Attack on Titan Griefing Thread - >tfw even your VA thinks that you're a loser

How will Eren be stopped?


  • Total voters
    146
  • Poll closed .
Those are some weighty assumptions you're making, as though you could say that the audience was lost when he resorted to genocide or that the rest of the Survey Corps wasn't also carrying the narrative in a story that spends a substantial amount of time not focused on Eren and his activities.

It's also difficult to dismiss the way that you used the terms "protagonist" and "antagonist" because the crux of your argument was that the lack of hero (presumably according to conventional morality that would suggest that genocide is a grave evil) meant that the story is non-operative, when the reality was that the narrative rejects that any of these characters are virtuous and suggests that you just sympathize with them even as they do reprehensible things like torture or promising slaughter-- you assert that Eren's resort to genocide must have lost the audience, but well before that point Eren outright said that he was the same as a man who, as a boy, ran through the barriers of his country and consigned his community to death.

When I meant protagonist, I don't mean hero. Because there are plenty of 'evil' protagonists done well. Eren is not one of them. The intense loops in logic to support genocide break suspension of disbelief in that the people he's killing cannot possibly be real. We're also given no reason to care. Genocide is morally bad, yes, duh. But this is a story. The way the story bends to support Eren fucking murdering the entire world is ludicrous. The fact that we don't know anything about it makes us cease to really have any stakes. We care about Paradis because that's where the majority of the story took place.

To use an example of a terrible movie, in Star Trek Generations, Captain Kirk dies for a planet full of nobodies. The assumption is the audience should give a fuck because all these innocent people will die. But we're not given any emotional connection to care.

Its the same with the outside world in this. We're given no emotional links (except god help us, Gabi) to give a shit about these people. All we know they're insane sadists who like torturing innocent people.

Going back to protagonist/antagonist, the protagonist drives the action while the antagonist opposes. They're like counterweights. With Eren going full genocide, it just becomes impossible to support him (except for the lulz), there is no equal counterweight to an antagonist for him. The cringe avengers are woefully too under developed to serve that purpose.

...yeah. That's... what part of what a narrative does. It brings its set pieces to a particular destination after a distance of some length and shape. I'm guessing you mean that the way that he got to that point broke your suspension of disbelief.

Railroading means forcing the story to go to places in an inorganic place, where you want it to go, but the situations where you've written don't merit it and there are other viable options. Genocide only breaks my suspension of disbelief just by how many other options there could have been based on PATHS and other shit. When the entire rest of the world were basically insane sadists that would take maybe a hundred fucking years to convince maybe torturing an entire people for what their ancestors did was bad, that basically ended all of my suspension of disbelief.

Dude, I think you betrayed yourself. The Rumbling was always looming in the background like a Chekhov's Vickers gun in the house of a first-time gun owning gun otaku with heavy Asperger's who keeps insisting that it can only do full auto-- I could not imagine a final climax where the Rumbling didn't happen, which meant that Eren would have had to activate it, which meant that he would have had to commit to the prospect of genocide like everyone was hoping would be an effective threat but was something they really didn't want to do. I especially wasn't thinking that he would come up with this plan to "save everyone" after reading him simultaneously eat Liberio's lunch and have the goaded Survey Corps clean up his table and foot the bill. I don't know how you thought the Rumbling wouldn't happen, or that Eren was concerned with the world after he talked about advancing until all his enemies were destroyed and then proceeding to give a grim reminder to the world powers gathered at Liberio. Mikasa even had to tell him that he killed civilians. This boy killed kids. Made them trample on each other.

This is what I get for reading in isolation. I really don't mean to offend-- I just find our divergence in expectations hilarious.

Again, the entire world are racist carictures and want to genocide an island. The fuck was he supposed to do? Not to mention since the other side acts like insane, blood thirsty race haters trained from 5 years old to want to murder an entire island, again, my suspension of disbelief is broken. This is not a 'real' war story. Its a fucking parody of one. Not to mention all we really know about the outside world is that they're all hysterical racists who want to enact genocide, torture and starvation. We're not really given a reason to sympathize with them, because their treatment of Paradis goes well beyond what's justified. So all we know that they're a bunch of insane people who are sadists and cannot be reasoned with.

