Snowflake Chloe Wilkinson / DissociaDID and Nanette Zuniga / Nan / TeamPinata

Considering that diagnostic criteria for DID (real ones, not the ones Chloe presents on her channel) are: a child under the age of 5 suffering from severe repeated trauma, without parental support (basically kid left alone with shit so messed up their brain has no other option but to kind of fall apart) I would feel like shit if I was her parents. This disorder basically implies that their kid was more or less tortured and left alone to deal with it. They would either have to be abusers themselves, enablers of the abuser, or not give a fuck about their kid for this to happen.

TMI ahead skip if you don’t care
I, as probably a lot of people here, am disgusted by Chloes behavior because it hits me personally. I have suffered early childhood trauma myself, so seeing someone fetishize a disorder based on that makes me want to punch them in the face. It’s not quirky and cute, most victims would rather keep the mental mess that resulted from their trauma a secret and the idea of blasting it on YouTube for views and money is absolutely insane for me.
 
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A little off topic from the last few posts but I just want to add in that according to Nan’s latest Instagram post, she believes she has COVID-19 (self diagnosed of course). Obviously it’s not impossible but I just see it as a ploy for sympathy and attention. In the comments, her fans are clearly worried, to which she replies something like... don’t worry, we have a weak immune system and bad lungs... but we’ll be fine. Barf. Also the spelling and grammar for Riven are horrendous. I can hear that fake midwestern (is it southern?) accent in my head as I read the comments.

Also fingers crossed these attachments are properly embedded. I’m trying to channel the basic HTML I learned back in the day when I made geocities and angel fire webpages covered in Blingee.

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Hmm... 🤔
Well, something doesn't quite line up here. So, which one is it Chloe? Wonder if the first one was made after she realized a flaw in her logic since she likely wasn't abused as a child so she changed it to trauma to cover herself from potential questioning of the validity of her disorder.

Chloe herself comes off as being a fake because... well she is technically fake.

Actually, to Chloe, Chloe isn't only fake, she's dead. After she integrated and became Nin, Chloe fucking died, or at least everyone treated her like she did. (Has anyone else pointed out how similar Nan's and Nin's names are. Wonder if it was intentional?)
 
Oddly, Dr. Valerie Hawes is a consulting forensic psychiatrist. She has a chapter in a book called Treating Personality Disorder (ISBN 978-0415404808 ), and all of her reference cases are from the justice system, as her title would imply. It seems odd to me that she would be the supervising psychiatrist at a private mental health center, and yet every reference case she uses is from someone she saw who was jailed or in prison.

Also from her chapter:

In her own words, she says that several interviews are necessary to make even a judgement about diagnosis, let alone a final diagnosis. This absolutely does not align with this idea of a 4 hour assessment for a diagnosis. I also can't seem to find any literature or interviews from her regarding The Potter Centre, it seems to absolutely run by Dr. Remy Aquarone, and I'm failing to see how Dr. Hawes is involved at all, other than on paper.

Aside from the fact that this assessment is clearly biased and lacks the proper data point depth necessary to determine cause and severity of symptoms that are self-reported, 60% being found to have DID, when that's the rarest of the spectrum of dissociate disorders is patently absurd. The majority of people suffering from dissociative events likely have either co-morbid low spectrum dissociative disorders, like depersonalization disorder and something like bpd, or c-ptsd. Or Malingering/Factitious/Histrionic Disorders

Well this is interesting. I wondered about the forensic psychiatrist title. Where I grew up that would have meant she would have been involved in criminal cases and it seems she was. Funny, because DID is never successfully used as a defence. If Hawes is involved in practice I'm sure she'll be getting some form of payout to make it worthwhile. Her lack of official comment on Pottergate is interesting. She doesn't want to tie her name to the place.

The sheer volume of people coming out of that place with a DID diagnosis is criminal. Particularly when you consider the fact that the majority self refer. Chloe really shot herself in the foot by using Pottergate to give her any amount of legitimacy. Having moved to Norwich deliberately to be closer to the centre in the hopes of getting her diagnosis I'm less inclined to believe she was duped by Aquarone and more inclined to believe she sought her diagnosis deliberately.

Axolotls in a Trenchcoat and DID Mom. (They've both collabed with Chloe.) The fact that I knew that off the top of my head means I've officially misused these quarantine days.

Damn, I forgot about DID Mom. Still, as promised, you get the n-word pass. Go call Chloe a nigger and see if she splits.

I think the idea that most people have a mental hospital is the dramatized version of them that resemble mental health jails, and thus, the malingerers talk about psychiatric facilities like they are scary and traumatic. Some people spend their holds in bad facilities, like in actual jails, if they aren't in need of emergent care, but as far as actual psychiatric hospitals/wards go, the worst thing about them are the bars on the windows.

It's honestly stuff like this that makes me wonder if she believes her own lies at this point.

Nan has a series of vlogs of her time spent in a psych unit of some description and she spends a lot of time lamenting over the conditions. At one stage she is sitting in the yard of what seems to be a house with a cigarette talking as if she's in the gulag.

I don't think Chloe believes her own lies. You see it when she switches in videos on other channels. She has this almost sheepish look like she's wondering if they think she's fake. She covers up her face in the Anthony videos when switching which is something I've never seen her do in her own videos. She usually does a lot of staring and blinking but with a whole camera crew surrounding her I think her embarrassment took over.
At times, she openly starts laughing at things that are legitimately funny but tries to play it off as nerves or another alter. Sometimes with Nan's ridiculous accents she can't stop herself and breaks character.

Just found this video.

At 8:25 Chloe starts talking about buying her diagnosis. Apparently, Remy also diagnosed Multiplicity and Me. Seeing as a small minority of doctors are responsible for having diagnosed the majority of DID cases, I'd be shocked if this guy wasn't making a living diagnosing every attention seeker and confused BPD sufferer in his corner of the UK willing to pay.

And, of course, after she's done talking about how Remy diagnosed her in a few hours, (Or asked someone licensed to do it for him, rather. Someone who, presumedly, didn't even speak to Chloe.) she proceeds to dramatically dissociate and switch. As is custom.

She also seems to be suggesting that her parents paid for her treatment. The £1000 raised in the GoFundMe wasn't enough as she'd set the goal at 3000. Four hours of form filling and a few thousands to buy her false legitimacy.

I don't think we would have been able to get a diagnosis without him. So, if there were more people like Remy - which is the name of the man from The Pottergate Centre if anyone in the UK is interested - then it would be so much easier to provide treatment and be able to access the diagnosis.

Why she feels the need to advertise Pottergate to her fans is beyond me. She makes a diagnosis so accessible, providing her audience have parents willing to pay.

Frankly, I feel some level of neurology should be standard for all psychological fields. Theoretical models are nice and all, but when genetics are responsible for at least 50% of personality development, you can't just be ignorant of how the brain works. It's also what makes me skeptical of DID in general. In order for cases like Chloe and Nan's to be legitimate, you'd have to have multiple personality states developing completely independent of their genetics.

Chloe often talks about brain scans of patients with DID. She claims that when alters switch different areas of the brain 'light up' in relation to different memories. I don't think she understands the studies she quotes and I don't think I have the background to understand them either. She seems to cherry pick the things that chime with her story.

In reality Chloe probably got sick of waiting for the NHS and decided to get shit diagnosed herself. It’s a long process so in a way it’s understandable, but she never finished the length of the NHS procedure to get formally diagnosed. The university probably needed her to get that so she could return, as to properly accomodate for her, and when she didn’t it turned into a stalemate.

