Jerry Peet / Lily Orchard / Lily Peet / Valkyrstudios / Bhaalspawn / Tara Callie / "Mod Ebara" - Sociopath writer of pedophile fanfiction and cartoon reviews, faked getting raped to force a divorce, then mobbed and gaslit their ex off Tumblr, satanist neoliberal of the MovieSlob variety, also wants to fuck dogs and/or pokemon

[starborn427614]

Ah, yes, that classic Mary Sue Goku. A man so dogshit retarded at anything except for fighting he was tricked into marriage because he thought it was some kind of food.

People confusing characters being OP and characters being Mary Sues is a problem going back a number of years now honestly.

 

[Nauseated Courgi]

The other problem is that the definition of Mary Sue is so broad and has become so warped that it's hard to know what shorthand people are using. Generally speaking, people that use the accusation of 'Mary Sue' are using it in its classical context, meaning a character who has bent the world to their will and faces no true adversity because of it. The people who are accused of writing Mary Sues, meanwhile, use its diluted definition -- which has been specifically formatted to deflect criticism -- of saying that people just don't like strong female characters winning.

I think E;R's definition of them is the best. That includes his reason for why people hate them so much (basically he believes people hate them mostly because they're a god pretending to be human).

 

[Typical Anime Trap]

Just to be clear, ace people can enjoy sex (although there are plenty out there that find the idea repulsive). Being asexual doesn't mean your nervous system stops before it reaches your genitals, it means you don't have a libido. Ace people will still have sex with a partner that they love and trust in order to make them happy, but it's not something they actively want to do. Asexuality isn't sexual dysfunction, it's sexual disinterest.

At least, it used to be.

But then it became a new and exotic hat to wear for people who both wanted to be part of the exclusive cool kids club that is the LGBT community without actually having to be gay, but they also didn't actually want to be asexual so they came up with the 'gray ace' spectrum, where you're suddenly considered part of the 'spectrum' if, say, you only want to have sex with somebody you've emotionally bonded with. You'd think the super-simple binary of 'I want to have sex' and 'I don't want to have sex' would be easy to understand, but people really want to identify as something rare and unusual to elevate their boring lives instead of finding a way to enrich themselves so might as well just open that umbrella until its inside-out.

To bring this back to Lily, she has said (and isn't alone in saying) that 'straight people are boring'. In her Korra review she explicitly says that Korra baffles her because Korra is bisexual and yet in spite of her sexuality is boring. She has legitimately made the argument that her trite romances are elevated beyond their station just because lesbians are involved.


Very minor fairness here: people do like comfort food. They will read the same story over and over again if it's something they enjoy. The romance genre as a whole is basically this but swapping out the players depending on what you're interested in, and there authors that churn out the same story over and over again and make mad bank just by doing that. There was an author my parents were reading back when I was in high school who had the exact same formula for every one of his books (I mean, beat for beat), and you know... sometimes it's fun to just go on a dumb adventure or escape with a different dashing romantic hero, even if it's fundamentally the same story.

That said, Lily doesn't really write stories, she writes scenes that are the same two characters having the same conversation over and over again with slightly different set dressing. There are no plot beats to follow because there is no plot. TSR only has a plot because she's patterning it the stories off the movies, and those stories cleave so close to the movies that even the changes she does introduce are just cosmetic. I totally get liking to explore particular scenarios and conversations because they're what interest you specifically, but that's all Lily does. Just those scenes. And then publishes them and expects endless praise.


The other problem is that the definition of Mary Sue is so broad and has become so warped that it's hard to know what shorthand people are using. Generally speaking, people that use the accusation of 'Mary Sue' are using it in its classical context, meaning a character who has bent the world to their will and faces no true adversity because of it. The people who are accused of writing Mary Sues, meanwhile, use its diluted definition -- which has been specifically formatted to deflect criticism -- of saying that people just don't like strong female characters winning.

That's why she chose the examples she chose-- the characters involved are not just considered to be overpowered, but they're also male. She's saying "I bet you like these characters because they're MEN and only dislike these other because they're WOMEN", which is not only a presumptive argument but false. I used to spend a lot of time in litcrit circles in high school and college, and the books that were chosen for criticism were almost entirely male-dominated and male-focused, with the common complaint being that the MALE PROTAGONIST was overpowered, had the universe bend to his will, encountered little opposition, and was overall boring and flawless. These kinds of books also generally had female leads who were little more than love interests. Everybody involved called them out on both aspects-- nobody likes a Gary Stu, and nobody likes a useless love interest.

