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Here. This made me really feel sick and confused.

https://jme.bmj.com/content/46/11/743

"Forever young? The ethics of ongoing puberty suppression for non-binary adults" -

"Phoenix, 18, was assigned female at birth but has identified as gender non-binary (not entirely/exclusively male or female) since age 5. Phoenix uses they/them pronouns, has short hair and wears gender-neutral clothes. When Phoenix was 11, they began puberty and became extremely distressed by development of their breast buds and anxious about menstruation commencing soon. This prompted Phoenix and their parents to ask Phoenix’s paediatrician for puberty blockers to halt puberty and stop further pubertal development. At that time, Phoenix told their paediatrician they did not want to discontinue the use of such blockers in the future, as they did not want to go through any puberty. Given Phoenix’s severe distress, Phoenix’s paediatrician agreed puberty blockers should be given, but informed Phoenix and their parents he was not prepared to prescribe long-term puberty suppression, as this is riskier than short-term suppression. The paediatrician stated that, when Phoenix turned 16 and had a better sense of their gender identity, they would meet to discuss whether Phoenix wished to discontinue the puberty blockers and (1) revert to their endogenous (female) sex hormones or (2) commence testosterone.

When Phoenix turned 16, they informed their paediatrician that they did not want option (1) or (2). Rather, Phoenix was confident they would identify as non-binary for the rest of their life and wanted to stay on puberty blockers ‘forever’ to ensure their body remained in a ‘genderless’ state. Reluctantly, the paediatrician agreed to extend Phoenix’s time on blockers for another 2 years.

Recently, Phoenix entered the adult healthcare system and informed their new doctor that their desire to continue puberty suppression on an ongoing basis has not changed. Phoenix feels that remaining in an androgynous, peripubertal state is the only way that their body can truly reflect their non-binary gender identity. Phoenix, supported by their parents, has the financial means to pay for ongoing puberty suppression (OPS) (approximately $A5200 per year in Australia).

Phoenix does not have any underlying medical conditions which would specifically contraindicate hormonal intervention. Nevertheless, Phoenix’s new doctor feels that OPS is still too physically risky, especially with regard to bone health, and wonders if Phoenix has underlying psychological issues about not wanting to grow up.

Phoenix’s doctor refers Phoenix to a psychologist, who confirms that Phoenix continues to have significant distress about their body, similar in degree to that experienced by binary trans patients that the psychologist has seen. Phoenix has regular counselling with the psychologist, who judges that Phoenix’s distress is significant and enduring, and is not a symptom of an underlying psychopathology. The psychologist also reports that she does not see any signs that indicate Phoenix has a fear of growing up.

Phoenix tells the psychologist that they highly value having a body that matches their gender identity. Alternative options, including low-dose testosterone, menstrual suppression and future ‘top’ surgery, are unacceptable to Phoenix because they do not believe these alternatives would accurately reflect their non-binary gender identity.

Phoenix’s doctor and psychologist conduct a capacity assessment, and find Phoenix capable of consenting to OPS. The psychologist also verifies that Phoenix’s desire for OPS is long-standing, informed, voluntary and free from coercion.

Should Phoenix’s new doctor agree to prescribe puberty blockers for Phoenix to take on an ongoing basis?"

right, honestly this made me feel weird reading it. How the fuck would that benefit anyone to have no PUBERTY at all to be non binary? what in the fucking fuck?

I can understand (to a point) people switching gender. It's a bit far fetched, some are obvs pervs but isn't entirely stupid nor a perversion for some. BLOCKING PUBERTY FOR SOMEONES WHOLE LIFE? THE HECK. It's like some nazi experiment to breed children that never grow. I can't understand it.

I tap out, im done; This is the worst thing i have read. oml.
 
