Containment 5/17/2018 - SORBET'S LOST

[Fareal]

Do people in America poison cats?

My mum is an inveterate cat poisoner to this day, although she’s careful now to make sure I don’t catch her.

The rate of feline death in our wee local area is much higher than seems to be normal, and I always suspect her wee saucer of cream and antifreeze is to blame.

Her neighbours lost four cats in six months a couple of years back, but luckily didn’t replace them. I know they came in her garden so I’m certain she offed them.

Are there people like her in America? Could that be what’s happened to Sorbet?

 

[Jaimas]

Do people in America poison cats?

My mum is an inveterate cat poisoner to this day, although she’s careful now to make sure I don’t catch her.

The rate of feline death in our wee local area is much higher than seems to be normal, and I always suspect her wee saucer of cream and antifreeze is to blame.

Her neighbours lost four cats in six months a couple of years back, but luckily didn’t replace them. I know they came in her garden so I’m certain she offed them.

Are there people like her in America? Could that be what’s happened to Sorbet?

It's possible. There was several people in Northport doing that for years before they got caught by police.

My biggest concern is that Sorbet went on "The Long Walk." Outdoor male cats tend to do this thing in their final days where they wander into their territory, one last time, to survey it, as if overlooking their accomplishments. More dominant male cats establish bigger territories and so as a general rule roam a lot farther. An unfortunate side effect of this is that usually they pass away on this last trip, far from home.

 

[zap2theextreme]

Do people in America poison cats?

My mum is an inveterate cat poisoner to this day, although she’s careful now to make sure I don’t catch her.

The rate of feline death in our wee local area is much higher than seems to be normal, and I always suspect her wee saucer of cream and antifreeze is to blame.

Her neighbours lost four cats in six months a couple of years back, but luckily didn’t replace them. I know they came in her garden so I’m certain she offed them.

Are there people like her in America? Could that be what’s happened to Sorbet?

what the fuck?

 

[nvrwastetree]

Presumably his attending vet didn’t think there was a surplus of benefit to removing his eye. His gammy paw was likely causing him pain and/or presented an infection risk.

Anyone know if that 8-ball of an eye would still function in any capacity?

I would have to say no. Sorbet is probably blind in one eye now, and if by some miracle he can see out of that eye, it's going to be really blurry.

 

[Marvin]

I've got to disagree with @Marvin on Sorbet not having health problems. Healthy cats don't wheeze and "make snorting sounds" when they breathe.

After it got hit by a car and the bones heal, if the facial bones healed in a funny way, it's going to wheeze for the rest of its life.

That's going to be a lifelong disability. Like a three legged dog limping. It sucks, but that's how things are.

The only point in time that could've been prevented was Chris took Sorbet to the vet and had to make the decision on whether or not to euthanize.

But cats being kept mostly indoors as pets still need more than just food and water.

These are outdoor cats. All they need is food and water and a safe place to sleep.

Marvin may own a couple of cats, himself - but with assumptions like that, he doesn't come off as an expert on cat habitual preferences to me. More like someone trying to defend CWC's lack of proper pet care.

It wasn't a serious point in any argument, but yes, cats do like climb in and over shit like boxes.

Chris does give his outdoor cats proper care. An outdoor cat is basically a semi feral animal that comes to sleep in your house sometimes. Providing a place where it can sleep and where it won't get ambushed by wild animals is proper pet care.

Do people in America poison cats?

My mum is an inveterate cat poisoner to this day, although she’s careful now to make sure I don’t catch her.

The rate of feline death in our wee local area is much higher than seems to be normal, and I always suspect her wee saucer of cream and antifreeze is to blame.

Her neighbours lost four cats in six months a couple of years back, but luckily didn’t replace them. I know they came in her garden so I’m certain she offed them.

Are there people like her in America? Could that be what’s happened to Sorbet?

I've heard of stuff like this, yeah.

Not sure how common it is.