This is an extremely common criticism of bad books in general, but the difference is, when you're criticizing male characters, you're just criticizing characters. When you're start criticizing female characters, well, obviously it's because you're just sexist. You have a whole stack of books and movies you've called out for having shitty Gary Stu protagonists? Well obviously the only reason you didn't like Captain Marvel is because you're a misogynist. I best you would like Rey if she were a man.

That said, Lily doesn't really write stories, she writes scenes that are the same two characters having the same conversation over and over again with slightly different set dressing. There are no plot beats to follow because there is no plot. TSR only has a plot because she's patterning it the stories off the movies, and those stories cleave so close to the movies that even the changes she does introduce are just cosmetic. I totally get liking to explore particular scenarios and conversations because they're what interest you specifically, but that's all Lily does. Just those scenes. And then publishes them and expects endless praise.

This is exactly why I cant stand her WoW stories. She takes a story and characters that already exists, adds one or two of her own, and then she tries to 'fix' the plot. She doesn't do any of the work herself and then calls herself a great writer. Having a character that is the sole champion of the Horde could actually be really cool if Lily knew how to write anything other than 'lesbians flirting at a bar' or 'elf gets quippy with men' because in all honesty its really not that bad of a concept. Would it mean that the protagonist is insanely powerful? yeah. Would it mean that you have to put insane amounts of effort into it to make it believable? yes, and that's exactly what Lily doesn't want to do.

Anevay is never in the wrong, she simply committed the crime of loving too much and apparently that makes her a sad, broken, and sympathetic character in Lily's eyes. Anevay could be a good character, a flirty strong willed blood-elf who's only goal is to support Sylvanas. The only problem with that is it demotes Anevay to the exact same Position as Nathanos but Lily just has to write a character that's extremely important and is actually relevant. So she forces fem-fatale Nathanos to be the best and while she's quirky and has a sharp tongue she's actually still really nice and just wants the best for people even though her own ideals of defending Sylvanas no matter the cost absolutely shatters her 'nice guy' personality.


One of my biggest issues with Lily is her complaints about lore. If she didn't want to involve lore why not just make her characters human? If the story is already set in a world that everyone understands then there's no reason to worry about missing out on the lore. If she just wrote human lesbians in modern day settings with no fantasy aspect to it it would solve just about every problem she had. One of my favorite authors is a manga artist/writer called Harada and while their works involve a lot of fucked up material its always very grounded and focuses only on what it needs to. Their story YataMomo is probably the best example of what lily so badly wants to write, a slice of life romance between a gay couple where one of the two is pretty fucked up and traumatized and a lot of the book deals with that trauma and coming to terms with it. The books are so good (in my opinion) that I didn't even question why I don't know the characters last names or what one of the two protagonists does for a living. Lily time and time again ignores the fact that you don't need to know every detail about a characters life for them to be a good character but then she turns around and yells at everyone else for revealing 'too much' in their stories as if she doesn't have a wiki for her own webcomic.

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]

View attachment 1648815

View attachment 1648816
I'm going to lose my mind

Wants kids now, huh? Not a self insert, huh?

Say, remember that short Lily wrote about a mom taking her toddler daughter to a therapist because said toddler was hitting on said mom? And the therapist’s response was “this is completely normal for a young lesbian, but it’s also your fault for wearing tight pants”?

My point is keep Lily away from children.

 

[Ben Laden]

Wants kids now, huh? Not a self insert, huh?

Say, remember that short Lily wrote about a mom taking her toddler daughter to a therapist because said toddler was hitting on said mom? And the therapist’s response was “this is completely normal for a young lesbian, but it’s also your fault for wearing tight pants”?

My point is keep Lily away from children.

I can just imagine her forcing her son to wear dresses and use female pronouns, or gaslighting her daughter into believing she's gay because she has a really close friend who is a girl.

And that's just the fucked up stuff she'd do that doesn't involve molestation.