I don't know, I always felt there was something more epic than the rumbling. The whole thing turned out to be way more boring than I expected. It felt like Eren had something cooler in mind than the rumbling. Fuck me for having higher expectations I guess. The rumbling felt like a plan B. That there was a more metal plan A. I did feel like the rumbling would happen, yes, but I thought something cooler would over-write it, like something would stop it or it wouldn't be effective. But that wasn't the case.

"There have been big titans."

"Yes but what if there were even BIGGER titans?"

Yawn.

Yes. Introduction of new elements in a story with ~100 pages left. How are they going to do that? The train for doing that is currently at EOL and awaiting scrapping. Literally everything you mentioned was introduced in a timely fashion.

When I talk about mythological constructs, I mean the "devil of all earth" just doesn't exist according to any indication beyond in-story folklore, we have two chapters left, and I expect the last chapter to be an epilogue. Even the giant hallucigenia was shown when Gabi blew Eren's block off however many chapters ago.

I mean shit, the guy introduced pigs like 10 chapters ago. Obviously its not going to happen. Just that like I said, 137 is an illogical, nonsensical mess that happens just because.

The next chapter will be a shitty monologue from Eren as he dies or Mikasa finally kills him and the last chapter will be the epilogue. What a fucking boring ass way to close.
 
When I meant protagonist, I don't mean hero.
That's what you were initially trying to argue, since you conflated protagonism with heroism.

The intense loops in logic to support genocide break suspension of disbelief in that the people he's killing cannot possibly be real.
No, these people completely make sense. That's the worst of it, in story-- while the Survey Corps is thinking that by putting a face to the island Eldians they may be able to convince them of their humanity, Eren rightly deduces that they'll only ever be seen as threat by non-Eldians because they are a threat, because they can turn into giant man-eating monsters at the drop of a hat, and they in fact used this power to subjugate the world centuries ago until one of their kings inexplicably cucked out after centuries of civil war and took a portion of his subjects to ɹɐɔsɐƃɐpɐW. Non-island Eldians have no incentive to join the island Eldians at the bottom of the civilization's totem pole, so they can't even get support from their own kind.

Its the same with the outside world in this. We're given no emotional links (except god help us, Gabi) to give a shit about these people. All we know they're insane sadists who like torturing innocent people.
...what about Ramzi, Hamil, their community that the Survey Corps spent time with, Annie's father, Grisha's father, or the rest of the Brauns?

Going back to protagonist/antagonist, the protagonist drives the action while the antagonist opposes. They're like counterweights. With Eren going full genocide, it just becomes impossible to support him (except for the lulz), there is no equal counterweight to an antagonist for him. The cringe avengers are woefully too under developed to serve that purpose.
I don't know what audience support has to do with the protagonist/antagonist dynamic. Eren's generally the protagonist (and I hope we can accept that as an axiom), and the "Cringe Avengers" are effectively the antagonists because they oppose him. I'd argue that they were at least sufficiently developed going into the final conflict-- even before the on-the-nose reconciliation talks between the various characters of the coalition-- but... that dynamic is a rather low bar, so I'm kind of at a loss as to trying to think of what else you could be referring to.
Railroading means forcing the story to go to places in an inorganic place, where you want it to go, but the situations where you've written don't merit it and there are other viable options. Genocide only breaks my suspension of disbelief just by how many other options there could have been based on PATHS and other shit.
But how fine is the line between "this world isn't giving me what I'd find suitable or the building blocks thereof" and "this world is actively conspiring to force this particular outcome"? It's as if you're simultaneously arguing that Eren had other choices and the narrative was forcing him into a position where genocide was the only thing he could do (i.e. he didn't have any other choices). And I think that ties into how you regard the world opposing Paradis as a collection of racist caricatures, except that the Eldians arouse anything from fear to disgust, and the reactions to those feelings are themselves varied. Here-- I've already described why Eldians are mistrusted as per the narrative. Since you're arguing that the hatred of Eldians is caricatured, what would you think would be a more rational basis for universal hatred of the Eldian? I imagine it's not the mere fact that they're nearly universally hated, since that much is possible (e.g. the Jews through most of the Common Era).