Here. This made me really feel sick and confused.

https://jme.bmj.com/content/46/11/743

"Forever young? The ethics of ongoing puberty suppression for non-binary adults" -

"Phoenix, 18, was assigned female at birth but has identified as gender non-binary (not entirely/exclusively male or female) since age 5. Phoenix uses they/them pronouns, has short hair and wears gender-neutral clothes. When Phoenix was 11, they began puberty and became extremely distressed by development of their breast buds and anxious about menstruation commencing soon. This prompted Phoenix and their parents to ask Phoenix’s paediatrician for puberty blockers to halt puberty and stop further pubertal development. At that time, Phoenix told their paediatrician they did not want to discontinue the use of such blockers in the future, as they did not want to go through any puberty. Given Phoenix’s severe distress, Phoenix’s paediatrician agreed puberty blockers should be given, but informed Phoenix and their parents he was not prepared to prescribe long-term puberty suppression, as this is riskier than short-term suppression. The paediatrician stated that, when Phoenix turned 16 and had a better sense of their gender identity, they would meet to discuss whether Phoenix wished to discontinue the puberty blockers and (1) revert to their endogenous (female) sex hormones or (2) commence testosterone.

When Phoenix turned 16, they informed their paediatrician that they did not want option (1) or (2). Rather, Phoenix was confident they would identify as non-binary for the rest of their life and wanted to stay on puberty blockers ‘forever’ to ensure their body remained in a ‘genderless’ state. Reluctantly, the paediatrician agreed to extend Phoenix’s time on blockers for another 2 years.

Recently, Phoenix entered the adult healthcare system and informed their new doctor that their desire to continue puberty suppression on an ongoing basis has not changed. Phoenix feels that remaining in an androgynous, peripubertal state is the only way that their body can truly reflect their non-binary gender identity. Phoenix, supported by their parents, has the financial means to pay for ongoing puberty suppression (OPS) (approximately $A5200 per year in Australia).

Phoenix does not have any underlying medical conditions which would specifically contraindicate hormonal intervention. Nevertheless, Phoenix’s new doctor feels that OPS is still too physically risky, especially with regard to bone health, and wonders if Phoenix has underlying psychological issues about not wanting to grow up.

Phoenix’s doctor refers Phoenix to a psychologist, who confirms that Phoenix continues to have significant distress about their body, similar in degree to that experienced by binary trans patients that the psychologist has seen. Phoenix has regular counselling with the psychologist, who judges that Phoenix’s distress is significant and enduring, and is not a symptom of an underlying psychopathology. The psychologist also reports that she does not see any signs that indicate Phoenix has a fear of growing up.

Phoenix tells the psychologist that they highly value having a body that matches their gender identity. Alternative options, including low-dose testosterone, menstrual suppression and future ‘top’ surgery, are unacceptable to Phoenix because they do not believe these alternatives would accurately reflect their non-binary gender identity.

Phoenix’s doctor and psychologist conduct a capacity assessment, and find Phoenix capable of consenting to OPS. The psychologist also verifies that Phoenix’s desire for OPS is long-standing, informed, voluntary and free from coercion.

Should Phoenix’s new doctor agree to prescribe puberty blockers for Phoenix to take on an ongoing basis?"

right, honestly this made me feel weird reading it. How the fuck would that benefit anyone to have no PUBERTY at all to be non binary? what in the fucking fuck?

I can understand (to a point) people switching gender. It's a bit far fetched, some are obvs pervs but isn't entirely stupid nor a perversion for some. BLOCKING PUBERTY FOR SOMEONES WHOLE LIFE? THE HECK. It's like some nazi experiment to breed children that never grow. I can't understand it.

I tap out, im done; This is the worst thing i have read. oml.
There is a huge elephant in the room gender loons won't adress:

There is NO drug called "puberty blockers". These drugs are gnrh agonists - which are mainly used as chemotherapy for cancer patients with HORRIFYING side effects. There are people who became disabled after using these drugs.



Side effects include: Bone thining, libido loss, bone pain, genital atrophy, memory loss, teeth problems and so on.

Gender loons pretend these drugs are harmless, save and reversible. Bullshit! They wreck your health and the longer you use them the worse it gets.

