfully) accused of supporting said disgusting person. If JY was a better troon without a history of pedophilia and racism, he'd win these cases handily. I think the only real strategy is to make JY as toxic as possible.

 

[Cato]

But we saw the report of the hearing and they steamrolled all over any legitimate arguments and went straight to a discussion of if vagina waxing is "gender affirming" and if it mattered that the victims were "racialized." (...) I think the only real strategy is to make JY as toxic as possible.

It's rather odd that you're citing JY v. Various Waxing Salons as justification for the efficacy of the strategy of tarring Yaniv as the piece of shit that he is, given that the respondent's counsel was explicitly reamed out for exactly that in that case, and it was made abundantly clear that attacking Yaniv's sincerity (edit - with respect to his gender identity, I mean) was, sadly, not going to work, as obvious a complete fraud as he is to everyone here.

As for "steamrolling all over any legitimate arguments," Yaniv's complaint and the application of the bona fide and reasonable justification defence to it were not resolved in that case, as Yaniv had already withdrawn said complaint. That case was merely addressing an application to limit publication and an application for costs. And, whatever else you want to say about the decision, it actually did explicitly acknowledge that the bona fide and reasonable justification defence had merit to it (and, unfortunately, that Yaniv's complaint also had merit, so there was public interest in sorting all of this out).

In any case, obviously we're not going to agree about this regardless, so I don't see any point in shitting up the thread arguing about it further.

 

[Tragi-Chan]

They spent an hour in court trying to determine if Jonathan had a period.
View attachment 830255
https://mobile.twitter.com/moebius_strip/status/1147634584164507649

Twitter

archived 7 Jul 2019 00:38:24 UTC

archive.fo

I don’t understand why this is so difficult. Fatty claims to be a trans woman. He has never explicitly claimed to be anything else, unless you count his mincing of words over being a “full woman,” but we know for a fact that he is trans.

For him to be able to menstruate would be extremely unusual and possibly medically unprecedented. He would be able to produce reams of documentation in support, especially with his daily hospital visits. But he doesn’t. He just complains that no one knows what he has or doesn’t have.

It is therefore very reasonable to assume that Tampon Jon does not menstruate. If he does, show us the proof. Don’t waste time debating something that simply cannot be.

"Fake" tits, right...

Ive never been to any doctors or hospital that just, even if you needed a note, handed out a personal note that was written up in like Microsoft Word.

Usually they give out more professional sort of documents, and they have like mass produced forms and shit, or they write it on a pad or something. Even if theyre handing you documentation, be it about your condition or whatever, it's usually pre-made pamphlets and shit.

I did a bit of medical temping back in the day, and had to produce a lot of reports. Typically, they would be as comprehensive as possible to answer any possible questions. You would have:

- A full list of known medical conditions.
- A list of medications the patient is currently on.
- Any relevant symptoms the patient has that relate to their application.
- Any special requirements relating to their condition.

This “letter” just seems really basic. If it’s in support of him using a scootypuff, it should specifically describe his mobility issues. If it’s a general report on his condition, it should go into more detail.

 

[wabbits]

Useful in this discussion I think - from the OP, Yaniv in March 2018: "I still have my male genitals though is that ok? I haven't had surgery."


In his first tease yesterday, Yaniv included an important bit of information in the upper left corner - Sparc issues parking permits to people with disabilities. The note is not about a scooter.


To those analyzing defense strategies before the BCHRT, don't forget that tribunal decisions can be appealed into BC's "real" court system. To succeed on appeal - and possibly challenging the laws creating the tribunals or granting such broadly worded privileges to trans genders to allow Yaniv to do what he is doing - a strong and complex factual basis has to be laid down at the tribunal level. The defense strategy - sound or not - may be aiming to do that.

Someone make some complete health timeline of his numerous and piling conditions. ...

It's right here.

 

[Charlie Delicious]

Maybe Yaniv could hire some actual private security, you know, one with a gun, so he can command them to shoot people on demand.

Or shoot brown A&W workers who don't speak English with his preferred accent

 

[Okami Green]

The scooter seat might be tall enough in the back for support. A bigger problem would be as you said, the knees and feet.

View attachment 830412

As you can see below, the scooter's seat is too high and the foot rests are too wide to be able to do a simple stand and pivot. The 1st photo has him standing next to it. The 2nd one is of him stepping on it. The 3rd is of him standing on it.

Spoiler: Photos

View attachment 830425View attachment 830433View attachment 830436

While he's putting on a bit of a performance he obviously can step up and down on it and do it safely enough that his neurotic mother isn't standing close by and ready to steady him in case he has trouble. His mother is actually on the opposite side of the scooter and not even in frame. So he doesn't seem like much of a fall risk.

There's no using a hoyer lift on that scooter. If he did suffer from temporary paralysis and had an episode while on it he would be stuck on it until he was able to move his legs again. That would be OK if he only had to go to the bathroom and he was wearing a diaper but it would be a large problem if there was a major medical emergency (like "a stroke").

I'm with you. I think he has something wrong with him but he's exaggerating.

I love seeing other people with a shred of knowledge of the medical field calling Yaniv out on his bullshit. I couldn't quite place exactly what made those photos so offputting to me but the way that he gets on to the scooter is very different than I've ever seen someone with a legitimate issue use one. His mother is not in the photos, but I presume that she does not assist him in rising/sitting from the scooter. You would expect someone with true mobility issues to have difficulty standing, too. Even in the first photo where he is bent over, Yaniv is exaggerating how difficult it is to stand. He is standing way too far away from the scoot to effectively brace himself against it. That's why his arms are bent and perpendicular to his body. His feet are spread wide apart and his knees are bent, but he is leaning forwards because the scoot is too far away.

