Wuhan Coronavirus: Megathread - Got too big

[E. Knee as Weapon - Cont.]

Biden will win in a landslide. This whole "but his emails" conspiracy theory will result in no charges, just like the "but her emails" or Benghazi theories last time. Meanwhile, 210,000 of your fellow citizens are DEAD of Coronavirus because Orange Man Drumph lied and did nothing.

They'd be dead anyway, you'd just feel better about it.

 

[Maradontia]

There seems to be some evidence that Biden's slipped a couple of points in the polls. That slip is within the margin of error, so we'll see.

The bigger issue with the polls is people actually lose their jobs in some parts of the US now for publically supporting Trump, so there is a chance a large number of voters are actually voting for Trump but are afraid to say out loud out of fear of backlash.

As for the thread itself being "proven wrong" the larger concern I'm seeing in the thread personally is social media censorship of the story when conspiracy theories about Trump with less of a basis are spread on Twitter and Facebook with zero issues. Do you feel that concern is invalid?





I don't live in the US. My part of the world has had four deaths. Know how we kept it under control? Locking down the border, which is what Trump advocated early on.

What do you suppose Biden would have done different than Trump had he been in power? It sounds like constitutionally the response is largely left in the hands of state governments. Even Biden has admitted a nationwide mask mandate would be unconstitutional. What should Trump have done?

What South Korea did. Mass testing, tracing, and quarantining the sick. Manufacture and distribute PPE, ventilators, and hospital beds. Instead, Orange Man inserted his thumb into his ass.

 

[mindlessobserver]

What South Korea did. Mass testing, tracing, and quarantining the sick. Manufacture and distribute PPE, ventilators, and hospital beds. Instead, Orange Man inserted his thumb into his ass.

Except Trump did all of those things. And it HAS worked. The vast majority of the US is largely unaffected by COVID. Only Cuomos shit pile seems to be having issues

 

[Never Scored]

What South Korea did. Mass testing, tracing, and quarantining the sick.

So you don't think border lockdowns work? Let me repeat four deaths.

The federal government in South Korea has more power than the federal government in the US. I think a lot of these things have to be handled at the state level. I know Canada better because I live here and testing, tracing and quarantining are all being handled at the provincial level. Are the state governments mentally retarded? Why does the federal government need to do those things in a country the size of the US?

Manufacture and distribute PPE, ventilators, and hospital beds. Instead, Orange Man inserted his thumb into his ass.

Didn't they send a hospital ship to New York?

 

[FAQnews Correspondent]

So you don't think border lockdowns work? Let me repeat four deaths.

The federal government in South Korea has more power than the federal government in the US. I think a lot of these things have to be handled at the state level. I know Canada better because I live here and testing, tracing and quarantining are all being handled at the provincial level. Are the state governments mentally retarded? Why does the federal government need to do those things in a country the size of the US?



Didn't they send a hospital ship to New York?

And to LA. Also the Javits Center was used as a makeshift hospital, and zero beds were used.

 

[Michael Jacks0n]

What South Korea did. Mass testing, tracing, and quarantining the sick. Manufacture and distribute PPE, ventilators, and hospital beds. Instead, Orange Man inserted his thumb into his ass.

And yet hospitals in Upstate NY eventually had to eliminate their staff due to lack of work available, as excess ventilators piled up.

 

[cantankerous jackalope]

What South Korea did. Mass testing, tracing, and quarantining the sick. Manufacture and distribute PPE, ventilators, and hospital beds. Instead, Orange Man inserted his thumb into his ass.

Comparing any first world country to South Korea is an automatic head scratcher. They were literally run by a suicidal death cult that had infiltrated the highest positions of their government and shit hit the fan in 2016. That place’s government is so fucked up now I wouldn’t believe them for shit

 

[Maradontia]

Hey, maybe you missed this, understandable because the thread is moving fast, but this is my reply to your earlier post:



Care to address any of it?

What do you want me to say? The deaths speak for themselves. The American government dropped the ball and 210,000 people are dead. If you want to shift the blame from federal to state governments, that just shows the level of incompetence and/or corruption is widespread? OK.