 

[nvrwastetree]

I've got to disagree with @Marvin on Sorbet not having health problems. Healthy cats don't wheeze and "make snorting sounds" when they breathe. I also have to disagree with the notion that Chris is fit to be a cat owner. Chris is lazy, incompetent, and extremely negligent. Are cats fairly easy to take care of? Yes. But cats being kept mostly indoors as pets still need more than just food and water. The Chandler cats rarely have their litter box(es) cleaned, their living environment is filthy, they live in a house where dogs piss and shit on the floor, they only ever see the vet when they are either hurt or seriously ill, they don't get their shots...that simply isn't good pet care. That isn't even mediocre pet care. "Food and water" isn't even the bare minimum for an indoor cat. Chris is simply too negligent to properly care for any pet.

A few of us here have been telling Marvin that sorbet has health issues only to have him say that the cat is healthy, even when there's proof that he's not (from what Chris has said, to the videos featuring sorbet). I think what people fail to realize is that sorbets health issues are going to effect him the rest of his life. They aren't going to magically dissapear and the cats going to be better. It doesn't work like that. When pets like sorbet have respiritory issues, you have to watch them. It's like saying to someone who has a brain tumor, terminal cancer, or liver failure that they do not have health issues and that they're healthy. Plus, as I said before we don't know if sorbet had any issues prior to Chris "adopting" him like FIV or feline leukemia. But yeah, sorbet is a healthy cat with no health issues.

After it got hit by a car and the bones heal, if the facial bones healed in a funny way, it's going to wheeze for the rest of its life.

That's going to be a lifelong disability. Like a three legged dog limping. It sucks, but that's how things are.

That's known as a health issue Marvin.

Marvin may own a couple of cats, himself - but with assumptions like that, he doesn't come off as an expert on cat habitual preferences to me. More like someone trying to defend CWC's lack of proper pet care.

I agree. I don't know why Marvin does what he does, maybe it's him genuinely liking Chris, or maybe it's trolls remorse, but it's really odd that Marvin can claim that sorbet is healthy when he's clearly not.

 

[Marvin]

A few of us here have been telling Marvin that sorbet has health issues only to have him say that the cat is healthy, even when there's proof that he's not (from what Chris has said, to the videos featuring sorbet). I think what people fail to realize is that sorbets health issues are going to effect him the rest of his life. They aren't going to magically dissapear and the cats going to be better. It doesn't work like that. When pets like sorbet have respiritory issues, you have to watch them. It's like saying to someone who has a brain tumor, terminal cancer, or liver failure that they do not have health issues and that they're healthy. Plus, as I said before we don't know if sorbet had any issues prior to Chris "adopting" him like FIV or feline leukemia. But yeah, sorbet is a healthy cat with no health issues.

That's known as a health issue Marvin.

I agree. I don't know why Marvin does what he does, maybe it's him genuinely liking Chris, or maybe it's trolls remorse, but it's really odd that Marvin can claim that sorbet is healthy when he's clearly not.

I'm not saying "sorbet is a healthy cat with no health issues" with no context. I'm clearly explaining what I mean. I'm distinguishing having a lifelong disability, like an amputation or missing an eye, with having a chronic health condition like AIDS.

I've explained this and people keep sperging about how "oh man, sorbet was probably going off to die". No, if the cat does not immediately die and it heals up, it has adapted to its new way of life. Having respiratory issues doesn't constantly drain you down to zero. It kills you immediately or not at all.

If you saw an amputee running a marathon, you'd describe them as healthy. That's the terminology I'm using.

Unfortunately, because of American's attitudes towards outdoor cats, we regularly regard lots of maimings and injuries as something the animal will just have to adapt to. Really rich people will spend a bunch of money for emergency treatment for their cat. But that is not typical of most cat owners in the US.

It's downright laughable. Think cats who hunt rats in the barn. The idea that some guy in a rural area would spend money to fix that cat up is laughable. There are millions of cats in that sort of situation in the US. They're called "outside cats".

Chris took Sorbet to the vet, they patched him up, did the best they could, and Sorbet just has to live with it for the rest of his life. It sucks, but everything in that arc of a story is completely standard practice here.