Do you happen to know if DID treatment is offered on the NHS? She claims often that it isn't which is why she was forced to go private. But the London clinic takes NHS referrals. Would I be right in thinking that whilst the NHS don't offer treatment 'in house' they would pay for private treatment if necessary at the London clinic?
My theory thus far is that she wanted the diagnosis and dropped hints to her crisis team, NHS workers, and her therapist who were all unresponsive or unwilling to offer her a diagnosis. If the NHS are so stretched it seems unlikely they would refer her to the clinic for treatment unless they felt she really needed it. So, frustration led her to pay at Pottergate. Is that plausible?

Yep that was what I was trying to say. Sorry if it didn't come out that way

You're fine, I was just clarifying.

Well... now I kind of am. Hadn't even thought of that, that's a bit fucky to think about. How do you suppose she actually is? I doubt she has a very stable sense of self; at this point, she may not even know who exactly she is, she's definitely very caught up in her delusions.

In her own words, "-the truth comes out eventually." So, when do you guys think she'll breakdown and realize shes deluded herself and needs to get serious help besides BetterHelp "therapy" and telling herself everything is fine and normal? I think it won't be for a while, but she won't stay relevant forever so I suspect it'll happen, for her sake at least. Granted I'm kind of leaning towards her never admitting it (or at least not publicly can't let the haters win). There is no way-- even if she is deluded-- that she doesn't realize how fucked all this is.

I don't think she has a stable sense of self but that is indicative of a personality disorder. The truth will eventually come out and I'm torn between thinking she was lead into the diagnosis and between thinking she sought it out deliberately. I'm leaning towards the latter. I do think there is more evidence to suggest that this is a deliberate act on her part rather than a delusion based on how she sought out her diagnosis and the inconsistencies in her story.

Honestly, I hope they ARE in on it. It's less sad than the alternative.

Imagine your child falsely leading you to believe that they experienced something so horrific that their mind had to fracture itself into pieces just to survive.

I don't think the parents are in on it. I think they're very distressed by the situation and are pouring all their financial support into her therapy as they're at a loss as to how else to help her. It seems they're just as confused as to what caused the disorder so there isn't a way to help.


Well, something doesn't quite line up here. So, which one is it Chloe? Wonder if the first one was made after she realized a flaw in her logic since she likely wasn't abused as a child so she changed it to trauma to cover herself from potential questioning of the validity of her disorder.

In this video quite early on in her channels life she says that DID is caused by abuse again and alludes to the fact that she was regularly abused. She also contradicts her later statements that there is no original personality by saying that alters like Kyle form to protect the original individual from the abuse.
Interestingly she is also acting as Kyle and claims that her accent is 'subtle' so as to protect the system from being caught out. In this early video, it really is quite subtle. Funny how that went out of the window in her later videos and Kyle's accent went very Oliver Twist.
 
Actually, to Chloe, Chloe isn't only fake, she's dead. After she integrated and became Nin, Chloe fucking died, or at least everyone treated her like she did. (Has anyone else pointed out how similar Nan's and Nin's names are. Wonder if it was intentional?)
Fuck, didn't realize Chloe was dead.

Chloe often talks about brain scans of patients with DID. She claims that when alters switch different areas of the brain 'light up' in relation to different memories. I don't think she understands the studies she quotes and I don't think I have the background to understand them either. She seems to cherry pick the things that chime with her story.
Can you link the studies? I may not be a psychiatrist yet, but if there's one thing that's been pounded into my head since day 1, it's how to read and interpret primary literature.
 
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Chloe often talks about brain scans of patients with DID. She claims that when alters switch different areas of the brain 'light up' in relation to different memories. I don't think she understands the studies she quotes and I don't think I have the background to understand them either. She seems to cherry pick the things that chime with her story.

I haven't seen the actual study but I can almost guarantee that it wasn't done properly. I imagine they only tested people who claimed DID, without creating one group of people that fit the diagnostic criteria and people who claimed DID but didn't fulfill the criteria to see if the brain lit up appropriately for each group.
 
Fuck, didn't realize Chloe was dead.
RIP sweet princess
Can you link the studies? I may not be a psychiatrist yet, but if there's one thing that's been pounded into my head since day 1, it's how to read and interpret primary literature.

I haven't seen the actual study but I can almost guarantee that it wasn't done properly. I imagine they only tested people who claimed DID, without creating one group of people that fit the diagnostic criteria and people who claimed DID but didn't fulfill the criteria to see if the brain lit up appropriately for each group.


I've got all of these videos archived but I can't upload anything longer than five minutes at the moment so I'll link for now. She talks about the studies in this video and the studies are from 1992, 2001, 2007. She linked a lot of things so they're under the spoiler.

Studies and sources used in this video: Reinders, Willemsen, Vos, den Boer, & Nijenhuis, (2012) Sar, Unal, and Ozturk, (2007) Reinders et al., (2003, 2006) Elzinga et al., (2007) Sar, Unal, Kiziltan, Kundakci, and Ozturk, (2001) Putnam (1997) Saxe, Vasile, Hill, Bloomingdale and van der Kolk, (1992)

 
12 years yet for me.

Frankly, I feel some level of neurology should be standard for all psychological fields. Theoretical models are nice and all, but when genetics are responsible for at least 50% of personality development, you can't just be ignorant of how the brain works. It's also what makes me skeptical of DID in general. In order for cases like Chloe and Nan's to be legitimate, you'd have to have multiple personality states developing completely independent of their genetics.
They really do need to require neurology courses so many people I run into don't know how the brain works.

Also since diagnostic criteria has been discussed here is the current requirements from dsm-v:

Dissociative Identity Disorder : Diagnostic Criteria 300.14 (F44.81)

A. Disruption of identity characterized by two or more distinct personality states, which may be described in some cultures as an experience of possession. The disruption in identity involves marked discontinuity in sense of self and sense of agency, accompanied
by related alterations in affect, behavior, consciousness, memory, perception, cognition, and/or sensory-motor functioning. These signs and symptoms may be observed by others or reported by the individual.

B. Recurrent gaps in the recall of everyday events, important personal information, and/or traumatic events that are inconsistent with ordinary forgetting.

C. The symptoms cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.

D. The disturbance is not a normal part of a broadly accepted cultural or religious practice. Note: In children, the symptoms are not better explained by imaginary playmates or other fantasy play.

E. The symptoms are not attributable to the physiological effects of a substance (e.g., blacl<outs or chaotic behavior during alcohol intoxication) or another medical condition (e.g., complex partial seizures).

Function Consequences of DID

Impairment varies widely, from apparently minimal (e.g., in high-functioning professionals) to profound. Regardless of level of disability, individuals with dissociative identity disorder commonly minimize the impact of their dissociative and posttraumatic symptoms.
The symptoms of higher-functioning individuals may impair their relational, marital, family, and parenting functions more than their occupational and professional life (although the latter also may be affected). With appropriate treatment, many impaired individuals
show marked improvement in occupational and personal functioning. However, some remain highly impaired in most activities of living. These individuals may only respond to treatment very slowly, with gradual reduction in or improved tolerance of their dissociative and posttraumatic symptoms. Long-term supportive treatment may slowly increase these individuals' ability to manage their symptoms and decrease use of more restrictive levels of care.

