2000 election: Who should win?

Who will you vote for?

  • Bush

    Votes: 9 39.1%
  • Gore

    Votes: 14 60.9%

  • Total voters
    23

ShahOfIran1979

Shah of Iran from 1941-1979 + soon...
kiwifarms.net
Joined
Aug 21, 2024
The 2000 Election marked the end of the Billenium. The economy was very good stupid, we had a budget surplus, and the internet was a growing technology. In a noncompetitive Democrat primary, VP Al Gore beat basketball player Bill Bradley for the nomination. Al Gore invented the internet (he didn't actually claim this) and had a segregationist father. He chose Joe Lieberman as his running mate, the first Jewish American to appear on a major ticket. The Republican primary included Texas governor and neocon George W. Bush, Senator and neocon John McClane, and Steve Forbes, who ran Forbes magazine. Bush won and chose Dick Cheney as his running mate, a man who had already filled plenty of positions in government since the Ford years.

This election had more relaxed themes, as nothing bad seemed to be happening and people were doing alright. Bush argued that the Clinton economy was actually shitty and that everyone was too stupid to notice. Al Gore distanced himself from Clinton in the campaign, attempting to prevent himself from being associated with the scandals of the administration. In addition, Joe Lieberman was already vocally opposed to many of Clinton's actions. This likely hurt Gore in the end, as Clinton was a genuinely popular president. Other issues included gay shit like education reform, (both thought our kids were retarded) what to do with our budget surplus, and campaign finance reform. Bush also took a critical stance on Clinton's foreign policy, arguing that nation-building was incorrect and led to unnecessary interventions.

This election was stolen by Bush, who told his brother Jeb to add a few hundred votes in Florida so he could win. Later, the 2004 election was stolen in Ohio when they barred black people from voting.

Anyway, who do you vote for?

Thread theme: (isn't from 2000, but fits Bush theme)
 
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Additional info you might find useful on how the candidates stand on the issues.
The Issues:

Budget Surplus: One of the biggest issue this election seems to be the Budget Surplus and what, if anything to do about it. Since 1998 the Federal Budget has been running a surplus (currently at $200 Billion) with the Washington Post projecting this surplus could be as high as a $750 billion or even a trillion dollars over the course of the next decade. With a federal debt of $6 trillion dollars the idea of paying the debt down for the first time since the Andrew Jackson administration has many Deficit hawks excited.

Al Gore: Vice President Gore supports using the surplus to increase spending for the environment, education, healthcare, and social security. At the same point in time Gore wants to keep some of the surplus so they can keep paying down the national debt. Gore claims that under his plan the national debt will be paid off by 2012 and Social Security solvency will be increased until at least 2054.


George Bush: Bush wants to use the budget surplus for big tax cuts. Tax cuts have been a centerpiece of his campaign since he announced his candidacy back in'99.

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Foreign Policy: In 1999 NATO forces intervened in the ongoing conflict in the Balkans, primarily through bombing Yugoslavia's forces. In October 2000 Al-Qaeda terrorists bombed the USS Cole, killing 17 servicemen. These two issues are front of mind of the foreign policy front.

Al Gore: Al Gore is defiantly the foreign policy hawk in this election, supporting Clinton's actions in the Balkans, and beveling Americans must intervene early to prevent problems from arising around the world.


George Bush: Governor Bush is running as an isolationist. During the debate with Gore he said, "If we don't stop extend our troops all around the world, in 'Nation Building' missions, then we're going to have a serious problem coming down the road and I'm going to prevent that". As President Bush plans to review all foreign troop deployments.

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Education: Education is expected to be a central issue this election, as George Bush has made it a center point of his campaign

Al Gore: The Vice-President supports the creation of a tax-free "lifelong learning savings accounts". He opposes Conservative initiatives to use federal aid to send students to private schools (school choice) but does support increasing the number of charter schools and increasing the use of tech in the classroom.


George Bush: Education has been one of the big themes of Bush's candidacy. Bush frequently highlights the successes of his education programs in Texas on test scores. This campaign he is calling for Federally required state testing of schools and supports the use of federal money for private school vouchers for students in failings public schools (school choice).

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Social Security: Strengthen Social Security is a key issue of the Gore campaign.

Al Gore: Al Gore has talked about creating an 'iron-clad lockbox' fund for Social Security and Medicare which can not be touched by congress. Additionally Gore hopes to strengthen Social Security benefits by putting some of the budget surplus towards strengthening it. Under his plan Al Gore believes he can increase Social Security's solvency until the 2050s.