Not to mention all we really know about the outside world is that they're all hysterical racists who want to enact genocide, torture and starvation. We're not really given a reason to sympathize with them, because their treatment of Paradis goes well beyond what's justified.
Nobody outside Marley thinks much of Paradis outside it being home to more of those -- if they did, they'd carpetbomb the island themselves. They take advantage of the Marley-Paradis conflict, and in particular the loss of the Colossal, to wage war against Marley. The reason why they're moved to go to war against Paradis is because they're told by Willy that the history they tout was partly a lie and they've actually been at the complete mercy of Paradis' royal family until the point that Eren acquired the power of the Founder and had the key to its full activation as well as a motive to use everything in his arsenal up to and including the Rumbling.

I'd like to submit what I just found for consideration:
ma.png


I may have unjustly crapped on you for that time-loop theory.
 
Last edited:
I think I'm going to stop our spergery since we're obviously not going to agree and I don't want it to completely hijack the thread, even though there's not much going on right now. It seems that you really enjoy the war story aspect and I don't and we're just not going to convince each other. I feel bad for the other people having to read our massive blocks of text.

I'd like to submit what I just found for consideration:
View attachment 1919857

I may have unjustly crapped on you for that time-loop theory.

Though yes, that's why I am disappointed with the way things are going because its so much more interesting. There's nothing really to indicate that's going to happen as of yet, which is why I and others are just like 'wut' with this chapter. I honestly think the time loop is the only savior to the end of the manga, ala Jojo Part 6.

EDIT:
Also if you want to continue this spergy, we can take it to PMs.
 
Last edited:
You know, I've been looking at these new titans variants we've been seeing in the more recent chapters, and all I can think of is just how much better this series would've been if it basically just stayed a unique spin on the zombie genre, and just had these new variants be just mutant forms of already existing titans. Sort of like what the T, and other subsequent viruses do in Resident Evil. It would've prevented things from getting stale while sticking to the original premise of the story, and serving as a call back to the initial genre it was inspired from.
 
I feel bad for the other people having to read our massive blocks of text.
I don't-- they're the ones that entered a thread called "Attack on Titan Griefing Thread". What the hell is the thread for if not for griefing and griefing about griefing?

Also, I might take you up on that offer, if there was anything else you wanted to say in response.
 
You know, I've been looking at these new titans variants we've been seeing in the more recent chapters, and all I can think of is just how much better this series would've been if it basically just stayed a unique spin on the zombie genre, and just had these new variants be just mutant forms of already existing titans. Sort of like what the T, and other subsequent viruses do in Resident Evil. It would've prevented things from getting stale while sticking to the original premise of the story, and serving as a call back to the initial genre it was inspired from.

I mean, my original theory WAY WAY WAY back when it started was that Eldia was an isolated island where the last bastion of unaltered humanity stood, and had been reduced down to these massive walls. Because of some unique characteristics (the steel bamboo and the methane deposits), they developed somewhat advanced weaponry to combat these titans.

You'd think that it was basically Medieval/early 20th century tech. The basement was the important part. The basement revealed some of the secrets, not all. The warriors suddenly try to destroy Eldia because Grisha escaped with a serum to create a warrior, as well as knowing the truth. The warriors of the pure needed to find Grisha and they were unsure of where the serum was or how far it was. Which is why they don't instantly destroy Eldia. They have to see how far the truth had spread with their spies. So they created a massive amount of pressure by destroying the walls in the first chapter.

The truth is that humanity developed the titans as biological weapons and created different 'classes'. The upper class would have been the ubermencsch, perfect DNA replication. Immortals. So-Called the 'Pure'. The problem was that their immune systems lost their randomness due to all their genetic engineering, so they were forced into isolation. They view themselves as supreme beings. In order to control the population, they created castes. The 'untouchables', criminals, dissidents, political prisoners, etc. are the titans. They have all of their intelligence removed and their only desire is to devour other humans. These are weapons sent to reign in specific populations. The 'warriors' are loyal to the pure. They are the workers and such, kept at a low technological level as well. The brightest and most powerful of these are gifted with the powers of transformation. Though so they don't betray the 'Pure' each of their families and loved ones are injected with a serum that can turn them into mindless titans at any time. Not to mention the 'Pure' possess all of the colossal titans.

