UN China and US fight with tariffs as they go into effect today

https://archive.fo/Lmbwz

As the day dawned across the U.S. on Friday, a new economic reality dawned with it: The tariffs long threatened against billions of dollars in Chinese goods took effect just at midnight ET while many Americans were sleeping — but Beijing was ready immediately with a wake-up call of its own.

The new trade regulations imposed by the Trump administration, which levy a 25 percent tariff on $34 billion worth of Chinese imports to the U.S., have "violated [World Trade Organization] rules and launched the largest trade war in economic history to date," China's Ministry of Commerce declared in a statement Friday.

Chinese authorities quickly retaliated with equivalent tariffs on $34 billion worth of imported U.S. goods — previously promised as ranging from vehicles to soybeans, beef and other agricultural products.

The rapid tit for tat follows weeks of anxious anticipation over the "trade remedies" President Trump vowed last month to implement. At the time he announced the tariffs, back in mid-June, Trump said the current U.S.-China economic relationship had grown to be "no longer sustainable."

"Trade between our nations," he explained, "has been very unfair, for a very long time."

And he has promised that Friday's package of economic penalties will not be the last. On Thursday aboard Air Force One, the president vowed to implement tariffs on an additional $16 billion worth of imported Chinese goods within the month.

China, for its part, has promised at each step of the way to retaliate in kind. "China is forced to strike back to safeguard core national interests and the interests of its people," its commerce ministry declared.

The two countries have engaged increasingly in verbal sparring in recent months, but Friday's pair of haymakers has dramatically escalated the trade dispute — and that has investors across the world worries about what comes next.

"What we can expect is disruption in supply chains. We can expect job losses and a decline in investor and consumer confidence," longtime Beijing-based attorney James Zimmerman tells NPR's Rob Schmitz. "And that's going to impact the stock market. And the impact on U.S. business, in my estimation, will be substantial."

Substantial they may be, but the average U.S. consumer will likely not see these impacts directly for a little while. Mary Lovely, economics professor at Syracuse University, says that roughly 60 percent of U.S.-China trade involves parts and supplies, rather than final goods — so the most immediate effect will be felt by the companies making the products, not the consumers finding them on store shelves.

But eventually those costs will take their toll on the average wallet, and it likely won't be simply because of these tariffs. Jeremy Haft, author of Unmade in China, tells NPR's Noel King that Beijing has a number of arrows in its economic quiver and that it is "already using these weapons."

"China can make it much more difficult to operate on the mainland," Haft says. "For example, they can quarantine [U.S.] products for a long time. They can make products difficult to clear customs."

He explains that he has already seen the effects in the pork industry.

"Normally, if your papers are in order, the pork proceeds smoothly through customs and into the country," he says. "But what's happened increasingly, is suddenly it became much, much more difficult for pork to clear customs and that becomes very expensive — especially with a perishable product, which can spoil in the port if its not kept in the right refrigeration condition."

The White House, however, has cast its volley of tariffs as a long overdue move to rectify a longstanding imbalance in trade between the countries — particularly, as Trump has said, in China's "unfair practices related to the acquisition of American intellectual property and technology."

But China is not the only country to find itself in Washington's crosshairs lately when it comes to trade.

The Trump administration engaged in a similar tit for tat last month with the European Union, Mexico and Canada.

In the weeks since the U.S. leveled tariffs on steel and aluminum — which the EU called illegal — Mexico retaliated with levies of 15 percent to 25 percent on U.S. agricultural products; Canada imposed tariffs on nearly $13 billion of U.S. goods; and the EU hit back with its own 25 percent tariff on distinctively American products ranging from bourbon to Harley-Davidson motorcycles.

Just days after the EU retaliation, Harley-Davidson said it plans to move its production of the motorcycles it sells in Europe overseas. The company said in a Securities and Exchange commission filing that the tariffs "would have an immediate and lasting detrimental impact to its business in the region."

The U.S. Chamber of Commerce, which has come out against the Trump administration's trade policy, published a state-by-state analysis of what it says the effects of that policy will be. The organization says some states — such as Alabama, Texas and Wisconsin, where Harley-Davidson is based — are likely to see upward of $1 billion in state exports threatened by a trade war with multiple fronts.

Still, the Trump administration sees the negative impacts as short-term "hiccups" on the path to more permanent solutions.

