Western Animation - Discuss American, Canadian, and European cartoons here (or just bitch about wokeshit, I guess)

[Alexander Thaut]

Perhaps. As you say it's a bit too obscure but of course obscure properties presumably are also available on the cheap. That said I believe it was a Hanna-Barbera production and David Kirschner wrote for it so they'd be the most likely ones to be behind any reboot notions. And much like Dino Riders its obscurity might be a blessing.

It's an awkward situation the series' lack of an ending. It was a decent enough show that not getting an ending is balanced out by not having a bad ending either.


I'm pretty sure we're getting gay Alan. Whether or not this means we're getting Obsidian who was gay from quite a while ago in the comics I'm not certain, though a version of him showed up in one of the other DC CW shows. Stargirl spoiler: we've had Green Lanterns daughter show up in Season 2 which I assume is going to be Jade. From what I recall of Alan Scott being gay I'm fairly certain that iteration did not have children. But I also think no show runner at the moment would dare use an outdated straight version though see the end of the post for more on that.

I did not catch enough of N52 to find out how they mangled the JSA thankfully.

Whole lot of deaths there, cleaning up excess characters or big crossover event where they needed to kill people to show off? Also Stargirl spoiler this season's got Eclipso in it. Hopefully the two characters will get a bit more well known from a live action run. Ideally in a good way.

It's basically a kaiju series really, just with more chatty monsters. I think they'd probably hammer in some environmental messages too but it'd be fairly simple since there was so little of it originally.

Pretty much. It was largely interesting because of its setting, the core story was a fairly generic Mcguffin hunt and Ren arguably is incredibly by the numbers in terms of his character even if inoffensively so, but having it be a not quite apocalyptic setting but one sort of living through an ongoing apocalypse that most people are pretty deep in denial about how bad it's gotten is a nice notion.

Hm, Roswell Conspiracies is another one they could redo I suppose.

I think, and will quickly check, that most of the new DC live action shows have their own Earth whereas all the CW stuff is on Earth Prime...yes. Stargirl, Green Lantern, Superman and Lois as well as Doom Patrol, Titans and Swamp Thing are all in separate Earths. So the Alan Scott on Green Lantern Earth may also exist on Stargirl Earth. It should be noted that the CW Flash show at least treated Earth hopping as borderline effortless after a certain point in its run so none of the Earths can be considered safely isolated.

they mangled the JSA by removing them.

but they still tried to make Stargirl a thing.


it was dumb and didn't work.

 

[Private Pyle]

but consider the bad publicity they got for announcing it.

You mean the bad publicity that faded after a few weeks like every controversy on the internet? Oh yeah, those twitter users are a real force to be reckoned with.

Consider all the people who were saying John K. was going to use the reboot to prey on underage girls.

One of the first things announced for the reboot was that John K would have no involvement in the reboot. Anyone saying that is retarded and so are you for thinking it’s a legitimate concern.

If that happened, you think a big company like Viacom would want that associated with them?

Why would you expect a faceless corporation to care, especially from a company already reviled like Viacom? Ffs, the new big name Nickelodeon game has a R&S characters front and center of the roster (to no uproar at that).

That's why it's likely completely dead, unless John somehow dies or goes to jail.

Is that your beef with the reboot? A grudge against the creator even though he got cucked out of his show and won’t work on it?

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

Why would you expect a faceless corporation to care, especially from a company already reviled like Viacom? Ffs, the new big name Nickelodeon game has a R&S characters front and center of the roster (to no uproar at that).

Faceless corporations don't want to be associated with pedophiles. They can have the reruns on TV and have them in games because those are minor products selling to a nostalgic audience. A whole new reboot is another thing entirely.

That's why it's not likely the reboot will make it to air unless John dies or goes to jail, like I said.

 

[Morethanabitfoolish]

But obscure properties are the ones that aren't going to get you any reboot buzz... But then again, once everything's been rebooted I guess they'll do those instead. I expect them to announce a Toonsylvania reboot in 2027.

