Diseased #Comicsgate - The Culture Wars Hit The Funny Books!

[NasserRabadi13]

Symmetry, set ups, pay offs, call backs, Easter eggs and shit like that are much harder to work in that "seat of the pants style"

Not for me. I manage to set most of those up in the first draft, and sometimes add more in the second and third.

You are way smarter than all those successful writers who thought there might be something to learn in order to improve.

All I said was the way to improve is write a lot and read a lot. I don't know why you're triggered.

 

[Newman's Own]

All I said was the way to improve is write a lot and read a lot. I don't know why you're triggered.

Nasser you are awesome.

I've learned so much from watching you.

 

[Captain Manning]

In fairness to Nasser, King once said that you are a successful writer if you sell your book, and the check you're given for the sale doesn't bounce.

Some people might consider that a low bar, but there's some definite wisdom to it. Success is a gradient. Not binary.

 

[jspit2.0]

Only Indiegogo I ever refunded.

So it's bad to say the characters felt real?
Because he just wasn't drawing. Nobody draws slow or writes slow, they just aren't doing the work.

Ethan Van Sciver draws slow. Brian Bolland draws slow. JRJR and Mark Bagley draw fast. I can absolutely guarantee you that different artists both work and do so at different speeds.

Preston became a cow the moment Null linked to the cuck porn shit in Happenings. Preston then exacerbated things by getting into a public pissing match with Rekieta on Twitter. Among other idiocy, Preston tried to scare people into thinking the law had been broken (it's too much to recount in total, but he looked like a complete idiot).

I've said this before but, to my knowledge, that has been the only CG related thing (sorta) that has made it into Happenings.

It's not hard to see why. It's milk that the "everyman" Kiwi can digest. You don't need a complete history lesson on CG lore in order to appreciate it.

I dunno about Micah, but I will note there is a TGWG section on the site. They might consider him one independent of CG.

Meh. None of the CG e-thots on their own are cows. Except Liam Grey. What makes Ethan, Doug, and yes Preston cows is their involvement in CG and with each other.

 

[Stoneheart]

All I said was the way to improve is write a lot and read a lot. I don't know why you're triggered.

Reading alot is only useful if you read the right stuff...

A degree isn't necessary but some training helps. Look up your favorite writers on Wikipedia and tell me most of them didn't get some training aside from reading.

Going outside and doing stuff is much more important than training... The US is also the worst place to learn anything about writing. there is just one US writer worth his salt and most of his books are about Africa, Europe and the Cuba....

 

[Unverified]

What are people's thoughts on the $25 price point that tends to be the standard for CG books, sometimes regardless of length? Seems to me that a lot of creators just think that's what you can charge for your book, when in reality that price was set by people like Zack who were putting out larger books in their first foray into crowdfunding. I've definitely had some buyer's remorse over spending $20-25 (often with an additional $10 shipping) for basically one or two standard-length floppies. It could also be bottlenecking some campaigns that aren't getting much support. I also see some people adding ashcans to their campaigns and charging as much for the ashcan as they do for the main book, which is a huge turnoff for me.
Related question: do you think creators are uncomfortable to suggest to others that they should lower their price point, as that might make it sound as if their work isn't worth what they're asking for? Input from creators welcome.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

What are people's thoughts on the $25 price point that tends to be the standard for CG books, sometimes regardless of length? Seems to me that a lot of creators just think that's what you can charge for your book, when in reality that price was set by people like Zack who were putting out larger books in their first foray into crowdfunding. I've definitely had some buyer's remorse over spending $20-25 (often with an additional $10 shipping) for basically one or two standard-length floppies. It could also be bottlenecking some campaigns that aren't getting much support. I also see some people adding ashcans to their campaigns and charging as much for the ashcan as they do for the main book, which is a huge turnoff for me.
Related question: do you think creators are uncomfortable to suggest to others that they should lower their price point, as that might make it sound as if their work isn't worth what they're asking for? Input from creators welcome.

They'll remain at whatever price people will pay for them.

