Biden Administration Urges Supreme Court To Let Cops Enter Homes And Seize Guns Without A Warrant - They're not coming for your guns and you still have The Constitution.

Article: https://www.forbes.com/sites/nicksi...seize-guns-without-a-warrant/?sh=6663072a2829
Archive: https://archive.is/Yr8ND


The U.S. Supreme Court on Wednesday will hear oral argument in Caniglia v. Strom, a case that could have sweeping consequences for policing, due process, and mental health, with the Biden Administration and attorneys general from nine states urging the High Court to uphold warrantless gun confiscation. But what would ultimately become a major Fourth Amendment case began with an elderly couple’s spat over a coffee mug.

In August 2015, 68-year-old Edward Caniglia joked to Kim, his wife of 22 years, that he didn’t use a certain coffee mug after his brother-in-law had used it because he “might catch a case of dishonesty.” That quip quickly spiraled into an hour-long argument. Growing exhausted from the bickering, Edward stormed into his bedroom, grabbed an unloaded handgun, and put it on the kitchen table in front of his wife. With a flair for the dramatic, he then asked: “Why don’t you just shoot me and get me out of my misery?”

Perhaps unsurprisingly, the tactic backfired and the two continued to argue. Eventually, Edward took a drive to cool off. But when he returned, their argument flared up once again. This time, Kim decided to leave the house and spend the night at a motel. The next day, Kim phoned home. No answer.

Worried, she called the police in Cranston, Rhode Island and asked them to perform a “well check” on her husband and to escort her home. When they arrived, officers spoke with Edward on the back deck. According to an incident report, he “seemed normal,” “was calm for the most part,” and even said “he would never commit suicide.”

However, none of the officers had asked Edward any questions about the factors relating to his risk of suicide, risk of violence, or prior misuse of firearms. (Edward had no criminal record and no history of violence or self-harm.) In fact, one of the officers later admitted he “did not consult any specific psychological or psychiatric criteria” or medical professionals for his decisions that day.

Still, police were convinced that Edward could hurt himself and insisted he head to a local hospital for a psychiatric evaluation. After refusing and insisting that his mental health wasn’t their business, Edward agreed only after police (falsely) promised they wouldn’t seize his guns while he was gone.

Compounding the dishonesty, police then told Kim that Edward had consented to the confiscation. Believing the seizures were approved by her husband, Kim led the officers to the two handguns the couple owned, which were promptly seized. Even though Edward was immediately discharged from the hospital, police only returned the firearms after he filed a civil rights lawsuit against them.

Critically, when police seized the guns, they didn’t claim it was an emergency or to prevent imminent danger. Instead, the officers argued their actions were a form of “community caretaking,” a narrow exception to the Fourth Amendment’s warrant requirement.

First created by the Supreme Court nearly 50 years ago, the community caretaking exception was designed for cases involving impounded cars and highway safety, on the grounds that police are often called to car accidents to remove nuisances like inoperable vehicles on public roads.

Both a district and appellate court upheld the seizures as “reasonable” under the community caretaking exception. In deciding Caniglia’s case, the First Circuit U.S. Court of Appeals acknowledged that “the doctrine’s reach outside the motor vehicle context is ill-defined.” Nevertheless, the court decided to extend that doctrine to cover private homes, ruling that the officers “did not exceed the proper province of their community caretaking responsibilities.”

Siding with law enforcement, the First Circuit noted that a police officer “must act as a master of all emergencies, who is ‘expected to...provide an infinite variety of services to preserve and protect community safety.’” By letting police operate without a warrant, the community caretaking exception is “designed to give police elbow room to take appropriate action,” the court added.

In their opening brief for the Supreme Court, attorneys for Caniglia warned that “extending the community caretaking exception to homes would be anathema to the Fourth Amendment” because it “would grant police a blank check to intrude upon the home.”

That fear is not unwarranted. In jurisdictions that have extended the community caretaking exception to homes, “everything from loud music to leaky pipes have been used to justify warrantless invasion of the home,” a joint amicus brief by the ACLU, the Cato Institute, and the American Conservative Union revealed.

This expansion could also have perverse effects and disincentivize people from calling for help. As that brief noted, “When every interaction with police or request for help can become an invitation for police to invade the home, the willingness of individuals to seek assistance when it is most needed will suffer.”

But in its first amicus brief before the High Court, the Biden Administration glossed over these concerns and called on the justices to uphold the First Circuit’s ruling. Noting that “the ultimate touchstone of the Fourth Amendment is ‘reasonableness,’” the Justice Department argued that warrants should not be “presumptively required when a government official’s action is objectively grounded in a non-investigatory public interest, such as health or safety.”