"The president is trying to fix long-term problems that should have been dealt with long time ago [and] weren't," Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross said earlier this week, "and there obviously is going to be some pulling and tugging as we try to deal with very serious problems."
 
In the big picture Europe and the EU are insignificant, they haven't been relevant since the end of the Cold War. I remember laughing my ass off when Trump and Kim were feuding Merkel announced she would try and mediate the situation, acting like Germany and the EU was a mover and shaker in 2018. The EU are pawns to us in our never ending feud with Russia and China, but they think they're players, it's hilarious.
 
Idk, do people who voted for Trump really care about holding influence over other nations? What has it brought them? All this talk sounds globalist, and isn't that what the US as a whole voted against?
Yeah geez. What possible merit could there be attached to being the most powerful, rich and influential nation to ever exist? :story:

In the big picture Europe and the EU are insignificant, they haven't been relevant since the end of the Cold War. I remember laughing my ass off when Trump and Kim were feuding Merkel announced she would try and mediate the situation, acting like Germany and the EU was a mover and shaker in 2018. The EU are pawns to us in our never ending feud with Russia and China, but they think they're players, it's hilarious.

Speaking economically, the EU is anything but irrelevant, specifically and especially for the US.
Strategically, they are (together with Japan) the most important partners for the US.
What Trump's politics thus far have achieved is making the EU question the status quo where they blindly support the US, cause we now slowly learn that any loudmouthed idiot can just toss aside all treaties if he dislikes them.
The EU has been the US' pawn for decades, that's correct. The question with all these recent events under Trump is whether this is set in stone or not.

If the EU has no strategic, political or economical advantage from playing nice with the US, what point is there in supporting them the way we did in the past?
 
Something seems off with all these countries saying the tarriffs are "illegal" and then retaliating with similar tarriffs in retaliation. Not really helping your case there, guys.

Not as off as Canadian and EU citizens gleefully proclaiming the fact that the tariffs they're proposing are specifically designed to target republican strongholds and influence the political process, all the while looking for Russians under their beds.

To say nothing of the many Americans cheering them on.
 
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Then there's the political side of things. Engaging in a trade war with China is a rather bad idea, but it's outright ridiculous with the EU - the US' closest ally. While the trade war might just be a short lived economical issue, the political problems and trust issues that come from this could have lasting effects to the US' detriment.
Oh no, does that mean next time the US wants something the EU might spend 2 years wagging their finger at us instead of just 1? How will we survive this chilling of relations.
 
Oh no, does that mean next time the US wants something the EU might spend 2 years wagging their finger at us instead of just 1? How will we survive this chilling of relations.
I was thinking more about the EU telling the US to go eat a dick when they prepare a new round of their famous desertland adventure rides or something like that.
Or possibly deciding that maybe it's time to wean themselves off USA's tit and start hanging out more with some other global players, following their own interests without caring what the US might think about it.

This, of course, is off in a far future, but the point is that the US-EU relationships take a turn for the worse that won't just go away once Trump finishes his second term.
Sanctions against the EU, constantly whining about the NATO 2% GDP thing, signing treaties and shitcanning them before the ink has even dried... that doesn't make the US a reliable partner to the EU.

Do those 3 things require taking bad trade deals and being willingly taken advantage of?
>US
>being taken advantage of

That's quite the amazingly reductive perspective :story:
 
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I was thinking more about the EU telling the US to go eat a dick when they prepare a new round of their famous desertland adventure rides or something like that.
I dare say we'd have little difficulty toppling another kebab dictator without a few hundred obese German welfare queens tagging along.

And who are they going to start suckling off of? Russia? China? The only people they might find more odious than us?

You know this permanent loss in global standing thing was a common talking point during the Bush administration too and nothing much came of it.
 
I dare say we'd have little difficulty toppling another kebab dictator without a few hundred obese German welfare queens tagging along.
I guess that's the reason why Bush was so passive aggressive about some european nations not following him into iraq and that whole "coalition of the willing" shtick, then.

You know this permanent loss in global standing thing was a common talking point during the Bush administration too and nothing much came of it.
As I said, this isn't what I expect to happen anytime soon (if it happens at all, which is dubious, too), I am just confused as to what Trump is trying to achieve by pissing off his closest allies (aka: the EU), given the risk of alienating them to a point where it might become a detriment to the US global position.
 
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