The defining feature of dissociative identity disorder is the presence of two or more distinct personality states or an experience of possession (Criterion A). The overtness orcovertness of these personality states, however, varies as a function of psychological
motivation, current level of stress, culture, internal conflicts and dynamics, and emotionalresilience. Sustained periods of identity disruption may occur when psychosocial pressuresare severe and/or prolonged. In many possession-form cases of dissociative identity
disorder, and in a small proportion of non-possession-form cases, manifestations of alternateidentities are highly overt. Most individuals with non-possession-form dissociativeidentity disorder do not overtly display their discontinuity of identity for long periods oftime; only a small minority present to clinical attention with observable alternation ofidentities. When alternate personality states are not directly observed, the disorder can beidentified by two clusters of symptoms: 1) sudden alterations or discontinuities in sense ofself and sense οί agency (Criterion A), and 2) recurrent dissociative amnesias (Criterion B).

Criterion A symptoms are related to discontinuities of experience that can affect anyaspect of an individual's functioning. Individuals v^ith dissociative identity disorder mayreport the feeling that they have suddenly become depersonalized observers of their"own" speech and actions, which they may feel powerless to stop (sense of self). Such individualsmay also report perceptions of voices (e.g., a child's voice; crying; the voice of aspiritual being). In some cases, voices are experienced as multiple, perplexing, independentthought streams over which the individual experiences no control. Strong emotions,impulses, and even speech or other actions may suddenly emerge, without a sense of personalownership or control (sense of agency). These emotions and impulses are frequentlyreported as ego-dystonic and puzzling. Attitudes, outlooks, and personal preferences(e.g., about food, activities, dress) may suddenly shift and then shift back. Individuals mayreport that their bodies feel different (e.g., like a small child, like the opposite gender, hugeand muscular). Alterations in sense of self and loss of personal agency may be accompaniedby a feeling that these attitudes, emotions, and behaviors—even one's body—are"not mine" and/or are "not under my control." Although most Criterion A symptoms aresubjective, many of these sudden discontinuities in speech, affect, and behavior can be witnessedby family, friends, or the clinician. Non-epileptic seizures and other conversionsymptoms are prominent in some presentations of dissociative identity disorder, especiallyin some non-Westem settings.

The dissociative amnesia of individuals with dissociative identity disorder manifests inthree primary ways: as 1) gaps in remote memory of personal life events (e.g., periods ofchildhood or adolescence; some important life events, such as the death of a grandparent,
getting married, giving birth); 2) lapses in dependable memory (e.g., of what happenedtoday, of well-leamed skills such as how to do their job, use a computer, read, drive); and3) discovery of evidence of their everyday actions and tasks that they do not recollect doing(e.g., finding unexplained objects in their shopping bags or among their possessions;finding perplexing writings or drawings that they must have created; discovering injuries;"coming to" in the midst of doing something). Dissociative fugues, wherein the persondiscovers dissociated travel, are common. Thus, individuals with dissociative identity disordermay report that they have suddenly found themselves at the beach, at work, in a nightclub,or somewhere at home (e.g., in the closet, on a bed or sofa, in the corner) with no
memory of how they came to be there. Amnesia in individuals with dissociative identity disorderis not limited to stressful or traumatic events; these individuals often cannot recalleveryday events as well.

Individuals with dissociative identity disorder vary in their awareness and attitude towardtheir amnesias. It is common for these individuals to minimize their amnestic symptoms.Some of their amnestic behaviors may be apparent to others—as when these persons
do not recall something they were witnessed to have done or said, when they cannotremember their own name, or when they do not recognize their spouse, children, or closefriends.

Possession-form identities in dissociative identity disorder typically manifest as behaviorsthat appear as if a "spirit," supernatural being, or outside person has taken control,such that the individual begins speaking or acting in a distinctly different manner. For example,
an individual's behavior may give the appearance that her identity has beenreplaced by the "ghost" of a girl who committed suicide in the same community yearsbefore, speaking and acting as though she were still alive. Or an individual may be "takenover" by a demon or deity, resulting in profound impairment, and demanding that the individualor a relative be punished for a past act, followed by more subtle periods of identityalteration. However, the majority of possession states around the world are normal,usually part of spiritual practice, and do not meet criteria for dissociative identity disorder.The identities that arise during possession-form dissociative identity disorder presentrecurrently, are unvs^anted and involuntary, cause clinically significant distress or impairment(Criterion C), and are not a normal part of a broadly accepted cultural or religiouspractice (Criterion D).

Individuals with dissociative identity disorder typically present v^ith comorbid depression, anxiety, substance abuse, self-injury, non-epileptic seizures, or another common symptom.They often conceal, or are not fully aware of, disruptions in consciousness, amnesia,
or other dissociative symptoms.
Many individuals with dissociative identity disorder reportdissociative flashbacks during which they undergo a sensory reliving of a previousevent as though it were occurring in the present, often with a change of identity, a partial
or complete loss of contact with or disorientation to current reality during the flashback,and a subsequent amnesia for the content of the flashback. Individuals with the disordertypically report multiple types of interpersonal maltreatment during childhood and adulthood.
Nonmaltreatment forms of overwhelming early life events, such as multiple long,painful, early-life medical procedures, also may be reported. Self-mutilation and suicidalbehavior are frequent. On standardized measures, these individuals report higher levelsof hypnotizability and dissociativity compared with other clinical groups and healthy controlsubjects. Some individuals experience transient psychotic phenomena or episodes.Several brain regions have been implicated in the pathophysiology of dissociative identity
disorder, including the orbitofrontal cortex, hippocampus, parahippocampal gyrus, andamygdala.

Dissociative identity disorder is associated with overwhelming experiences, traumatic events, and/or abuse occurring in childhood. The full disorder may first manifest at almost any age (from earliest childhood to late life). Dissociation in children may generate problems with memory, concentration, attachment, and traumatic play. Nevertheless, children usually do not present with identity changes; instead they present primarily with overlap and interference among mental states (Criterion A phenomena), wiüi symptoms related to discontinuities of experience. Sudden changes in identity during adolescence may appear to be just adolescent turmoil or the early stages of another mental disorder. Older individuals may present to treatment with what appear to be late-life mood disorders, obsessive- compulsive disorder, paranoia, psychotic mood disorders, or even cognitive disorders due to dissociative amnesia. In some cases, disruptive affects and memories may increasingly intrude into awareness with advancing age.

Psychological decompensation and overt changes in identity may be triggered by 1) removal from the traumatizing situation (e.g., through leaving home); 2) the individual's children reaching the same age at which the individual was originally abused or traumatized;
3) later traumatic experiences, even seemingly inconsequential ones, like a minor motor vehicle accident; or 4) the death of, or the onset of a fatal illness in, their abuser(s).

Environmental.
Inteφersonal physical and sexual abuse is associated with an increased risk of dissociative identity disorder. Prevalence of childhood abuse and neglect in the United States, Canada, and Europe among those with the disorder is about 90%. Other forms of traumatizing experiences, including childhood medical and surgical procedures, war, childhood prostitution, and terrorism, have been reported.

Course modifiers. Ongoing abuse, later-life retraumatization, comorbidity with mental disorders, severe medical illness, and delay in appropriate treatment are associated with poorer prognosis.

Many features of dissociative identity disorder can be influenced by the individual's cultural
background. Individuals with this disorder may present with prominent medically
unexplained neurological symptoms, such as non-epileptic seizures, paralyses, or sensory
loss, in cultural settings where such symptoms are common. Similarly, in settings where
normative possession is common (e.g., rural areas in the developing world, among certain
religious groups in the United States and Europe), the fragmented identities may take the
form of possessing spirits, deities, demons, animals, or mythical figures. Acculturation or
prolonged intercultural contact may shape the characteristics of the other identities (e.g.,
identities in India may speak English exclusively and wear Western clothes). Possessionform
dissociative identity disorder can be distinguished from culturally accepted possession
states in that the former is involuntary, distressing, uncontrollable, and often recurrent
or persistent; involves conflict between the individual and his or her surrounding
family, social, or work milieu; and is manifested at times and in places that violate the
norms of the culture or religion.

