Is the term 'Judeo-Christian' a grift?

[AnimeGirlConnoisseur]

I've heard this term get thrown around recently and I think it might be a grift. Now, I'm not Christian or Jewish, but I've learned a little bit about the religions and I'm not sure if they're that similar ideologically. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Judaism a religion that's focused around one group of people and very concrete rules about how they should live while Christianity is about how one man's sacrifice has opened a path to salvation for anyone who is willing to follow his teachings? The way I see it Islam has more in common with Christianity than Judaism. In Islam anyone of any race can become a Muslim as long as they follow the teachings of Muhammad and both religions say that their followers can go to a heaven after they die, while Judaism doesn't have anything to say on the matter. Yes, there are some differences in the faiths, but I think they're more similar to each other than to Judaism.

 

[stupidpieceofshit]

Because Jesus the son of God in Christianity was a Jew, Judaism gave birth to Christianity, to the point where you have Christian sects that observe Jewish holidays and customs and at least one Jewish sect that sees Jesus as the savoir of the Jewish people (but are not Christian). In a way Christanity is the sequel to Judaism, where is Islam is more of a spin off of the two (back in the 00s it was "popular" to pointout that something in Islam said that Christians and Jews are to be treated nicely or some shit like that, despite well how most followers of Islam treat them).

 

[DumbDude42]

it's an attempt by jews to gain the trust of the goyim

 

[Queen Elizabeth II]

The humanities generally just recognises that European civilisation wasn't just built by Christianity. The Jews were also a forming force in several parts and of course are the source material for Christianity itself. It's a label for a specific influence upon a society and sometimes the wider cultural sphere itself.

Some go further to say Abrahamic as a catch all to include the influence of Islam in areas like Greece and Spain but that's a little bit less common.

Neither of them are intended as a slur, purely a demarcation of a specific cultural influence sphere.

 

[MediocreMilt]

How do you do, fellow goyim?

 

[GhostButt]

It should only be used to categorize ideas and culture stemming from "judeo-christian" roots, like the shared old testament stories and ect. Using it to describe everything all the time, like non-stem academia does, is completely useless.

Most of the time its used as a way to sweep away non-poc customs as being fuddyduddy while simultaneously mocking them for being attached to a jewish origin, projecting their own antisemitism onto christians. (who either don't care, are theology scholars and already know this, or are actual white supremists so who cares what they think)

 

[Orion Balls]

Call it Abrahamic, and be done with the whole spiel.

 

[Kenobi]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32zQIZufNPQ

Republicans: I don´t see why you guys hate us JUDEOCHRISTANS so much!
Conservatives: We call ourselves Christians republican party!
Republicans : Thats right JudeoChristians!

 

[Joe Swanson]

While it is true that Christianity was built upon Second Temple Judaism, it was vehemently opposed to the sect of the Pharisees who's oral law evolved into the Talmud and other books. With the exception of the Karaites all people who claim to be Jews today are the descendants of the Jews who embraced the Pharisees that put Jesus to death which is why there has been a mutual hatred for 2000 years. And while Rabbinical Jews have been intertwined with European Christian culture for most of it's existence with some being prominent especially within the last 300 years, but to call Western culture "Judeo-Christian" is giving them too much credit.

 

[the fall of man]

Final Boss: Actually, my agents have been living secretly among you the whole ti-
/pol/: jews

 

[Kosher Dill]

"Judeo-Christian" is sort of like Islam's catchall term "People of the Book". It's just a reflection of the fact that under a certain political situation - postwar America in this case - Jews as well as Christians are considered "morally civilized" by the types who care about such notions.

Recall that it's well within living memory that this wasn't the case - up until the 60s Catholics were still told to pray for the hellbound "perfidious Jews". Various Protestant denominations held onto vestigial anti-Jewish beliefs even longer.

 

[Spooky Bones]

Recall that it's well within living memory that this wasn't the case - up until the 60s Catholics were still told to pray for the hellbound "perfidious Jews".

For the record, the Latin perfidus in the Good Friday Prayer for the Jews simply means "faithless," i.e. not accepting the Gospel. It's not equivalent to our term "perfidious" perfidious as certain Jews may be

The term "Judeo-Christian" is often used as a grift these days by Jews who want to find common ground with Christians, often about Israel and other things that benefit the Jews, but there is a lot of shared ground, moral and otherwise, between the two (even a fair bit with Islam, which is referred to by the term "Abrahamic religions"), including monotheism itself, so there's something to be said for the term.

 

[Kosher Dill]

For the record, the Latin perfidus in the Good Friday Prayer for the Jews simply means "faithless," i.e. not accepting the Gospel. It's not equivalent to our term "perfidious"

Sure - not that preceding generations of Latin-speaking prelates were in any great hurry to correct the misconception among their flocks.
Point being, putting the so-called "Christ-killers" on an equal moral footing with Christians is a fairly recent development.

 

[Spooky Bones]

I was curious so I did a google ngram for the term:

Not sure what the dips in the 60s and around 1980 are about, but interestingly, it seems to have really taken off after the foundation of ✡ Israel. There also seems to be a peak after the events of the Six-Day War in 1967 and the events of the 1970s in Israel too.