Everyone who gives healthy children these drugs is evil. No matter how much they pretend they do it for the poor gender confused kids. That's like "curing" a headache with decapitation. Little gender Snowflake doesn't know that she is going to spend the rest of her life in a wheelchair and/or in constant pain because the puberty blocking poison is going to ruin her bones and her health.

Gender Snowflakery has gone way too far.
 
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There is a huge elephant in the room gender loons wont adress:

There is NO drug called "puberty blockers". These drugs are gnrh agonists - which are mainly used ad chemotherapy for cancer patients with HORRIFYING side effects. There are people who became disabled after using these drugs.



Side effects include: Bone thining, libido loss, bone pain, genital atrophy, memory loss and so on.

Gender loons pretend these drugs are harmless, save and reversible. Bullshit! They wreck your health and the longer you use them the worse it get's.

Everyone who gives healthy children these drugs is evil. No matter how much they pretend they do it for the poor gender confused kids. That's like "curing" a headache with decapitation.
Even with cancer treatment there's harm but it's seen as needed to prevent death from cancer. Plus with cancer treatment it's time limited, not taken for years and even then it causes serious harm.

the fact some people see never going through puberty as a good thing indicates that there's people in the trans movement who're pedoes. I mean we knew that with Peter Tatchell being all over lowering age of consent, baws deep in the pedophile information exchange and totally into all of that.
 
Here. This made me really feel sick and confused.

https://jme.bmj.com/content/46/11/743

"Forever young? The ethics of ongoing puberty suppression for non-binary adults" -

"Phoenix, 18, was assigned female at birth but has identified as gender non-binary (not entirely/exclusively male or female) since age 5. Phoenix uses they/them pronouns, has short hair and wears gender-neutral clothes. When Phoenix was 11, they began puberty and became extremely distressed by development of their breast buds and anxious about menstruation commencing soon. This prompted Phoenix and their parents to ask Phoenix’s paediatrician for puberty blockers to halt puberty and stop further pubertal development. At that time, Phoenix told their paediatrician they did not want to discontinue the use of such blockers in the future, as they did not want to go through any puberty. Given Phoenix’s severe distress, Phoenix’s paediatrician agreed puberty blockers should be given, but informed Phoenix and their parents he was not prepared to prescribe long-term puberty suppression, as this is riskier than short-term suppression. The paediatrician stated that, when Phoenix turned 16 and had a better sense of their gender identity, they would meet to discuss whether Phoenix wished to discontinue the puberty blockers and (1) revert to their endogenous (female) sex hormones or (2) commence testosterone.

When Phoenix turned 16, they informed their paediatrician that they did not want option (1) or (2). Rather, Phoenix was confident they would identify as non-binary for the rest of their life and wanted to stay on puberty blockers ‘forever’ to ensure their body remained in a ‘genderless’ state. Reluctantly, the paediatrician agreed to extend Phoenix’s time on blockers for another 2 years.

Recently, Phoenix entered the adult healthcare system and informed their new doctor that their desire to continue puberty suppression on an ongoing basis has not changed. Phoenix feels that remaining in an androgynous, peripubertal state is the only way that their body can truly reflect their non-binary gender identity. Phoenix, supported by their parents, has the financial means to pay for ongoing puberty suppression (OPS) (approximately $A5200 per year in Australia).

Phoenix does not have any underlying medical conditions which would specifically contraindicate hormonal intervention. Nevertheless, Phoenix’s new doctor feels that OPS is still too physically risky, especially with regard to bone health, and wonders if Phoenix has underlying psychological issues about not wanting to grow up.

Phoenix’s doctor refers Phoenix to a psychologist, who confirms that Phoenix continues to have significant distress about their body, similar in degree to that experienced by binary trans patients that the psychologist has seen. Phoenix has regular counselling with the psychologist, who judges that Phoenix’s distress is significant and enduring, and is not a symptom of an underlying psychopathology. The psychologist also reports that she does not see any signs that indicate Phoenix has a fear of growing up.