 

[Crescent Fresh]

What are people's thoughts on the $25 price point that tends to be the standard for CG books, sometimes regardless of length? Seems to me that a lot of creators just think that's what you can charge for your book, when in reality that price was set by people like Zack who were putting out larger books in their first foray into crowdfunding. I've definitely had some buyer's remorse over spending $20-25 (often with an additional $10 shipping) for basically one or two standard-length floppies. It could also be bottlenecking some campaigns that aren't getting much support. I also see some people adding ashcans to their campaigns and charging as much for the ashcan as they do for the main book, which is a huge turnoff for me.
Related question: do you think creators are uncomfortable to suggest to others that they should lower their price point, as that might make it sound as if their work isn't worth what they're asking for? Input from creators welcome.

As a backer generally uninterested in the “speculative market” side of things, little in CG has interested me.

Going by the old adage, “you can only have two out of three: good, cheap, or fast”, few creators in CG even have two. I’d be more than fine paying prices like $25 if the books turned around within weeks, however that effectively just never happens in CG, with books taking months to a year to finally ship out to backers, and on top of that many ongoing series don’t have the option to purchase the entire series except for insanely-priced, very-limited bundles. If I could pay $40-60 to get the three Jawbreakers books, I absolutely would, I’m genuinely interested in those. Due to that whole “enforced rarity” thing common in CG, though, that option is long, long gone, so I’m more likely to not buy the third book at all.

 

[jspit2.0]

What are people's thoughts on the $25 price point that tends to be the standard for CG books, sometimes regardless of length? Seems to me that a lot of creators just think that's what you can charge for your book, when in reality that price was set by people like Zack who were putting out larger books in their first foray into crowdfunding. I've definitely had some buyer's remorse over spending $20-25 (often with an additional $10 shipping) for basically one or two standard-length floppies. It could also be bottlenecking some campaigns that aren't getting much support. I also see some people adding ashcans to their campaigns and charging as much for the ashcan as they do for the main book, which is a huge turnoff for me.
Related question: do you think creators are uncomfortable to suggest to others that they should lower their price point, as that might make it sound as if their work isn't worth what they're asking for? Input from creators welcome.

I've brought up my opinion before.

*Most CG books are ridiculously over priced. Moreover, they clump content together to justify higher prices.

*Despite this, pay piggies will pay for these projects at current prices.

*If they will, why would you charge less?

 

[Brother Maynard]

I take it all back Nasser. That's great advice. ("On Writing" must be a short book...)

It's only half a page. 'Read a lot, write a lot.' And a special thanks to everyone who taught him everything he's not telling you to do.

 

[cow-wannabe]

Yep, I knew that was exactly where it was going. I don't need to "workshop" a short story and get feedback from 6 other losers.

Don't do down workshops and creative writing courses, they can provide invaluable feedback about what works and what doesn't, and they give you great insight into how to hit the right emotional notes, as you can see it in people's faces when you are gripping or boring them.

It's also good to connect with other writers, and you can learn lots from people with radically different interests to yourself. You become familiar with working in different genres, which in turn broadens the canvas of your own favoured genre. Working through exercises is also really good for getting your brain working in radical directions, whilst building discipline, with activities like being given a random photo to write about, or rewrite a story from a completly different POV.

These workshops give you new tools for your writers toolbox, whilst helping to hone the ones you already have.

 

[NasserRabadi13]

What are people's thoughts on the $25 price point that tends to be the standard for CG books, sometimes regardless of length? Seems to me that a lot of creators just think that's what you can charge for your book, when in reality that price was set by people like Zack who were putting out larger books in their first foray into crowdfunding. I've definitely had some buyer's remorse over spending $20-25 (often with an additional $10 shipping) for basically one or two standard-length floppies. It could also be bottlenecking some campaigns that aren't getting much support. I also see some people adding ashcans to their campaigns and charging as much for the ashcan as they do for the main book, which is a huge turnoff for me.
Related question: do you think creators are uncomfortable to suggest to others that they should lower their price point, as that might make it sound as if their work isn't worth what they're asking for? Input from creators welcome.

I think some people that are newer and haven't done this before might charge a lot because they want to be "safe" and know they have enough. I like to keep my price point low--even with Trixie, 2 of our 4 variants could be purchased for $15 with free shipping, since it'll bring in more backers.