Sure - not that preceding generations of Latin-speaking prelates were in any great hurry to correct the misconception among their flocks.
Point being, putting the so-called "Christ-killers" on an equal moral footing with Christians is a fairly recent development.

The history of the prayer is interesting.

After World War II, Eugenio Zolli, the former Chief Rabbi of Rome and a convert to Roman Catholicism, asked Pope Pius XII to excise the adjective "perfidis" from the prayer for the Jews.[6] Professor Jules Isaac, a French scholar of Catholic-Jewish relations, did so as well in an audience with Pius in 1949. Pius responded with a public declaration that the Latin word "perfidus" means "unbelieving", not "perfidious" or "treacherous".[7] Fifteen years later, Pope John XXIII made that change official.[8]

In 1959, the word perfidus was removed; after Vatican II, the "veil on the hearts of the Jews" was removed.

 

[Lemmingwise]

Is the term 'Judeo-Christian' a grift?

Yes. Originally it meant christianized jews. These days use it to emphasize the common source, but it's usually used for judified christians (though usually without being very aware of it).

[Quote]The way I see it Islam has more in common with Christianity than Judaism[/quote]

You can draw commonalities between every two that deviate from the other.

 

[Terrorist]

The “Judeo” elements are already folded into the OT, so all you should have to say is “Christian”. There’s an (((agenda))) here.

Lots of conservative Christians think Judaism is just the OT with a few colorful holidays and therefore sympatico to them. They’re obviously wrong. The Talmud regards Christians/Goyim like the Koran regards infidels (i.e. that it’s pretty much OK to abuse them however you want).

 

[Kosher Dill]

The “Judeo” elements are already folded into the OT, so all you should have to say is “Christian”.

Christianity is already folded into Islam, minus a few misconceptions they have about the Prophet Isa being the son of God, so really we just need to say "Islamic".

 

[Terrorist]

Christianity is already folded into Islam, minus a few misconceptions they have about the Prophet Isa being the son of God, so really we just need to say "Islamic".

Judaism isn't relevant to western traditions other than the elements shared in common in the OT. "Judeo" is not needed.

 

[5t3n0g0ph3r]

I've heard this term get thrown around recently and I think it might be a grift. Now, I'm not Christian or Jewish, but I've learned a little bit about the religions and I'm not sure if they're that similar ideologically.

At first glance, I thought this was going to be one of these threads:


But, in the hopes of an honest discussion, I'll put in my thoughts.
Christianity started as an off-shoot of Judaism because, surprise, the first Christian were Jews.
The faith has evolved over the centuries because of the efforts to bring in the Gentiles including some concessions to make Gentiles feel comfortable (incorporation of pagan holidays and "Christianizing" being among these concessions).
The cross-influence has caused a bit of ignorance of the Jewish cultural meanings in the Old Testament texts as well as some New Testament interactions.
But, I agree that there have been efforts to soften relations between the Christian (often Protestant) and Jewish communities since the establishment of Israel.

 

[AnimeGirlConnoisseur]

At first glance, I thought this was going to be one of these threads:
View attachment 1390052

But, in the hopes of an honest discussion, I'll put in my thoughts.
Christianity started as an off-shoot of Judaism because, surprise, the first Christian were Jews.
The faith has evolved over the centuries because of the efforts to bring in the Gentiles including some concessions to make Gentiles feel comfortable (incorporation of pagan holidays and "Christianizing" being among these concessions).
The cross-influence has caused a bit of ignorance of the Jewish cultural meanings in the Old Testament texts as well as some New Testament interactions.
But, I agree that there have been efforts to soften relations between the Christian (often Protestant) and Jewish communities since the establishment of Israel.

Doing something like what you described with that pic was not my intention. I'm glad that you're willing to have a discussion.

I understand that the first Jews were Christians, but I just don't see the religion as related to Judaism ideologically. From what I learned about the OT, it is mostly a documentation of the history of the Jewish people followed by some rules that Jews should live by. The latter part is why, if you open a Christian Bible today, you can find stuff in there about not wearing clothes made out of two different kinds of fabrics or not eating shellfish. The NT, on the other hand, is about the life and teachings of Jesus Christ as well as (I think) some documentation about what happened to Jesus's followers after his death. The OT is aimed at one group of people while the NT is aimed at all people. I personally think that lumping Christianity together with Judaism, just because Jesus and his original followers were Jewish is like lumping Communism with Judaism just because Marx was a Jew or lumping capeshit with Judaism just because alot of the OG capeshit writers and artists (Stan Lee, Bob Kane, Bill Finger, Jack Kirby, Joe Shuster, Jerry Siegal) were Jewish.

Also, (and I don't know if you are doing this on purpose), you kinda imply that the incorporation of non-jews into Christianity was something that just sort of happened over time. I don't think this is the case. I remember learning that the NT was originally written in Koine Greek (the lingua-franca of the Eastern portion of the Roman Empire), not Hebrew (the religious language of the Jews) or Aramaic (the language Jesus spoke in his day-to-day life). I was told the point of this was specifically to make the text available to non-Jews. Christianity was never meant to be an exclusively Jewish thing.