Diseased #Comicsgate - The Culture Wars Hit The Funny Books!

[cow-wannabe]

I am very happy and optimistic for CG's future, gents. Everything is really looking up and people need real escapist entertainment away from the corporate crap now more than ever. I know we're supposed to just complain about other people on here but big stuff is in the works on not just my front, but on a lot of others I'm hearing about as well.

I don't mean to be a profit of doom Jon, but do you really think you'll still be in CG in a years time? Give it six month and WC will be back in the fold (if they aren't already via back channels), new narratives of CG Lore will be writen, and 'undesirables' like you will be out on their ear.

(And please don't think I'm insulting you calling you 'undesirable', being undesirable to CG is something I think is quite virtuous.)

So my advice is to enjoy it while it lasts, but be ready to jump before you are pushed.

(Editied because I am illiterate.)

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

This is really good, JDA. It's fun to look at.

Tell your artist to be careful with the way he draws women though. From the waist down, that chick is a man, baby.

Congrats on the toys, watching your replay now and they are impressive. Will you be signing/dating the boxes for backers? That would be a nice touch to differentiate from those you sell on eBay but a big pain in the ass.

 

[TESTEFY-HD]

This was fun last night @FROG ! Thank you for mingling with the commoners!

 

[FROG]

Congrats on the toys, watching your replay now and they are impressive. Will you be signing/dating the boxes for backers? That would be a nice touch to differentiate from those you sell on eBay but a big pain in the ass.

View attachment 1928511

I don't think so...That'd be a hell of a project, signing thousands of huge boxes. I'll save my energy for REIGNBOW THE BRUTE. But thank you!

 

[Crescent Fresh]

I am very happy and optimistic for CG's future, gents. Everything is really looking up and people need real escapist entertainment away from the corporate crap now more than ever. I know we're supposed to just complain about other people on here but big stuff is in the works on not just my front, but on a lot of others I'm hearing about as well.

I don't mean to be a profit of doom Jon, but do you really think you'll still be in CG in a years time? Give it six month and WC will be back in the fold (if they aren't already via back channels), new narratives of CG Lore will be writen, and 'undesirables' like you will be out on their ear.

(And please don't think I'm insulting you calling you 'undesirable', being undesirable to CG is something I think is quite virtuous.)

So my advice is to enjoy it while it lasts, but be ready to jump before you are pushed.

(Editied because I am illiterate.)

Crowdfunded comics as a whole are certainly on the upswing, even if CG itself... isn’t. I know it’s basically all I bring up these days, however crowdfunded comics on Kickstarter are going through like a 75-80% or so success rate lately, which is genuinely pretty damn insane, and even a few percent up from last year.

CG, on the other hand, is permanently top-heavy, as many incredibly in-depth posts from Dongs and Frieza can attest to. It’s in a precarious position that can’t sustain smaller creators unless they’re also good YT personalities or already-famous names that can utilize their own existing audiences.

CG is going to wind up in probably about a year or so as some sort of brand name for like ten or so established creators with overpriced books, and an unrelated gaggle of like 50 unsuccessful crowdfunders a month all trying to ride on those coattails.

 

[NasserRabadi13]

CG, on the other hand, is permanently top-heavy,

I think it's like that for everything. Not everyone in CG needs to make the same amount.

There are reasons those people make the most, they have the most fans. More people are aware of them.

I couldnt tell you how many times a random video comes up in my feed from a smaller CG creator whose previous upload was a year ago--and if they arent constantly building that audience, theyll constantly be at the bottom. 1 video per year won't cut it.

 

[Crescent Fresh]

I think it's like that for everything. Not everyone in CG needs to make the same amount.

There are reasons those people make the most, they have the most fans. More people are aware of them.

I couldnt tell you how many times a random video comes up in my feed from a smaller CG creator whose previous upload was a year ago--and if they arent constantly building that audience, theyll constantly be at the bottom. 1 video per year won't cut it.

See, that’s my entire point with my constant KS shilling, though.

On there, you don’t even need to be good at YT as long as your book is, y’know, good. It’s just utterly insane to me that you have so many people acting like being a good YT personality is the only way to sell comics if you’re a smaller creator when there’s literally an alternative with so much more money overall flying around to smaller creators, that people in CG pretty much universally don’t use because of one mistake a now-fired person made like four years ago.