Some people need to charge more because the value you're getting. Cyberfrog comes with 60 pages of top tier art, high end paper, and a chrome cover, and that's just the book. You get all sorts of extras, and I think even at the lowest tier (correct me if I'm wrong) on Cyberfrog 2, you get a toy with the book too. So when you're giving so many things more than just the book, you'll need more money.

I'd for the books to be more affordable, but sometimes $25 + $10 shipping is what it needs to be.

They'll remain at whatever price people will pay for them.

True.

 

[Unverified]

As a backer generally uninterested in the “speculative market” side of things, little in CG has interested me.

Going by the old adage, “you can only have two out of three: good, cheap, or fast”, few creators in CG even have two. I’d be more than fine paying prices like $25 if the books turned around within weeks, however that effectively just never happens in CG, with books taking months to a year to finally ship out to backers, and on top of that many ongoing series don’t have the option to purchase the entire series except for insanely-priced, very-limited bundles. If I could pay $40-60 to get the three Jawbreakers books, I absolutely would, I’m genuinely interested in those. Due to that whole “enforced rarity” thing common in CG, though, that option is long, long gone, so I’m more likely to not buy the third book at all.

I believe Zack has mentioned that he'll be running a third printing of Lost Souls pretty soon. I imagine he'll add a bundle option with the other two books, as Grand Bizarre should be out soon. Not sure though. I completely agree with the enforced rarity thing; Malin's model is especially retarded in that regard. People should either leave their campaigns in demand while they have overstock or follow Ethan's eBay practice.

Related: I backed Brand: Way of the Gun, but at the time that I backed, there wasn't a perk that included the first book. That was added much later, but only as a bundle. Didn't feel like rearranging shit since it was beyond IGG's refund window and from my experience, Antonio is horrible at dealing with customers and with taking criticism in general. Plus he and Canaan put Way of the Gun on hold to do that absolute joke of a book with Daym Drops, so it's unlikely I'll be backing him again.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

Did Zack join the Klan?

 

[FROG]

What are people's thoughts on the $25 price point that tends to be the standard for CG books, sometimes regardless of length? Seems to me that a lot of creators just think that's what you can charge for your book, when in reality that price was set by people like Zack who were putting out larger books in their first foray into crowdfunding. I've definitely had some buyer's remorse over spending $20-25 (often with an additional $10 shipping) for basically one or two standard-length floppies. It could also be bottlenecking some campaigns that aren't getting much support. I also see some people adding ashcans to their campaigns and charging as much for the ashcan as they do for the main book, which is a huge turnoff for me.
Related question: do you think creators are uncomfortable to suggest to others that they should lower their price point, as that might make it sound as if their work isn't worth what they're asking for? Input from creators welcome.

No, 90% of these books are overpriced.

Mine aren't.

 

[Rupin]

Ethan Van Sciver draws slow. Brian Bolland draws slow. JRJR and Mark Bagley draw fast. I can absolutely guarantee you that different artists both work and do so at different speeds.



Meh. None of the CG e-thots on their own are cows. Except Liam Grey. What makes Ethan, Doug, and yes Preston cows is their involvement in CG and with each other.

i think of Ethan and Doug as Rat Kings. Preston is a definite cow though.

 

[Absurdity]

The weird criticism from people here who previously had insulting caricatures of me for their avatar, people who have been obsessed with me for 3 years now, seems so personal and angry that it's not worth listening to. It's creepy projection, demanding that people make excuses for enjoying my work...It's not going to age well, either.

The reality is that people are having fun with CyberFrog. They're collecting the comics, trading cards and merch. They're producing amazing fan art. They're chasing rare old books. It all seems like a good time, which is mostly what I set out to create when I aligned with ComicsGate.

Oh you mean this one?

Or was it this one?

And by "people" you mean me? And by "obsessed with you for 3 years" you mean posting pointed criticism on Kiwi Farms and nowhere else for 10 months? And by "creepy projection" you refer to me actually giving your fans an opportunity to voice their positive opinion about your work?

What a cool story, Frog!

