Wuhan Coronavirus: Megathread - Got too big

[StarkRavingMad]

lol as far as professions go, healthcare workers are in a better place for keeping their job than most. it's actually the opposite in most states, there are shortages of healthcare professionals and certain regions.

btw since previous poster conflated "1000 deaths" with "1000 cases," that's not how it works. most people who get wuflu won't die. the actual, logistical problem that the virus poses isn't necessarily deaths (as long as resources are available) but the large and rapid # of people who will require hospitalization. people who are hospitalized with wuflu also take a really long time to recover. so hospitals can very quickly get overwhelmed if the region isn't equipped to handle it, and this poses the threat of collapsing the entire system, which can drives up death rates as well.

I think people are looking for a solution which has no downsides, which is just impossible. There is no perfect outcome to this now that the cat is out of the bag, it's a matter of trying to minimize the shitty aspects to whatever action you end up taking.

Bruh ... COVID-19 Hits Some Healthcare Workers With Pay Cuts and Layoffs

It's happening already. And I think it's going to become a huge problem if we keep telling everyone to stay home unless they have severe symptoms of the coof, even though it's already been proven that we have successfully prevented the hospitals from being overwhelmed.

This also presents another question and a potential "unintended consequence": How many people aren't going to the doctor or hospitals right now while they have heart conditions? Possible cancer symptoms? We're going to see upticks in deaths when this is over, since every other health condition is being ignored right now and people are scared to get checkups, I would bet. And it will become a large problem when people start flooding the hospitals and doctors offices when COVID-19 is long gone, especially if multiple hospitals and healthcare offices start to actually shut down/close their doors due to the lack of patients during this pandemic.

 

[Rudy Russo]

BREAKING: Trump Announces He'll Suspend Immigration Into the U.S.

https://archive.vn/DIm7G

In light of the attack from the Invisible Enemy, as well as the need to protect the jobs of our GREAT American Citizens, I will be signing an Executive Order to temporarily suspend immigration into the United States!


Trump pulls the pin and now the fun begins.

 

[pull over dat ass too fat]

Bruh ... COVID-19 Hits Some Healthcare Workers With Pay Cuts and Layoffs

It's happening already. And I think it's going to become a huge problem if we keep telling everyone to stay home unless they have severe symptoms of the coof, even though it's already been proven that we have successfully prevented the hospitals from being overwhelmed.

This also presents another question and a potential "unintended consequence": How many people aren't going to the doctor or hospitals right now while they have heart conditions? Possible cancer symptoms? We're going to see upticks in deaths when this is over, since every other health condition is being ignored right now and people are scared to get checkups, I would bet. And it will become a large problem when people start flooding the hospitals and doctors offices when COVID-19 is long gone, especially if multiple hospitals and healthcare offices start to actually shut down/close their doors due to the lack of patients during this pandemic.

This is about an OBGYN. People aren't coming in for ultrasounds as often, is that really surprising? Many normal people are getting laid off. As far as things go, medical professionals are generally well positioned.

There are rural areas in the US that even during normal times don't have access to healthcare, because it isn't profitable to serve their communities. Why not just have something like the US postal service and offer a nationalized option for these types of communities, so that there's never the risk of people not having access to a hospital? It seems like the coronavirus just makes the already shitty & broken parts of our economy more clear. The best analogy that I can think of is choosing to not fireproof your house, and then once your house catches fire, ruminate over all the pros and cons of how you react to the fire, trying to find the perfect solution with no downsides. it sucks, but it kind of is what it is imo.

 

[Marchesa of the Vast]

Do they not realize that this could break the healthcare system, too? Empty hospitals could lead to them closing their doors entirely ... It costs money to make those machines run and to have the healthcare professionals show up to work.

Chalk this up to another "unintended consequence" in the name of safety and in the name of "it's for our own good."

"unintended consequence"

No, it should have been obvious, that it apparently wasn't to certain groups means that faces need to hit dirt and some asses need booting.