“The ultimate question in this case is therefore not whether the respondent officers’ actions fit within some narrow warrant exception,” their brief stated, “but instead whether those actions were reasonable,” actions the Justice Department felt were “justified” in Caniglia’s case.


As a fail-safe, the Justice Department also urged the Supreme Court to uphold the lower court ruling on qualified immunity grounds, arguing that the officers’ “actions did not violate any clearly established law so as to render the officers individually liable in a damages action.”

But the Biden Administration, along with the courts that have extended the community caretaking exception, overlook a key component of the Fourth Amendment: the Security Clause. After all, the Fourth Amendment opens with the phrase, “the right of the people to be secure.”

In an amicus brief, the Institute for Justice noted that “to the Founding generation, ‘secure’ did not simply mean the right to be ‘spared’ an unreasonable search or seizure” but also involved “harms attributable to the potential for unreasonable searches and seizures.” Expanding the community caretaking exception to “allow warrantless entries into peoples’ homes on a whim,” argued the IJ brief, “invokes the arbitrary, looming threat of general writs that so incited the Framers” and would undermine “the right of the people to be secure” in their homes.

The IJ brief further argued that extending the “community caretaking” exception to the home would “flatly contradict” the Supreme Court's prior rulings, which “has only discussed community caretaking in the context of vehicle searches and seizures.” In those cases, “the animating purpose for the exception [was] to allow officers to remove damaged or abandoned vehicles that pose a risk to public safety.” By contrast, the IJ amicus asserted, “that justification is entirely absent” when it comes to homes.

“The Fourth Amendment protects our right to be secure in our property, which means the right to be free from fear that the police will enter your house without warning or authorization,” said Institute for Justice Attorney Joshua Windham. “A rule that allows police to burst into your home without a warrant whenever they feel they are acting as ‘community caretakers’ is a threat to everyone’s security.”
 
The case is interesting because it's being brought by the ACLU which never touches 2nd amendment cases

It's also the 3rd time the ACLU has sued the Cranston police department over this issue.
It's not just a second amendment issue, it's also a major fourth amendment issue. As the article says, the police have used the "community caretaking" exemption clause for shit like noise complaints.
 
We're definitely not heading towards The Turner Diaries in real life, oh no.

In all seriousness, disarming the populace is on the agenda, it has to happen in order to get their utopia, so one day sooner or later, push is going to come to shove and they're going to demand you turn in your guns, this is literally only a matter of time.

And that's when it'll be on... like Donkey Kong!


The TSA is an unconstitutional organisation that solely exists to deprive americans of their rights. Not only should you have guns; you should have field guns, mortars, AT rifles, and warships as well.
I wish I had a warship so I could staff it with all females in sailor uniforms with short skirts.


Am I a bad person for wanting bad things to happen on their watch? Wishing they'll trip over their own ladydicks and screw the pooch so they don't go down in history favorably is the only hope I seem to have left.
They in theory have 8 solid years in office, look at how fucking intense the left has gotten over the last 8 years and that's 4 years without a Democrat actually in office and tell me that by the end of the decade they're not going to attempt a Bolshevik style revolution.

It might not happen but it's more likely than not if you ask me.

Exactly 8 years ago the term Black Lives Matter had not yet even been coined (though it would be in July), now black America has turned into a cult that worships itself, all in less than a decade.

Just try to imagine where we might be in the year 2030, to say America is the proverbial power keg just waiting for one single match to make it explode is putting it lightly.

And a blatant grab for guns might be that match.

I hope we don't go down without a fight, but I doubt it. Anyway why the fuck is it so hard to get a ps5? They cut off the bread and circuses too early imo
First they made games less fun by "diversifying" them and taking all the sexy women out of them, now people aren't even able to play new games at all.

I wonder what's going to happen if you give an entire generation of young men literally nothing to lose, no wife and kids or anything like thanks to muh feminism ruining an entire generation of women, with not even fantasy escapism to turn to? Hmmm, I wonder.


When laws, morality, and everything else is so fucking flexible with these people who try to hold you to a static idea; no. There comes a point in time where you have to put you foot down and say "No more." When the people pushing you have no problem using violence against you; it's not unreasonable to want to see it returned on them. Fuck optics and morality; you can either be a bigot or get your throat slit (and then be a dead bigot).
This is the realization I've come to, to not be a "bigot" these days mean you'd be willing to let them slit your throat, fuck that and fuck them.

It's already happening. You don't see it here often, and it's true that 2A is in danger nationally, but at the state and local levels, I dare say gun rights are winning. More and more states and counties are becoming 2A Sanctuaries and passing constitutional carry.

