Inactive Nick Bate / Nickalaus B. Stoutzenberger (Thread 2: THE RECKONING)

[RecordStoreToughGuy]

Isn't it a week or something until hearing number 2?

Uh, with Nick you're probably hearing number 2 all the goddamn time.

I'll just see myself out thank you...

 

[DrJonesHat]

Legal Kiwis, share if you will what is likely to happen at Nick's preliminary hearing if it does indeed go forward, and why it might be waived.

I wonder how Nick's family has handled his incarceration. I wonder if his aunt has left his apartment alone in the vain belief he'll return. Or did she have the place stripped bare and completely remodeled? His mom probably thinks he's being railroaded and that they should have handled the matter "in the family" probably by praying about it a lot. I suspect Amber's dad is hoping Nick will plead out to spare Amber the trauma of having to relive the abuse at trial.

 

[RepQuest]

I appreciate the old-school reference, bu I'm not really seeing it, tbh.

Yeah, it'd have to be a lot neater, for one thing.

 

[AnOminous]

Legal Kiwis, share if you will what is likely to happen at Nick's preliminary hearing if it does indeed go forward, and why it might be waived.

I wonder how Nick's family has handled his incarceration. I wonder if his aunt has left his apartment alone in the vain belief he'll return. Or did she have the place stripped bare and completely remodeled? His mom probably thinks he's being railroaded and that they should have handled the matter "in the family" probably by praying about it a lot. I suspect Amber's dad is hoping Nick will plead out to spare Amber the trauma of having to relive the abuse at trial.

Nothing.

By nothing, I mean nothing of any great importance.

What will happen, if there is a hearing, is that the Commonwealth will present some small part of the evidence they will need to convict Nick. Perhaps an investigating officer or CPS person will testify as to their basis for arresting Nick. The DA will explain how the evidence establishes probable cause for the case existing. The judge will rule that probable cause does, in fact, exist.

Then the case will be sent to the Court of Common Pleas for Lancaster County, where the case will be tried, and subsequently, a calendar for future proceedings will be set. At this point, the Magistrate Judge will be done with the case and it will be assigned a docket number, etc.

This is a serious enough case that the defense might actually try to do some litigating at the preliminary hearing stage. This isn't out of any genuine likelihood that the case will be thrown out at this point, but especially when discovery in criminal proceedings isn't all that great, some defense lawyers will basically use the preliminary hearing as a way of getting the prosecution to lay out more of its case than they might want to.

That would at least give a roadmap for how the rest of the case would go, and give the defense enough information to know what to request in discovery, whether or not to file something called a motion in limine, which seeks to limit the scope of what evidence is allowed at trial, and otherwise to prepare for trial.

But I wouldn't expect that. Public defenders are overworked enough that devoting limited resources to what is usually a completely unwinnable hearing is rarely worth the candle.

So basically, what I expect is that the Commonwealth brings one or two witnesses, like a cop and/or the CPS person who did the investigation on Nick, they summarize their findings, and then it's bound over for trial. That or there isn't a preliminary hearing at all. Maybe Nick and his PD show up and waive it, or it just doesn't happen and goes straight to the Court of Common Pleas.

 

[LordCustos3]

I just can't wait to see Sick Nick get his ass tried....

Oh, I'm sure his cellmate has tried Nick's ass. Probably found it to be too loose and.....

oh....I'm sorry, you were talking about something else.
My bad.

I just can't wait to see Sick Nick get his ass tried and finally be convicted. That fucker deserves to be in prison for life.
Also, the fact that he is willing to tarnish food (esepcially cookies) with his filthy and probably shit-infused cum (considering his abysmal hygiene) is pretty fucked up and flat-out disgusting. All the more reason to keep that sick fuck locked up in prison.

Hopefully he never gets (whetever you'd call the prison equivalent of) KP Duty. Hopefully the prison staff knows about his....experimental cuisine techniques....and doesn't ever assign him to even clean up the kitchen, much less serve food to the other inmates.
I guess if we ever hear a news item about how an entire prison in Pennsylvania is suffering from a pandemic of e coli, we know which shit-stained orangutan to blame it on.

 

[derpi]

Is it really likely to be waived though? Surely Nick wants to (in his mind) get out of jail faster so presumably doing the hearing will make the whole process go by faster??

 

[AnOminous]

Is it really likely to be waived though? Surely Nick wants to (in his mind) get out of jail faster so presumably doing the hearing will make the whole process go by faster??

Something like 50 percent of these hearings are waived. I can't really say how likely it is in this case. After all, it's a set of very serious crimes carrying very serious penalties and lifetime registration as a sex offender. Short of murder, you don't get more serious. So I'd guess it's more likely than not there will be at least a pro forma hearing, and possibly something more.

 

[Trans Fat 41g]

All I know is Nick is going to have a lot of paint on his garage door if he's given anything easier than a cozy life in the pen.

 

[DrJonesHat]

@AnOminous, when would a plea be discussed? Now? After the prelim?

Unless his PD and aunt are very persuasive, I doubt Nick will take a plea, because in his mind he didn't do anything wrong. If it goes to trial and he's convicted on all counts, I seriously doubt the judge will show mercy. He'll probably get the maximum sentence since he's so unrepentant.

 

[AnOminous]

@AnOminous, when would a plea be discussed? Now? After the prelim?

