Avatar: The Last Airbender / The Legend of Korra

[Shield Breaker]

Hope you guys are ready

‘Avatar: The Last Airbender’ is returning with its original creators

 

[Chilson]

Hope you guys are ready

‘Avatar: The Last Airbender’ is returning with its original creators

Well pack it in for more LOK-esque garbage.

 

[biscuitscilia]

Have either Bryan or Mike ever expressed interest in HxH? The only anime I’ve ever heard them cite directly as inspiration is Miyazaki films, so I just always figured that the pro-bending side plot was because tournament arcs are such a cliche staple to generic shonen at this point.

I'm pretty sure Bryke were dorky otakus around the 90s/2000s and probably heard of it that way. Though it is a stretch if anything, the tournament storyline in HxH is an example of how to make something like that work.

But yeah, from everything I gathered a lot of the actual world-building (or at least the heavy lifting to make the world-building connect meaningfully to the story/characters/themes) was done by the writing, art, and consultant teams and Bryke had little to do with this process (according to the commentary they spent very little time in the writing room’s brainstorming sessions) and their own process mostly throwing cool images they’ve seen/found together into a blender and chasing whatever aesthetic or isolated concept happened to tickle their fancy that week. By the time they got to LoK they were kinda “over” the martial art based bending system and Eastern mythos/philosophy/culture that served as the basis for ATLA, which was ultimately to LoK’s detriment considering it was replaced with a more generic system & Korra not being spiritual was supposed to be the first season’s whole thing.

Bryan and Mike seem more interested in the socio-political aspects of the world of Avatar but were never character-driven guys. Even the praise for Korra (specifically Book 3) is usually focused on the political aspects of the show, but never the characterization. Ehasz was the guy for that, he really had foresight in how these storylines were going and how to flesh it out over the series. Him being head writer and co-producer was a god-send. Even Dragon Prince does characterization much better than Korra. But sadly, I think the main issue with Dragon Prince is that it's kind of a bland, even generic, fantasy world without a clear narrative drive. Which I actually think was an accident in Bryke's case with ATLA. I don't think Ehasz is much of a world builder, or at least, he needed a better premise for Dragon Prince.
I think it would've been cool if Ehasz and Bryan and Mike created their own studio and made "spiritual successors" to Avatar instead of direct continuations. I think Dragon Prince could've actually benefited from Bryke's touch (if only a little.)

 

[Prophetic Spirit]

I couldn't get enough of Avatar.

I was hoping to like LOK just as much, but I gave up after 5 episodes.

I tried, I really did.

I'm gonna be honest, i was a kid when i saw the cartoon (13 years old); and i really dev a crush on Korra & Asami. Lin, Kya, Varrick & Tenzin are my favorite secondary characters.
Same year Yakuza 4 got released in Western. And boy, i really wished the same phase of the game in the cartoon; S1 was boring; i really wished a long fight scenario in that season, since Amon had actually a good point. But we're got only a tournament without a real plot, shit amorous triangle relationships and inconsistency as fuck, even with the ending with that off-screen double kill.
Just the year when S4 was over, Yakuza 5 appears the year later. That game really fullfilled my wish of writing something epic & wonderful. And rethinking of how TLOK was in previous seasons, something in my soul was "awaken", so to speak.
Probably the last words i said are meaningless in my youth, but builded something important in my mind in that time; i really want a world with elements but pretty hand-to-hand based. I don't like how TLOK was retconned the fight thing (i watched ATLA one year before), even as a kid i encounter flaws with those details, and more feedbacking with this thread.
The thing is... i always wondering if a creation based mainly by the Avatar franchise & Ryu Ga Gotoku (Yakuza) franchise could be work, and that's my propositon in a novel i'm writing on (the same shit i said since i'm here in the forum).

TL;DR I really like TLOK when i was a kid. When i grow up, only liked the entire base, since the execution was good-to-bad. Yakuza & Avatar (in general) franchise helped me to create a novel.

I really wanted to say this guys.