Eldia would basically be the rebels of this society. They split off hundreds of years ago and basically this knowledge was lost as so much is. As for Grisha, he grew tired with this oppression and escaped, knowing humanity's only hope lie with the Eldians. But the 'Pure' made a deal with the royals of Eldia. Keep the island in line, and you can have your own freedom. They knew the entire island was surrounded by titans. Its also why they executed anyone who tried to make advanced technology. The scouts always failed because there were warriors always infilitrated within Eldian society to stop them. And since Eldia had no warriors of their own, it was impossible to stop them or really just get anywhere significant. The 'Pure' didn't outright destroy Eldia because they figured the royals would want to live with all their creature comforts, and their arrogance decided that such a small place wasn't worth their notice.

Until Grisha gives Eren the serum. Since Grisha is basically genetically designed as the warrior caste, Eren devouring him turns him into a warrior himself. So for the first time, Eldians have a weapon. Eren's will and desire for freedom basically plows it along.

They'd reach and cross the sea, and the rest of the manga would be fighting the 'untouchables', looking for a cure for titianification and convincing the warriors to join their side. Like 3D maneuver gear around destroyed cities and fucking slashing the necks out of these weird, mutated titans. I'd limit the amount of warriors that could transform probably, because I'd want the stakes to be intense for the other characters. I wouldn't want to turn it into flesh kaijus until maybe they fight the colossals at the end of the story. Each encounter with an enemy shifter would be rare and possibly end everyone. As to not overuse it.

Eren would sort of be like superman. He's awesome, but he can't protect everyone all the time and he has some hard decisions to make. But his goals are the same. Freedom for his people.

No PATHS, no WWII shit, just sci-fi and dark fantasy, with plenty of action, gore and drama.
 
I feel bad for the other people having to read our massive blocks of text.
I'm quite enjoying reading your back-and-forth, to be honest, it's a nice change from the low-effort "Isayama is a hack writer" posts and it's interesting how differently you've both interpreted the story and characters' actions. That literally makes Attack on Titan a work of art, doesn't it?
 
For me the one really great character development post-timeskip is Reiner being suicidal, it's a completely reasonable reaction to all the trauma he's been through, and the irony of the Armored Titan having plot armor that prevents him from dying even though that's literally all he wants at this point is hilarious. He's like a reverse One Punch Man, he just wants someone to kill him but whether it's thunder spears, modern artillery, other titan shifters, or the literal apocalypse, he just can't die.
He earned that fate by continuing the mission instead aborting it. Or changing mission objective by localing and either retrieve or nom-nom Grisham Jeager first and then deciding to continue original objective or return home.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Stay safe
Okay, well, I'll get going again. Don't say I didn't warn you.

No, these people completely make sense. That's the worst of it, in story-- while the Survey Corps is thinking that by putting a face to the island Eldians they may be able to convince them of their humanity, Eren rightly deduces that they'll only ever be seen as threat by non-Eldians because they are a threat, because they can turn into giant man-eating monsters at the drop of a hat, and they in fact used this power to subjugate the world centuries ago until one of their kings inexplicably cucked out after centuries of civil war and took a portion of his subjects to ɹɐɔsɐƃɐpɐW. Non-island Eldians have no incentive to join the island Eldians at the bottom of the civilization's totem pole, so they can't even get support from their own kind.

Actually Eldia lost because of a plague, they split apart and then Marley pushed their shit in. They decided to retreat to Paradis and King Cuck built the walls and then brainwashed everyone to forget what happened because he thought it would save his people from further atrocity. When it didn't, he just fully cucked out and decided to fucking starve them, torture them and slowly murder them because its 'what they deserved'.

The peace deal fucking sucked, which is why King Cuck is the worst character in the series because if he just nutted up and said, "If you don't leave our island alone, we're going to fucking wreck your shit again." He was self hating and deserved a more painful death.

Again, they're caricatures. What have the Eldians done in 200 years? Nothing. Sit in the walls. If King Cuck let them have their fucking memories maybe nobody would try to go out there. Instead Marley treats it as a concentration camp and constant punishment for a war they lost like 400 years ago. At some point you just gotta go, "Bro, just let them have the island and blockade it." The don't act like rational human beings. Why should I feel compassion? Its part of the reason people got behind Eren's retarded genocide idea, because the story just makes it the only conclusion possible. Eren still could have taken his time, done tactical strikes, worked it out with the scouts, and reduced the world's level of technology to below Paradis'. They could have stolen the world's tech. Then went, "We're not going to conquer you, but stay the fuck off our island or we'll come back and burn you to cinders." A story leading to pure genocide of humans, which we can understand, doesn't strike me as realistic. Isayama had to make the people of the world like they were in order to force it. It suspends my disbelief because rational humans don't act like that.


