Star Wars Griefing Thread (SPOILERS) - Safety off

Ita a weird double edged sword. The sequel trilogy characters are quite possibly the worst characters and yes I'm counting them worse than Jar Jar. However the mando characters are amazing.
I'm looking forward to Bad Batch and Ashoka ngl. Probably in the minority tho
 
Iger renewed Kennedy's contract after what- Last Jedi? Solo? Either one of those was significantly worse to the brand than the current kerfuffles, especially with the benefit of hindsight. My odds are on her staying at least through her contract. There won't be a housecleaning until a replacement head comes in who is at odds with the status quo at LFL. At that point, expect everyone (outside of ILM) to be moved/replaced from the Bay Area to soCal in order to be more tightly subsumed into the Disney corporate Empire.
You need to purge the entire upper echelons at this rate too, since it's not just the CEO of MouseCorp that's fucking shit up in it.
 
The problem I can see with it relates to the fact that post O66 the Commando units were supposed to be hunting Jedi so Bad Batch are technically the villians in the Star Wars universe as they're technically supposed to be Imperial at that point. This is an interesting take but I don't see Filoni keeping it going and giving us a unique 'take'. I see him doing whatever he can bring Ahsoka into play and make the Bad Batch 'good guys'.
The premise of the show is that the Bad Batch is taking on "daring mercenary missions" in the aftermath of the Clone Wars, so we're not going to see them working for the Empire.
 
Post-Palpatine Emperors in legends weren't that impressive either. Two I can recall were fraud Trioculus and fatboy Carivus, then nobody aimed for the title for years.
Carnor Jax aimed for the title of Emperor, and he was a good threat. So was Galak Fyyar, who openly stated that he wanted to rule the "New Empire".

I would actually posit that Kylo Ren is one of the worst characters in Star Wars history, as well as the uncontested candidate for the one I hate. Some may scoff, arguing that characters like Vice Admiral Holdo or Rose Tico are patently worse, but I would disagree.

Kylo Ren, to me, embodies all of the ST's worst problems. He's an aimless, underwritten character whose edgy animu conflict is shouted at the audience through maudlin exposition instead of being shown to them, and whose motives are practically non-existent. Ancillary writers for the comics and novels have had to write mountains of material to explain this character because his on-screen incarnation is so shallowly-written and paper-thin, that we as viewers have virtually no idea what drives this character, or what supposed "trauma" he's been through. It's as if the writers just expect us to care about him simply because of him being the offspring of characters we care about, and they can simply ride on that investment without having to try hard to write him well. As a result, this character lives and dies on whatever feeble exposition is thrown about him feeling isolated and alone, and Adam Driver quivering his lip like a constipated child at regular intervals. All of his struggle exists off-screen, through things that have happened to him that we didn't witness. Snoke manipulating him through the womb, being neglected by his parents, being the troubled student at Luke's academy...we aren't shown any of this, and yet we're inexplicably expected to care because we're told about it. It's telling instead of showing of the worst kind, implemented to the character whose redemption is the supposed emotional focal point of this new trilogy from the beginning, instead of being a surprise late-game goal like Vader's.

And this wouldn't piss me off as much if the story didn't bend itself five ways to Sunday trying to not only get the audience to feel sorry for him, but justify him as some kind of fucking victim. These writers want me to feel sorry for some emotionally-turbulent manbaby, who throws a diaper-shitting tantrum if someone so much as looks at him funny. And not content with framing the trilogy's tragic undercurrent around this insufferable cunt, they actually wrote the OT Heroes completely out-of-character in order to narratively accommodate him. Han and Leia are suddenly awful parents, with Leia being a business-first workaholic and Han being a neglectful asshole who walks out at the first sign of trouble and regressing back to his selfish smuggler self. And Luke? Well, he exercises the restraint, patience and understanding to work and train with every other student at his Academy, but when he has trouble with Crylo and senses a potential vision of what he might do, he relapses into the impulsive idiot he was during ESB, the kid who reacts to visions too quickly and acts without thinking....all to absolve little baby Kylo of any blame, and make his actions and Dark Side Turn the fault of other people.

Now, I'm not married to the OT or its characters like a lot of other people are, but I know fanfic levels of hamfisted character insertion when I see it, and Kylo stinks of it like a Reylo stinks of cat litter and boxed wine. The way this character is written is like the misguided tween author on FF.Net or Wattpad who really, really wants their edgy self-insert OC to be some kind of tragic victim, so they write all of the prestablished characters like abusive assholes--bending them out of character--in order to elevate their character. Or they'll force their ship into reality by breaking up existing couples, and forcing together couples without any sort of in-universe justification. These type of writers do this because they're so creatively inept, that they can't find a way to organically accomodate their ideas, so they just whimsically break canon to satisfy their creative impulses. It's the glaring mark of a misguided fanfic author, and it's on full display anytime Kylo is on-screen.