 

[One Man Bland]

Bryan and Mike seem more interested in the socio-political aspects of the world of Avatar but were never character-driven guys. Even the praise for Korra (specifically Book 3) is usually focused on the political aspects of the show, but never the characterization. Ehasz was the guy for that, he really had foresight in how these storylines were going and how to flesh it out over the series. Him being head writer and co-producer was a god-send. Even Dragon Prince does characterization much better than Korra. But sadly, I think the main issue with Dragon Prince is that it's kind of a bland, even generic, fantasy world without a clear narrative drive. Which I actually think was an accident in Bryke's case with ATLA. I don't think Ehasz is much of a world builder, or at least, he needed a better premise for Dragon Prince.
I think it would've been cool if Ehasz and Bryan and Mike created their own studio and made "spiritual successors" to Avatar instead of direct continuations. I think Dragon Prince could've actually benefited from Bryke's touch (if only a little.)

Which is funny, since I don’t think Bryan or Mike are particularly because the socio-political aspects precisely because their approach to characterization is so shallow. There’s this one interview from last year with them about Korra where they were asked if they had any opinion about how the first season of LoK puts a new light on Aang’s choice with Ozai in the finale, since he is indirectly responsible for the origin of Amon/the equalizers and Amon’s doing the pretty much the same thing as Aang, and their response was basically “Well no you see it’s different because Aang’s actions are good because he’s good, and Amon is bad so what he does is bad.”

I agree that a lot that holds back The Dragon Prince is the setting itself, while often sporting some great locals and designs, is flat by comparison. I still think at least part of this is because of time constraints, and possibly that Ehasz’s true interest is the post-war stuff so he barreled through seasons 1-3 like a battering ram, but that does little to change the fact that most of TDP’s fantasy world has been little more than window dressing and there was often so much plot happening at once it could feel like you would be tested on it later, that made getting to the points where Ehasz’s characteribg writing kicked in difficult. But I can’t say I’m impressed with some of the individual world building of Bryan and Mike either, given their non-Avatar solo projects were a “girl power furries with mechs” comic that was never published, and a book series about Renaissance artists having superpowers activated by His Dark Material-esque animal familiars (the characters at one point even journey to find an artifact called The Golden Compass) and controlled by FMA-style transmutation circles that turns into 100 pages of Mike fellating himself over how much more special artists are compared to the rest of the non-artistic plebs.

And I wouldn’t hold your breath on Bryke ever letting Ehasz near anything Avatar-related, or any collaboration with them, ever again. For whatever reason Bryke seem to have some sort of beef with Ehasz, because over the years they’ve made it a point to stop acknowledging Ehasz’s contributions to their story - they had an event for the finale’s 10 year anniversary where they talked about the writing for the episodes they penned, but when it came to the finale episode written by Ehasz they only talked about the animation and the Lion Turtle - that they don’t even credit him for writing/fleshing out Zuko and Iroh anymore. Made even weirder by how the feeling doesn’t seem to be mutual considering Ehasz has complimented them and LoK on several occasions.

 

[Chilson]

And I wouldn’t hold your breath on Bryke ever letting Ehasz near anything Avatar-related, or any collaboration with them, ever again. For whatever reason Bryke seem to have some sort of beef with Ehasz, because over the years they’ve made it a point to stop acknowledging Ehasz’s contributions to their story - they had an event for the finale’s 10 year anniversary where they talked about the writing for the episodes they penned, but when it came to the finale episode written by Ehasz they only talked about the animation and the Lion Turtle - that they don’t even credit him for writing/fleshing out Zuko and Iroh anymore. Made even weirder by how the feeling doesn’t seem to be mutual considering Ehasz has complimented them and LoK on several occasions.

I think its just base jealously and Bryke's massive insecurity about their own lack of skill. You have to remember, these guys were held up as the REASON ATLA was so good by the fandom who basically spent a decade felating them over it.

They got fat heads off it and it has only been since LOK, where all their faults are put on display for the entire fandom, that more people have begun to realize how important Ehasz was to the writing. Probably moreso than Bryke to be quite honest. This probably pissed the now massively egotistic duo off and now Ehasz has become persona non grata to protect those massive ego's they developed.

 

[starborn427614]

Dragon Prince was one of those shows where I always planned to watch it, but when the time came there were just other, more interesting things to watch instead.

 

[madethistocomment]

As much as I really wanted to, I could never get into Dragon Prince because of the choppy-ass animation in the first season. It was distracting and legit gave me a headache to watch. My friends tell me it's a pretty decent show, but having to sit through an entire season's worth of 8 fps animation is pretty solidly holding me back.