Phoenix tells the psychologist that they highly value having a body that matches their gender identity. Alternative options, including low-dose testosterone, menstrual suppression and future ‘top’ surgery, are unacceptable to Phoenix because they do not believe these alternatives would accurately reflect their non-binary gender identity.

Phoenix’s doctor and psychologist conduct a capacity assessment, and find Phoenix capable of consenting to OPS. The psychologist also verifies that Phoenix’s desire for OPS is long-standing, informed, voluntary and free from coercion.

Should Phoenix’s new doctor agree to prescribe puberty blockers for Phoenix to take on an ongoing basis?"

right, honestly this made me feel weird reading it. How the fuck would that benefit anyone to have no PUBERTY at all to be non binary? what in the fucking fuck?

I can understand (to a point) people switching gender. It's a bit far fetched, some are obvs pervs but isn't entirely stupid nor a perversion for some. BLOCKING PUBERTY FOR SOMEONES WHOLE LIFE? THE HECK. It's like some nazi experiment to breed children that never grow. I can't understand it.

I tap out, im done; This is the worst thing i have read. oml.
People have talked in this thread and the GRS horrors one about the future health issues caused by blocking puberty temporarily. But forever? What slew of problems would that end up with?

It also makes me really ticked off, as someone growing up as a tomboy and having whatever hobbies or clothing I wanted to wear and being comfortable with it. Is it irrational of me? I legitimately don’t understand why non binary is a thing. Gender non conforming is perfectly fine if you just like stuff that doesn’t “fit” your sex. Be butch or dainty or androgynous or all of the above. You don’t have to (and literally cannot) nope out of the gender concept because you want to. It’s insulting to people as well (primarily women since 99% of envies I see are female) since it implies that they don’t want to be one at all. Anything but.

Edit: some other people have posted side effects. I don’t understand it. Either the doctors failed to explain anything, they (or the parents) failed to do any research themselves, or the individuals know and STILL go through with damaging procedures because ew, puberty is awful.
 
There is a huge elephant in the room gender loons wont adress:

There is NO drug called "puberty blockers". These drugs are gnrh agonists - which are mainly used ad chemotherapy for cancer patients with HORRIFYING side effects. There are people who became disabled after using these drugs.



Side effects include: Bone thining, libido loss, bone pain, genital atrophy, memory loss and so on.

Gender loons pretend these drugs are harmless, save and reversible. Bullshit! They wreck your health and the longer you use them the worse it get's.

Everyone who gives healthy children these drugs is evil. No matter how much they pretend they do it for the poor gender confused kids. That's like "curing" a headache with decapitation.


Imo. Didn't we have a study awhile ago in this thread that also expressed concerns that long term use of hormone blockers in younger people may actually mentally stunt you as well? Puberty isn't just body changes it's when your brain begins to develop into an adult brain because of those hormones. As well as the concern that there's a window for puberty that you may inadvertently close because your body is still aging even though you're stopping it from hormonally developing. So even if you change your mind and stop in your twenties your body might decide that no, you don't get a puberty. In which case you'd what? have to try to artificially induce it?

All those side effects in someone who hasn't even undergone puberty would arguably be worse; bone development halted, no libido developed, no development of genitals, lack of brain development.

It's like everyone thinks hormones are just some science word and they don't matter much beyond giving you some secondary sex characteristics but they literally govern every aspect of your growth.

There's no way this doesn't cause a spike in Dementia and Alzheimer's.
 
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Imo. Didn't we have a study awhile ago in this thread that also expressed concerns that long term use of hormone blockers in younger people may actually mentally stunt you as well? Puberty isn't just body changes it's when your brain begins to develop into an adult brain because of those hormones. As well as the concern that there's a window for puberty that you may inadvertently close because your body is still aging even though you're stopping it from hormonally developing. So even if you change your mind and stop in your twenties your body might decide that no, you don't a puberty. In which case you'd what? have to try to artificially induce it?

All those side effects in someone who hasn't even undergone puberty would arguably be worse; bone development halted, no libido developed, no development of genitals, lack of brain development.