I’ve been looking at the projects ending soon and seeing so many full green bars on projects that have no real promotion anywhere, on YT or otherwise. They get a genuine boost from being actual quality products on a site with a far, far better way of searching for said actual quality products.

 

[Mister Dongs]

Crowdfunded comics as a whole are certainly on the upswing, even if CG itself... isn’t. I know it’s basically all I bring up these days, however crowdfunded comics on Kickstarter are going through like a 75-80% or so success rate lately, which is genuinely pretty damn insane, and even a few percent up from last year.

CG, on the other hand, is permanently top-heavy, as many incredibly in-depth posts from Dongs and Frieza can attest to.

There's nothing saying that Kickstarter is any different than CG in terms of inequal funding distribution. A 75-80% success rate is actually extremely low compared to Comicsgate projects (at least for now).

Right now the interesting thing (for me) is watching how this surge of two CG projects launching per day is turning out right now. @COMMI3 MARK had his stream and Jon Malin is getting an oar in each hand to tun back-to-back Comicsgate Presents programs, one for existing campaigns and another for pre-launch mailing lists (this one had 15 guests) is what's going to be interests. Overall the big winners though were the guests on Michael Bancroft's stream, Joe Catapano's polished looking cyberpunk debut project Star Circuit (which is at $6000) and Justin "Prof" Murphy of War Party putting out a line of $200 figurines.

ROCK N' ROLL NINJA if it follows the same trajectory as 499, will close at ~$61,000; barely more than PANdemIC despite being upgraded to a 100 page graphic novel.

 

[FROG]

See, that’s my entire point with my constant KS shilling, though.

On there, you don’t even need to be good at YT as long as your book is, y’know, good. It’s just utterly insane to me that you have so many people acting like being a good YT personality is the only way to sell comics if you’re a smaller creator when there’s literally an alternative with so much more money overall flying around to smaller creators, that people in CG pretty much universally don’t use because of one mistake a now-fired person made like four years ago.

I’ve been looking at the projects ending soon and seeing so many full green bars on projects that have no real promotion anywhere, on YT or otherwise. They get a genuine boost from being actual quality products on a site with a far, far better way of searching for said actual quality products.

I just looked at KickStarter, and examined the comics section using the filter Ending Date, and it's shit.

There doesn't seem to be "so much more money overall." People seem to be making about $3000 on average. There are a couple of exceptions, including a project ending this week by the CTRL ALT DELETE team, which has raised just shy of $100K, but they're all time crowdfunding record holders for their first set of reprints.

$3000 is nothing to sneeze at, but ComicsGaters routinely raise much more than that on IndieGoGo with few exceptions. IndieGoGo has been really good to ComicsGate. What's with this gaslit and gay push for CG to abandon them for the bluehairs at KS?

 

[Newman's Own]

$3000 is nothing to sneeze at, but ComicsGaters routinely raise much more than that on IndieGoGo with few exceptions. IndieGoGo has been really good to ComicsGate. What's with this gaslit and gay push for CG to abandon them for the bluehairs at KS?

Why not use both?

IGG doesn't bring the customers like KS does but CG faithful use IGG.

A smart creator would work to tap both kegs like your old friends Tim Lim and Doug TenNaple did.

People using KS should run second campaigns on IGG as well. Seems like a no-brainer really.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

I just looked at KickStarter, and examined the comics section using the filter Ending Date, and it's shit.

There doesn't seem to be "so much more money overall." People seem to be making about $3000 on average. There are a couple of exceptions, including a project ending this week by the CTRL ALT DELETE team, which has raised just shy of $100K, but they're all time crowdfunding record holders for their first set of reprints.

$3000 is nothing to sneeze at, but ComicsGaters routinely raise much more than that on IndieGoGo with few exceptions. IndieGoGo has been really good to ComicsGate. What's with this gaslit and gay push for CG to abandon them for the bluehairs at KS?

Who is pushing to abandon IGG? What's to lose by listing on both?

 

[Crescent Fresh]

There's nothing saying that Kickstarter is any different than CG in terms of inequual funding distribution. A 75-80% success rate is actually extremely low compared to Comicsgate projects (at least for now).