 

[starborn427614]

Info on new stuff "coming soon" according to IGN

https://twitter.com/IGN/status/1372956297042259971

 

[starborn427614]

Apologies for the double post, but new news and all that jazz. Janet Varney (Korra's VA) said she's been involved in a Nickelodeon project that'll be announced soon.

https://twitter.com/thecartooncrave/status/1380579503865466885

 

[Yamma Damma]

Hope you guys are ready

‘Avatar: The Last Airbender’ is returning with its original creators

"Original Creators" is what scares me. Bryan and Mike were given some control over ATLA and it was something special. They got full control over LoK and it laid an egg then sucked it. If they don't bring back their tardwranglers as well as these two idea guys then nothing they do will be worth more than one watch. If that.

 

[HumanHive]

Dragon Prince was one of those shows where I always planned to watch it, but when the time came there were just other, more interesting things to watch instead.

As much as I really wanted to, I could never get into Dragon Prince because of the choppy-ass animation in the first season. It was distracting and legit gave me a headache to watch. My friends tell me it's a pretty decent show, but having to sit through an entire season's worth of 8 fps animation is pretty solidly holding me back.

Dragon Prince is aggressively “okay”. I would not call it good, I would not call it bad; but... it really feels like someone’s D&D campaign. Huge gaps in worldbuilding, brief sparks of uniquely grey morality for a kids show, reasonably entertaining characters.

It is what it is. Comparing it to ATLA is a disservice, it has neither the budget nor the worldbuilding to reach its level; but it is still watchable as an adult.

 

[starborn427614]

Here we go... https://avatarnews.co/post/648651929980960768/a-new-original-series-will-stream-exclusively

Don't get too excited though, it's a Youtube channel thing. Probably just some shorts.

Edit:
Turns out I was right. It's just a series of fan-led discussion videos. Might include some VA's, not sure. https://twitter.com/MKatwood/status/1383250911040995328

 

[Juan's Sombrero]

Given how Toph in the final season gives a whole speech about how the moral of LoK is about how all the villains (including Amon) made good points and it was just their actions that were wrong, and a lot of statements outside the show by Bryke, the intent was always that the nonbenders/equalists were people with legitimate grievances led astray by one guy.

A lot of that got muddled in Bryke slapping together ideas and everything they thought looked cool without regard for the actual setting. Hence how you get inherent contradictions like the show telling you that benders are the supposed ruling class despite most of the reoccurring non-benders being wealthy (and one being based on Henry Ford) while the most of benders characters are poor.

That's what always bothered me. Mako and Bolin were literally given examples of how benders weren't that high up on the food chain and that Class seemed to be the deciding factor of privilege. Once you start to actually think about this entire "equality" hoopla, this little number comes up.

"Why the hell is this millionaire whining about how much a bunch of street rats have it better than him?"

One good subplot would have been to show how full of baloney the Equalists were when it would be shown that benders aren't that well off, that they have to do what amounts to hard labor through their bending and that many of the more prominent figures in the city are mostly non-benders. But, no, this is the era of social justice. Can't have more nuance or gray writing.

 

[The Great Chandler]

That's what always bothered me. Mako and Bolin were literally given examples of how benders weren't that high up on the food chain and that Class seemed to be the deciding factor of privilege. Once you start to actually think about this entire "equality" hoopla, this little number comes up.

"Why the hell is this millionaire whining about how much a bunch of street rats have it better than him?"

One good subplot would have been to show how full of baloney the Equalists were when it would be shown that benders aren't that well off, that they have to do what amounts to hard labor through their bending and that many of the more prominent figures in the city are mostly non-benders. But, no, this is the era of social justice. Can't have more nuance or gray writing.

Are you saying that race bending is not the real issue and that it's actually class inequality? You can't just say that!

 

[Random Internet Person]

 

[Gar For Archer]

That's what always bothered me. Mako and Bolin were literally given examples of how benders weren't that high up on the food chain and that Class seemed to be the deciding factor of privilege. Once you start to actually think about this entire "equality" hoopla, this little number comes up.