How many people aren't going to the doctor or hospitals right now while they have heart conditions? Possible cancer symptoms?
I have unironically been told by micro-brained doomers that those are just hidden COVID cases. There are no deaths in America not COVID related apparently.

 

[StarkRavingMad]

This is about an OBGYN. People aren't coming in for ultrasounds as often, is that really surprising? Many normal people are getting laid off. As far as things go, medical professionals are generally well positioned.

There are rural areas in the US that even during normal times don't have access to healthcare, because it isn't profitable to serve their communities. Why not just have something like the US postal service and offer a nationalized option for these types of communities, so that there's never the risk of people not having access to a hospital? It seems like the coronavirus just makes the already shitty & broken parts of our economy more clear. The best analogy that I can think of is choosing to not fireproof your house, and then once your house catches fire, ruminate over all the pros and cons of how you react to the fire, trying to find the perfect solution with no downsides. it sucks, but it kind of is what it is imo.

OBGYNs are people who can detect certain types of serious health conditions including cancer. Cervical cancer, ovarian cancer, and breast cancer ... All of these cancers can be discovered by doing a routine checkup in these medical offices.

With people being discouraged from going to any doctor for any reason other than the Chinese Virus, then guess what? Certain types of conditions are going to be undetected until it's possibly too late, which will result in people dying.

OBGYNs have become the first ones affected. Key word here is "first."

 

[pull over dat ass too fat]

OBGYNs are people who can detect certain types of serious health conditions including cancer. Cervical cancer, ovarian cancer, and breast cancer ... All of these cancers can be discovered by doing a routine checkup in these medical offices.

With people being discouraged from going to any doctor for any reason other than the Chinese Virus, then guess what? Certain types of conditions are going to be undetected until it's possibly too late, which will result in people dying.

OBGYNs have become the first ones affected. Key word here is "first."

and if the healthcare system gets overwhelmed to the point of collapse, those people still won't have access to these services. (edit: and actually an early stage cancer patient may even be much better off staying at home until a vaccine is available rather than exposing themselves to a hospital environment, given that they'd be at risk of dying if they catch the virus)
we're in a crisis, idk what else to tell you. there are literally no great options. it's going to hurt no matter what we do.

 

[StarkRavingMad]

and if the healthcare system gets overwhelmed to the point of collapse, those people still won't have access to these services.
we're in a crisis, idk what else to tell you. there are literally no great options. it's going to hurt no matter what we do.

The healthcare system in the United States hasn't been overwhelmed, though. Have you not been reading anything I've posted here? It's so un-overwhelmed to the point where hospitals and doctors offices are at risk of laying many workers off or closing entirely.

If the lockdowns continue, and if the government keeps telling people to not go to the doctor for things that aren't COVID-19 related, then the healthcare system will break in a big and bad way (and, in my opinion, in a more permanent way than overwhelming the hospitals with COVID-19 would).

I agree that we needed to prevent the hospitals from being overwhelmed. The United States accomplished that already. Now it's time to start getting things back to normal. If we don't, we're going to have even more people die and suffer.

 

[Dog-O-Tron 5000v5.0]

BREAKING: Trump Announces He'll Suspend Immigration Into the U.S.

https://archive.vn/DIm7G

In light of the attack from the Invisible Enemy, as well as the need to protect the jobs of our GREAT American Citizens, I will be signing an Executive Order to temporarily suspend immigration into the United States!


Trump pulls the pin and now the fun begins.

The Absolute Madman

 

[pull over dat ass too fat]

The healthcare system in the United States hasn't been overwhelmed, though. Have you not been reading anything I've posted here? It's so un-overwhelmed to the point where hospitals and doctors offices are at risk of laying many workers off or closing entirely.

If the lockdowns continue, and if the government keeps telling people to not go to the doctor for things that aren't COVID-19 related, then the healthcare system will break in a big and bad way (and, in my opinion, in a more permanent way that overwhelming the hospitals with COVID-19 would).