Right now the interesting thing (for me) is watching how this surge of two CG projects launching per day is turning out right now. @COMMI3 MARK had his stream and Jon Malin is getting an oar in each hand to tun back-to-back Comicsgate Presents programs, one for existing campaigns and another for pre-launch mailing lists (this one had 15 guests) is what's going to be interests. Overall the big winners though were the guests on Michael Bancroft's stream, Joe Catapano's polished looking cyberpunk debut project Star Circuit (which is at $6000) and Justin "Prof" Murphy of War Party putting out a line of $200 figurines.

ROCK N' ROLL NINJA if it follows the same trajectory as 499, will close at ~$61,000; barely more than PANdemIC despite being upgraded to a 100 page graphic novel.

“For now” being the operative words. Not sure where you’re getting the list you’re using for new CG projects(would genuinely like a link), however I’m using the slightly outdated CG tracker at ComicsGo, and even that shows that out of the current 2021 projects, about a third aren’t exactly looking too great. Only one is explicitly failed, however when you have projects with $2000 to raise in ten days, it’s looking particularly unlikely that a bunch of these make it.

I’ll readily admit, though, that the 2021 CG rate is better than IGG in general since that’s more along the lines of a coin flip, yet at the same time is worse overall than KS is right now.

I just looked at KickStarter, and examined the comics section using the filter Ending Date, and it's shit.

There doesn't seem to be "so much more money overall." People seem to be making about $3000 on average. There are a couple of exceptions, including a project ending this week by the CTRL ALT DELETE team, which has raised just shy of $100K, but they're all time crowdfunding record holders for their first set of reprints.

$3000 is nothing to sneeze at, but ComicsGaters routinely raise much more than that on IndieGoGo with few exceptions. IndieGoGo has been really good to ComicsGate. What's with this gaslit and gay push for CG to abandon them for the bluehairs at KS?

If this new project rate continues as it has lately, that $3000 average is going to practically seem like a... well, ALL CAPS campaign. You genuinely should be hoping that CG levels out soon and stays on the smaller end when it comes to project counts.

I genuinely don’t give a single shit about KS’ politics, it’s just the better service overall, with the capacity to handle an insane influx of small projects significantly better than the IGG/CG audience can.

Who is pushing to abandon IGG? What's to lose by listing on both?

Do this, just not at the same time. Run a campaign on one, then a second chance on the other. (Basically, copy the Tim Lim strategy as close as possible, with or without the patriotic fanservice.)

I’ve never said to abandon IGG, especially not for the larger creators, that’s their brand. I’m just constantly here saying that they handle smaller projects much better and CG needs to drop the stigma around it being against “the rules” or however people act towards it.

 

[cow-wannabe]

I think it's like that for everything. Not everyone in CG needs to make the same amount.

There are reasons those people make the most, they have the most fans. More people are aware of them.

I couldnt tell you how many times a random video comes up in my feed from a smaller CG creator whose previous upload was a year ago--and if they arent constantly building that audience, theyll constantly be at the bottom. 1 video per year won't cut it.

The problem is no one is building an audience, they're fighting for a share of a dwindling audience. Most streams are about CG drama or are filled with cliquey, self-referential jokes that don't do anything to draw anybody in. Most people in CG seem to think EVS invented indie comics, so it's not like you're going to pick-up people interested in discussing comics in general, worse the shilling makes streams look like a shopping channel presentation...and one for 'off brand' products at best.

The only way CG ever pulls in new people now is with new comics creators looking to get in on the grift, but who end up being like Ponzi investors not realizing the emperor has no clothes and so they spend-hard for exposure, and the trickle of non-comic reading culture-wars types who'll drop cash for a book they'll never read to 'own the libs', and lets be honest Doug is cleaning-up those types.

It's sad, because CG could have been great, a unified alternative to the mainstream & mainstream-indie comics, and instead it's become a pyramid scheme. This entire grow-your-channel BS is just that, BS. For all but the sharpest operator It's just a marketing trick to stop you realizing how bad a deal CG is for the little guys. You're constantly chasing subs rather than refining your craft, and to get the subs you either go into the chat of big streams, or talk about the big names, never realizing that most of the 'promoting' you're doing isn't benefiting you, it's just free shilling for the folks at the top.