...what about Ramzi, Hamil, their community that the Survey Corps spent time with, Annie's father, Grisha's father, or the rest of the Brauns?

Its a handful, for the most part we see the vast majority calling for their death.

I don't know what audience support has to do with the protagonist/antagonist dynamic. Eren's generally the protagonist (and I hope we can accept that as an axiom), and the "Cringe Avengers" are effectively the antagonists because they oppose him. I'd argue that they were at least sufficiently developed going into the final conflict-- even before the on-the-nose reconciliation talks between the various characters of the coalition-- but... that dynamic is a rather low bar, so I'm kind of at a loss as to trying to think of what else you could be referring to.

Stories are all about emotion and emotional weight. Yes, he's the protagonist because he's driving the action. The problem is, if the audience can no longer relate to Eren and him killing the world, that emotional connection is severed. Which means people no longer care. The antagonists, if you can call the cringe avengers that, have largely been reactionary. I don't consider them well-developed characters at all. They simply follow Eren's shadow. That's what I mean when they're not a sufficient counterweight to him. I mean what's their plan? Use explosion and cut Eren? Without Armins Deus Ex Machina nonsense, its like every plan they've used for the series almost. Its not inspiring. Its not unique. Its the same. The stakes to me just aren't there.

I don't have an emotional connection to the world at large. I don't have an emotional connection to Eren's actions (except hilarity). I don't have an emotional connection to the antagonists. Its basically, "Why should I care?" I've been given no reason to do so. I've not seen enough of the outside world except a very few small sections to care why it gets blown the fuck up. In a story, even in an act as evil as genocide, I need a reason to give a shit. The story does not give me a good enough reason. "Genocide bad is simply not good enough." Just like I keep saying, people would rather everyone on that shitty no name planet die than Captain Kirk.

But how fine is the line between "this world isn't giving me what I'd find suitable or the building blocks thereof" and "this world is actively conspiring to force this particular outcome"? It's as if you're simultaneously arguing that Eren had other choices and the narrative was forcing him into a position where genocide was the only thing he could do (i.e. he didn't have any other choices). And I think that ties into how you regard the world opposing Paradis as a collection of racist caricatures, except that the Eldians arouse anything from fear to disgust, and the reactions to those feelings are themselves varied. Here-- I've already described why Eldians are mistrusted as per the narrative. Since you're arguing that the hatred of Eldians is caricatured, what would you think would be a more rational basis for universal hatred of the Eldian? I imagine it's not the mere fact that they're nearly universally hated, since that much is possible (e.g. the Jews through most of the Common Era).

The Jews were hated, but I mean they take it above and fucking beyond. I'm not saying the world is, I'm saying the narrative is forcing him to do so as the only choice. He's constantly being pushed towards it. There doesn't seem to be any way out. Which is another reason why people laugh at the story, because its seemingly saying "Sometimes, you just have to genocide" and that is ludicrous.

The problem is so much time has passed between the war between Marley and Eldia, where Eldia has been in complete exile and has posed no threat for centuries, they're acting like the war happened just two days ago. Sure there can be hatred, but I call them caricatures because the insanity is that they're in exile on an island and have no boats. The rest are in camps. For centuries.

There is no rational basis for the extreme hatred and persecutions, there just isn't, unless you had another titan like the founder just brainwashing the populace to hate Paradis. People have been mortal enemies, killing each other and putting them in camps and 50 years later their shaking hands. Here they've been torturing, starving and killing Eldians for centuries. There's not a rational basis for this.

It simply doesn't work unless the world has a King Cuck version 2 who is pushing the hatred on the citizens constantly. Wouldn't that be interesting? Two founders who want to kill the Eldians, one radiating out waves of hatred, the other serenity and forgetfulness, towards one horrible goal and Eren realizes this? And that's his plan, but no one believes him? That would be a rational justification for their extreme hatred. Otherwise it breaks my suspension of disbelief. They defeated Eldia in a war even though they had Titans. It proves they're not this invincible civilization. They don't have any warriors or shifters. That have king cuck keeping them in line. So why are they constantly being terrorized? It doesn't make sense.
 