And what the writers don't even realize with their exhaustive attempts to trace Kylo's growth and origins to other people exclusively--neglectful parents, abusive uncle, an evil Sith filling his head with false voices of Vader--is that they've unintentionally created a villain with no agency. This character has no real motives or actions of his own, at least not ones that can't be attributed to other characters being mean to him or remotely manipulating him, a la Palpatine. He doesn't have the obsession with attachment that drives Anakin, or even the closed-off philisophical sense of martyrdom that Jacen has. They put events into motion, and have sole-ownership of their actions and goals. But Kylo? This stupid raging incel just accelerates to different points of the story because of the whims of other characters--because Mommy and Daddy didn't pay enough attention to him, or because Darth Vader told him to in his head, or because Rey finally brushed hands with him. He's driven solely by the actions of other people, and has virtually no character agency as a result. The story splits itself in half to create forced drama around him that doesn't come about by his hand, but by the way other characters treat him. By what his current Dark Side Master tells him to do, or whether or not Rey rejects his advances.

Ultimately, Kylo Ren is little more than an object of forced, vapid drama that came at the cost of not only the entire emotional subplot of the new films, but the integrity of the pre-established characters. The writers wanted so badly for the audience to care about this sniveling cretin that they actively downgraded existing characters to placate his navel-gazing self-victimhood, to make him some kind of "pOoR aNd mIsUnDeRsToOd" ornament of Tumblr landwhales. And by doing so, he helped open the franchise up to the narrative sensibilities of woobifying harlequin romance, with all of the pants-shittingly retarded romance writing and abusive undertones inherent to that genre...spawning the loudest, most insufferable kind of Star Wars autism in the form of Reylo's, who are the uncontested rock-bottom of the fandom.

Nothing, and I repeat, nothing good came from the creation of Crylo. If I have a seething hatred for any focused part of the ST, it's for this abortion of a character...for what he did to the story, and the fandom blight he brought to the franchise.
And the worst part about it was, Kylo Ren just took a plot point from the old EU that was already hated-AND MANAGED TO MAKE IT WORSE. Say what you will about Darth Caedus, but he still carried the GRAVITAS and the motivations that would make for a good Sith villain. Kylo Ren is Darth Caedus, except they stripped away any meaningful motivations and the power that a full-blooded Skywalker on the Dark Side would regularly have. Kylo should have been the kind of monster that can outstrip both Vader and the Emperor, since like Anakin, he has that blood with the OP midichlorian count, but unlike Vader, he's not a paraplegic cripple. Shit, he should be at least up to Plagueis' level, which is why Caedus was such a threat. Instead, he can't even beat some random girl who hasn't gotten a lick of training her whole life, and he gets yeeted by a guy who isn't even as powerful in the Force as his granddad was in EP3.

This is an ongoing problem across a lot of media though and I guess it's marketing in an attempt to catch that 'age group'. Just like the characters they've got in the High Republic who're all talented and powerful teenagers, some 15 year old knight? LoL. Same with a lot of other media in recent years. Like that The 100 show. It falls flat because teenagers are idiots, handing them positions of massive power when they've barely lived is recipe for disaster. In this case it's even more egregious because Hux was a stand in for Tarkin's character who had all the cold menace and presence required for a guy with that amount of power. His Vader analog being Kylo just made it that much worse.

They should have gone full space hitler with a guy who had more charisma, and age, instead of an angry ginger child throwing his own tantrums.
At most, a 15-year-old should be a Padawan, nothing more. Knighthood is for adults.

Hux had none of Tarkin's sinister charm or cold strength. Tarkin could boss Vader around and Vader would take it. Hux couldn't keep Kylo Ren in line. He just came off as some angry ginger boy throwing a temper tantrum instead of a charismatic military leader.
 
Carnor Jax aimed for the title of Emperor, and he was a good threat.
Not the greatest leader you can imagine... He himself caused a situation where a non-Force sensitive man killed him in one-on-one combat, so: arrogant and unskilled.
So was Galak Fyyar, who openly stated that he wanted to rule the "New Empire".
Fyyar was a subordinate to Desann (an alien, so not very imperial). And many more Remnant military leaders wanted to rule the Empire (Thrawn, Pellaeon, Daala, Zsinj just to name few) without claiming the title.
 