Edit: Well, and many people just wouldn't take Sorbet to the vet in the first place. They might just shoot him.

And this is not about Chris himself. This is about seeing how little people care about cats, and I regard Chris' attitude and actions as above the cut from what I've seen. Chris is a better cat owner than many I've seen.

Chris' house being gross is a non-issue in the grand scheme of things. People focus on that because it's a visceral response on their part, but honestly I don't think they have a realistic understanding of cat ownership here.

 

[Rich Lee Konsumov]

Do people in America poison cats?

My mum is an inveterate cat poisoner to this day, although she’s careful now to make sure I don’t catch her.

The rate of feline death in our wee local area is much higher than seems to be normal, and I always suspect her wee saucer of cream and antifreeze is to blame.

Her neighbours lost four cats in six months a couple of years back, but luckily didn’t replace them. I know they came in her garden so I’m certain she offed them.

Are there people like her in America? Could that be what’s happened to Sorbet?

I take it you were disappointed with the response you got the last time you posted this spiel?

 

[nvrwastetree]

If you saw an amputee running a marathon, you'd describe them as healthy. That's the terminology I'm using.

Healthy because the dudes running with one leg, but on the other hand, it's still a health issue on top of aliments we don't know the runner has. Cats (pets/animals in general) are usually more fragile than humans. What the common cold/flu/infectious disease is to us and how it effects us is completely different to how it effects animals and pets.

 

[Marvin]

Healthy because the dudes running with one leg, but on the other hand, it's still a health issue on top of aliments we don't know the runner has.

This isn't about possibilities, but rather articulatable reasons why we should think there's an ailment. Any person on the street could have an ailment. You need to be able to explain why you think so.

Amputations don't induce additional diseases. (I mean, aside from any initial infections.)

Cats (pets/animals in general) are usually more fragile than humans. What the common cold/flu/infectious disease is to us and how it effects us is completely different to how it effects animals and pets.

That's simply the nature of the beast of owning outdoor cats. Hell, it's not even just cars. They get into fights and fuck each up too. They lose eyes from those fights.

 

[Rich Lee Konsumov]

I'm not saying "sorbet is a healthy cat with no health issues" with no context. I'm clearly explaining what I mean. I'm distinguishing having a lifelong disability, like an amputation or missing an eye, with having a chronic health condition like AIDS.

I've explained this and people keep sperging about how "oh man, sorbet was probably going off to die". No, if the cat does not immediately die and it heals up, it has adapted to its new way of life. Having respiratory issues doesn't constantly drain you down to zero. It kills you immediately or not at all.

If you saw an amputee running a marathon, you'd describe them as healthy. That's the terminology I'm using.

Unfortunately, because of American's attitudes towards outdoor cats, we regularly regard lots of maimings and injuries as something the animal will just have to adapt to. Really rich people will spend a bunch of money for emergency treatment for their cat. But that is not typical of most cat owners in the US.

It's downright laughable. Think cats who hunt rats in the barn. The idea that some guy in a rural area would spend money to fix that cat up is laughable. There are millions of cats in that sort of situation in the US. They're called "outside cats".

Chris took Sorbet to the vet, they patched him up, did the best they could, and Sorbet just has to live with it for the rest of his life. It sucks, but everything in that arc of a story is completely standard practice here.

Edit: Well, and many people just wouldn't take Sorbet to the vet in the first place. They might just shoot him.

And this is not about Chris himself. This is about seeing how little people care about cats, and I regard Chris' attitude and actions as above the cut from what I've seen. Chris is a better cat owner than many I've seen.

Chris' house being gross is a non-issue in the grand scheme of things. People focus on that because it's a visceral response on their part, but honestly I don't think they have a realistic understanding of cat ownership here.

The thing is, because of the myriad complications that can arise from an ongoing respiratory problem and neurological injury in a cat, particularly if it isn’t being actively managed with regular vet checkups, Sorbet is/was closer to the AIDS patient side of your analogy.