He earned that fate by continuing the mission instead aborting it. Or changing mission objective by localing and either retrieve or nom-nom Grisham Jeager first and then deciding to continue original objective or return home.
That's what makes Reiner's continual wish for suicide and his guilt even better, the fact that it was all his fault and he knew that. That's what makes Timeskip Reiner very great is that his he ended up in a hell of his own making and all he has left is to make sure Gabi doesn't become just like him.

Also still find it funny how Levi is a true manlet by the end of the day

1613335751863.png


(But why does Connie look like he has autism in this anime shot)

1613335764274.png
 
Okay, so I just thought of something.

What if the reason Eren just let the Cringevengers win was that his Titan Cancer finally caught up to him, and he's already dead?
He has four years (I think) before his Shifter AIDS kill him. That said, I would not put it past Isayama to change the rules at the last second so the Cringevengers win.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Secret Asshole
He has four years (I think) before his Shifter AIDS kill him. That said, I would not put it past Isayama to change the rules at the last second so the Cringevengers win.
Does he have four years? I thought he had less than that. I thought he had only about 1-2 years left when he set off to the KoM for the first time. Regardless, I agree with your sentiment that Isayama would change the rules to allow it to happen with his excuse probably being that either Ymir's powers or the PATHs system itself accelerated the process.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Stay safe
Does he have four years? I thought he had less than that. I thought he had only about 1-2 years left when he set off to the KoM for the first time. Regardless, I agree with your sentiment that Isayama would change the rules to allow it to happen with his excuse probably being that either Ymir's powers or the PATHs system itself accelerated the process.
I think that's Reiner and Zeke you're thinking of, Reiner has two years left and Zeke only had one left, actually it probably wasn't even a full year. Which makes Levi's obsession with killing him even more ridiculous. Isayama could've actually wrote an interesting subplot with Levi finding out it's impossible to get his revenge and having to reevaluate his mindset.
 
Does he have four years? I thought he had less than that. I thought he had only about 1-2 years left when he set off to the KoM for the first time. Regardless, I agree with your sentiment that Isayama would change the rules to allow it to happen with his excuse probably being that either Ymir's powers or the PATHs system itself accelerated the process.
That would be such a miserable fucking anti-climax I'd love it.
 
Does he have four years? I thought he had less than that. I thought he had only about 1-2 years left when he set off to the KoM for the first time. Regardless, I agree with your sentiment that Isayama would change the rules to allow it to happen with his excuse probably being that either Ymir's powers or the PATHs system itself accelerated the process.
Yeah that would be the most likely excuse I could see if he went the route of titan cancer killing Eren or somehow Eren pulls a Chris Chan acting like they foresaw their defeat happening and didn't fight fate (legit if that happens, I only can head canon Eren just pulling a massive cope that he got BTFO by everyone he likes). Also if Reiner somehow survives, I am going to laugh hard and double laugh if the curse is broken since he can't even die from that either.
 
That's what makes Reiner's continual wish for suicide and his guilt even better, the fact that it was all his fault and he knew that. That's what makes Timeskip Reiner very great is that his he ended up in a hell of his own making and all he has left is to make sure Gabi doesn't become just like him.

Also still find it funny how Levi is a true manlet by the end of the day

View attachment 1920210

(But why does Connie look like he has autism in this anime shot)

View attachment 1920211
Man, Connie in general looks like he's seen some shit. I mean, he HAS, but that shot really looks like he's having a fullblown 'Nam flashback there.

Nigga's hurtin'. ESPECIALLY since he saw best girl die on his arms.
 
(But why does Connie look like he has autism in this anime shot)
Man, Connie in general looks like he's seen some shit. I mean, he HAS, but that shot really looks like he's having a fullblown 'Nam flashback there.

Nigga's hurtin'.
He entered the PATHs system, and saw all the shit that was about to go down.
 
Man, Connie in general looks like he's seen some shit. I mean, he HAS, but that shot really looks like he's having a fullblown 'Nam flashback there.

Nigga's hurtin'. ESPECIALLY since he saw best girl die on his arms.
It's kind of amazing Connie hasn't gone completely insane at this point, with the whole "entire home village turned into mindless titans because Zeke wanted to save money on transportation costs" thing. I was half-expecting him to try to murder Zeke on the spot when I was reading the Liberio Arc.
 
Back