Edit: which is why "defund the police" is really a dog whistle for "federalize the police". They know cops from the community of Buttfuck Nowhere will tell the feds to go pound sand, and thus, want to ensure cops will always be loyal Redcoats.
Not just "federalize the police" but turn them into their lapdogs whose first and foremost job would be brutalizing white men who don't bend the knee with any other law enforcement being a distant second and third.

It's a "no bad tactics just bad targets" thing, they don't dislike police or police brutality, they dislike the fact that they don't totally control the police and they dislike brutality at the "wrong" targets, they'd love to see a conservative white man with his neck pinned to the ground by a cop George Floyd style, they'd cheer it on, look at how they're disappointed when a white shooter is arrested and not killed.

They love violence and barbaric brutality, they're not upset about blacks being put in chains and whipped, they're not upset about Jews being put into death camps, they're upset those things happened to blacks and Jews, they'd love it if it happened to white men, they'd absolutely love it.

If they get the power they so desperately crave there's literally no underestimating the brutality they would do, this is why we have the Second Amendment and this is why we can't let them take it, give an inch and oh boy, they'll take quite a mile.
 
We're definitely not heading towards The Turner Diaries in real life, oh no.

In all seriousness, disarming the populace is on the agenda, it has to happen in order to get their utopia, so one day sooner or later, push is going to come to shove and they're going to demand you turn in your guns, this is literally only a matter of time.

And that's when it'll be on... like Donkey Kong!



I wish I had a warship so I could staff it with all females in sailor uniforms with short skirts.



They in theory have 8 solid years in office, look at how fucking intense the left has gotten over the last 8 years and that's 4 years without a Democrat actually in office and tell me that by the end of the decade they're not going to attempt a Bolshevik style revolution.

It might not happen but it's more likely than not if you ask me.

Exactly 8 years ago the term Black Lives Matter had not yet even been coined (though it would be in July), now black America has turned into a cult that worships itself, all in less than a decade.

Just try to imagine where we might be in the year 2030, to say America is the proverbial power keg just waiting for one single match to make it explode is putting it lightly.

And a blatant grab for guns might be that match.


First they made games less fun by "diversifying" them and taking all the sexy women out of them, now people aren't even able to play new games at all.

I wonder what's going to happen if you give an entire generation of young men literally nothing to lose, no wife and kids or anything like thanks to muh feminism ruining an entire generation of women, with not even fantasy escapism to turn to? Hmmm, I wonder.



This is the realization I've come to, to not be a "bigot" these days mean you'd be willing to let them slit your throat, fuck that and fuck them.


Not just "federalize the police" but turn them into their lapdogs whose first and foremost job would be brutalizing white men who don't bend the knee with any other law enforcement being a distant second and third.

It's a "no bad tactics just bad targets" thing, they don't dislike police or police brutality, they dislike the fact that they don't totally control the police and they dislike brutality at the "wrong" targets, they'd love to see a conservative white man with his neck pinned to the ground by a cop George Floyd style, they'd cheer it on, look at how they're disappointed when a white shooter is arrested and not killed.

They love violence and barbaric brutality, they're not upset about blacks being put in chains and whipped, they're not upset about Jews being put into death camps, they're upset those things happened to blacks and Jews, they'd love it if it happened to white men, they'd absolutely love it.

If they get the power they so desperately crave there's literally no underestimating the brutality they would do, this is why we have the Second Amendment and this is why we can't let them take it, give an inch and oh boy, they'll take quite a mile.
I also feel like they want gun control in conjunction with their feral pets rioting, because that gives them plausible deniability in their desire to kill you.

Why else would they be so assblasted about Kyle Rittenhouse and the McCloskeys? Because they resent the idea that you are able to defy them. Few things make a liberal seethe more than being disobeyed.

It's like the bully who is shocked and horrified when the nerd he's been bullying gets fed up and suddenly gives him a bloody nose.
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Come take them, please they may try, I insist. You may take my life only once, but I can take at least a couple with me. A couple that didn't deserve to die, because of a bunch of liberals elected Saturday morning cartoon villains. Someone fetch me a tophat, I'll want to look good.
 
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I also feel like they want gun control in conjunction with their feral pets rioting, because that gives them plausible deniability in their desire to kill you.

Why else would they be so assblasted about Kyle Rittenhouse and the McCloskeys? Because they resent the idea that you are able to defy them. Few things make a liberal seethe more than being disobeyed.

It's like the bully who is shocked and horrified when the nerd he's been bullying gets fed up and suddenly gives him a bloody nose.
They really are bullies and the only thing a bully understands, the only thing that will make them stop, is violence.

I'm not saying anyone should start any violence, the only thing I'm advocating for is self defense, if they come for you, you have every right to defend yourself.
 
