The Final Fantasy Thread

[Coldgrip]

Why are some sequels (especially nowadays) obsssessed with saying that nothing that was accomplished in the original mattered and that our heroes's struggles and heroic deaths (if that happened) were ultimately for nothing? it doesnt tell me anything except that the writers dont respect the efforts of the heroes in the original.

Because some people just can't let a happy ending be and think that unless everything is all misery and woe people won't recognize how "deep" and "clever" their work is.

Or they're just shit at writing.

 

[The handsome tard]

Kato thought he was being slick by titling it "Cross". Then he could backtrack and claim it was never meant to be taken as a sequel.

Which he contradicts in the very next sentence by blasting the fans:



I wish him luck in his future endeavors. Oh, that's right, he makes Gacha games now.

Because some people just can't let a happy ending be and think that unless everything is all misery and woe people won't recognize how "deep" and "clever" their work is.

Or they're just shit at writing.

Good to see that Kato was doing a Rian Johnson before it was trendy to be a pretentious dick to the fans after making a sequel that deconstrusts and makes everything that our heroes fought and sacrificed kind of null in the long term.

Its one thing to make a sequel that continues the fight with a next generation, its another kind just say that nothing from the original mattered and everyone from it ultimately failed to stop the big bad.

And all of that could have been avoided by making Chrono Cross dettached from Trigger or maybe setting it centuries into the future like Mother 3

 

[Berrakh]

Aya Brea is just Squeenix’s Madonna-whore complex. Unless the character is a little girl or deliberately evoking innocence she’ll be fanserviced at some point. You may fight me on this but you’ll have a hard time.

 

[Coldgrip]

Aya Brea is just Squeenix’s Madonna-whore complex. Unless the character is a little girl or deliberately evoking innocence she’ll be fanserviced at some point. You may fight me on this but you’ll have a hard time.

All Square-enix girls wind up being fanservicy at times. Look at FF7R's Tifa.

Not complaining though.

 

[Captain Syrup]

Unless the character is a little girl or deliberately evoking innocence she’ll be fanserviced at some point.

When a story seems to be one thing, and then jacknifes to spam more fanservice; that's the only problem people have with it, as far as I can see.

 

[Berrakh]

All Square-enix girls wind up being fanservicy at times. Look at FF7R's Tifa.

Not complaining though.

Slightly bad example since she always was. If someone can find the old FF7 PC ad that would be great.

When a story seems to be one thing, and then jacknifes to spam more fanservice; that's the only problem people have with it, as far as I can see.

It’s one of those things where there’s nothing inherently wrong but pushing it is tantamount to flanderization (Yuna FFX-2, or Rikku too even).

 

[Captain Syrup]

Slightly bad example since she always was.

If anything, they've toned it down since then.

I'll say this for Square, the female characters are (usually) on point.

 

[UnKillFill]

I don't know if this is an unpopular opinion or not, but the mode 7 graphics in FF6 are kind of shit. (I'm specifically talking about when you're riding a chocobo or in one of the airships) Everything becomes so flat that it's hard to tell what's even going on. I would even go so far as to say flying around in an airship looked objectively better in both FF4 and FF5. I still love FF6, but I'm currently replaying it, and being reminded of a nitpick I have for it.

 

[Cisna H. Scumale]

I don't know if this is an unpopular opinion or not, but the mode 7 graphics in FF6 are kind of shit. (I'm specifically talking about when you're riding a chocobo or in one of the airships) Everything becomes so flat that it's hard to tell what's even going on. I would even go so far as to say flying around in an airship looked objectively better in both FF4 and FF5. I still love FF6, but I'm currently replaying it, and being reminded of a nitpick I have for it.

Agreed. One of the reasons I think FF6 is overrated in spite of agreeing with most of the reasons why people love the game is that a lot of the gameplay concepts are incredibly rough prototype ideas that got fleshed out to amazement in the PS1 games. Other examples include the coliseum, desperation strikes/limit breaks, non-magic skills, summons as a leveling feature, etc.

 

[MooseGump]

Agreed. One of the reasons I think FF6 is overrated in spite of agreeing with most of the reasons why people love the game is that a lot of the gameplay concepts are incredibly rough prototype ideas that got fleshed out to amazement in the PS1 games. Other examples include the coliseum, desperation strikes/limit breaks, non-magic skills, summons as a leveling feature, etc.

By the end of the game you're just gonna spam Ultima and the characters don't really matter, even though I'd say that aspect is a bit worse in FF7

FFV job chads rise up

 

[Captain Syrup]

I don't know if this is an unpopular opinion or not, but the mode 7 graphics in FF6 are kind of shit. (I'm specifically talking about when you're riding a chocobo or in one of the airships) Everything becomes so flat that it's hard to tell what's even going on.

Secret of Mana is like that. I can't see where Flammie is going. I love me some Mode 7 but that is some bullshit.

FFV job chads rise up

By the end of the game you're just gonna spam Barrage/Coin Toss and the characters don't matter. A lot of these games can be cheesed with a single move or summon.

