StoneToss (allegedly, formerly Red Panels)

Erischan said:
Doctrinal differences about concepts that exist only within abrahism. If you disagree about who the messiah is, you are still both asking "Who is the messiah, and when is he coming?" That is a question which is exclusive and specific to judaism and its subsequent sectarian divisions. Buddhists don't ask who the messiah is. South American animists don't ask who the messiah is.
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Erischan said:
Doctrinal differences about concepts that exist only within abrahism. If you disagree about who the messiah is, you are still both asking "Who is the messiah, and when is he coming?" That is a question which is exclusive and specific to judaism and its subsequent sectarian divisions. Buddhists don't ask who the messiah is. South American animists don't ask who the messiah is.
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That's being incredibly simplistic. Judaism is an incredibly rules-based religion whose primary basis is the selective nature of its adherents and its emphasis on having all of its adherents be able to understand and debate one another on the true meaning of the Word of God (not to say this isn't found in Christianity or Islam, but not nearly to the same degree as strict Jews are expected to do). Islam, on the other hand, is about submission to the Will of God and being a good member of the collective, and while there are certainly religious scholars who debate the finer points of dogma, that's not expected of the average Muslim. Christians are somewhere in between, especially the Protestants, and have a much less stringent set of rules that they're required to live by than either Jews or Muslims. And by the way, Hindus do have a Messiah they expect to arrive in the end times, even though they're a non-Abrahamic faith.
 
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soy_king said:
That's being incredibly simplistic.
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Whenever someone says this phrase my brain translates it to "You're so right that I have no counterargument."
I'm being incredibly simplistic because it's incredibly simple.

Group A worships YHWH.
Group B worships YHWH.
They do it kinda differently in a way that only seems substantially different within YHWH worship, but seems effectively identical to anyone outside it, in the way that two apples might have different grains but still look the same to anyone but an apple autist.
 
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Erischan said:
Whenever someone says this phrase my brain translates it to "You're so right that I have no counterargument."
I'm being incredibly simplistic because it's incredibly simple.

Group A worships YHWH.
Group B worships YHWH.
They do it kinda differently in a way that only seems substantially different within YHWH worship, but seems effectively identical to anyone outside it, in the way that two apples might have different grains but still look the same to anyone but an apple autist.
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To put it in a materialist's perspective, your argument is functionally equivalent to saying that physics, chemistry, and biology are all essentially the same because they're all based on a foundation of certain natural laws that vary in their expression within each field, especially when you view them from the outside perspective of the Humanities or Social Sciences.
 
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soy_king said:
To put it in a materialist's perspective, your argument is functionally equivalent to saying that physics, chemistry, and biology are all essentially the same because they're all based on a foundation of certain natural laws that vary in their expression within each field, especially when you view them from the outside perspective of the Humanities or Social Sciences.
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Yes.
 
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Erischan said:
No.

Which god do christians worship?
Which god do jews worship?
Which god to muslims worship?

The answer to all three questions is the same name: YHWH.
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Christians don't worship YHWH lol what the fuck are you even talking about. Your flimsy grasp of the tetragrammaton isn't the sole defining characteristic here. Also religions are not defined solely by God. Your entire argument is just hilariously "why don't these ancient, distinct, and warring groups not realize that I don't care how different they are?"
 
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Rekkington said:
Christians don't worship YHWH lol what the fuck are you even talking about.
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When they say God are they referring to Vishnu? Zeus?
They're talking about YHWH, the god who spoke to moses through the burning bush. Don't play this game lol, it's dumb.
Rekkington said:
Also religions are not defined solely by God.
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Yeah they are. Two groups worshipping the same god differently are different sects of the same religion. What else would define it?
Rekkington said:
Your entire argument is just hilariously "why don't these ancient, distinct, and warring groups not realize that I don't care how different they are?"
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Internal conflict is a thing that exists. Not all conflict is external. Sects of a religion fight each other more often than religions fight each other. There are more wars between hindu cults than there are between hinduism and confucianism.
 
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Erischan said:
When they say God are they referring to Vishnu? Zeus?
They're talking about YHWH, the god who spoke to moses through the burning bush. Don't play this game lol, it's dumb.

Yeah they are. Two groups worshipping the same god differently are different sects of the same religion. What else would define it?

Internal conflict is a thing that exists. Not all conflict is external. Sects of a religion fight each other more often than religions fight each other. There are more wars between hindu cults than there are between hinduism and confucianism.
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I dare you to make this argument in a mosque.

But anyway 2/10, made me reply. Ok troll, tho.
 
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My favorite derailment was when we almost got a chance to sperg about Alternate History stuff.
 
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Orange Rhymer said:
The left has already changed STEM to STEAM - including (A)rts. Because, you know, everything/everyone is equally valid.
Waiting for the next change adding (E)ducation, (W)riting, and (H)istory - invalidating their entire argument.
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Not really necessary though (and I never seen leftists do as you describe), as there is already a term called HASS. (H)humanities, (A)rts, and (S)ocial (S)ciences.

Lemmingwise said:
There's considerable reason to believe jesus was greek, not jewish (but living in the land we now call israel).

"Judeo-Christian" is a very strange american term. Because the new testament makes clear that it's the jewish religious leadership that is responsible for the cricifixion of christ, more so than the romans.

Jewish religion was messianic at the time and waiting for the messiah that would offer salvation. Christians believe that was christ. Jews did not and nailed him to the cross for falsely claiming it. Christians consider this rejection of christ and god.

So when the most essential part is not only rejected in judaism, but they are the villain, it's really strange to put them in the same term, and first too. As if there were no difference between the two, or as if judaism is an older brother.

The term is usually used to further jewish interests among christian populations. Some of the more religious jews aren't fan of being lumped in with christians either.

And that's leaving out the later jewish religious scripture of jesus being boiled in piss in hell and all that.

The comic makes the point simply. Jews crucified jesus, christians consider him divine. The beliefs are irreconcillable. And it's a disingenuous oppertunisticly used term.



The romans were very surprised to discover that jews had managed to keep religious writings secret for hundreds of years.
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It's not exactly strange when you consider why the term 'Judeo-Christian' was invented and that evangelical Christians in general (especially the hardcore ones) are super supportive of Israel: Israel as a Jewish state is important in bringing about the end times prophecy and the second coming of Christ.

 
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