 

[Lurk Jurk]

Lily Orchard's Official Tumblr, Since the topic came up, I wanted to …

archived 11 Oct 2020 14:53:28 UTC

archive.md

I'm not sure what would be worse: him sending this to himself so he can write out a story about teenage girl incest, or him falling for a troll and actually, earnestly saying "I guess just let your daughters molest each other until they get bored."

Saying the daughters "are the same age" sounds like when he wrote about he and his sister both being fourteen even though they're presumably not twins, because if he was a twin he'd never shut up about it and would probably use it as further evidence for his troonism.

 

[Chapter Master Tu'Shan]

Ah, yes, that classic Mary Sue Goku. A man so dogshit retarded at anything except for fighting he was tricked into marriage because he thought it was some kind of food.

Not to mention that he spends just about every waking hour of his life actually training to get better at fighting AND tends to get brutalized by whatever big villain he fights until he catches up.

Lily Orchard's Official Tumblr, Since the topic came up, I wanted to …

archived 11 Oct 2020 14:53:28 UTC

archive.md

View attachment 1655191

I'm not sure what would be worse: him sending this to himself so he can write out a story about teenage girl incest, or him falling for a troll and actually, earnestly saying "I guess just let your daughters molest each other until they get bored."

Saying the daughters "are the same age" sounds like when he wrote about he and his sister both being fourteen even though they're presumably not twins, because if he was a twin he'd never shut up about it and would probably use it as further evidence for his troonism.

For both daughters to be the same age, they'd have to either be twins, or one or both would have to be adopted.
Given that this is Lily's incest fantasy, my guess would be twins, although it would be amusing if their were adoptive siblings, since that's such a common thing in Anime these days.

 

[Lurk Jurk]

For both daughters to be the same age, they'd have to either be twins, or one or both would have to be adopted.
Given that this is Lily's incest fantasy, my guess would be twins, although it would be amusing if their were adoptive siblings, since that's such a common thing in Anime these days.

Or he thinks women routinely have a baby and immediately get pregnant again and pop out another one in 9 months so their ages would line up sometimes.

 

[Nauseated Courgi]

For both daughters to be the same age, they'd have to either be twins, or one or both would have to be adopted.
Given that this is Lily's incest fantasy, my guess would be twins, although it would be amusing if their were adoptive siblings, since that's such a common thing in Anime these days.

That's assuming Jerry watches Anime despite him making it clear he hates it.

 

[Chapter Master Tu'Shan]

That's assuming Jerry watches Anime despite him making it clear he hates it.

In my experience, people who spend their time standing on a soapbox, ranting about how [Insert Topic Here] is Evil and Bad and how they're Pure and Good for not doing it, are usually doing that exact thing themselves.

Purity Culture breeds these sort of types.

The more Lily shits on anime and paints herself as a paragon for not watching it, the higher the chance that she totally watches Anime on the regular.

 

[thebananaonion]

Lily Orchard's Official Tumblr, Since the topic came up, I wanted to …

archived 11 Oct 2020 14:53:28 UTC

archive.md

View attachment 1655191

Can someone hand me a loaded revolver, a jug of bleach and point to to the direction to the nearest cliff please.

 

[starborn427614]

In my experience, people who spend their time standing on a soapbox, ranting about how [Insert Topic Here] is Evil and Bad and how they're Pure and Good for not doing it, are usually doing that exact thing themselves.

Purity Culture breeds these sort of types.

The more Lily shits on anime and paints herself as a paragon for not watching it, the higher the chance that she totally watches Anime on the regular.

You'd think Lilly would get along with anime more considering how many people with anime avatars on Twitter shit on SU. They'd probably have a nice chat about how Rebecca Sugar is a nazi.