 

[Dr. Geronimo]

My biggest beef with FF6 is that the second half of the game feels either rushed or they didn't have enough memory. The first half is tight, with plenty of character interaction and characterization. When you get to the second half while you have some fantastic moments for all the characters, a lot of the general story feels cookie cutter. Because they can't bank on who you have in your party, dialogue is more generic and you often don't have a character portrait to go with it.

 

[eternal dog mongler]

Because they can't bank on who you have in your party, dialogue is more generic and you often don't have a character portrait to go with it.

This is one of the biggest drawbacks to the World of Ruin, yeah. It may have been better if your other party members tagged along with you instead of hanging out on the airship so they could participate in story scenes and such. Being limited to four people in a game where you can make a party out of Umaro, Gogo, Gau and Mog is going to be difficult to write anything for.

 

[Smug Chuckler]

Story:

4 > 6 > 5

Gameplay:

5 > 6 > 4

By the end of the game you're just gonna spam Ultima and the characters don't really matter, even though I'd say that aspect is a bit worse in FF7

Was it better in later games?

8 - Aura -> Wait -> LB
9 - Basic Attacks and Doomsdays
10 - Double Cast Ultimas
12 - ATTACKATTACKATTACKATTACKATTACKATTACKATTACK while the other pre-programmed party members cast haste and cure spells

 

[Radical Cadre]

My biggest beef with FF6 is that the second half of the game feels either rushed or they didn't have enough memory. The first half is tight, with plenty of character interaction and characterization. When you get to the second half while you have some fantastic moments for all the characters, a lot of the general story feels cookie cutter. Because they can't bank on who you have in your party, dialogue is more generic and you often don't have a character portrait to go with it.

The second half of the game is the best fucking part (except for Edgar's castle tentacles). It is entirely open-ended and you can develop your characters as you see fit. The reason the first part is "tight and wet" as you say, is because the first half of FF6 is a tutorial. Once you get to the second half you're supposed to sink or swim based on what you've learned. It is excellent.

 

[Berrakh]

I think the Second Half of FF6 is ultimately subjective. What some people dislike about it is necessary to abet what others like about it, and vice versa, so it's really just a question of how you value the tradeoff. You can't definitively say one way is better. Part 1 might be a better straight narrative but FF has a lot of those while Part 2 is type of setting/story configuration you can only find in video games.

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

My biggest beef with FF6 is that the second half of the game feels either rushed or they didn't have enough memory. The first half is tight, with plenty of character interaction and characterization. When you get to the second half while you have some fantastic moments for all the characters, a lot of the general story feels cookie cutter. Because they can't bank on who you have in your party, dialogue is more generic and you often don't have a character portrait to go with it.

It is the same sort of thing that Octopath Traveler Had (I give it more leeway though because this was decades ago)

It wants to let you choose the path you take and what quests you do, but the freeform nature of it means they would have to write dialogue for every possible combination of party.

 

[Dr. Geronimo]

The second half of the game is the best fucking part (except for Edgar's castle tentacles). It is entirely open-ended and you can develop your characters as you see fit. The reason the first part is "tight and wet" as you say, is because the first half of FF6 is a tutorial. Once you get to the second half you're supposed to sink or swim based on what you've learned. It is excellent.

If you're coming to the series to 'break the game' then yeah it is, but after 4 people came for a decent narrative and that wasn't there in 6. Hell if you wanted Cyan to be your lead in the 2nd half then it's downright annoying because the dialogue can't be written with just him in mind.

In fact your post actually hit the nail on the head as to why I've never considered myself a true FF fan. I've played every game and I enjoy most of them, but it seems like the fan base comes to the game specifically to break them or to do hardcore endgame shit. I'm not saying I want zero difficulty, I just find cheesing the systems to be boring.

 

[John Titor]

It's woeful writing. All of it could gave been avoided if Lynx, not Dalton, took over Porre.

How did the twist go again? Lynx is the jaguar who mauled you as a baby. No, wait, he's Darth Vader. Wait, cancel that. He's SHODAN?

Anytime someone tries to sell you on the idea that Kato is this misunderstood genius, remind them of this.

I honestly don't know if this was truly intentional or some localizer just wanted to include the most popular fan theory at the time.

 

[Captain Syrup]

I'm not saying I want zero difficulty, I just find cheesing the systems to be boring.

Ultima is a weird example, though. Yes, you can learn Ultima from 100 battles or by grinding out Cactuars for an hour.

Yes, you can spam Knights of the Round by farming nuts and save-scumming until you breed a blue, black, and gold chocobo. (I have never bothered to do this.)

6 was better in that regard, because it splits up your party at regular intervals and forces you to work with characters you may not like. The weakest build could prove to be the most deadly, with the right setup.

Once you reach FF7, the only thing separating each character are limit breaks.

Hell if you wanted Cyan to be your lead in the 2nd half then it's downright annoying because the dialogue can't be written with just him in mind.

Cyan wraps up his arc in the WoR, and each character gets an epilogue when you beat Kefka. He wasn't exactly shortchanged.