Chris - The Legal Issues - A Prosecutor's Perspective

Okay, changing topic from the capacity issue (fascinating though it is) — What are the chances we get to see the police custody interrogation video?

Chris is way too cocky to shut up and ask for a lawyer. Part of me suspects the cops were slowing down and letting Chris interact with the killstream onlookers in hopes of them saying something incriminating. I can’t imagine the kind of shit Chris will tell cops over the course of an hour or more (if they don’t zone out listening to the dimensional merge explained).

What is Virginia law regarding publication of recorded interrogations? Can we expect it to be presented to the jury? Would it be made public only after a plea deal or trial is set?

I am assuming we only got the Nikolas Cruz interrogation because Florida has the “sunshine” law that make all kinds of info related to charged and indicted individuals accessible through a FOIA-like mechanism. Any chance Virginia has something similar for situations like these?

To answer your questions in no particular order:

1) Virginia has a law similar to FOIA, but we would not see any interrogation or custody video until after the conclusion of the case, which is how it usually goes in VA.

2) Chris may not ask for a lawyer, but given his...well, let's just see given that it is Chris, I would put money on the police very carefully explaining his rights to him, and if there was lingering concern, finding him a social worker or similar to help explain his rights to him. Police tend to be very gunshy around miranda.
 
One thing is for sure.

There’s no doubt that Chris will manage to fuck himself long and hard, from the moment the police detective steps into the interview room.

He won’t even need to use the ol’ “I don’t think you’re a bad person, I just want your side of the story”-ruse.

Chris with his bizarre understanding of honesty (“Honesty is good, so telling strangers I shit myself is even better!”) will undoubtably just start babbling away, leaving a stunned detective thinking, if not saying out loud “WHY ARE YOU TELLING ME THIS?!”

He won’t do himself any favors on the witness stand either.

If the prosecutor has half a brain, he’ll have a female prosecutor with a kind demeanor question Chris. Who’ll no doubt see this as an occasion to impress an attractive boyfriend-free girl with his sexual prowess and skills.

I can picture his public defenders head on the desk, as Chris smugly starts explaining how he “reached his mothers G spot” (after some pain and experimentation), something “no other man has ever previously achieved”.
To quote our old friend BILLY MAYS, “WHY THE FUCK WOULD YOU OFFER THAT INFORMATION”

I mean, aside from Chris’ long history of telling trolls and the world at large shit we never wanted to know, just look at what he was already willing to tell Null and the trolls about raping his mother. Chris’ police interviews will be a car crash.
 
I do not believe Chris would be placed on the stand unless absolutely necessary. It is rare defendants ever do; they have a (not absolute right anymore, thanks SCOTUS, but very compelling protections) regarding not testifying if they do not want to. Only in rare circumstances can they be compelled to do so. I cannot think of any competent counsel putting Chris on the stand if it came to that.
Wait but doesnt chris have to actually plead the fifth himself? Can his lawyer plead it for him? In his prior run ins with the law he resorted to childish theatrics and getting pissy when he gets called barely functional. I think his ego is too big to just shut the fuck up.
 
Waith yeah thats an excellent point.are there any provisos for cross examining someone who's clearly delusional? Would Chris's testimony even be admissible after he tards out and starts screeching for his polyamorous gaggle of psychic furries to enact the dimensional merge?

Bro, as a governor Bill Clinton put a man with literally half a brain and a 45 IQ in the electric chair.

I assure you that Chris is far from a total outlier. As we speak, there are schizophrenics in dozens of courtrooms babbling away about Satan and aliens.

The only difference it might make, is that the most obviously insane ones never make it to a trial, but just plead guilty to whatever their defender and the prosecutor can agree on.

I can easily picture Chris turn down a plea deal though and insist on a trial.

(Especially if his defender inadvertently makes the mistake of presenting the plea deal as a result of Chris being a tard and not a deal reached because of his public figure and “internet fame”.)
 
Wait but doesnt chris have to actually plead the fifth himself? Can his lawyer plead it for him? In his prior run ins with the law he resorted to childish theatrics and getting pissy when he gets called barely functional. I think his ego is too big to just shut the fuck up.

A lawyer can invoke the fifth amendment on behalf of their client in federal court, I'm not sure about Virginia specifically but I imagine it won't be too far off. But not to slag overburdened and overworked PDs, but I still think we're speaking about the most remote chance it goes to trial at all.
 
I can easily picture Chris turn down a plea deal though and insist on a trial.

Personally I doubt it. Maybe if he is out and about, but if they keep him locked up or he violates bail conditions (which may well restrict his internet or social media usage)? All the public defender has to tell him is that after pleading he will be going home "soon" or that he'll be sent to a prison with relatively more freedom than a regional jail or county lockup. Deprive Chris of his asspats, social media, videogames, and legos for long and he will deal. Depending on what details come out I don't think a probationary sentence is unlikely (although that could change with a quickness depending on how deep they go on charges).
 
Wait but doesnt chris have to actually plead the fifth himself? Can his lawyer plead it for him? In his prior run ins with the law he resorted to childish theatrics and getting pissy when he gets called barely functional. I think his ego is too big to just shut the fuck up.
DING DING! We have a winner.

Unless his defender handles him with the most gentle of kid gloves, reverse psychology and utmost respect (All three of which are extremely doubtful), Chris will fall over himself to fuck this up for himself.

Chris, more than anything, hates to be “misunderstood”.

He will turn down a slap on the wrist plea deal without a second thought, if he thinks it’ll give him a chance to explain himself.

Chris will believe that if he only explains the whole thing TRULY AND HONESTLY, they’ll understand and find him not guilty, since he didn’t do anything wrong.
 