Allowing a stolen election to stand has consequences. The left will cement their ability to stay in power forever, and surprise the last step before communism is grabbing those guns.
Isn’t that what’s already happening with the left? I mean, gun grabbing has been a pet project of the left for years, and with two mass shootings in a matter of a few weeks, this would be what Alex Jones would call a false flag.
 
Leftist morons don't understand how local sheriffs work. Back last summer, some of the dumbasses marched through Bethel, OH, which is right on the edge of rural and never had police or race issues but whatever. Well, some Iron Horsemen live out that way, the town sheriff told them it was him and a couple deputies and they couldn't protect them if things got heated and a couple people got roughed up a bit. The lefties were bitching online, wanting to report the elected sheriff to his "police department" and get him fired.

Anyways, I'm really starting to think these morons want Right Wing "Defense" Squads. Because this is how you get Right Wing "Defense" Squads.
The more I think about Nicaraguan death squads during Iran-Contra, the more I'm convinced those death squads were in the right. Fucking commies ruin everything.
 
Speaking as an outsider, live from the scorched, salted Earth that is the UK, it really looks to me like your country is set for being utterly destroyed from within. I’ve seen first-hand how government policies, once never thought possible from a sane perspective, have irreversibly ruined my own land.

Under this turkeyfucker Biden, the divisions will become seismic; and the filthy, diseased Chinese will completely overtake you.

I can finally see just why the left and their media enablers so rabidly detested Trump. For his myriad faults, he was your last chance.
 
Speaking as an outsider, live from the scorched, salted Earth that is the UK, it really looks to me like your country is set for being utterly destroyed from within. I’ve seen first-hand how government policies, once never thought possible from a sane perspective, have irreversibly ruined my own land.

Under this turkeyfucker Biden, the divisions will become seismic; and the filthy, diseased Chinese will completely overtake you.

I can finally see just why the left and their media enablers so rabidly detested Trump. For his myriad faults, he was your last chance.
Yep. The left is making moves I can only describe as “going all in”, and they’re working double time to make their paradise a reality. And I’m not sure if people here can see that.
 
Basically transforming cops into prison guards who can toss your cell(house) whenever they get the itch.

Arresting killers and rapists is in the public interest, such as the safety of anyone else the suspect might decide to victimize, and yet warrants are still required.
The first sentence is literally what Pascal Sauvage from Johnny English wanted to do to the UK. Turn the whole country into the world's biggest prison. I suppose the leftards figured out that they can't just arrest everyone and lock them all in jail, so hey let's turn America itself into a fucking gulag. With a defunded police force. I tell people that to get rid of 2A you have to shit on all the rest of the Bill of Rights, and nobody. Fucking. Believes me.

I'll bring up the "cameltoe jailed thousands of innocent black men" talking point and they call me a Notsee. I'm fucking DONE trying to get through to them. It's like Peter Parker trying to convince Harry Osborn that his dad died by his own hand in Spider Man 3. Fucking hopeless.

Warrants for rapists and murderers and child molesters, but for so-called "enemies of the people?" Whoever the fuck it is they decide it to be!?

LOLno

Odds are this stuff will get struck down by the SCOTUS. In the event that it doesn't, well, I hope the sham administration likes all the dead cops this will cause.
LOL get a load of this evil Nazi white supremacist who cares about the lives of COPS. Of COPS!!! The fucking modern day KKK!!!!

I bet you say the N word on the internet too, huh? Don't you CARE about the lives of MINORITIES?

(sadly this is what rich white kids waving hammer and sickle flags and buying DisneyWars and StarFucks actually believe. We really do live in a post-joke world don't we...)
 
I for one am glad the orange dictator is out of his illegitimate office, and we are now back to normal American tradition respecting government, that will walk into your house and take your shit without a warrant.
If you can translate Southern "Bless your heart" you know what I mean.
 
I for one am glad the orange dictator is out of his illegitimate office, and we are now back to normal American tradition respecting government, that will walk into your house and take your shit without a warrant.
If you can translate Southern "Bless your heart" you know what I mean.
Yes, Yes I can. Remember, breaking and entering is legal if you have a badge.

And LOL @ conservatards who thought "the cops are on OUR side"
 
And LOL @ conservatards who thought "the cops are on OUR side"
It's amazing. They really thought cops, who are no better than mercenaries, would show them respect just because they were shown respect.

That sort of thing was what I meant when I said that a problem with the right-wing is belief that the world is fundamentally just.
 
Daily reminder "oops lord Poseidon took my guns " is a yellowbellied cope. It doesn't matter much that you've got a hidden gun stash if your life is over the moment you use them in self-defense. If you use the fishing accident story, you've already lost and you're already disarmed.
 
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