George Bush: Bush supports a privatization plan that would allow workers to put to a portion of their payroll taxes to be placed into personal accounts and to be invested in stocks and bonds.

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Elián González: While immigration is not a major issue this election, there is one particular immigration case which has risen to national prominence. At only five years old Elián González and his mother fled Cuba along with his mother on refugee rafts, his mother drowned during the journey but Elián survived and was placed into the custody of his great-Uncle in Miami. Elián's father meanwhile sued for the return of his son to Cuba, resulting in an international custody battle. This issue motivated Cuban-Americans (an important demographic in the battleground of Florida) and anti-Communists who felt the eventual return of Elián to the communist dictatorship by the Clinton Administration was a betrayal of American values.

Al Gore: Al Gore broke with President Clinton on this issue, supporting legislation that would have allowed Elián to remain in America, much to the chagrin of his fellow Democrats.


George Bush: Governor Bush has said that Elián getting US citizenship would be a wonderful thing, and suggesting bringing in his father so he can "get a taste of freedom" too. He called on Janet Reno to reconsider her decision to send the boy back to Cuba, though added that he thought the Florida Family Courts should ultimately decided what's best.
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Gun Control: In 1994 a Federal Assaults Weapons ban was passed which is set to expire in 2004, during the term of whoever wins this election. As such it's renewal (or lack therefor) is of top concern to gun owners. Additionally the school shooting last year at Columbine has elevated gun control in the minds of many Americans.

Al Gore: Gore supports the current assault weapons ban. In the aftermath of the shooting at Columbine Gore, in his role as Vice-President, cast the tie-breaking vote in the senate on a bill requiring background checks for purchases at gun shows. Additionally he supports requiring people who purchase firearms to obtain photo licenses. He is also open to a national gun registry for all firearms, though he thinks this has very little chance of passing.


George Bush: The Bush Campaign also supports renewing the assault weapons ban, though the Governor does not support a firearms registry.

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Energy Policy: Two big energy concerns this election is rather or not to ratify the 1997 Kyoto Protocol, which is designed to limit greenhouse gas emissions, and rather or not to open the Alaska National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR) to drilling for Oil

Al Gore: A big environmentalists Gore helped negotiate the Kyoto protocol and opposes any efforts to drill in the ANWR


George Bush: Governor Bush has criticized the Kyoto Protocol and has called for allowing drilling in the ANWR.
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Race Relations: In 1998 James Byrd Jr, a black man, was brutally killed in Texas by 3 men (two of whom were avowed White supremacists), this was sparked debate surrounding hate crimes and hate crime legislation in the country.

Al Gore: Vice-President Gore has called on the passage of federal hate crime legislation.


George Bush: When asked about hate crime laws Bush simply said, "all crime is hate" and refused to elaborate his position any further. As Governor of the state where Byrd was murdered Bush resisted calls for hate crime legislation, highlighting the fact hat two of the three perpetrators were put to death as evidence the current legislation was satisfactory. Bush has said he supports the state of South Carolina deciding itself rather to remove the Confederate battle flag over the state capitol building.
This is the first election we're doing that I didn't personally vote in (I was too young).

For me personally I like George Bush's opposition to 'nation building' and commitment to isolationism in the face of Al Gore's support for NATO bombings in the Balkans. However since we're currently at peace I'll set aside foreign policy during this election and say I really like Al Gore's plan with the federal surplus. Personally I think we have a large debt and his calls to have it paid off by 2012 are music to my ears. I have a newborn child and I would hope the debt would be gone by the time my kid turns 18. I'm a bit skeptical Gore can succeed in this with his increases benefits for Social Security as I want the surplus to remain untouched while we pay down the debt. but I figure if we have to use the surplus for something (either tax cuts as Bush calls for or increases SS benefits as Gore calls for) might as well go with Gore's plan since it feels the more 'Christian' choice. Also, even though he was personally never directly implicated, I would be a bit turned off of Bush by some of the ugly mudslinging directed at John McCain during the 2000 South Carolina primary, particularly the accusations of having a Black child out of wedlock, I'd have hoped we'd gotten past race based attacked by the new millennium. I'm not happy about Gore's support for renewing the Assault Weapons ban but since the Bush campaign has the same position I guess I'll have to discount it. So it's Gore/Liberman for me this time around.
 