Canada had over 9000! deaths. Still way above the death rates of South Korea or other countries with responsible governments. Canada fucked up, just not as bad as the US.

 

[Never Scored]

What do you want me to say? The deaths speak for themselves. The American government dropped the ball and 210,000 people are dead. If you want to shift the blame from federal to state governments, that just shows the level of incompetence and/or corruption is widespread? OK.

Now you're shifting the goalposts. You specifically said it was Trump's fault. I didn't argue any response was perfect, or that any state did good or bad. I said the things you are advocating must specifically be carried out at the state level, and therefore you should blame the deaths on the states, not Donald J Trump. Trump does not have the ability under the constitution to do the things you are saying you want him to do. So why blame him for it?

Canada had over 9000! deaths. Still way above the death rates of South Korea or other countries with responsible governments. Canada fucked up, just not as bad as the US.

My province has a marginally lower death rate per 100,000 people than South Korea. Like dude, my province has had four deaths. Trudeau didn't do that, my provincial government did. The point is in jurisdictions with powerful sub-national entities such as the US and Canada, the power to respond in the way you want is not legally in the hands of the federal government. Trump literally does not have the power to do the things you're blaming him for not doing.

 

[Zbk3VmLfujjzjxBd43tL]

What do you want me to say? The deaths speak for themselves. The American government dropped the ball and 210,000 people are dead. If you want to shift the blame from federal to state governments, that just shows the level of incompetence and/or corruption is widespread? OK.

Canada had over 9000! deaths. Still way above the death rates of South Korea or other countries with responsible governments. Canada fucked up, just not as bad as the US.

210,000 people dead in 8 months in a country of 325 million, oooh, scary. I wouldn't be surprised if tens of thousands of them would've died this year anyway from the pre-existing conditions they had (since 94% of deaths from the Chinese virus occured in people with pre-existing conditions) given that the average age of death hovers around 80. It's just instead of dying of a heart attack or expiring from cancer while surrounded by family, they instead get to live the last months of their life with minimal human contact, constant worry, and constant misery all in the name of their health.

Trump's response is bad in that he didn't listen to the actual science that was coming out by April that this isn't world-ending, didn't publicize it more, didn't do more to force governors to re-open their states and cease violating the civil rights of citizens, and didn't put Fauci out on his ass for his failed predictions, relying on broken models, and constant flip-flopping. Because at the end of the day, it wasn't a disease that caused this disaster, it was a broken political system, stupid politicians, and un-elected bureaucrats. Society was too autistically focused on preventing deaths that they forgot that people have lives to live. Because of that, the quality of life for hundreds of millions of people has suffered immensely, so much that some will literally die from it and for millions of others they've lost businesses and huge amounts of money and will never again be as fortunate. But their lives don't matter, not even if they're black. Only preventing a dementia-ridden grandma or 500 pound hambeast from keeling over matters.

 

[E. Knee as Weapon - Cont.]

Now you're shifting the goalposts. You specifically said it was Trump's fault. I didn't argue any response was perfect, or that any state did good or bad. I said the things you are advocating must specifically be carried out at the state level, and therefore you should blame the deaths on the states, not Donald J Trump. Trump does not have the ability under the constitution to do the things you are saying you want him to do. So why blame him for it?



My province has a marginally lower death rate per 100,000 people than South Korea. Like dude, my province has had four deaths. Trudeau didn't do that, my provincial government did. The point is in jurisdictions with powerful sub-national entities such as the US and Canada, the power to respond in the way you want is not legally in the hands of the federal government. Trump literally does not have the power to do the things you're blaming him for not doing.

Exactly. But this is typical of a lot of complaints about America.

They don't understand federalism. They don't understand the electoral college. They don't understand the division of powers. They don't understand jurisdiction. They don't understand the Senate. They just bitch and moan when things don't fit their retarded worldview, like some toddler trying to process why mommy took a different route to the grocery store today.