It's like everyone thinks hormones are just some science word and they don't matter much beyond giving you some secondary sex characteristics but they literally govern every aspect of your growth.

There's no way this doesn't cause a spike in Dementia and Alzheimer's.

I remember it came up in the Jazz Jennings thread and there were studies that all basically indicated that blockers given to kids caused an IQ around 10 points lower than normal, in addition to the brain being stuck permanently at a preteen level of maturity, and all the behaviors and poor decision making that goes with it.
 
I remember it came up in the Jazz Jennings thread and there were studies that all basically indicated that blockers given to kids caused an IQ around 10 points lower than normal, in addition to the brain being stuck permanently at a preteen level of maturity, and all the behaviors and poor decision making that goes with it.
So, you could say that as long as someone remains on puberty blockers they cannot consent to sex... or to the puberty blockers themselves.
 
Here. This made me really feel sick and confused.

https://jme.bmj.com/content/46/11/743

"Forever young? The ethics of ongoing puberty suppression for non-binary adults" -

"Phoenix, 18, was assigned female at birth but has identified as gender non-binary (not entirely/exclusively male or female) since age 5. Phoenix uses they/them pronouns, has short hair and wears gender-neutral clothes. When Phoenix was 11, they began puberty and became extremely distressed by development of their breast buds and anxious about menstruation commencing soon. This prompted Phoenix and their parents to ask Phoenix’s paediatrician for puberty blockers to halt puberty and stop further pubertal development. At that time, Phoenix told their paediatrician they did not want to discontinue the use of such blockers in the future, as they did not want to go through any puberty. Given Phoenix’s severe distress, Phoenix’s paediatrician agreed puberty blockers should be given, but informed Phoenix and their parents he was not prepared to prescribe long-term puberty suppression, as this is riskier than short-term suppression. The paediatrician stated that, when Phoenix turned 16 and had a better sense of their gender identity, they would meet to discuss whether Phoenix wished to discontinue the puberty blockers and (1) revert to their endogenous (female) sex hormones or (2) commence testosterone.

When Phoenix turned 16, they informed their paediatrician that they did not want option (1) or (2). Rather, Phoenix was confident they would identify as non-binary for the rest of their life and wanted to stay on puberty blockers ‘forever’ to ensure their body remained in a ‘genderless’ state. Reluctantly, the paediatrician agreed to extend Phoenix’s time on blockers for another 2 years.

Recently, Phoenix entered the adult healthcare system and informed their new doctor that their desire to continue puberty suppression on an ongoing basis has not changed. Phoenix feels that remaining in an androgynous, peripubertal state is the only way that their body can truly reflect their non-binary gender identity. Phoenix, supported by their parents, has the financial means to pay for ongoing puberty suppression (OPS) (approximately $A5200 per year in Australia).

Phoenix does not have any underlying medical conditions which would specifically contraindicate hormonal intervention. Nevertheless, Phoenix’s new doctor feels that OPS is still too physically risky, especially with regard to bone health, and wonders if Phoenix has underlying psychological issues about not wanting to grow up.

Phoenix’s doctor refers Phoenix to a psychologist, who confirms that Phoenix continues to have significant distress about their body, similar in degree to that experienced by binary trans patients that the psychologist has seen. Phoenix has regular counselling with the psychologist, who judges that Phoenix’s distress is significant and enduring, and is not a symptom of an underlying psychopathology. The psychologist also reports that she does not see any signs that indicate Phoenix has a fear of growing up.

Phoenix tells the psychologist that they highly value having a body that matches their gender identity. Alternative options, including low-dose testosterone, menstrual suppression and future ‘top’ surgery, are unacceptable to Phoenix because they do not believe these alternatives would accurately reflect their non-binary gender identity.

Phoenix’s doctor and psychologist conduct a capacity assessment, and find Phoenix capable of consenting to OPS. The psychologist also verifies that Phoenix’s desire for OPS is long-standing, informed, voluntary and free from coercion.