Unless his PD and aunt are very persuasive, I doubt Nick will take a plea, because in his mind he didn't do anything wrong. If it goes to trial and he's convicted on all counts, I seriously doubt the judge will show mercy. He'll probably get the maximum sentence since he's so unrepentant.

Any time between now and the jury verdict.

Nick being recalcitrant depends on exactly how stupid he is. It's one thing for him to be a delusional moron on the Internet. It's entirely another after being bitchslapped hard by reality for a couple months. His circumstances might be hellish enough he'd want to get it over with and to wherever he's going for the next part of his life.

 

[DrJonesHat]

While a plea would mean Nick would get less time for his horrible actions, I kinda hope they manage to get through his thick skull that it's in his best interests to take any offered plea, but not for his sake. I just don't want Amber to have to suffer through giving testimony, and worst of all, being in the same room as her abuser.

Since she's a minor, would they let her give video testimony so she doesn't have to be near Nick? Or is that not done in Pennsylvania? I would hope they'd take steps to lessen her trauma.

 

[Bassomatic]

I may be wrong but I'm 95% sure they have that law passed in PA, last time judges were elected and the 45698450869 ads for them, one was championing their work on it but then again as all sane people I drown those ads out pretty hard.

Agreed hard, Nick will get a long time and what's coming to him, at this point, I want the easiest route for Amber. She's had it the hardest and let's be honest for Nick 30 years vs 40 won't offer a different result with that lack of hygine and poor health.

 

[AnOminous]

Since she's a minor, would they let her give video testimony so she doesn't have to be near Nick? Or is that not done in Pennsylvania? I would hope they'd take steps to lessen her trauma.

Yes. Pennsylvania has a statute allowing for such testimony (42 Pa. C.S. § 5984.1), which has been upheld as constitutional.

 

[DrJonesHat]

He probably still thinks he's going to get out of it. The psych report says he's not very connected to reality, so I'm sure in his mind he'll go to trial, be exonerated because of his shitplay video, and that'll be that. In reality, I'm sure the defense will try like mad to suppress that vid if the prosecution tries to introduce it, since it would immediately sway a jury against Nick. Since the evidence against him is pretty damming, the only reason a prosecutor might offer a plea is to spare Amber. He's so fucked he might as well plead guilty and gamble with the judge showing some small bit of mercy.

 

[Dudeofteenage]

He probably still thinks he's going to get out of it. The psych report says he's not very connected to reality, so I'm sure in his mind he'll go to trial, be exonerated because of his shitplay video, and that'll be that.

This has already been discussed, but: no. Nick is extremely paranoid and thinks random people are going to attack him on the street for no reason. He is likely to have a very realistic view of his prospects.

 

[DrJonesHat]

He may think he's going to get punished, but he won't understand why. In his mind he did nothing wrong. He knows other people think what he did is wrong, but he doesn't get why, he thinks he's in the right. I still think he thinks he may walk. He believes screaming "I didn't do anything!" absolves him of any responsibility no matter how much evidence there is to the contrary.

 

[Dudeofteenage]

He may think he's going to get punished, but he won't understand why. In his mind he did nothing wrong. He knows other people think what he did is wrong, but he doesn't get why, he thinks he's in the right. I still think he thinks he may walk. He believes screaming "I didn't do anything!" absolves him of any responsibility no matter how much evidence there is to the contrary.

He definitely believes that other people's hatred for him is without justification, but I don't think that means that he thinks that he'll be able to escape the consequences of their hatred. There's a very strong persistent thread throughout Nick's discussions of the way he relates to the world that he expects hostility from basically everybody. Remember the whole thing about how he's frightened a dentist would cut his throat?

It's been said that Nick's view actually ends up being realistic, because the behaviour he expects and believes is unjustified is actually the way that people would treat him if they realised he was a pedophile rapist. But even that isn't true - for all people like to posture in the armpits of the internet about how they would love to personally enact some kind of Cannibal Corpse-esque punishment on convicted pedophiles, very few of them would actually do it. And yet that is what Nick Bate expects just from walking around outdoors among strangers.

I can't claim to know what he is expecting from being part of the justice system. But the idea that he expects to be let free goes against basically everything we know about the way his brain 'works'*

*To the extent it can be said to 'work'.

 

[Corn Sake]

Knowing Sick Nick's logic, he'll plead not guilty because he'll be all "I DIDN'T DO ANYTHING!"; going to any means possible to prove his innocence and drag poor Amber through the sheer trauma of recounting everything in graphic detail what he did to her. Including how the defence will no doubt cross-examine her, it'll take a lot of time and help to pull through and move on with her life.

I really hope that Nick will do the very decent thing and plead guilty.

 

[DrJonesHat]

Good points, I had forgotten about the whole dentist phobia. He still thinks he's being treated unfairly, and he'll never fully understand that he's being punished justly for something he chose to do of his own free will.

I wonder how he's adapted to prison life. Probably not well. He's surrounded by other people, he's being told what to do constantly, and every minute of every day, he's being watched. Also, they've made him shower and shave, and won't let him smear shit on the walls. He's most likely abjectly miserable, or he's retreated so far into his own world that he's never coming out again.

 

[Dudeofteenage]

I really hope that Nick will do the very decent thing and plead guilty.

Surely from our p.o.v. we should hope he goes not guilty? A guilty plea is one of the only things that could conceivably count in his favour during sentencing.