 

[YesNoMaybe]

Maybe not everyone in life is cut out to be a comic book creator on a professional level. Or a YouTuber for that matter. This idea that Frog is supposed to promote on behalf of everyone else, I think its nonsense.

 

[SuiSui1]

@SaidNoOneEver It's easy to forget but Frog and his obiters consider KS haram for what it "did" to Yah boi when they rejected his application for a campaign on it. History that has become distorted over the years and live streams. And plus Indiegogo has something for Frog that is "sus"

considering Nasser whimpered and cried for a measly 5 - 10k cut and yet didn't get it even though the Brutus got 39k shows that 3k is not enough for a successful campaign. Between the artist, colorist, writer, letterer, shipping and fulfillment as well as Indie/KS getting their cut. You have to either have to have a competent person that knows how to handle a campaign or do it yourself for pennies on the dollar and hope that the backers are willing to wait for you.

This idea that Frog is supposed to promote on behalf of everyone else, I think its nonsense.

Here is the thing, he is doing that as a publisher for his buddy's "snowman" comic. Which puts that guy heads above any person that is just starting. As Frog stole all the knowledge from Dynamite, he knows where to print, where to ship and how to list. The only plus side is that Frog has his buddy under a contract which is a much better position than Nasser who is at the mercy of that cuck Donal.

Spoiler: But who can blame frog, he is the real victim here

Her tits are the size of blimps. And unless the guy is expecting to become a jew, getting a blow job from her would be torture. And you made a million $$$, Ethan, if you really are a victim, your father would have beaten you the red out of you. your jokes are pathetic.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

It's easy to forget but Frog and his obiters consider KS haram for what it "did" to Yah boi when they rejected his application for a campaign on it. History that has become distorted over the years and live streams. And plus Indiegogo has something for Frog that is "sus"

I didn't forget. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if Ya Boi listed a new campaign on KS tomorrow out of the blue if they let him. The worst-kept secret in CG is that Zack doesn't really give a shit about CG or its ideals. That was proven when he dropped the suit.

Here is the thing, he is doing that as a publisher for his buddy's "snowman" comic.

That's different, he's a partner on that and the Creed books. Publishing, promoting and fulfillment. The authors are basically the hired help: story development and art. The only reason to partner with them and have them appear on-stream at all is because they're already famous and can add draw to the audience.

I believe his recent push to advise the small-fry to build their own audience is a polite way of telling them to leave him alone already. Who can blame him?

 

[YesNoMaybe]

If you have creative talent, audience and a platform, working to max out your earning power seems like the only sensible thing in life. These arguments reminds me of the weirdos who think they should have a say in that Ninja guys streams.

As for YBZ, he is a stay in his lane kind of guy, given that mindset, its not surprising the lawsuit went up in smoke. I miss the days he was roasting those Iceman comics. Feel like he's fallen into this typecast deal and there's not much passion. Frog either has passion or is very good at faking it.

 

[Newman's Lovechild]

This idea that Frog is supposed to promote on behalf of everyone else, I think its nonsense.

I believe his recent push to advise the small-fry to build their own audience is a polite way of telling them to leave him alone already. Who can blame him?

He didn't exactly disabuse many of the notion and push the little guys away when his schtick was 'building a new industry', and his image as the toad who laid the golden eggs drew in the subs. So I can blame him some. I'd agree the about face was largely down to having to deal with the kind of personalities that make up the angry politicized nerd crowd, but also just a little bit dropping those people like a bored spoiled kid with an old toy.

Spoiler: But who can blame frog, he is the real victim here

View attachment 1929392
Her tits are the size of blimps. And unless the guy is expecting to become a jew, getting a blow job from her would be torture. And you made a million $$$, Ethan, if you really are a victim, your father would have beaten you the red out of you. your jokes are pathetic.

The Comicsgate thread just took a swerve towards the Deviantart Horrors thread. And the Furry Art Freakshow thread? You've been drawing animal-people too long, Ethan. Wasn't Doreen introduced as a fourteen year old girl? I don't know if they aged her up in the comics, but still, yeesh.