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They're both uniparty New World Order stooges. In the grand scheme of things the butterfly effect and policy differences would render certain areas different, some better and others worse, but any massive issues faced by Bush (9/11 unavoidable from a motivated party in 2001, the Great Recession housing market crash in ~2008 caused by bipartisan policies catering to the lowest common denominator) likely would have seen an extremely similar response and outcome from Gore. The neoliberals have shown themselves every bit the bloodthirsty interventionist as neoconservatives, just ask Hillary or Obama, and the public fervor for military intervention would have been too much to resist. It's easy to play the peaceful contrarian when you're the out party and can sing kumbaya, but in a position of leadership nobody was going to not intervene in the Middle East. Clinton's policies in conjunction with a Republican Congress caused many long-term issues, in particular in the areas of Midwestern manufacturing and NAFTA, as well as illegal immigration slave wages being encouraged by such policies. Many short-term gains were grasped at in exchange for long-term issues in many areas. The deficit would have been every last bit as bad off, considering.

Where the discussion becomes interesting is from a cultural perspective. The Millennials are what you get when you have eight years of Bush demonized by a media and popular culture at the peak of its influence, followed by the "cool" Obama coming around when they started to become of voting age. There is a 99% chance that a Republican would have won in 2008 after four terms of Democratic rule. Obama's administration likely never would have happened, and the demonization of Bushie conservatism would have rendered right wing thinking less toxic and unpopular to the general populace. Things become far too muddy at that point to wargame or play hypotheticals as the variables are immense.

In any event, Bush was a failed leader that made poor cabinet choices who embarrassed him regularly. His first term was a modest success, whereas his second term and eventually his administration was a complete snafu with very little to point to in the way of accomplishments. Gore may have been a better overall President, but the tentacles of expanding globalism and issues of leftist governance and cultural rot would have been every bit as worse. Some of the biggest issues and hurdles Bush faced were completely unavoidable and were bipartisan muckups from decades of poor forecasting and short-term thinking. A large scale shake up was needed, with Biden's tenure showing the inevitable outcome of our shared bipartisan policies since the 90s.
 
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he neoliberals have shown themselves every bit the bloodthirsty interventionist as neoconservatives, just ask Hillary or Obama, and the public fervor for military intervention would have been too much to resist. It's easy to play the peaceful contrarian when you're the out party and can sing kumbaya, but in a position of leadership nobody was going to not intervene in the Middle East.
You have to remember in this election Bush is running as the isolation while Gore, perhaps as a result of Clinton's intervention in the Balkans, is positioning himself as a foreign policy hawk.

Answering the question without the benefit of hindsight if you're anti-War George Bush is, surprisingly, your candidate. Bush has even called for reviewing all foreign troop deployments upon taking office to determine where we can scale back.
 
Dubya is the Peter Principle personified

Al Gore is an extremely narcissistic empty vessel

idk
 
Gore because the alternate timeline would be interesting. Would 9/11, PATRIOT ACT, and Afghanistan + Iraq occupations still happen? Maybe all of them except Iraq.
 
Bush and Gore were pretty much the same candidate outside of a couple of policy differences. At least Bush got rid of the Assault Weapons Ban.

 
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Answering the question without the benefit of hindsight if you're anti-War George Bush is, surprisingly, your candidate.

No, that would be Pat Buchanan. Even in 2000 it was obvious that the Democrats and Republicans were both neoliberal/globalist parties.
 
Bush and Gore were pretty much the same candidate outside of a couple of policy differences. At least Bush got rid of the Assault Weapons Ban.

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He didn't really get rid of it. It sunsetted in 2004 due to it not being renewed. It was more so the fact that congress couldn't pass an extension, which he would have supported.
 
At least Bush got rid of the Assault Weapons Ban.
During the campaign George Bush actually supported renewing the assault weapons ban.

"In October 2000, Bush spokesperson Ray Sullivan told Salon magazine that he would expect then-candidate Bush to reauthorize the ban". (source)
"In 1999, then-Gov. George W. Bush supported the ban on assault weapons, saying 'it makes no sense for assault weapons to be around our society.'" (source)

As recently as 2003 the Bush white house said they would work with congress to get an assault weapons ban renewed, though ultimately this didn't come to pass and the ban quietly expired. It was perhaps because of his rather pro gun control stance that George Bush was not even mentioned once during the speeches at the 2000 annual NRA convention, though they did bad mouth Al Gore quite a bit.
 
im gonna have to go with bush, i dont trust this al gore fellow. i think bush will bring stable mediocrity to the federal government which is all we can hope for really. some tax cuts, anti-fag, no big rocking of the boat with him imo
 
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