New York's healthcare system was actually overwhelmed. Not to the point of collapse, but it was too fucking close for comfort. Coincidentally after a couple weeks of social distancing is when the hospital admissions began letting up. And yes, I have been reading things here, I've been contributing to this thread since January & sharing bits as I learn things, I'm a comp bio research scientist.

btw, I added this to my previous post, but many people really should not be going to the hospital unless they actually require inpatient care. sick people are everywhere in hospitals, and certain at-risk patients are very likely to require critical care or even die if they catch the virus.

Now it's time to start getting things back to normal. If we don't, we're going to have even more people die and suffer.

Do you have anything to back up this claim? Comparatively, I mean. The number of people dying & suffering by making things "getting back to normal" vs. the number of people dying and suffering via taking other options. Do you have any solid support for this?

Just because things suck how they are doesn't mean things are better by saying fuck it and doing nothing. You really need to back up any claim you make with some sort of stat model or something. Some situations have no possible perfect outcome, and action should be taken by what causes the least amount of harm.

 

[StarkRavingMad]

New York's healthcare system was actually overwhelmed. Not to the point of collapse, but it was too fucking close for comfort. Coincidentally after a couple weeks of social distancing is when the hospital admissions began letting up. And yes, I have been reading things here, I've been contributing to this thread since January & sharing bits as I learn things, I'm a comp bio research scientist.

btw, I added this to my previous post, but many people really should not be going to the hospital unless they actually require inpatient care. sick people are everywhere in hospitals, and certain at-risk patients are very likely to require critical care or even die if they catch the virus.


Do you have anything to back up this claim? Comparatively, I mean. The number of people dying & suffering by making things "getting back to normal" vs. the number of people dying and suffering via taking other options. Do you have any solid support for this?

Just because things suck how they are doesn't mean things are better by saying fuck it and doing nothing. You really need to back up any claim you make with some sort of stat model or something. Some situations have no possible perfect outcome, and action should be taken by what causes the least amount of harm.

New York City does not reflect the state of things for the rest of the country, though. Every state (and city) has experienced this pandemic uniquely, and the hospitals in other states and cities have not been overwhelmed.

There's a risk of hospitals losing workers and being shut down around the country right now because they're empty. I showed you an example of that already happening. Less health care workers and less hospitals undoubtedly puts people's lives at risk.

 

[RodgerDodger]

The Domino's begin to fall. Georgia's Governor Kemp announced an end to the Lockdowns. Normal Medical Care services, elective surgery, Barbers, Dentists, etc open on Friday. Restaurants can begin dine in service with capacity limitations on Monday. Most retail can reopen over the weekend providing reasonable Social Distancing is maintained.

 

[Fascist Ferret]

The Domino's begin to fall. Georgia's Governor Kemp announced an end to the Lockdowns. Normal Medical Care services, elective surgery, Barbers, Dentists, etc open on Friday. Restaurants can begin dine in service with capacity limitations on Monday. Most retail can reopen over the weekend providing reasonable Social Distancing is maintained.

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/04/20/839338550/georgia-beginning-to-reopen-its-economy-lifting-some-coronavirus-crisis-limits

Yay! Hopefully if they do well after lowering restrictions, other states will follow suit.

 

[RodgerDodger]

New York's healthcare system was actually overwhelmed. Not to the point of collapse, but it was too fucking close for comfort. Coincidentally after a couple weeks of social distancing is when the hospital admissions began letting up. And yes, I have been reading things here, I've been contributing to this thread since January & sharing bits as I learn things, I'm a comp bio research scientist.

btw, I added this to my previous post, but many people really should not be going to the hospital unless they actually require inpatient care. sick people are everywhere in hospitals, and certain at-risk patients are very likely to require critical care or even die if they catch the virus.