"Why the hell is this millionaire whining about how much a bunch of street rats have it better than him?"

One good subplot would have been to show how full of baloney the Equalists were when it would be shown that benders aren't that well off, that they have to do what amounts to hard labor through their bending and that many of the more prominent figures in the city are mostly non-benders. But, no, this is the era of social justice. Can't have more nuance or gray writing.

If we do a realistic analysis of “what if post-industrial society but some minority of the population has specific elemental manipulation abilities”, it doesn’t make much sense for benders to be inherently high up in society. In ATLA, pretty much all of the benders we see outside of the royal families are soldiers and guards because bending is a primarily offensive, physical ability. With regards to high-paying, skilled labor, non-benders have no inherent disadvantage, because being a bender has no correlation to your ability to be a lawyer or an engineer. If anything they’d be more pigeonholed into blue-collar work, because why pay a normal plumber when a water bending plumber can literally bend the clog out of your drain? Why pay a construction team to lay your foundation when an earthbender can get it done on their own in a tenth of the time?

 

[cactus]

If we do a realistic analysis of “what if post-industrial society but some minority of the population has specific elemental manipulation abilities”, it doesn’t make much sense for benders to be inherently high up in society. In ATLA, pretty much all of the benders we see outside of the royal families are soldiers and guards because bending is a primarily offensive, physical ability. With regards to high-paying, skilled labor, non-benders have no inherent disadvantage, because being a bender has no correlation to your ability to be a lawyer or an engineer. If anything they’d be more pigeonholed into blue-collar work, because why pay a normal plumber when a water bending plumber can literally bend the clog out of your drain? Why pay a construction team to lay your foundation when an earthbender can get it done on their own in a tenth of the time?

Yeah, maybe if the earth or water bender were stupid enough to do that to themselves. They don't have inherent knowledge for that stuff, they still have to train.

 

[Los Pollos Hermanos]

If we do a realistic analysis of “what if post-industrial society but some minority of the population has specific elemental manipulation abilities”, it doesn’t make much sense for benders to be inherently high up in society. In ATLA, pretty much all of the benders we see outside of the royal families are soldiers and guards because bending is a primarily offensive, physical ability. With regards to high-paying, skilled labor, non-benders have no inherent disadvantage, because being a bender has no correlation to your ability to be a lawyer or an engineer. If anything they’d be more pigeonholed into blue-collar work, because why pay a normal plumber when a water bending plumber can literally bend the clog out of your drain? Why pay a construction team to lay your foundation when an earthbender can get it done on their own in a tenth of the time?

On the other hand, the fire benders control the majority (totality?) of the electrical grid in Republic City. If they ever banded together and said "Pay us more money, give us control of the electric company, or the lights will never work again!", what option would anyone have but to give in? Even if you went in and busted heads, they're still the only ones that can lightning-bend to actually make the energy.

Similarly, every building in the city is subject to the random whims of any passing earth bender, since brick and steel are their specialities and on a drunken dare any 3 idiots could knock down half a city block before they're taken out.

Its a schizophrenic mix of "Benders are uber-powerful" and "Benders are treated as wage-slaves and struggle to survive" and both statements can't be true.

lets not even get into how fucking retarded it is that there even ARE enough lightning benders to do this, given how insanely difficult it is to get into the state of mind needed to channel the electricity

 

[Chilson]

On the other hand, the fire benders control the majority (totality?) of the electrical grid in Republic City. If they ever banded together and said "Pay us more money, give us control of the electric company, or the lights will never work again!", what option would anyone have but to give in? Even if you went in and busted heads, they're still the only ones that can lightning-bend to actually make the energy.

Similarly, every building in the city is subject to the random whims of any passing earth bender, since brick and steel are their specialities and on a drunken dare any 3 idiots could knock down half a city block before they're taken out.

Its a schizophrenic mix of "Benders are uber-powerful" and "Benders are treated as wage-slaves and struggle to survive" and both statements can't be true.

lets not even get into how fucking retarded it is that there even ARE enough lightning benders to do this, given how insanely difficult it is to get into the state of mind needed to channel the electricity

Yeah, LOK is bad and Bryke are absolute hackfrauds who got lucky to work with the team they had during ATLA. Its pretty much an implicit reality you have to accept entering this thread.