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Ita a weird double edged sword. The sequel trilogy characters are quite possibly the worst characters and yes I'm counting them worse than Jar Jar. However the mando characters are amazing.
I'm looking forward to Bad Batch and Ashoka ngl. Probably in the minority tho
I disagree, they all suck. Mando characters are kind of bland (not to mention the sect the show focuses on are religious fanatics). I only enjoyed Carl Weathers playing Carl Weathers.
 
Not the greatest leader you can imagine... He himself caused a situation where a non-Force sensitive man killed him in one-on-one combat, so: arrogant and unskilled.
Said man was a Royal Guard, they were trained to kill Force-sensitives, after all.
Fyyar was a subordinate to Desann (an alien, so not very imperial). And many more Remnant military leaders wanted to rule the Empire (Thrawn, Pellaeon, Daala, Zsinj just to name few) without claiming the title.
Fyyar voiced the desire to rule the Empire, and those others would have claimed the throne had they succeeded. Also, Desann needed Fyyar's resources, so it was more along the lines of a partnership between the two like Tarkin and Vader.

Also, we did have the Fel Emperors and Darth Krayt down the line. And they succeeded where Palpatine failed when they destroyed the Alliance once and for all, leaving nothing but a puny military junta in exile led by some admiral.

but that's outrageous! it's unfair! how can you be a 15-year-old in the High Republic and NOT be a Jedi Knight?!?
TAKE A SEAT, PADAWAN.
 
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Said man was a Royal Guard, they were trained to kill Force-sensitives, after all.
True, but Jax was the same age and possesed the same training. Additionally he was trained in the ways of the Sith by Lumiya (who was not a bad master judging by how far Caedus went under her training). Still he fell in a duel against someone who only had Royal Guard training. He was a good schemer to sabotage the clones on Byss, I give him that, but that's not enough to make one an Emperor.
Fyyar voiced the desire to rule the Empire, and those others would have claimed the throne had they succeeded. Also, Desann needed Fyyar's resources, so it was more along the lines of a partnership between the two like Tarkin and Vader.
When Daala needed resources she offed most of Remnant warlords and took those resources (and wasted them, but that's another story). Pellaeon had every chance to declare himself the Emperor when signing Bastion Accords to give the document more meaning or after that, as someone who brought peace to the Empire and pretty much runned the show, yet he never did.
I would guess if Fyyar and Desann managed to grow their organization they would turn on each other due to conflicting visions of the Empire. Fyyar would probably push for more militarized government, Desann for a kind of quasi-theocracy ruled by his enchanced Force users.
Also, we did have the Fel Emperors and Darth Krayt down the line. And they succeeded where Palpatine failed when they destroyed the Alliance once and for all, leaving nothing but a puny military junta in exile led by some admiral.
Jagged Fel claimed the title out of political necessity. Roan Fel didn't want the war and only got pushed to it by his Moffs and the Sith, showing how weak he was as the Emperor. While Krayt's ability to scheme and gain followers and bending others to his will was impressive, he had no long-term plans for his Empire in case he's gone so entire organization crumbled soon after his death, mostly destroyed by one of his own followers.

As a side note I would like to point out we're being slightly autistic here :)
 
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Yes, we are being a tad bit autistic here. But my point is that these warlord remnants actually tried to scavenge the old Empire instead of running away and forming their own faux-empire with none of the good and all of the bad.
Then in the old continuity Palpatine planned to return and rule again. In the new one he gave order to burn everything to the ground for no reason so there wasn't much to build on.
 
Then in the old continuity Palpatine planned to return and rule again. In the new one he gave order to burn everything to the ground for no reason so there wasn't much to build on.
The old Palpatine actually tried to build something that he thought would be beneficial to the people of the galaxy as a whole. Granted, he was a genocidal psychopath, but he still sought to benefit the galaxy one way or another. New Palpatine is truly a nutcase, burning down worlds that were loyal to him just because he died, even though he plans to return, whereas the old Palpatine had planned to return and made plans to ensure that the Empire will still be there when he gets back.
 
The old Palpatine actually tried to build something that he thought would be beneficial to the people of the galaxy as a whole. Granted, he was a genocidal psychopath, but he still sought to benefit the galaxy one way or another. New Palpatine is truly a nutcase, burning down worlds that were loyal to him just because he died, even though he plans to return, whereas the old Palpatine had planned to return and made plans to ensure that the Empire will still be there when he gets back.
I think the only way to explain it is to move to out-of-the-universe perspective. They started post-Endor era without a solid plan, they had Wendig's books, the first movie and improvised from there. With too many contributors to the story and without Leland Chee to keep the continuity straight it just all fell apart by the end.
 
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