 

[gangweedfan]

When it comes to masks the media is clearly lying by omission by saying that you get the same amount of oxygen when wearing a mask. While that is true they completely forget to mention that your breathing pattern changes while wearing one which is what makes face masks uncomfortable. are there any long term effects from having your breathing patterns disrupted like this? Im not a doomer who thinks he will get brain cancer from wearing a mask but better safe than sorry I guess.

Also what face mask is best if you just dont want retards to bother you? I was thinking about those complience masks or mabye something with a message

 

[Govt. Shitposting Machine]

Also what face mask is best if you just dont want retards to bother you? I was thinking about those complience masks or mabye something with a message

Chiffon masks are pretty ok if you don't mind looking a little faggy, it's normal looking enough that Karens don't go up to your face and scream at you for not wearing the correct mask and still breathable enough that you're not passing out after walking for an hour because it's too hard to breathe.

 

[JosephStalin]

 

[Never Scored]

When it comes to masks the media is clearly lying by omission by saying that you get the same amount of oxygen when wearing a mask. While that is true they completely forget to mention that your breathing pattern changes while wearing one which is what makes face masks uncomfortable. are there any long term effects from having your breathing patterns disrupted like this? Im not a doomer who thinks he will get brain cancer from wearing a mask but better safe than sorry I guess.

Also what face mask is best if you just dont want retards to bother you? I was thinking about those complience masks or mabye something with a message

Get one with a Confederate flag.

 

[Super-Chevy454]

They'd be dead anyway, you'd just feel better about it.

Yeah because dead people vote democrat.

 

[Peace and Harmony]

Anyone who still believes that political leadership is among even the top ten variables regarding handling of coronavirus at this point needs to automatically recuse themselves from the conversation to avoid looking like an absolute fucking dumbass.

 

[Bosmadden]

Had another Skype call with my friend in Melbourne Australia.

TLDR Melbourne is the archetype for extreme lockdown policy. They've been in some form of lockdown since March, a very brief respite in June but then back to a batshit insane house arrest policy from July up until now.

Current situation is as follows. Melbourne is reporting 1-2 cases per day with zero deaths. (Yes you read that right). Government has announced a very slight easing of restrictions starting Monday. Instead of being restricted to travelling a max 2 miles from your home, citizens can now travel 10 miles. They can go out exercising whenever they want. Some sport is allowed, including golf and tennis. And um that's about it. Citizens still can't leave their homes unless it's for an approved reason (food shopping, work etc). Most businesses remain shut. Citizens will still be required to wear face masks at all times outside their home, citizens will still be required to carry their papers, including work permits to travel, and need to produce them when required by the police or army. Travel outside of Melbourne remains prohibited unless an approved work permit has been issued an roadblocks surround the city to monitor travel.

From the beginning of November, assuming there are zero cases, businesses will re-open in a "Covid safe" manner. This includes restaurants and cafes being restricted to a max of 10 inside and 20 outside (Melbourne is a slightly warmer version of Seattle, it rains a LOT, so good luck with the outdoor dining thing). Churches and other places of worship will remain closed indefinitely with a max of 20 people allowed to attend services as long as they're conducted in the car park. Weddings will be restricted to 10 people and funerals to 20. And so on. This is in a locality where there is essentially zero transmission occurring, let alone any kind of pandemic wave. Welcome to the new normal I guess.

 

[Elwood P. Dowd]

The cloud cuckoo land that is the NY Times attempts to show that up is down, black is white...and that wearing a mask should be referred to as "freedom." You can't make this stuff up.

https://archive.li/3kIAu

Opinion
There’s a Word for Why We Wear Masks, and Liberals Should Say It
It’s high time Democrats played some philosophical offense on the concept of “freedom.”

Michael Tomasky
By Michael Tomasky
Contributing Opinion Writer

Oct. 17, 2020


A Trump rally in Pennsylvania this month.
A Trump rally in Pennsylvania this month.Credit...Doug Mills/The New York Times
Donald Trump is now back on the road, holding rallies in battleground states. These events, with people behind the president wearing masks but most others not, look awfully irresponsible to most of us — some polls show that as many as 92 percent of Americans typically wear masks when they go out.