Females with dissociative identity disorder predominate in adult clinical settings but not
in child clinical settings. Adult males with dissociative identity disorder may deny their
symptoms and trauma histories, and this can lead to elevated rates of false negative diagnosis.
Females with dissociative identity disorder present more frequently with acute
dissociative states (e.g., flashbacks, amnesia, fugue, functional neurological [conversion]
symptoms, hallucinations, self-mutilation). Males commonly exhibit more criminal or violent
behavior than females; among males, common triggers of acute dissociative states include
combat, prison conditions, and physical or sexual assaults.


Other specified dissociative disorder.
The core of dissociative identity disorder is the division of identity, v^ith recurrent disruption of conscious functioning and sense of self.
This central feature is shared with one form of other specified dissociative disorder, which may be distinguished from dissociative identity disorder by the presence of chronic or recurrent mixed dissociative symptoms that do not meet Criterion A for dissociative identity disorder or are not accompanied by recurrent amnesia.

Major depressive disorder.
Individuals with dissociative identity disorder are often depressed, and their symptoms may appear to meet the criteria for a major depressive episode. Rigorous assessment indicates that this depression in some cases does not meet full criteria for major depressive disorder. Other specified depressive disorder in individuals with dissociative identity disorder often has an important feature: the depressed mood and cognitions fluctuate because they are experienced in some identity states but not others.

Bipolar disorders.
Individuals with dissociative identity disorder are often misdiagnosed with a bipolar disorder, most often bipolar II disorder. The relatively rapid shifts in mood in individuals with this disorder—typically within minutes or hours, in contrast to
the slower mood changes typically seen in individuals with bipolar disorders—are due to the rapid, subjective shifts in mood commonly reported across dissociative states, sometimes accompanied by fluctuation in levels of activation. Furthermore, in dissociative
identity disorder, elevated or depressed mood may be displayed in conjunction with overt identities, so one or the other mood may predominate for a relatively long period of time (often for days) or may shift within minutes.

Posttraumatic stress disorder.
Some traumatized individuals have both posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD) and dissociative identity disorder. Accordingly, it is crucial to distinguish between individuals with PTSD only and individuals who have both PTSD and dissociative identity disorder. This differential diagnosis requires that the clinician establish the presence or absence of dissociative symptoms that are not characteristic of acute stress disorder or PTSD. Some individuals with PTSD manifest dissociative symptoms that also occur in dissociative identity disorder: 1) amnesia for some aspects of trauma, 2) dissociative flashbacks (i.e., reliving of the trauma, with reduced awareness of one's current orientation), and 3) symptoms of intrusion and avoidance, negative alterations in cognition and mood, and hyperarousal that are focused around the traumatic event. On the other hand, individuals with dissociative identity disorder manifest dissociative symptoms that are not a manifestation of PTSD: 1) amnesias for m any everyday (i.e., nontraumatic) events, 2) dissociative flashbacks that may be followed by amnesia for the content of the flashback, 3) disruptive intrusions (unrelated to traumatic material) by dissociated identity states into the individual's sense of self and agency, and 4) infrequent, full-blown changes among different identity states.

Psychotic disorders.
Dissociative identity disorder may be confused with schizophrenia or other psychotic disorders. The personified, internally communicative inner voices of dissociative identity disorder, especially of a child (e.g., "I hear a little girl crying in a closet and an angry man yelling at her"), may be mistaken for psychotic hallucinations. Dissociative experiences of identity fragmentation or possession, and of perceived loss of control over thoughts, feelings, impulses, and acts, may be confused with signs of formal thought disorder, such as thought insertion or withdrawal. Individuals with dissociative identity disorder may also report visual, tactile, olfactory, gustatory, and somatic hallucinations, which are usually related to posttraumatic and dissociative factors, such as partial flashbacks. Individuals with dissociative identity disorder experience these symptoms as caused by alternate identities, do not have delusional explanations for the phenomena, and often describe the symptoms in a personified way (e.g., "I feel like someone else wants to cry with my eyes"). Persecutory and derogatory internal voices in dissociative identity disorder associated with depressive symptoms may be misdiagnosed as major depression with psychotic features. Chaotic identity change and acute intrusions that disrupt thought processes may be distinguished from brief psychotic disorder by the predominance of dissociative symptoms and amnesia for the episode, and diagnostic evaluation after cessation of the crisis can help confirm the diagnosis.

Substance/medication-induced disorders.
Symptoms associated with the physiological effects of a substance can be distinguished from dissociative identity disorder if the substance in question is judged to be etiologically related to the disturbance.

Personality disorders.
Individuals with dissociative identity disorder often present identities that appear to encapsulate a variety of severe personality disorder features, suggesting a differential diagnosis of personality disorder, especially of tiie borderline type. Importantly, however, the individual's longitudinal variability in personality style (due to inconsistency among identities) differs from the pervasive and persistent dysfunction in affect management and inteφersonal relationships typical of those with personality disorders.

Conversion disorder (functional neurological symptom disorder).
This disorder may be distinguished from dissociative identity disorder by the absence of an identity disruption characterized by two or more distinct personality states or an experience of possession. Dissociative amnesia in conversion disorder is more limited and circumscribed (e.g., amnesia for a non-epileptic seizure).

Seizure disorders.
Individuals with dissociative identity disorder may present with seizurelike symptoms and behaviors that resemble complex partial seizures with temporal lobe foci. These include déjà vu, jamais vu, depersonalization, derealization, out-of-body experiences, amnesia, disruptions of consciousness, hallucinations, and other intrusion phenomena of sensation, affect, and thought. Normal electroencephalographic findings, including telemetry, differentiate non-epileptic seizures from the seizurelike symptoms of
dissociative identity disorder. Also, individuals with dissociative identity disorder obtain very high dissociation scores, whereas individuals with complex partial seizures do not.

Factitious disorder and malingering.
Individuals who feign dissociative identity disorder
do not report the subtle symptoms of intrusion characteristic of the disorder; instead
they tend to overreport well-publicized symptoms of the disorder, such as dissociative
amnesia, while underreporting less-publicized comorbid symptoms, such as depression.
Individuals who feign dissociative identity disorder tend to be relatively undisturbed by
or may even seem to enjoy "having" the disorder. In contrast, individuals with genuine
dissociative identity disorder tend to be ashamed of and overwhelmed by their symptoms
and to underreport their symptoms or deny their condition. Sequential observation, corroborating
history, and intensive psychometric and psychological assessment may be
helpful in assessment.

Individuals who malinger dissociative identity disorder usually create limited, stereotyped
alternate identities, with feigned amnesia, related to the events for which gain is
sought. For example, they may present an "all-good" identity and an "all-bad" identity in
hopes of gaining exculpation for a crime.

Many individuals with dissociative identity disorder present with a comorbid disorder. If
not assessed and treated specifically for the dissociative disorder, these individuals often
receive prolonged treatment for the comorbid diagnosis only, with limited overall treatment
response and resultant demoralization, and disability.