I really don’t see why people should curb their criticisms of Chris on this matter just to accomodate prevailing low standards in cat ownership. If you’re not going to give a cat a nice place to live and decent vet coverage, don’t own one, end of. That goes whether you’re Chris or Cledus T Sorghumpus.

 

[MilkAddict]

Holy shit, what is this turning into? DSP made enough cows to last, at this rate Sorbet alone will overtake him. Atleast on the bright side Sorbet, in death (potentially) will have had more success than DSP and CWC combined.

 

[Marvin]

The thing is, because of the myriad complications that can arise from an ongoing respiratory problem and neurological injury in a cat, particularly if it isn’t being actively managed with regular vet checkups, Sorbet is/was closer to the AIDS patient side of your analogy.

I don't think we really consider "complications" with cat injuries very often. I think we think in terms of "dead" or "not dead". And that decision gets made in the heat of the moment at the vet.

But fair enough.

I really don’t see why people should curb their criticisms of Chris on this matter just to accomodate prevailing low standards in cat ownership. If you’re not going to give a cat a nice place to live and decent vet coverarge, don’t end one, end of. That goes whether you’re Chris or Cledus T Sorghumpus.

I'm glad you brought this up.

Chris specific commentary is what most people come here for, I think. Criticizing Chris for something only he does is enjoyable discussion. Criticizing Chris for something everyone does is dull and uninteresting circlejerking.

Like for example, if someone got pictures of Chris parking illegally, I think a lot of people here would roll their eyes at it. Only the spergiest of the sperglords would give a shit.

Now Chris parking illegally in the judge's spot at the courthouse? (Which he did!) That's fucking hilarious.

See what I mean?

I'm very much against outdoor cats. I also can't stand people not getting their cats spayed or neutered. I've got a grocery list of things I find annoying about cats in the US. But Chris kept an outdoor cat. I can't do anything about that. It'd be weird and spergy if someone did something about that (like stealing his cat), because people aren't out stealing every other outdoor cat owner's cats. It'd be weird vigilante justice against some fat nobody on the internet. So moving on from that: Chris' cat got hit by a car. He took the cat to the vet. That's more than a lot of people would do. I appreciate that.

Although, an important thing is: my attitude would do a 180 if Chris' cats were entirely indoor cats. If they actually were forced to stay inside the trashheap that is 14BC, then yeah, that's not acceptable. But since they are let out, and seem to come back regularly, then I can't find anything out of the norm to criticize.

He feeds them, he lets them out, they come back. They got injured, he took them to the vet. Not sure what else needs to be said.

 

[Lipitor]

Chris does give his outdoor cats proper care. An outdoor cat is basically a semi feral animal that comes to sleep in your house sometimes. Providing a place where it can sleep and where it won't get ambushed by wild animals is proper pet care.

I've never owned a cat but I'm searching "indoor vs outdoor cat" and I'm seeing the life span of outdoors to be significantly lower than indoor cats. Seems like they can just get into more trouble. It's like 2-5 for outdoor average, 17 average for indoor. So I don't understand if you have an outdoor cat you need to be more responsible or need to adopt a "if he dies... he dies.." attitude.

 

[Marvin]

I've never owned a cat but I'm searching "indoor vs outdoor cat" and I'm seeing the life span of outdoors to be significantly lower than indoor cats. Seems like they can just get into more trouble. It's like 2-5 for outdoor average, 17 average for indoor. So I don't understand if you have an outdoor cat you need to be more responsible or need to adopt a "if he dies... he dies.." attitude.

It's really not pretty.

Having an outdoor cat requires a very fatalistic perspective. Cars, other cats and wildlife are a huge danger.

Oh, and people don't spay/neuter their cats so the population just keeps growing.

In cities they just mass because of rats. What Charlie says in this scene is very accurate (the part about having 50 cats howling outside the window, because of 10k rats running around outside):

 

[nvrwastetree]

Hell, it's not even just cars. They get into fights and fuck each

Do trucks and motorcycles get into fights as well Marvin...lol

 

[Rich Lee Konsumov]

I don't think we really consider "complications" with cat injuries very often. I think we think in terms of "dead" or "not dead". And that decision gets made in the heat of the moment at the vet.