True. I did spot Gravedale High in the list of things when I was checking who made Pirates of Dark Water and what they've done previously/are doing now and wonder when they'd dig that up.

they mangled the JSA by removing them.

but they still tried to make Stargirl a thing.

it was dumb and didn't work.

Like that will stop people from repeating the mistake.

 

[Private Pyle]

Faceless corporations don't want to be associated with pedophiles.

Imagine typing this out and thinking it’s actually true. Holy shit this is a new level of cope.

They can have the reruns on TV and have them in games because those are minor products selling to a nostalgic audience. A whole new reboot is another thing entirely.

Reboots by their nature are products selling to a nostalgic audience. At this point, you come across as trying as reassure yourself that it’s not happening rather objectively try to prove it’s dead. I think from here on out, anything you say about R&S should be taken with a grain of salt by the other Kiwis.

I just don’t get how you can go from speaking about cartoons normally to twitter levels of retard the moment R&S and it’s reboot is brought up.

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

Reboots by their nature are products selling to a nostalgic audience. At this point, you come across as trying as reassure yourself that it’s not happening rather objectively try to prove it’s dead. I think from here on out, anything you say about R&S should be taken with a grain of salt by the other Kiwis.

I just don’t get how you can go from speaking about cartoons normally to twitter levels of retard the moment R&S and it’s reboot is brought up.

Let me ask you something... can you show me some concrete evidence that the reboot is still in production? I'd love to see it since you seem to believe it's still on.

 

[Vyse Inglebard]

Faceless corporations don't want to be associated with pedophiles.

If that's the case. why did Roman Polanski keep getting work even after he was convicted of drugging and raping a 13-year old girl? Hell, one of his movies got him the Oscar for Best Director 14 years after he fled to Europe to escape charges! Why did Oprah Winfrey shield Harvey Weinstein? And need we forget, from the hallowed halls of Nickelodeon itself, Dan "I Like Little Girls' Feet, They're Really Neat" Schneider?

Let me ask you something... can you show me some concrete evidence that the reboot is still in production? I'd love to see it since you seem to believe it's still on.

Let me answer your question with a question of my own: Can YOU provide concrete evidence that the reboot is shelved? We're still waiting on that.

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

Let me answer your question with a question of my own: Can YOU provide concrete evidence that the reboot is shelved? We're still waiting on that.

Well, like I said, Bob Camp said he heard from the person who was supposed to direct the show that it was shelved. Robyn Byrd has sources, apparently, but I have no idea who they are. I doubt she made it up when she could have kept protesting the damn thing.

Otherwise I have no idea who was supposed to be working on it, or if they even hired people to work on it, so I can't ask them.

Thad Komorowski probably knows. He's here (@thadwell) but he probably isn't going to respond. He just lurks. Maybe PM him if you want a more concrete answer.

 

[OmnipotentStupidity]

Let me ask you something... can you show me some concrete evidence that the reboot is still in production? I'd love to see it since you seem to believe it's still on.

The fuck is this Reddit tier bullshit?
"This thing is totally dead, no bones about it whatsoever, and that is a fact. What? No, I won't tell you how, what you think it's not? Well then YOU should find concrete information yourself if you're so sure."

Being extremely obtuse and deflecting the responsibility to him is such a jackass move. I'm with Vyse on this one, if you're so sure the reboot's dead and have such connections, then either show us or shut up about it. You're the one who always posits the possibility the reboot's gone and done whenever you're in this thread.

EDIT:

Well, like I said, Bob Camp said he heard from the person who was supposed to direct the show that it was shelved. Robyn Byrd has sources, apparently, but I have no idea who they are. I doubt she made it up when she could have kept protesting the damn thing.

So we have hearsay from a biased source who already hated John to begin with, and one of John's victims who hasn't even worked in the industry for nearly two decades on a "lol trust me and my sources". That's...not very convincing. Bob Camp does seem like a nice guy, but he's also got a large chip on his shoulder even to this DAY about John, wasn't even working on the reboot (IIRC he's working on SpongeBob right now), and Nickelodeon Productions is notorious for not letting their animation department know what's happening and letting them just find out for themselves, and striking anyone who badmouths the company down.