Individuals with dissociative identity disorder usually exhibit a large number of comorbid
disorders. In particular, most develop PTSD. Other disorders that are highly comorbid
with dissociative identity disorder include depressive disorders, trauma- and
stressor-related disorders, personality disorders (especially avoidant and borderline personality
disorders), conversion disorder (functional neurological symptom disorder),
somatic symptom disorder, eating disorders, substance-related disorders, obsessivecompulsive
disorder, and sleep disorders. Dissociative alterations in identity, memory,
and consciousness may affect the symptom presentation of comorbid disorders.
 
Dissociation, for instance derealization or depersonalization exist. DID does not and the DSM's discernment over what counts as a real mental illness is marred by unfalsifiably circular research efforts i'm too lazy to sperg about, but I know from experience in the academic field.
Regardless, the goal of DID treatment is to integrate and get rid of alters. Stop pretending your 'therapist' wants to treat all their woes individually, you're doing a bad job at faking it. All this maintaining systems bullcrap is awfully convenient and idealistic, but absolutely contrary to real doctors' prognoses.
 
I've now gone through countless blog posts and comments and tweets about people's experience with or recommending the Pottergate Centre. I can't find a single instance of someone not being diagnosed with DID after seeing Remy. Seems like the general process is them sending you a free screening test. You send the test back and they go, "Yep. Looks like you have a dissociative disorder, but we can't say for sure unless you pay us thousands of dollars."

Funnily enough, I've seen a few people asking for experiences and describing the screening process in DID communities only to be met with other DID folks that haven't heard of the Pottergate Centre going, "That's shady. It sounds like a scam."
 
Dissociation, for instance derealization or depersonalization exist. DID does not and the DSM's discernment over what counts as a real mental illness is marred by unfalsifiably circular research efforts i'm too lazy to sperg about, but I know from experience in the academic field.
Regardless, the goal of DID treatment is to integrate and get rid of alters. Stop pretending your 'therapist' wants to treat all their woes individually, you're doing a bad job at faking it. All this maintaining systems bullcrap is awfully convenient and idealistic, but absolutely contrary to real doctors' prognoses.

I've spoken to a psychiatrist about DID, and she believes DID exists, but not in the way it is portrayed by suspected malingerers or in pop culture. She believes that stories like Sybil popularized this presentation of DID, and just like Shirley Ardell Mason fabricated the whole thing, so is everyone who is a copycat of Sybil. She believes that DID is related mostly to the most dysfunctional form of a dissociative disorder, and I've consumed a ton of literature from doctors who say they have seen very few cases of legitimate DID who seem to agree with that. That 1) being aware of the states is absolutely unlikely, and 2) the states are not characters, but rather a composition of whatever memories are in that "compartment", and are truly just fragmented, not "whole personalities" as people like Chloe insist. One used the example that a fragmented state may be "you at age 8" when the abuse stopped, but that because of biology and genetics, you would be unable to infer that the fragmented state is mentally 8 years old, as personality is not only derived from the compartmentalized part of your brain. You use "shared" cognitive function, so while there may be slight alterations in voice consistent with mood shifts, you would not suddenly act like an 8 year old child. You simply would only have amnesia leading to a different, fragmented version of yourself influenced only by experiences available to that compartmentalized conscious state.

From everything I've read, it seems this was the main reason that the name and criteria was updated in 1994 in DSM-IV. Simply because they no longer believed as an academic field that there were actually multiple personalities, instead that there are dissociated identities that are really just fragments of a whole identity.

All of them vehemently deny that switching as it is portrayed by popular media and social media is real.

Also, in the video below, the doctors seem to distinguish that the difference between dissociative amnesia and dissociative identity disorder is the ongoing, highly disruptive dissociative events in which you lose time (they specifically mention that having a dissociative disorder of this nature as a surgeon would make doing that job impossible), and that they see patients coming in thinking they have DID because they dissociate, but that when they poke for evidence of trauma, the patient cannot identify any knowledge or sense that they were abused or in a chronic traumatic situation as a child (like a war zone), and are referred on for other things. So, Chloe would be a patient that would be referred for another diagnosis, as the childhood trauma is required to make the diagnosis.


I've now gone through countless blog posts and comments and tweets about people's experience with or recommending the Pottergate Centre. I can't find a single instance of someone not being diagnosed with DID after seeing Remy. Seems like the general process is them sending you a free screening test. You send the test back and they go, "Yep. Looks like you have a dissociative disorder, but we can't say for sure unless you pay us thousands of dollars."

Funnily enough, I've seen a few people asking for experiences and describing the screening process in DID communities only to be met with other DID folks that haven't heard of the Pottergate Centre going, "That's shady. It sounds like a scam."

They diagnose 90% of people who take the test with a dissociative disorder. 90% for a class of disorders that has less than 1-3% prevalence, and individually, less estimated .1-1%. It's quite clearly a scam.

The sheer volume of people coming out of that place with a DID diagnosis is criminal. Particularly when you consider the fact that the majority self refer. Chloe really shot herself in the foot by using Pottergate to give her any amount of legitimacy. Having moved to Norwich deliberately to be closer to the centre in the hopes of getting her diagnosis I'm less inclined to believe she was duped by Aquarone and more inclined to believe she sought her diagnosis deliberately.

Why she feels the need to advertise Pottergate to her fans is beyond me. She makes a diagnosis so accessible, providing her audience have parents willing to pay.

Agree. All of her actions seem to point to the fact that she specifically sought out the diagnosis, like someone with drug-seeking behavior would do in an effort to get Vicodin.

Given that she is so celebratory of folks who get the diagnosis, and offers no insight into treatment (like EMDR, which has shown extremely effective and beneficial in trauma-based disorders), it's like she's inviting her fans into a club. She'll make videos that say "you don't want this disorder, don't sensationalize it", and then her actions are completely opposite to that.

Every legitimate doctor I've seen talking about this says that they know of NO legitimate case that was treated with various applications of therapy that wasn't "made whole" by treatment. Their only concern is that the different types of therapies aren't well studied because of how rare the disorder is.

Well this is interesting. I wondered about the forensic psychiatrist title. Where I grew up that would have meant she would have been involved in criminal cases and it seems she was. Funny, because DID is never successfully used as a defence. If Hawes is involved in practice I'm sure she'll be getting some form of payout to make it worthwhile. Her lack of official comment on Pottergate is interesting. She doesn't want to tie her name to the place.

I could find nothing of her talking about DID specifically, no studies even. Nothing. The only mention of dissociation I can find she makes is that one paragraph I quote from the chapter of that book. She has worked mainly with personality disorders and some addiction, from what I can find. Which, when it comes to doctors who are practicing around rare cases, this is odd to me. Typically, they want to be published as a part of understanding the disorder and developing treatment.

She also seems to be suggesting that her parents paid for her treatment. The £1000 raised in the GoFundMe wasn't enough as she'd set the goal at 3000. Four hours of form filling and a few thousands to buy her false legitimacy.

One of the videos linked here she specifically says that her parents paid for her to go to Pottergate. She giggles and says she's so fortunate to have such supportive parents.

Chloe often talks about brain scans of patients with DID. She claims that when alters switch different areas of the brain 'light up' in relation to different memories. I don't think she understands the studies she quotes and I don't think I have the background to understand them either. She seems to cherry pick the things that chime with her story.

Do you have a link to these studies? This doesn't sound like any evidence of multiple personalities. Granted, I studied only a few semesters of brain physics and neural networking, not pure neuroscience or brain function, but still, it seems like even general knowledge of brain anatomy would question why this would be indicative of a "switch".
 
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I've got all of these videos archived but I can't upload anything longer than five minutes at the moment so I'll link for now. She talks about the studies in this video and the studies are from 1992, 2001, 2007. She linked a lot of things so they're under the spoiler.