Trumpworld sees these things differently. Mike Pence articulated the view in the vice-presidential debate. “We’re about freedom and respecting the freedom of the American people,” Mr. Pence said. The topic at hand was the Sept. 26 super-spreader event in the Rose Garden to introduce Amy Coney Barrett as the president’s nominee for the Supreme Court and how the administration can expect Americans to follow safety guidelines that it has often ignored.

Kamala Harris countered that lying to the American people about the severity of the virus hardly counts as “respect.”

It was a pretty good riposte, but she fixed on the wrong word. She could have delivered a far more devastating response if she’d focused on the right word, one that the Democrats have not employed over the past several months.

The word I mean is “freedom.” One of the key authors of the Western concept of freedom is John Stuart Mill. In “On Liberty,” he wrote that liberty (or freedom) means “doing as we like, subject to such consequences as may follow, without impediment from our fellow creatures, as long as what we do does not harm them even though they should think our conduct foolish, perverse or wrong.”

Note the clause “as long as what we do does not harm them.” He tossed that in there almost as a given — indeed, it is a given. This is a standard definition of freedom, more colloquially expressed in the adage “Your freedom to do as you please with your fist ends where my jaw begins.”

Now, conservatives revere Mill. But today, in the age of the pandemic, Mill and other conservative heroes like John Locke would be aghast at the way the American right wing bandies about the word “freedom.”

Freedom emphatically does not include the freedom to get someone else sick. It does not include the freedom to refuse to wear a mask in the grocery store, sneeze on someone in the produce section and give him the virus. That’s not freedom for the person who is sneezed upon. For that person, the first person’s “freedom” means chains — potential illness and even perhaps a death sentence. No society can function on that definition of freedom.

Joe Biden does a pretty good job of talking about this. At a recent town hall in Miami, he said: “I view wearing this mask not so much protecting me, but as a patriotic responsibility. All the tough guys say, ‘Oh, I’m not wearing a mask, I’m not afraid.’ Well, be afraid for your husband, your wife, your son, your daughter, your neighbor, your co-worker. That’s who you’re protecting having this mask on, and it should be viewed as a patriotic duty, to protect those around you.”


That’s good, but it could be much better if he directly rebutted this insane definition of freedom that today’s right wing employs.

There are certain words in our political lexicon that “belong” to this side or the other. “Fairness” is a liberal word. You rarely hear conservatives talking about fairness. “Growth” is mostly a conservative word, sometimes the functional opposite of fairness in popular economic discourse, although liberals use it too, but often with a qualifier (“balanced” or “equitable” growth, for example).

“Freedom” belongs almost wholly to the right. They talk about it incessantly and insist on a link between economic freedom and political freedom, positing that the latter is impossible without the former. This was an animating principle of conservative economists in the 20th century like Ludwig von Mises, Friedrich Hayek and Milton Friedman.


ImagePresident Trump and supporters in Greenville, N.C., on Thursday.
President Trump and supporters in Greenville, N.C., on Thursday.Credit...Doug Mills/The New York Times
It’s manifest silliness. To be sure, when they were writing, it was true of a place like the Soviet Union. But it is not true of Western democracies. If they were correct, the Scandinavian nations, statist on economic questions, would have jails filled with political prisoners. If they were correct, advanced democratic countries that elected left-leaning governments would experience a simultaneous crushing of political freedom. History shows little to no incidence of this.

And yet, the broad left in America has let all this go unchallenged for decades, to the point that today’s right wing — and it is important to call it that and not conservative, which it is not — can defend spreading disease, potentially killing other people, as freedom. It is madness.

One thing Democrats in general aren’t very good at is defending their positions on the level of philosophical principle. This has happened because they’ve been on the philosophical defensive since Ronald Reagan came along. Well, it’s high time they played some philosophical offense, especially on an issue, wearing masks, on which every poll shows broad majorities supporting their view.

 

[Keystone]

@JosephStalin this you?