 

[A nameless trool]

The problem is no one is building an audience, they're fighting for a share of a dwindling audience. Most streams are about CG drama or are filled with cliquey, self-referential jokes that don't do anything to draw anybody in. Most people in CG seem to think EVS invented indie comics, so it's not like you're going to pick-up people interested in discussing comics in general, worse the shilling makes streams look like a shopping channel presentation...and one for 'off brand' products at best.

The only way CG ever pulls in new people now is with new comics creators looking to get in on the grift, but who end up being like Ponzi investors not realizing the emperor has no clothes and so they spend-hard for exposure, and the trickle of non-comic reading culture-wars types who'll drop cash for a book they'll never read to 'own the libs', and lets be honest Doug is cleaning-up those types.

It's sad, because CG could have been great, a unified alternative to the mainstream & mainstream-indie comics, and instead it's become a pyramid scheme. This entire grow-your-channel BS is just that, BS. For all but the sharpest operator It's just a marketing trick to stop you realizing how bad a deal CG is for the little guys. You're constantly chasing subs rather than refining your craft, and to get the subs you either go into the chat of big streams, or talk about the big names, never realizing that most of the 'promoting' you're doing isn't benefiting you, it's just free shilling for the folks at the top.

TLR with some extra clarifications:
Most CG creators are morons who can't make it as indie comics creators and are just playing a losing hand pursuing CG instead of sucking up to the big two, like they used to...

Edit: And they are the same types that used to be the people laughing at the tweets of Gail Simone and the rest of the twitter cows working on the comicbook industry, or showing their tits at Warren Ellis. Only difference is, this time they do get to get their comics out, so this is an upgrade.

 

[Smug Freiza]

I agree with @Crescent Fresh that a lot of these smaller creators probably should be using Kickstarter to access a wider pool of potential customers for a better chance of their books getting funded. Frog and the larger CG creators don't really need it because of the sheer size of customers who follow them to Indiegogo, but I must admit I'm curious to see how well Cyberfrog: Bloodhoney and Rekt Planet would do on Kickstarter given the results from Doug TenNapel and Tim Lim.

CreatorGo is an interesting resource and I must thank @Mister Dongs for not only pointing it out but informing us of all these projects currently funding.

FROM CREATORGO
​

Currently there are 34 Comicsgate projects listed, with 2 in-demand and 1 failed. CreatorGo is quite helpful in designating campaigns with "badges" which are almost like achievements for campaigns, similar to video games.

I will breakdown the campaigns into their following groups and add several other groups for analysis, at this time no campaigns can be considered Legendary, Amazing or a Home Run.

GREAT - Alien Alamo, GROKEN, CREED: Re-Imaginary, ROCK N ROLL NINJA, Supervillains Anonymous

All the campaigns above have hit the 25K mark and come from either established pros or large youtubers; Graham Nolan, Kenneth Rocafort, Trent Kaniuga/ALL CAPS COMICS, Richard C Meyer and Adam Friended respectively. Graham Nolan's Alien Alamo is in the top position with $46,640 raised from 737 backers with 7 days remaining. It's highly unlikely at this rate he will hit the Amazing badge (100K) but possible he might get a Home Run (1000 backers).

GOOD - Thomas Valiant, SeaDog and Codename Killswitch 2, Shadow of the Kraken, BONDS: The Drive, Star Circuit, X-Farce Reloaded, NOT DAREDEVIL UNIVERSE, The Rabbi From Another Planet, Wart the Wizard 2, Shotgun Samurai

Thomas Valiant leads the pack on $14,436 from 237 backers but is still 11K away from moving up into the Great category. We can see some familiar faces among these creators including:

• Graveyard Shift and USAssassin writer Mark Poulton with SeaDog and Codename Killswitch 2, which is performing less than great compared to it's first entry in the series.​
• Vinnie Tartamella with Shadow of the Kraken which is performing far worse than his previous two flagship campaigns City of Venus and Through the Woods.​
• Don Chin with X-Farce Reloaded, Chin was the creator of 1980s indie series Adolescent Radioactive Black Belt Hamsters.​
• Kiwifarms own @COMMI3 MARK with NOT DAREDEVIL UNIVERSE which is doing reasonably well compared to his previous crowdfunded campaign and stands a good chance of beating it in both backers and funds.​
• Resident Comicsgate e-thot Mandy Summers with her sequel book Wart the Wizard 2, which is massively underperforming the original Wart the Wizard campaign and her two subsequent books Super Dead and Pirate Queen.​