Studies and sources used in this video: Reinders, Willemsen, Vos, den Boer, & Nijenhuis, (2012) Sar, Unal, and Ozturk, (2007) Reinders et al., (2003, 2006) Elzinga et al., (2007) Sar, Unal, Kiziltan, Kundakci, and Ozturk, (2001) Putnam (1997) Saxe, Vasile, Hill, Bloomingdale and van der Kolk, (1992)


The biggest problem with this kind of research is small sample sizes and how the data is interpreted. For example, the second link is a study conducted with self-reported questionnaires. How reliable are those supposed DID sufferers? Will they answer truthfully if they are already pretending to have 20 different people living in their head?

Didn’t read the first one because fuck that. Might try again tomorrow.

Number 3 has ‘some’ validity but there’s no indication of how many subjects they had and also the areas of the brain that were activated in DID subjects were motor-related (see 4) and self-reference. Which could mean bloody anything.

The fourth study looks at one women who can ‘voluntarily’ switch and it found activation in parts of the brain related to muscle movement (during switching) and the nucleus accumbens, which is linked to ‘rewards and reinforcing stimuli’ which would be the satisfaction of fooling these desperate researchers.

The last one also seems to be somewhat valid. However they grouped DID subjects with PTSD subjects so I’m inclined to believe it’s skewed data.

Basically the research and analysis on DID is highly subjective and the brain imaging interpretations could mean a multitude of things. Psychological studies are always going to be biased too so it will never be exact. Imo the participants in these studies probably have some other form of mental illness. NPD, BPD or bipolar.
 
The NHS has a dire mental health department, very slow to get processed through. When she went into hospital likely she was tested and monitored for a short period then released. She probably spoke to a counsellor at the hospital, at which point diagnoses are mentioned. You aren’t formally diagnosed, it’s only suggestions that will be put into your file and be reviewed later. The only time someone would ever be in a facility would be if a) they were willing to pay or b) their risk is extremely high. Mental facilities are hard to get into. If you’re in one in the UK you’re either a rich kid with depreshun or actually fucked.

Likely she had to wait at least 3 months to go to Colchester hospital and see a psychiatrist. You will have another talk with the psych, your file will be reviewed, and they will make a prognosis. Not a diagnosis. This is who will prescribe you any medication they think you may be responsive to, and after that they will refer you on again to NHS therapy, during which you will be diagnosed. This part can usually take between 3-6 months depending on what council and what area.

In reality Chloe probably got sick of waiting for the NHS and decided to get shit diagnosed herself. It’s a long process so in a way it’s understandable, but she never finished the length of the NHS procedure to get formally diagnosed. The university probably needed her to get that so she could return, as to properly accomodate for her, and when she didn’t it turned into a stalemate.

I think you’re being generous there.
Mental health funding has been cut the shit out of in recent years and there’s a general trend toward avoiding ‘labels’ so as not to have a duty to treat.

Were Chloe to have gone to the NHS and got unlucky in the postcode lottery, she would have just been given SSRIs and offered group CBT. It’s a battle to move beyond that.

I know someone who was told by a community mental health nurse that they were pretty sure she had BPD but that the wait was too long. So they referred her to an eating disorder clinic instead. The ED clinic were like WTF? She ended up being tossed around in the system for 2 years until I found the email of a more senior person in the trust via some job adverts and kicked up a fuss.

I ended up literally being told to go private for something else after almost 2 years. They finally admitted that they had no funding.

Despite these being NHS pages, and Chloe having paid privately for her bollocks 'diagnosis', the laws are the same whether NHS or private. If she claims to have been seen and 'diagnosed' solely by Remy and not the psychiatrist he keeps on staff, then she's talking shit. She's probably so intent on touting his name because he clearly has a public presence on the subject so she thinks it gives her more credibility to say he diagnosed her, even though he himself cannot actually do so. She was probably banking on the fact that her teenage fans won't go so far as to establish this for themselves, which is sadly true.

The laws might be the same but a private diagnosis carries far less weight. Depending on the condition, the NHS might not even recognise it as a means to continue treatment.

This happens a lot with ADHD for example, which has become an easy cash grab for psychs. Quick diagnosis and a monthly catchup to renew the script.
The meds are controlled so most GPs won’t prescribe with a private Dx as they don’t want the hassle.
 
I've spoken to a psychiatrist about DID, and she believes DID exists, but not in the way it is portrayed by suspected malingerers or in pop culture. She believes that stories like Sybil popularized this presentation of DID, and just like Shirley Ardell Mason fabricated the whole thing, so is everyone who is a copycat of Sybil. She believes that DID is related mostly to the most dysfunctional form of a dissociative disorder, and I've consumed a ton of literature from doctors who say they have seen very few cases of legitimate DID who seem to agree with that. That 1) being aware of the states is absolutely unlikely, and 2) the states are not characters, but rather a composition of whatever memories are in that "compartment", and are truly just fragmented, not "whole personalities" as people like Chloe insist. One used the example that a fragmented state may be "you at age 8" when the abuse stopped, but that because of biology and genetics, you would be unable to infer that the fragmented state is mentally 8 years old, as personality is not only derived from the compartmentalized part of your brain. You use "shared" cognitive function, so while there may be slight alterations in voice consistent with mood shifts, you would not suddenly act like an 8 year old child. You simply would only have amnesia leading to a different, fragmented version of yourself influenced only by experiences available to that compartmentalized conscious state.

From everything I've read, it seems this was the main reason that the name and criteria was updated in 1994 in DSM-IV. Simply because they no longer believed as a academic field that there were actually multiple personalities, instead that there are dissociated identities that are really just fragments of a whole identity.

All of them vehemently deny that switching as it is portrayed by popular media and social media is real.



They diagnose 90% of people who take the test with a dissociative disorder. 90% for a class of disorders that has less than 1-3% prevalence, and individually, less estimated .1-1%. It's quite clearly a scam.

I've discussed DID with a few friends since falling down this rabbit hole and one is a big fan of memoirs written by abuse survivors under the name Toni Maguire. She sent me some ebooks to look through and whilst I'm not going to read them in detail as I find graphic descriptions of sexual abuse Triggering™ I've found the sections that mention DID.

Toni is an abuse survivor who wrote her own memoirs. Since, she has been approached by other survives to help write their own. These are women who have been through some horrific sexual abuse. Here are some extracts from one such book about Jackie who was sexually abused by her uncle and several of his friends throughout her childhood. She subsequently developed DID and it is described in the same way the doctors you mention described it. The description is a world away from Chloe and Nan's depiction.

That night was the first time my angry, terrified five-year-old self appeared. She stepped out of my body, ready to scream and shout at the world that had betrayed her.
My parents had witnessed, when I was younger, the toddler me, the one who had talked in a baby language and rocked herself against a wall, but then the word ‘regression’ had been bandied about. This time there was no mistaking it. They realized that something was seriously wrong.
I had completely disappeared when my younger self put in her appearance. Gone to a place where my thoughts, my hearing and all sense of who I was vanished. And the little girl who sat in her room likewise had no recollection of me. At first she was quiet, a good child who brought her teddy bears down from the shelves, where for several years they had lain neglected, and placed them in a corner. She sat down with them, picked up the one that had been her favourite, Paddington, and cuddled him.
It was when my mother called me to come down for my meal that I was found. Annoyed at what she thought was bad behaviour she had climbed the stairs, marched to my room and, without knocking, unceremoniously flung open the door. There she was faced with a small child in her thirteen-year-old daughter’s body. At first the child refused to speak, just sat holding Paddington, and looked at the woman with something akin to bewilderment. Realizing that the mother’s initial anger was turning to worry, she tried to utter a few words. Her speech was different. Her voice was higher and her vocabulary smaller. For a few moments, my mother thought I was playing some sort of malicious game.
I can imagine her impatience, how she tried to snatch Paddington from my arms, how she shouted, forgetting that five-year-olds are more easily frightened than older children. But she had not accepted that that was who she was dealing with.
That realization came when the child in front of her opened her mouth and bawled, face red with approaching temper. My mother took a step back, still unsure of what was happening. Then the child ran across the room screaming and, as she had done at five, threw herself against the wall, filling the room with ear-piercing, anguished cries.
I was not witness to that or to my mother wrestling me to the floor and yelling for my father. Neither was I there when the doctor arrived and slid a needle into my arm. I have no memory of the ambulance arriving or of the journey to the hospital. I only know that when I woke there was no sign of my five-year-old self. I didn’t know she had ever been there.