I really don't want to say you're lying, I really REALLY don't, but Nick is known to change shit on a dime; the one thing I can give that may point to this is Ren and Stimpy's short being cut from the third SpongeBob movie might've contributed to the reboot's current state, but that was also a project that directly involved John K up until Kricfalusi got called out, and even then: Nick never really formally announced the short wasn't being made anymore, it was just assumed.

Nick's fuckin' weird man.

Thad Komorowski probably knows. He's here (@thadwell) but he probably isn't going to respond.

However I will grant you this is at least actually a lead, depending on whether or not he had any involvement in the reboot.

 

[Private Pyle]

I'd love to see it since you seem to believe it's still on.

For the umpteenth, no one ever said that. Believing something is TBD isn’t the same as saying it’s completely on. And it’s pretty hypocritical to demand concrete evidence from others when you haven’t yourself.

With all this ignoring my points and repeating myself into a circle, it feels like you’re trolling.

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

So we have hearsay from a biased source who already hated John to begin with, and one of John's victims who hasn't even worked in the industry for nearly two decades on a "lol trust me and my sources". That's...not very convincing. Bob Camp does seem like a nice guy, but he's also got a large chip on his shoulder even to this DAY about John and isn't even working on the reboot (IIRC he's working on SpongeBob right now).

Bob's been trying to get a reboot off the ground for years. Supposedly he wanted to figure out how he could get on the reboot when it was announced. This really doesn't have anything to do with John, and I don't see why exactly he would lie about this.

I wish I knew anyone who was working on the reboot, but unfortunately I don't and they probably wouldn't be able to tell me anything anyhow with the NDAs and all. But if you want to ask Thad, well, maybe he can give you an answer... if he does answer.

I really don't want to say you're lying, I really REALLY don't, but Nick is known to change shit on a dime; the one thing I can give that may point to this is Ren and Stimpy's short being cut from the third SpongeBob movie might've contributed to the reboot's current state, but that was also a project that directly involved John K up until Kricfalusi got called out, and even then: Nick never really formally announced the short wasn't being made anymore, it was just assumed.

Nick's fuckin' weird man.

FWIW I had heard that the short idea was dead long before he was exposed. I don't think it really got anywhere beyond, say, a meeting (where John might have brought one of his underage victims with him). And then he came out with a feature on the Cans Without Labels DVD - the boards for a short for the second SpongeBob film. So it might never have happened at all.

However I will grant you this is at least actually a lead, depending on whether or not he had any involvement in the reboot.

Thad wrote the book on Ren and Stimpy and knows a lot of the guys involved in it, which is why I said he'd be the man to ask. He's got the insider connections.

 

[OmnipotentStupidity]

Bob's been trying to get a reboot off the ground for years. Supposedly he wanted to figure out how he could get on the reboot when it was announced. This really doesn't have anything to do with John, and I don't see why exactly he would lie about this.

I don't think Bob would lie either but here's the thing: are his reboot idea and Nick's reboot one in the same? Bob's shown both at conventions and through interviews that he still loves the show to death; outside of John he was one of the main people that made it what it was. I don't doubt him wanting to get the show rebooted over and over and over again without John's involvement.

But when the reboot WAS finally announced, Bob also said (I believe on his Facebook?) that he was not a part of the reboot, which I thought was strange. Nick's done weirder shit before, but they've never really up and thrown out the person who helped greenlight a project the second it got picked up (AFAIK. I could be wrong there). Which makes Bob's statement about it ending all the more confusing; he could've heard it around the studio that Nick was ending production and shelving it, fair, but why would he then talk publicly about it and risk screwing over an unrelated team that could still be working on it?

That's the part that's tripping me up, it just seems weirdly spiteful of Bob.

EDIT:
While looking this up, I was also reminded of this response from Billy West at the end of last year that the reboot was still being made on Comedy Central, but that plans for it were halted due to the COVID-19 epidemic.

Billy West Says 'Ren & Stimpy' Reboot Still On At Comedy Central

West cites delays at ViacomCBS in production and development due to Covid.

www.cartoonbrew.com

And unlike Bob, Billy West is actively involved with the show as the voice of Stimpy again. So add that on to the pile of weird shit with this cursed to hell reboot.