But fair enough.

I'm glad you brought this up.

Chris specific commentary is what most people come here for, I think. Criticizing Chris for something only he does is enjoyable discussion. Criticizing Chris for something everyone does is dull and uninteresting circlejerking.

Like for example, if someone got pictures of Chris parking illegally, I think a lot of people here would roll their eyes at it. Only the spergiest of the sperglords would give a shit.

Now Chris parking illegally in the judge's spot at the courthouse? (Which he did!) That's fucking hilarious.

See what I mean?

I'm very much against outdoor cats. I also can't stand people not getting their cats spayed or neutered. I've got a grocery list of things I find annoying about cats in the US. But Chris kept an outdoor cat. I can't do anything about that. It'd be weird and spergy if someone did something about that (like stealing his cat), because people aren't out stealing every other outdoor cat owner's cats. It'd be weird vigilante justice against some fat nobody on the internet. So moving on from that: Chris' cat got hit by a car. He took the cat to the vet. That's more than a lot of people would do. I appreciate that.

Although, an important thing is: my attitude would do a 180 if Chris' cats were entirely indoor cats. If they actually were forced to stay inside the trashheap that is 14BC, then yeah, that's not acceptable. But since they are let out, and seem to come back regularly, then I can't find anything out of the norm to criticize.

He feeds them, he lets them out, they come back. They got injured, he took them to the vet. Not sure what else needs to be said.

It’s hard to see how discussion of the Chandler cats wouldn’t wind up here, particularly when there’s posters honestly canvassing opinions from cat owners, as was the case in this thread, but I take your point and will keep it in mind the next time a discussion starts to go in the direction this one has.

 

[nvrwastetree]

It’s hard to see how discussion of the Chandler cats wouldn’t wind up here, particularly when there’s posters honestly canvassing opinions from cat owners, as was the case in this thread, but I take your point and will keep it in mind the next time a discussion starts to go in the direction this one has.

I don't see why discussion of the Chandler cats wouldn't wind up I this thread seeing it's about one of said cats. We haven't heard anything from Chris about pollo lately. I wonder if he was let out and ended up running away.

 

[James Howlett]

I'm surprised the discussion of Sorbet's health has gotten this in depth/contentious.

I'm hopeful there's an actual resolution to this that we get to hear about. Either Sorbet comes back or is found, or he's dead. Both tragic results for different reasons. I just don't want another month to pass and it's never mentioned again.

 

[Marvin]

It’s hard to see how discussion of the Chandler cats wouldn’t wind up here, particularly when there’s posters honestly canvassing opinions from cat owners, as was the case in this thread, but I take your point and will keep it in mind the next time a discussion starts to go in the direction this one has.

I don't see why discussion of the Chandler cats wouldn't wind up I this thread seeing it's about one of said cats. We haven't heard anything from Chris about pollo lately. I wonder if he was let out and ended up running away.

The discussion is fine, I just think that much of this discussion is analyzing Chris' behavior from the perspective of the "1%" cat owners who care about their cats' safety and who keep them indoors. When you discuss the topic realistically, considering that Sorbet is an outdoor cat, then you realize there's not much to talk about.

When it comes to Chris and animals, there certainly is interesting stuff to talk about:

• the horrifying situation the dogs are kept in. The cats are allowed to roam and they come back of their own accord. The dogs on the other hand are kept inside virtually all the time. They're basically ill tempered veal calves.
• Chris thinking he got the neighbor kid's cat killed and that the kid deserved it (or Chris just didn't care) - this is actually one of the most awful things Chris has done (or believes he's done, anyway). You can't really alog Chris hard enough on this point. Chris really should've gotten his ass kicked by the neighbor's dad or something over that.
• the time Chris swerved to run over a snake because "snakes are bad"

Chris is totally a shithead to animals, both intentionally and unintentionally. But not really when it comes to Sorbet.