Do you have anything to back up this claim? Comparatively, I mean. The number of people dying & suffering by making things "getting back to normal" vs. the number of people dying and suffering via taking other options. Do you have any solid support for this?

Just because things suck how they are doesn't mean things are better by saying fuck it and doing nothing. You really need to back up any claim you make with some sort of stat model or something. Some situations have no possible perfect outcome, and action should be taken by what causes the least amount of harm.

Select parts of New York Cities Healthcare system were hit hard. Not even the entire city system. Sections of Queens, Brooklyn and the Bronx and their associated hospitals. With some stress out on Long Island as the locusts fled. Particularly in Eastern Suffolk. The larger Manhattan hospitals were not anywhere near capacity. The rest of New York State was viewed to be so well off that the Governor stripped Ventilators from them at gunpoint and has refused to send them test kits or PPE.

An Open Letter to Cuomo from one of the Upstate NY Radio Stations

An Open Letter to Governor Cuomo from WGY’s Kelly Lynch | News Radio 810 & 103.1 WGY | Chuck and Kelly

wgy.iheart.com

And the Radio station is not lying about Cuomo and the PPE. A friend is high ranked in Health Response in an upsate NY City. The State gave them 1 mask per medical staffer per week of n95 Masks. For the past month. And has only given them 600 test kits total. Which have been rationed to Hospital Personnel and First Responders.

 

[Kiwi Lime Pie]

This also presents another question and a potential "unintended consequence": How many people aren't going to the doctor or hospitals right now while they have heart conditions?

i think right now, people -- except maybe the most dedicated munchies/hypochondriacs -- are avoiding the doctor's office out of fear they might end up sharing the waiting room with people infected with COVID-19.

Some doctor's offices have even resorted to sending their regular patients a recorded message reminding them that the office is still open if they need to see their doctor for anything.

BREAKING: Trump Announces He'll Suspend Immigration Into the U.S.

Inb4 the expected TDS/Salt from Dems and other Trump detractors.

Even with the expected salt/fallout from this, it's still a good idea. A nation has a vested interest in protecting the people inside its borders. A pandemic such as COVID-19 is no exception. My only surprise is Trump didn't do this sooner.

The Domino's begin to fall. Georgia's Governor Kemp announced an end to the Lockdowns. Normal Medical Care services, elective surgery, Barbers, Dentists, etc open on Friday. Restaurants can begin dine in service with capacity limitations on Monday. Most retail can reopen over the weekend providing reasonable Social Distancing is maintained.

Not knowing what Georgia's COVID-19 stats are, this sounds prudent on the surface because it allows some stuff to resume under lessened but reasonable restrictions. One hopes that other states, especially those with numbers similar to Georgia's, take notice to see whether it would be prudent for them to follow suit as soon as they're able.

 

[RodgerDodger]

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/04/20/839338550/georgia-beginning-to-reopen-its-economy-lifting-some-coronavirus-crisis-limits

Yay! Hopefully if they do well after lowering restrictions, other states will follow suit.

And this is why you never trust the media

According to Georgia Department of Public Health data, 60 more people died from the virus over the last weekend.

Hmmm? 60 dead? Really? Really? Because actual Georgia DOH sources say 4!!! FOUR! 2+2 does not equal 60!

 

[JosephStalin]

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/04/20/839338550/georgia-beginning-to-reopen-its-economy-lifting-some-coronavirus-crisis-limits

Yay! Hopefully if they do well after lowering restrictions, other states will follow suit.

Let's hope so. Not optimistic re CA. 'They" will fuck us over as long as they can.

Our county's "medical director" says there are three more cases in the county, making the number 149. Refuses to give any more information. Still maintains there will be 33,000 cases in the county around mid-May. We were supposed to have 8-9,000 cases now. Don't know why this fuck still has a job. He's an idiot.



On another subject, I do all I can to avoid "tele-health". At this stage of life and with my particular medical background, I expect to be seen by a doctor. I just tell the person who wants me to settle for tele-health no. Can't listen to the heart over the phone.