Maybe that white space where a memory should have been frightened me so much that I never sought to fill it. I have been told of that time, little bits of information imparted to me in stages, as I have of the following days and what happened thereafter. It has mixed with my own memories until I am unable to separate which are mine and which were given to me by someone else. All I know is that it happened.
I learnt, much later, that it did not take long after that night for my parents to seize on the excuse, with apparent relief, that what was wrong with me was not their fault. The psychiatrists all agreed I had a mental illness, although they disputed among themselves as to what name it should be given. They agreed on one other thing when they talked to my parents: it had been caused by something outside their control.
The consensus was that my troubled mind was nothing to do with the adult world. My parents had never made me feel unwanted and unloved, had they? But I might have been born with a problem, a weakness, that had manifested itself as I developed.
How about a split personality, or dissociative identity disorder, as it has since been named? That seemed, in light of my actions that night, to be possible. Or perhaps it was even schizophrenia, which often showed itself with the onset of the teenage years. Nowadays, with all the medical breakthroughs, that could be treated – or, rather, controlled with drugs. The NHS could become my new supplier.

The only thing I had to deal with was the visits from my younger self.
‘Why?’ I asked my therapist. ‘Why now, when I’m happy? What is it she wants? That’s what I would like to ask her.’
‘I think,’ my therapist said, ‘that she wants to know if you’re still angry with her. When she has been reassured enough, I think you’ll find she’ll go. Jackie,’ she asked me then, ‘how do you feel about her now?’
‘I feel sad,’ I said, ‘when I think of the little girl I once was and what those men did to her. I don’t think she stood a chance, do you?’
‘No,’ said my therapist, ‘she didn’t – but the adult you does.’
After my early sessions, my therapist talked to Helena; she told her how to handle the appearance of my younger self. The most important thing was to make the little girl feel safe.
We bought soft toys that Helena gave her, when she came. To begin with, there were times when an ambulance had to be called – that was when the little girl was angry and frightened. But gradually she appeared more content. Helena said my other self was rather sweet and just wanted to play.
She comes much less now.

You'll notice that the alter was not given a name. She did not have her own personality. She was not an individual. She was hardly even verbal. She contained the memories and emotions associated with the abuse.
The alter is mentioned several times in the book. She got Jackie into a lot of trouble as a teenager as she appeared at random moments Jackie had no control over. She threw tantrums and her behaviour was so erratic and frightening Jackie was hospitalised on a number of occasions as she simply was not able to function. There is no cutesy shit like you see in Chloe and Nan's videos. The alter just existed to contain the pain of the abuse. There was no communication or memory between her and her child state. She relied on her parents, her wife, and her therapist to explain what had happened when she switched. It sounds utterly debilitating but as her therapist said the child alter would stop appearing once her emotions around the abuse had been tackled.

ETA:
Whilst I feel a lot of sympathy for the victims of genuine abuse I do find books like these really fucking weird. I can understand the catharsis of writing something like this anonymously but I find myself wondering who the audience for this kind of literature is. To some extent I understand professional curiosity but I don't recommend anyone picks this up to read. From skimming through I can tell you it's fucking bleak.
 
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links n stuff

Ok so I went through the studies.

The first one cited is hilarious because in regards to DID the findings are that the brain scans in different groups is all over the map. The bulk of the research cited was for other forms of dissociative disorders because there are many. In the video she glosses over the contradictory studies cited to get to the ones favorable to DID, naturally.

WayHarshTai nailed the rest.
 
One of the videos linked here she specifically says that her parents paid for her to go to Pottergate. She giggles and says she's so fortunate to have such supportive parents.
Honestly, she's taking her parents for a ride as much as her audience.

Do you have a link to these studies? This doesn't sound like any evidence of multiple personalities. Granted, I studied only a few semesters of brain physics and neural networking, not pure neuroscience or brain function, but still, it seems like even general knowledge of brain anatomy would question why this would be indicative of a "switch".

Yeah, I linked them in a comment above.

The fourth study looks at one women who can ‘voluntarily’ switch and it found activation in parts of the brain related to muscle movement (during switching) and the nucleus accumbens, which is linked to ‘rewards and reinforcing stimuli’ which would be the satisfaction of fooling these desperate researchers.

Honestly lmao. Colour me unsurprised.
 
Do you happen to know if DID treatment is offered on the NHS? She claims often that it isn't which is why she was forced to go private. But the London clinic takes NHS referrals. Would I be right in thinking that whilst the NHS don't offer treatment 'in house' they would pay for private treatment if necessary at the London clinic?
My theory thus far is that she wanted the diagnosis and dropped hints to her crisis team, NHS workers, and her therapist who were all unresponsive or unwilling to offer her a diagnosis. If the NHS are so stretched it seems unlikely they would refer her to the clinic for treatment unless they felt she really needed it. So, frustration led her to pay at Pottergate. Is that plausible?

I can’t say for certain but I’d imagine there would be DID specific psychiatrists on the NHS. I would be surprised if there weren’t, particularly in university hospitals.

You’re absolutely right on for the NHS would paying for private treatment, although very specific criteria hasto be met. Apparently, most private insurance plans do not cover mental health issues, so any stays in psych facilities are NHS funded. For the NHS to fund you seeing a clinic it usually has to do with long waiting times. This means substially higher, not just a month or so. Moaning to your GP so they push you through the system faster is usually more effective. However, most private clinics are also NHS linked and they take both NHS and private patients. All paying does is bump you up the same list. The NHS also only cover treatment costs at centres they approve of. Websites of such places usually mention that the NHS can review you to them if are waiting extraordinary lengths for an appointment. I haven’t spotted that on the Pottergate website but they may well have done.

edit: just because it was mentioned while I was writing this, Essex has reasonably good funding for mental health. Colchester’s a commuter town close to London and overall very middle class and a lot of funding has been poured into both Colchester hospital and Broomfield in the past 10 years. Its waiting times are mostly pretty good on average, and it’s close enough to London to refer people there if needed.
 
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The alter is mentioned several times in the book. She got Jackie into a lot of trouble as a teenager as she appeared at random moments Jackie had no control over. She threw tantrums and her behaviour was so erratic and frightening Jackie was hospitalised on a number of occasions as she simply was not able to function. There is no cutesy shit like you see in Chloe and Nan's videos. The alter just existed to contain the pain of the abuse. There was no communication or memory between her and her child state. She relied on her parents, her wife, and her therapist to explain what had happened when she switched. It sounds utterly debilitating but as her therapist said the child alter would stop appearing once her emotions around the abuse had been tackled.