Should Phoenix’s new doctor agree to prescribe puberty blockers for Phoenix to take on an ongoing basis?"

right, honestly this made me feel weird reading it. How the fuck would that benefit anyone to have no PUBERTY at all to be non binary? what in the fucking fuck?

I can understand (to a point) people switching gender. It's a bit far fetched, some are obvs pervs but isn't entirely stupid nor a perversion for some. BLOCKING PUBERTY FOR SOMEONES WHOLE LIFE? THE HECK. It's like some nazi experiment to breed children that never grow. I can't understand it.

I tap out, im done; This is the worst thing i have read. oml.
Her refusal to grow up is gonna get her killed at this rate. I doubt anyone is going to actually explain that to her and make sure she stops, and that sucks.
Phoenix, 18, was assigned female at birth but has identified as gender non-binary (not entirely/exclusively male or female) since age 5
Her parents especially are going to do nothing to help, since they're clearly the ones who got her into this mess to begin with.
 
What's I don't get do whatsover regarding Trans right is that what is the benefits to our society to give them free pass on everything? In the way other identies in liberal activism don't get to the same extent, not LGB and not racial minorities.

Because the most vocal troons are straight, white, middle class men.


62d1476fd1dbdb546f2aa7c4e278c4fa.jpg
 
Because the most vocal troons are straight, white, middle class men.


View attachment 1766499
Trooning out is the easiest way for people in that demographic to matter. If someone went on twitter and said "I'm a 35 year old white male, people must listen to me", they'd be universally condemned. However "I'm a 35 year old transwomen, everything must listen to me" gets applauded for bravery. There's no reason not to troon out, espcially when you don't need to take hrt or mutilate yourself.
 
Her refusal to grow up is gonna get her killed at this rate. I doubt anyone is going to actually explain that to her and make sure she stops, and that sucks.

Her parents especially are going to do nothing to help, since they're clearly the ones who got her into this mess to begin with.
This non-binary shit didn't really exist 13 years ago. It's most likely that she was molested/raped as a kid.
 
Two things:
1. The public by and large still thinks troon == extra gay and "transwoman" == dick chop, therefore "transwomen" are safe and can be allowed into women's restrooms.
2. Normal people don't want to mutilate their dicks or tits any more than healthy people want chemo, and they tend to not question why the money goes where it does. Once they're made aware that troons are getting free boob jobs, hair removals, hair transplants, face beautifications, and genital mutilation isn't actually a requirement, they'll want in on this. Why doesn't an ex-hambeast get free skin removal? Why doesn't a balding man get free hair plugs?

Yeah, the entire reason they’ve tried to demand nobody ask them about their genitals is that they rely on normies assuming “gender confirmation surgery” is the dick chop, even though we all know it rarely is. You are spot on - they assume trans women are the gayest of gays and all get their penis removed. Trannies are desperate to maintain this illusion.
 
Yeah, the entire reason they’ve tried to demand nobody ask them about their genitals is that they rely on normies assuming “gender confirmation surgery” is the dick chop, even though we all know it rarely is. You are spot on - they assume trans women are the gayest of gays and all get their penis removed. Trannies are desperate to maintain this illusion.
They also tend to picture dainty, effeminate men with no interest in women anyway, not not a 6'3" transbian with linebacker shoulders and a Buzz Lightyear chin. It's honestly funny when people try to argue "but how would you know if someone has a penis?" as if it isn't glaringly obvious 100% of the time. Even the likes of Blair White and Laverne Cox who are brought up as examples of passing troons don't hold up in candid shots or next to real women.
 
"Hello my fellow Discord degenerates, I've finally decidied to cut off my male genitalia, oh an don't forget to stay hydrated." A redditor by any other name..
It’s amazing how differently these people react depending on the context. Under most circumstances, saying “Hey guys. I’ve hated my body for a long time and decided I’ll feel better if I mutilate myself beyond repair” would be met with people urging you to get help.

But when you announce that it’s so you can become trans, these same people will throw themselves at your feet and shower you with compliments and tell you you’re so brave for coming out.
 
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