 

[pull over dat ass too fat]

New York City does not reflect the state of things for the rest of the country, though. Every state (and city) has experienced this pandemic uniquely, and the hospitals in other states and cities have not been overwhelmed.

Yeah, that's because every state has different conditions and regulations. Things became serious more rapidly in places like New York and Illinois because they have more densely populated areas, but even relatively less populated regions have become hotspots or heavy strain & shortages on medical resources due to income disparity and state policy for handling the virus.

I actually view this as a difficulty for the US, because when a single state shits the bed from doing asinine shit, it sucks up massive resources nationally, which then weaken other states. We saw this acutely when New York state was in panic mode.

There's a risk of hospitals losing workers and being shut down around the country right now because they're empty. I showed you an example of that already happening. Less health care workers and less hospitals undoubtedly puts people's lives at risk.

the type of people you're referring to wouldn't (and probably genuinely shouldn't) get healthcare if "things go back to normal" either because they'd be at risk and not in critical need of care, so this is a moot point as far as I'm concerned. unless by "back to normal" you really genuinely mean that we just pretend none of this is happening, in which case those people are certainly fucked, along with whatever people need inpatient care and are unable to receive it from overloaded hospital systems. you're just saying "there's a bad aspect to what we're doing now, so we should do this other thing instead" without any assessment of what bad aspects come from your own plan. There is no normal anymore. Longing for it to be doesn't change anything. It's just kind of sad for your own wellbeing, tbh.

do you not have any thoughts on a nationalized hospital option for underserviced areas? this problem exists normally in certain rural areas anyway, even without the virus. hospitals make more money setting up in bigger cities, so they don't bother wasting resources on those communities.

 

[HTTP Error 404]

I have no idea. I hate playing pump and dumps. The whole fucking economy feels like a pump and dump rn.

> Oil down over 200% in one day
> S&P 500 down... wait for it... 2%
> Gold up like 11%

WHAT. THE FUCK.

(edit: bloomberg was giving me 2-day metrics, it's even worse lmao)

So basically all the big name investors were holding off until shit finally fell apart, and... that was today, around 10 hours ago.

Great. We're in the Great Chinese Depression.

 

[Dog-O-Tron 5000v5.0]

Select parts of New York Cities Healthcare system were hit hard. Not even the entire city system. Sections of Queens, Brooklyn and the Bronx and their associated hospitals. With some stress out on Long Island as the locusts fled. Particularly in Eastern Suffolk. The larger Manhattan hospitals were not anywhere near capacity. The rest of New York State was viewed to be so well off that the Governor stripped Ventilators from them at gunpoint and has refused to send them test kits or PPE.

An Open Letter to Cuomo from one of the Upstate NY Radio Stations

An Open Letter to Governor Cuomo from WGY’s Kelly Lynch | News Radio 810 & 103.1 WGY | Chuck and Kelly

wgy.iheart.com

And the Radio station is not lying about Cuomo and the PPE. A friend is high ranked in Health Response in an upsate NY City. The State gave them 1 mask per medical staffer per week of n95 Masks. For the past month. And has only given them 600 test kits total. Which have been rationed to Hospital Personnel and First Responders.

She is dead on. He has shown time and time again that NY ends for him below Orange County (which itself is reeling with 6000 cases). Upstate is just where there "are more cows than people" and Albany is jusst an annoying place he has to go to a few days a week.

He know he can win the Governor's election pandering to Dem votes in NYC. That is all he needs. If he runs for President, that's probably all he needs to carry the state and get the electoral votes. The rest of the state can hang.

 

[Marchesa of the Vast]

And this is why you never trust the media

Hmmm? 60 dead? Really? Really? Because actual Georgia DOH sources say 4!!! FOUR! 2+2 does not equal 60!

Well yea, it's NPR, might as well be Democracy Now or CNN.