How cutesy and twee Chloe and the vast majority of the online DID community make what should be a debilitating disorder look is one of my biggest problems with it. It's so neat and clean, and what should be personality states are treated like fully formed people with these clearly defined, almost spiritual roles. 'This is my primary protector. This is my persecutor. This is my Native American spiritual protector, ect.'

PTSD and dissociation alone are debilitating. I don't want to TMI, but losing time is absolutely terrifying on top of being debilitating. By definition, I gather DID involves dissociation a step above even that. Chloe, especially, seems to be dissociating left and right and still finds time to have fun with it and go on vacations and lose time so that her alters can go on dates with someone else's alters.

It's so absurd it's insulting. She constantly defends doing fun stuff on her channel by insisting that she wants to show that a diagnosis of DID doesn't mean you can't enjoy life. According to her, you can do anything you want up to and including being a surgeon-- which makes me think she doesn't just not have DID, she hasn't even experienced an honest to goodness dissociative episode.
 
I can’t say for certain but I’d imagine there would be DID specific psychiatrists on the NHS. I would be surprised if there weren’t, particularly in university hospitals.

You’re absolutely right on for the NHS would paying for private treatment, although very specific criteria hasto be met. Apparently, most private insurance plans do not cover mental health issues, so any stays in psych facilities are NHS funded. For the NHS to fund you seeing a clinic it usually has to do with long waiting times. This means substially higher, not just a month or so. Moaning to your GP so they push you through the system faster is usually more effective. However, most private clinics are also NHS linked and they take both NHS and private patients. All paying does is bump you up the same list. The NHS also only cover treatment costs at centres they approve of. Websites of such places usually mention that the NHS can review you to them if are waiting extraordinary lengths for an appointment. I haven’t spotted that on the Pottergate website but they may well have done.

PODS says that the London clinic is the only place that would take NHS referrals but there are NHS staff qualified to conduct certain tests.

The questionnaires you completed was screening tools – indicating a likelihood of a dissociative disorder rather than providing a diagnosis. An ‘official’ diagnosis is usually given using the SCID-D clinical assessment tool, delivered face-to-face by a qualified clinician. We are currently only aware of 2 UK centres where this is offered – The Pottergate Centre in Norwich which only offers private assessments and The Clinic for Dissociative Studies in London which only offers NHS referrals. However certain professionals in a NHS mental health team or individual private therapists may be qualified to conduct the SCID-D.

I really wonder how legitimate Pottergate is and how NHS staff view the team there then. If they don't take NHS referrals only private patients I wonder what that says about the quality of care. Tempted to give them a call and see what they say in regards to NHS referrals.

How cutesy and twee Chloe and the vast majority of the online DID community make what should be a debilitating disorder look is one of my biggest problems with it. It's so neat and clean, and what should be personality states are treated like fully formed people with these clearly defined, almost spiritual roles. 'This is my primary protector. This is my persecutor. This is my Native American spiritual protector, ect.'

PTSD and dissociation alone are debilitating. I don't want to TMI, but losing time is absolutely terrifying on top of being debilitating. By definition, I gather DID involves dissociation a step above even that. Chloe, especially, seems to be dissociating left and right and still finds time to have fun with it and go on vacations and lose time so that her alters can go on dates with someone else's alters.

It's so absurd it's insulting. She constantly defends doing fun stuff on her channel by insisting that she wants to show that a diagnosis of DID doesn't mean you can't enjoy life. According to her, you can do anything you want up to and including being a surgeon-- which makes me think she doesn't just not have DID, she hasn't even experienced an honest to goodness dissociative episode.

I completely agree. I'm not one to offer TMI or moralfag but I have a history with abuse and I do feel solidarity with survivors of genuine abuse. Whilst I mostly lean towards finding Chloe and Nan amusing I suppose I have some emotional stake in this too. Abuse should not be used as a backstory for quirky characters and attention seeking behaviour. It is damaging to genuine survivors who do exhibit dissociative symptoms. As pointed out in the Dr Grande video, when students are shown videos of influencers like Chloe and Nan they are less inclined to take dissociative disorders seriously. Their behaviour has real consequences for survivors of abuse seeking treatment as now they are easily painted as attention seeking spergs.

The reality is, you can't have a great deal of fun or a functional life when you are consistently dissociating. You just can't. You can if you put the work into therapy and recover. But she doesn't promote that path. She claims that therapists don't even encourage integration and rather encourage her to let all 22 alters share the front and live their own lives. Pathetic.
 
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I completely agree. I'm not one to offer TMI or moralfag but I have a history with abuse and I do feel solidarity with survivors of genuine abuse. Whilst I mostly lean towards finding Chloe and Nan amusing I suppose I have some emotional stake in this too.

I feel it's fair to say the most invested of us in this are invested for personal reasons. It's hard not to TMI or powerlevel when it comes to things of this nature, but honestly, the deeper we get into dismantling her facade, the easier it feels for me to reconcile that what she's doing is harmful and absurd, without feeling the need to justify or validate those feelings with my own personal reprehensible childhood or subsequent adult life.

I've discussed DID with a few friends since falling down this rabbit hole and one is a big fan of memoirs written by abuse survivors under the name Toni Maguire. She sent me some ebooks to look through and whilst I'm not going to read them in detail as I find graphic descriptions of sexual abuse Triggering™ I've found the sections that mention DID.

Toni is an abuse survivor who wrote her own memoirs. Since, she has been approached by other survives to help write their own. These are women who have been through some horrific sexual abuse. Here are some extracts from one such book about Jackie who was sexually abused by her uncle and several of his friends throughout her childhood. She subsequently developed DID and it is described in the same way the doctors you mention described it. The description is a world away from Chloe and Nan's depiction.

This is extremely helpful. I, too, cannot read such accounts. The reaction I have is so visceral. I struggle to understand why anyone outside of mental health professionals and law enforcement would purposefully subject themselves to this kind of literature.

Whilst I feel a lot of sympathy for the victims of genuine abuse I do find books like these really fucking weird. I can understand the catharsis of writing something like this anonymously but I find myself wondering who the audience for this kind of literature is. My friend works in the community with children like this so to some extent I understand professional curiosity but I don't recommend anyone picks this up to read. From skimming through I can tell you it's fucking bleak.

I've written about some of my experiences, namely about my suicide attempts. I did so because of the show 13 Reasons Why, and my Twitter feed at the time was just absolutely littered with misinformation and a glamorous view of suicide and especially glorifying stories of "wow, I'm so glad I lived, now I love life!!!" that makes suicide attempts look like a good way to refresh the way you see the world.

As for detailed accounts of abuse, I, like you, can see how it could be cathartic to write it, especially anonymously, and I've tried to. The problem I found was that it was just as traumatic to write down a general description of what happened, and that's with amnesia of the actual experiences. One of the things I've found with writing is that while it gets things out of your head, it can also be grounding and make things that you have mentally detached from start to feel like they are an actual part of reality. In writing, you learn to be detailed with imagery, so that readers can properly create a world in their head of your design. Traumatic memories are detached in such a way that there is significant suppression of sensory details required to create this imagery, such as ambient sounds, smells, and textures. I hope the people who make these accounts do so in a therapy setting, because I cannot imagine suddenly tying a detached memory to this kind of sensory information and not having a severe mental breakdown.

I really appreciate writing that is allegorical in this sense, talking about how you or your environment was affected by events in parallel metaphors, instead of subjecting readers (and yourself) to violent trauma. Especially when it comes to children, as you said. It also makes it feel more academic in a way, in that there's something to be learned from that experience for the general public.
 
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