I don't think Ethan really fits the criteria of being a lolcow and is more kiwi than some users would be willing to admit. Other than wearing some outrageous outfits from time to time, he doesn't really exhibit any lolcow behavior.

Comicsgate really doesn't have as many true lolcows as Weeb Wars or other parts of the site; other than Liam Gray, Sketch Therapy and several of the Warcampaigners.

I'd even argue Micah Curtis isn't really a lolcow, just a fat idiot.

Ethan is a true werecow. A wolf in cow's clothing. A man who discreetly searches for gay fetish gear online, yet is married. An artist for the people, as long as people are for the artist. Only under certain conditions will he transform, but he is just self aware enough to pull himself back in when he begins to see a net negative effect. He does a metric ton of damage control and for the most part is able to maintain the core of his fandom. Lolcows become very rigid and even defiant the more they become exposed for who they are and will keep doubling down until their reputations are reduced to a gurgling mixture of stupidity, horror, degeneracy, malice and pride. Lolcows want to be accepted for who they think they are, werecows are content for having a calculated approximation stand in for them as long as it passes for the real thing.

Ethan is much more high functioning and while not a lolcow, he does thinly veil his true self image through Cyberfrog. It is my unprofessional non-industry insider opinion that "Cyberfrog" is the amalgamation of all the things lurking in Ethan's closet space. Not a terrible comic on the surface, though a less original version of TMNT, Battletoads, and that other slimy creature given superhuman abilities from otherworldy robotic enhancements... He's gone out of his way to personally identify with the character so it's his own fault that I can only draw parallels to an ugly useless animal given a talent from above (or below as it were) in order to win a sense of belonging and family he never had. Unfortunately for everyone involved, frogs eat their own too.

I love the fact that I'm one of those people he can't manipulate into liking him with his talent, his money, his throat-puffs, or his insistence of always being maligned or misunderstood when he gets criticized. He's been fed his own recycled propaganda many times over and he doesn't like it when his cycle of self delusion occasionally gets challenged or disrupted. But the mad cow in him must recede back to the forced laughter of Uncle E. As long as he manages to keep his dopey YouTube persona going (and his rendering skills afloat), people will find something to like in Cyberfrog. But like ill-fated siamese twins joined at the intestines: when one shits the other speaks.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

Liam livestreaming with Ro Kabir. Now joking about his funny pickup line "I'm good at sex and have money." He wants to print up shirts with it. Ro claims to have no idea what he's talking about.

So much for being 'honeypotted'.

 

[TheCosmicWarrior]

What are people's thoughts on the $25 price point that tends to be the standard for CG books, sometimes regardless of length? Seems to me that a lot of creators just think that's what you can charge for your book, when in reality that price was set by people like Zack who were putting out larger books in their first foray into crowdfunding. I've definitely had some buyer's remorse over spending $20-25 (often with an additional $10 shipping) for basically one or two standard-length floppies. It could also be bottlenecking some campaigns that aren't getting much support. I also see some people adding ashcans to their campaigns and charging as much for the ashcan as they do for the main book, which is a huge turnoff for me.
Related question: do you think creators are uncomfortable to suggest to others that they should lower their price point, as that might make it sound as if their work isn't worth what they're asking for? Input from creators welcome.

I've experimented with this.

Did $25 and 66-pages to give a little more value than the 48 pagers out there.

Did $20 for a 50 pager.

Done $10 for a 22 pager.

I also offer digital levels at "normal comic prices." Most marvel DC book single issues are $3.99 for 22 pages. so I try to do increments of this (66 pages = $12).

What I've found is frankly that price differential doesn't make any difference at all in backing.

 

[WhimsicalTrolli]

What are people's thoughts on the $25 price point that tends to be the standard for CG books, sometimes regardless of length?

Ethan and Zack done it first and everyone copied. Ethan's prices seems justifiable because of his 27/28 career in the comics industry but it doesn't make sense for books like wart the wizard and cashgrab be 25, even 15 is pushing it.

Did Zack join the Klan?

View attachment 1953275

No...thats been his icon since day 1 I think it's a image character but holy shit...did he lose subscribers?

@FROG nice pfp update.