Summers and Tartamella seem screwed and I doubt they can grow on their previous projects, Mark Poulton might be able to pull it off but currently it appears doubtful and Commie Mark stands a good chance if he keeps promoting and gains access to non CGUK channels. Why Mandy Summers bothered to launch a sequel in the first place is beyond me, especially since Super Dead has the highest amount of backers and Pirate Queen earned the most money from all her campaigns. She should have just left Wart the Wizard as the curious oddity that got her foot in the door of Comicsgate and continued with those more successful properties.

GOOD IN-DEMAND - Tribulation Taskforce 1-3, Seeing Red: The Girl That Kissed Death #1

There's not really much to tell with the above campaigns except they both earned between $1545-$2188 from 47 and 48 backers respectively. I think the Tribulation Taskforce guy was called out by Micah Curtis over their characters being similar until Renfamous just laughed at them both, but I could be wrong.

A-OK - The Ace Vol 1, Thrilling Comics #1, Hybrids: The Killing Fields, Malevolent Rising #4

Again there's nothing really notable about the above books except for Warcampaign apologist Edwin Acevedo trying to sneak his way back into Comicsgate with "The Ace Volume 1" and Chuck Dixon and Sweetcast's collaboration on Thrilling Comics #1 which had previously failed to fund.

UNFUNDED - The Abductables 2, Automartyr #1, EVERMATTER: Conscript, Everlasting Survivors #1, The Tome of Reckoning, RAPTOR: The Preamble, Chateau Obsidian #3, Melvin #1, Albatross Junction Vol 1, Cross Comics Coloring Book, Kinetic, Pillowman and Blanket Boy 2nd Chance.

The only campaigns that stand a chance of being funded are The Abductables 2 (72% funded) and Automartyr #1 (86% funded) each with over two weeks remaining on their campaigns. The Abductables 2 is an interesting case as it features art from Ibai Canales (Iron Sights 1 &2) and the creator Michael Derrick was a staunch Warcampaign creator who appears to have come crawling back to Comicsgate. His last two projects The Abductables and Grayskale both funded, probably due to promotion on Warcampaigns streams but this latest campaign is struggling to find traction.

FAILED - The Current Plane Comic #1

Never heard of the guy or this campaign, not surprised it failed. Judging from the results of the unfunded category above, at least soon he'll be having company.

TLDR

​

Currently from 34 campaigns launched in CG2021 we have:

• 19/34 funded and continuing to fund (55%)
• 2/34 funded and in-demand (5.9%)
• 12/34 funding but remain unfunded (35.3%) with 10 of the 34 at serious risk of failing to fund (29.4%)
• 1/34 failing to fund (2.9%) which could be as high as 11 of 34 (32.3%) in several weeks.

Adding fuel to the fire is @Mister Dongs recent revelation that according to Jon Malin's latest Comicsgate Presents: Sign Up Edition stream there are a further 15 Comicsgate projects launching in the near future. One of the projects was Star Circuit which launched shortly after the stream.

This means within a few days/weeks there could be a further 14 entries on the CreatorGo website bringing the total Comicsgate books launched in the first two months of CG2021 to 48. This figure could also be incorrect as Comicsgate creators are required to register with the site and there could be more creators out there planning to launch without knowing the resource exists. Mid-tier creators like Mandy Summers and Vinnie Tartamella are definitely feeling the current squeeze, while the smaller creators are getting absolutely crushed under their own weight.

Even good looking first timer's like BONDS: The Drive, Shotgun Samurai and Automartyr #1 aren't performing as well as they should and others with a history of fulfillment like Michael Derrick are struggling to get funded. I would like to see the CG landscape in two months once all these campaigns have ended in-demand, if this glut will be followed by a vacuum of CG books. A wise creator following these trends must realize that obviously by postponing their launch by a few months would probably pay off in the long run, especially as big ticket books like Bladedevil, Cash Grab, Rekt Planet and Graveyard Shift 3 begin to start fulfillment.

Source: https://creatorgo.com/cg/2021/