 

[SubarashiiRage]

https://archive.fo/y2xg5

another question answered with whataboutism with a touch of not exemplifying and clarifying your argument and sexist gaslight
again
https://archive.fo/P1Qwx

do you know why females are more offended at being called Mary Sues and males not?

because when a man does it, he doesn't have a series of paragraphs on how this character is actually super complex and flawed (at least not as much as for females, but they ended up looking like losers ), they are a litle more honest

When it is a male power fantasy, the authors embrace the whole concept, but a female power fantasy wants to sell itself as the pinnacle of good writing and characterization when they do nothing different besides fantasizing to kill and attack people and still be the biggest victim.
what makes a Mary Sues is not only what is written in the story, but also the defense of the author to criticism

males characters have no easy excuse or deflection when their stories are written poorly, so hack writers choose to write female and gay characters these days to put on a shield where they can accuse misogyny and homophobia to all criticisms

and this is the point in current characterization, males have suffered criticism all the time and now their characters need to be better written to stand out, but females have no standards they just introduce them to any franchise and it is already reason to praise them for no reason whatsoever and they are protected from any criticism and deprived of absorbing them to be better

 

[InfinityBuster]

https://archive.vn/0LbHP

More on Lily's tangent on 'Mary Sue' criticism

"It's a conspiracy against women!"

 

[Chapter Master Tu'Shan]

https://archive.vn/0LbHP

View attachment 1655356

More on Lily's tangent on 'Mary Sue' criticism

"It's a conspiracy against women!"

The term was literally invented by a woman
But I guess she'd just deflect that as "muh internalized misogynie"

 

[TheAmbiguousLurker]

Lilly does such a great job of countering these points that she doesn't even need to dedicate any words to, you know, actually making an argument of why she thinks these characters count.

 

[ShiftyBoi]

The thing about Me: an FAQ - YouTube

archived 11 Oct 2020 17:51:56 UTC

archive.li

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D55bEmjW4T0

Whilst I tear my eyes out after reading that incest post, here's an FAQ video on Mikail's channel.
Not much to say it's just Mikail telling the audience about herself with her shmorky-esque voice.
For the most part the video devolves into parroting Lily.

She parrots a bunch of Lily's points about Steven Universe and shit.
Later there's some prequel praise, and she parrots Lily's stance on people recommending her things.

There's a poll in the description about her next video, one of the options is called "the thing about normies" that just sounds funny to me, here's the link.
http://www.strawpoll.me/21080413

 

[Ben Laden]

There's something I think a lot of people forget about when they call Goku a Gary-Stu and that is that Goku never settles for being the strongest guy and is constantly training himself to get better. Goku doesn't want to be the best guy ever, because if there was no one stronger than him, he'd get bored. He'd have no goal to reach, no limits to break. His dick gets hard anytime he hears that someone or something is really strong and dangerous because it's a chance for him to test his skills. Even Toriyama, a guy who wrote most of Dragon Ball as he went along and just forgets things he created, understands that the manga wouldn't be interesting if Goku always beat everyone without trying. The setting is written specifically to provide a challenge for Goku, whereas most sues bend the setting to suit them.

 

[SubarashiiRage]

https://archive.md/zI1uH

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D55bEmjW4T0

Whilst I tear my eyes out after reading that incest post, here's an FAQ video on Mikail's channel.
Not much to say it's just Mikail telling the audience about herself with her shmorky-esque voice.
For the most part the video devolves into parroting Lily.

She parrots a bunch of Lily's points about Steven Universe and shit.
Later there's some prequel praise, and she parrots Lily's stance on people recommending her things.

There's a poll in the description about her next video, one of the options is called "the thing about normies" that just sounds funny to me, here's the link.
http://www.strawpoll.me/21080413

why have a separate channel if it’s just going to regurgitate what Lily already says, in the same style?

I understand that they are engaged, but that’s no reason to be unidentifiable without Lily
and seriously looking at this channel it would be difficult not to see it as a clone, as if she had to have Lily's approval to post videos

and "all art is political" is a horrible way of consuming media, always looking in the same lens and ignoring any other interpretation and context is a dealbreaker for me

 

[starborn427614]

There's something I think a lot of people forget about when they call Goku a Gary-Stu and that is that Goku never settles for being the strongest guy and is constantly training himself to get better. Goku doesn't want to be the best guy ever, because if there was no one stronger than him, he'd get bored. He'd have no goal to reach, no limits to break. His dick gets hard anytime he hears that someone or something is really strong and dangerous because it's a chance for him to test his skills. Even Toriyama, a guy who wrote most of Dragon Ball as he went along and just forgets things he created, understands that the manga wouldn't be interesting if Goku always beat everyone without trying. The setting is written specifically to provide a challenge for Goku, whereas most sues bend the setting to suit them.

He's also not beloved by everyone instantly and especially not in Super considering the tournament and such.