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

I don't think Bob would lie either but here's the thing: are his reboot idea and Nick's reboot one in the same? Bob's shown both at conventions and through interviews that he still loves the show to death; outside of John he was one of the main people that made it what it was. I don't doubt him wanting to get the show rebooted over and over and over again without John's involvement.

But when the reboot WAS finally announced, Bob also said (I believe on his Facebook?) that he was not a part of the reboot, which I thought was strange. Nick's done weirder shit before, but they've never really up and thrown out the person who helped greenlight a project the second it got picked up (AFAIK. I could be wrong there). Which makes Bob's statement about it ending all the more confusing; he could've heard it around the studio that Nick was ending production and shelving it, fair, but why would he then talk publicly about it and risk screwing over an unrelated team that could still be working on it?

That's the part that's tripping me up, it just seems weirdly spiteful of Bob.

I've seen some of Bob's reboot ideas... I don't think they're the same. Especially since the reboot was supposed to be a series and Bob wanted to do a movie, in the vein of the Hey Arnold and Rocko films.

But in any case he wasn't the only guy trying to get R&S rebooted - John, of course, was trying to, and so was one other R&S guy. (Neither of them got theirs off the ground either.)

So I don't think he had any actual involvement in the reboot that was greenlit, and it was done independently of any of his ideas. If he had been involved in any way, he probably would have said so and we would have known.

EDIT:
While looking this up, I was also reminded of this response from Billy West at the end of last year that the reboot was still being made on Comedy Central, but that plans for it were halted due to the COVID-19 epidemic.

Billy West Says 'Ren & Stimpy' Reboot Still On At Comedy Central

West cites delays at ViacomCBS in production and development due to Covid.

www.cartoonbrew.com

And unlike Bob, Billy West is actively involved with the show as the voice of Stimpy again. So add that on to the pile of weird shit with this cursed to hell reboot.

Billy was never confirmed as coming back. He was just "expected to return," which doesn't mean he was confirmed. Several of the original writers were expected to return as well and I just wonder how, considering most of those guys are busy elsewhere and a lot of them don't want to be involved in any reboot of the show. (Maybe they got Ron Hauge?)

So, knowing that, Billy saying "Not that I've heard" isn't actually a confirmation... especially since animation studios had long since adapted to the pandemic when the reboot was announced in August last year.

 

[Durag Oddish]

Just dropped, the trailer for a totally needless animated remake of Night of the Living Dead.

I saw somebody say what I was thinking, that it looks like an episode of Archer where they accidentally turned off the cel shading. New lows in lifeless (ha!) Western animation.

Getting some Wikihow vibes from the first scene alone

 

[OmnipotentStupidity]

I've seen some of Bob's reboot ideas... I don't think they're the same. Especially since the reboot was supposed to be a series and Bob wanted to do a movie, in the vein of the Hey Arnold and Rocko films.

But in any case he wasn't the only guy trying to get R&S rebooted - John, of course, was trying to, and so was one other R&S guy. (Neither of them got theirs off the ground either.)

So I don't think he had any actual involvement in the reboot that was greenlit, and it was done independently of any of his ideas. If he had been involved in any way, he probably would have said so and we would have known.

Yes.

Exactly.

So if he's not involved, then why immediately treat it being shelved as fact, due to the news coming from a couple of people who aren't involved in the new reboot in the first place?

Billy was never confirmed as coming back. He was just "expected to return," which doesn't mean he was confirmed. Several of the original writers were expected to return as well and I just wonder how, considering most of those guys are busy elsewhere and a lot of them don't want to be involved in any reboot of the show. (Maybe they got Ron Hauge?)

So, knowing that, Billy saying "Not that I've heard" isn't actually a confirmation... especially since animation studios had long since adapted to the pandemic when the reboot was announced in August last year.

I finally get Vyse and Private's frustration now jfc
...Again, I never said he's confirmed to be coming back, but that he's talked about the production of the reboot and is actively still voicing Stimpy.