Why do I care about the scoot being too far away?
Because it means that Yaniv sitting down on the bus seat was not a strenuous task. If there truly were mobility issues, Yaniv would have lined the scoot up to the seat as close as possible so his mother could help him slide into the seat. He also left the scoot in the middle of the aisle. There's a door behind him, but the scoot looks to be diagonally parked across the open aisle in the cabin. That is a safety hazard and extremely inconsiderate, but I expected nothing less from the rolling troll of BC.

I personally can't wait until he steps- well, hobbles - his act up and gets a power wheelchair. The upgrade is inevitable and I could use a good laugh.

 

[wabbits]

I love seeing other people with a shred of knowledge of the medical field calling Yaniv out on his bullshit. I couldn't quite place exactly what made those photos so offputting to me but the way that he gets on to the scooter is very different than I've ever seen someone with a legitimate issue use one. His mother is not in the photos, but I presume that she does not assist him in rising/sitting from the scooter. You would expect someone with true mobility issues to have difficulty standing, too. Even in the first photo where he is bent over, Yaniv is exaggerating how difficult it is to stand. He is standing way too far away from the scoot to effectively brace himself against it. That's why his arms are bent and perpendicular to his body. His feet are spread wide apart and his knees are bent, but he is leaning forwards because the scoot is too far away.

Why do I care about the scoot being too far away?
Because it means that Yaniv sitting down on the bus seat was not a strenuous task. If there truly were mobility issues, Yaniv would have lined the scoot up to the seat as close as possible so his mother could help him slide into the seat. He also left the scoot in the middle of the aisle. There's a door behind him, but the scoot looks to be diagonally parked across the open aisle in the cabin. That is a safety hazard and extremely inconsiderate, but I expected nothing less from the rolling troll of BC.

I personally can't wait until he steps- well, hobbles - his act up and gets a power wheelchair. The upgrade is inevitable and I could use a good laugh.

From what I've read online and heard from my neighborhood medical equipment dealer yesterday, a power chair would be better for Yaniv given what he's said about his condition.

A chair provides better physical security for someone who has seizures, "collapses," cannot feel his legs, or passes out completely without warning - all of which Yaniv has reported as happening to him more than once a week and sometimes more than once a day.

People can fall out of wheelchairs if they don't have seating restraints, but falls from scooters are far likelier and are particularly dangerous if the scooter is in motion or is near the edge of any kind of platform or path.

Scooters can be configured to keep someone on the seat, but Yaniv's does not appear to have been customized in that way. He either did not inform the provider of the symptoms he's reported on Facebook and Twitter or he had a careless/inexpert provider.

The equipment lady watched Yaniv's McDonald's drive-thru video with horror and asked why he wasn't wearing a helmet when he's driving around with what he reports as an uncontrolled seizure disorder.

Her more fundamental question was why Yaniv was driving the scooter among cars and trucks when he doesn't know from moment to moment whether he will lose consciousness or control of his body. It's not about accessibility. It's about staying alive and not risking the injury of others you may collide with or force to avoid you. Driving a scooter across highways is dangerous enough, but actually being in a traffic lane, albeit a slow moving one, is far more dangerous.

Which leads to another question: Has he had his driver's license revoked?

BC's standards for drivers who have experienced seizures generally state that a driver must (among other things) have not had a seizure for six months before resuming driving, a requirement Yaniv clearly cannot meet.

The Section 17.6.1 requirement seems to fit what Yaniv says he has experienced, but perhaps 17.6.6, 17.6.11, or 17.6.14 would be appropriate. None of them would allow him to pilot half a ton of steel or more at any speed. In the States, I know from a friend's experience that doctors treating someone with a new seizure disorder report that health problem to the driver licensing authority. It's not left up to the patient to do that. My friend went into the hospital with a flawless driving record and left ineligible to drive for a year in our state.

Perhaps Miriam is driving him to the handicapped spaces he's now entitled to use. I hope so.

 

[Judge Holden]

Ya know every time I visit this thread Yaniv is acting an order of magnitude worse and more repulsively beyond what I previously assumed possible even for him. Each and every time I think he has found rock bottom the nigger pulls out a jackhammer and digs ever deeper into the shame pit. Like being a pedophile obsessed with children's menstruation/legally bullying traumatised young muslim women for not bikini waxing him/forcing his way into beauty pagents/literally all the other shit we have documented wasnt bad enough now he is just straight up pretending to be crippled for asspats and sympathy

Im legitimately worried that when I check this thread again next week he is going to be wearing nothing but an obscenely soiled diaper in public and suing little girls for not changing him in exchange for in-depth tampon advice or some shit....I mean jesus fucking christ how much lower can this specimen go before being arrested/publically beaten by a baying mob?!

 

[CatParty]

hay guis! I totally have diagnosed JY with the ultimate diagnosis that totally also proves s he's female!

female!

Female hysteria was once a common medical diagnosis for women, which was described as exhibiting a wide array of symptoms, including anxiety, shortness of breath, fainting, nervousness, sexual desire, insomnia, fluid retention, heaviness in the abdomen, irritability, loss of appetite for food or sex, (paradoxically) sexually forward behaviour, and a "tendency to cause trouble for others".

He’s got the vapors!

 

[Judge Holden]

He’s got the vapors!

TLDR