It's all he said she said semantic bullshit either way, but my point was his say has a bit more credence to what he's talking about because a.) he actively voices him in all Nick projects involving R&S that don't involve John to this very day (see again: Nickelodeon All-Stars and any new promotional material for the networks that's not recycled lines), and B.) why would he speak of behalf of something he supposedly wasn't involved in, same as Camp? He's much more involved with R&S right now. Bob Camp isn't save for pet projects and unrelated pitches.

Fair: Camp has about as much authority to talk on this as West or the other past people of R&S do. Yet for some reason: you treat Bob and Robyn's word as gospel and treat it being shelved as fact. That's where Private's taking issue; speculate it's shelved all you want. that's fine, but if there's something you know, don't laud it over us by saying "Well I know X people in the industry know Y" and not extrapolate; otherwise most people take your "dude trust me"s the same as the other "dude trust me"s, cuz unlike Thad you're completely anonymous and we can't know for sure if you're right until we hear it from either Nick or someone confirmed to be involved (unless you screenshotted convos or something, but I'm assuming this is all just by talking to them so...). And Nick's been so wishy-washy about info that that makes that tough to parse.

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

...Again, I never said he's confirmed to be coming back, but that he's talked about the production of the reboot and is actively still voicing Stimpy.

It's all he said she said semantic bullshit either way, but my point was his say has a bit more credence to what he's talking about because a.) he actively voices him in all Nick projects involving R&S that don't involve John to this very day (see again: Nickelodeon All-Stars and any new promotional material for the networks that's not recycled lines), and B.) why would he speak of behalf of something he supposedly wasn't involved in, same as Camp? He's much more involved with R&S right now. Bob Camp isn't save for pet projects and unrelated pitches.

Fair: Camp has about as much authority to talk on this as West or the other past people of R&S do. Yet for some reason: you treat Bob and Robyn's word as gospel and treat it being shelved as fact. That's where Private's taking issue; speculate it's shelved all you want. that's fine, but if there's something you know, don't laud it over us by saying "Well I know X people in the industry know Y" and not extrapolate; otherwise most people take your "dude trust me"s the same as the other "dude trust me"s, cuz unlike Thad you're completely anonymous and we can't know for sure if you're right until we hear it from either Nick or someone confirmed to be involved (unless you screenshotted convos or something, but I'm assuming this is all just by talking to them so...). And Nick's been so wishy-washy about info that that makes that tough to parse.

The new Nickelodeon game won't have any voice acting, though - Richard Horvitz said they didn't ask him or any of the other Nick actors to come back - and I don't think he's done any new promo material (and I think they exclusively use recycled lines). The last game Stimpy was in that had voice acting, it was Eric Bauza doing the voice, and that was in 2011. There isn't really any new R&S stuff with voice acting for him to be involved in. (Excepting obviously fake entries on IMDB.)

He may have talked about the production of the reboot but he hasn't done anything with Stimpy's voice for years, and that's why I'm skeptical of this idea. He didn't announce that he was coming back for the reboot when it was all over the news that he would probably return. On his Twitter account the only tweet I could find of him mentioning a R&S reboot after it was announced was this one, which was about Adult Party Cartoon.

So I can't really say he was involved with the reboot... because there isn't much evidence.

As for Nick, studios don't generally announce that a show's been shelved. They announce when things have been greenlit, but if a show never makes it, well, they prefer not to say anything. This happens a lot in TV.

 

[5t3n0g0ph3r]

@Steamboat_Bill @Private Pyle Knock off the slapfight.

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

OK.

Did any of you hear about this?

 

[Sinner's Sandwich]

Just dropped, the trailer for a totally needless animated remake of Night of the Living Dead.

I saw somebody say what I was thinking, that it looks like an episode of Archer where they accidentally turned off the cel shading. New lows in lifeless (ha!) Western animation.

I fucking hate how stiff & robotic the characters move. Even the living characters suffer from rigor mortis.

 

[A Grey Cat]

@Steamboat_Bill @Private Pyle Knock off the slapfight.

Ikr? This is some way to remember that the nicktoons turned 30 and we're next if not already.