Okay well no one will rent to Chris for many reasons, especially with a felony conviction when that takes place, and the restrictions on where a sex offender can live are super strict. And cops constantly check and recheck the address and that the dude actually resides there. I see no way for Chris to secure compliant living conditions. This would cause him to be imprisoned, right?

Not having a place to live does not immediately place felons in prison. Plenty of felons are homeless or transient. You can still meet with a parole officer if you don’t have a permanent address.

While it’s true that it is more difficult to find rents housing if you’re a sex offender or felon, there are many slumlords and/or housing complexes etc. (ie certain trailer parks, certain apartment buildings) that cater specifically to these types of individuals. With sex offenders, they’re usually located in “bad” or remote areas where they are located within legally acceptable distances from facilities such as schools that some offenders are prohibited from being near.

Almost all of these places accept Section 8, too.
 
I suspect the weens calling the cops so much made them think it was a high publicity case (not wrong). How likely was it that the charges being pressed was accelerated by the attention? Or were charges filed normally quickly and the arrest was accelerated?

On the jail lookup site, they say "INCEST W/ OWN CHILD OR GRANDCHILD". I assume this is not a super formal thing - just a "close enough" for the public.

View attachment 2402461
At the jail they probably type in 18.2-366 and that's what comes up as the title of the offense. But it includes the whole section on incest offenses. Otherwise it'd be something like "Sexual contact among persons forbidden to marry". But the way that title is written it could include incest, and it could include adultery.
 
Personally I doubt it. Maybe if he is out and about, but if they keep him locked up or he violates bail conditions (which may well restrict his internet or social media usage)? All the public defender has to tell him is that after pleading he will be going home "soon" or that he'll be sent to a prison with relatively more freedom than a regional jail or county lockup. Deprive Chris of his asspats, social media, videogames, and legos for long and he will deal. Depending on what details come out I don't think a probationary sentence is unlikely (although that could change with a quickness depending on how deep they go on charges).

Yeah, but what are the chances of Chris being kept locked up for a crime that carries a penalty of up to a year, when he presents zero flight risk?

He’ll either be released on his own recognizance, or (more likely) get bail set so low that he or someone else can pay it.

best case scenario is that cwc is institutionalized.

Guys, he’s not getting institutionalized. He lived his whole adult life as an emancipated adult, and they’re not going to take that away and throw him into the funny house for fucking Barb.

Sorry, that’s the way the cookie crumbles.

(Especially after most of the asylums were closed down.)
 
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Yeah, but what are the chances of Chris being kept locked up for a crime that carries a penalty of up to a year, when he presents zero flight risk?

He’ll either be released on his own recognizance, or (more likely) get bail set so low that he or someone else can pay it.
Isnt the whole being evicted from 14BC still an issue though? He cant go posting bail without an address
 
DING DING! We have a winner.

Unless his defender handles him with the most gentle of kid gloves, reverse psychology and utmost respect (All three of which are extremely doubtful), Chris will fall over himself to fuck this up for himself.

Chris, more than anything, hates to be “misunderstood”.

He will turn down a slap on the wrist plea deal without a second thought, if he thinks it’ll give him a chance to explain himself.

Chris will believe that if he only explains the whole thing TRULY AND HONESTLY, they’ll understand and find him not guilty, since he didn’t do anything wrong.
I can't agree enough. These cops buddy up to much smarter people and extract confessions all the time. They're experts at it. Chris isn't an expert on anything except for CWCville.
 
So if I read this thread correct, there's no chance for his PD to push for a not guilty by insanity plea (because Chris will fuck it up) and his best bet is taking a plea deal?

There is never no chance, but NGRI in this case is as close to zero as you can functionally get in terms of law.

Chris's only viable path forward is to take a plea deal, and defending on how his counsel explains it, there is a 99% chance he will. Chris still has an absolute right to a trial if he insists on one, but this would be a disaster (for him).

The two ways I sort of cut on this is by default, I want to see clients walk, but on the other, a facility is likely the best place for Chris at this point for many reasons.
 
So if I read this thread correct, there's no chance for his PD to push for a not guilty by insanity plea (because Chris will fuck it up) and his best bet is taking a plea deal?
NGRI is built upon the concept of the defendant being either chronically or temporarily unable to determine what's right and wrong. As its been previously stated the fact that Chris lied to Null and tried to keep bella quiet on the whole issue is proof that he was more than aware that ploughing Borb was wrong (understatement of the century)
 
Yeah, but what are the chances of Chris being kept locked up for a crime that carries a penalty of up to a year, when he presents zero flight risk?

He’ll either be released on his own recognizance, or (more likely) get bail set so low that he or someone else can pay it.
Not particularly high. Chris is interesting due to his internet fame, but as criminal offenders go he isn't anything exemplary.

I think it is much more likely he may violate his bail conditions though if they include restrictions on internet usage or the like. Or contact with Barb.

Pretrial services can assist with the whole registered address issue and can place him on electronic monitoring. I have in the past known VA to have decent pretrial service programs. I've been in the area but I'm not sure exactly on the jurisdiction who will be prosecuting (Virginia has a very convoluted court system with multiple court levels and some cities that would generally be considered very small will maintain their own courts instead of being county level like on most places- they'll proudly refer to their commonwealth sovereign cities as being a good idea, but it's mostly confusing) but if the area includes Charlottesville, they're pretty hippy-dippy over there and are likely to try and get a trooned out autistic out of jail if they can.
 
For every CP watcher that gets caught how many are still at large?


Thousands more. That's not even the actual predators or like a pedo ring, just the people who are downloading CP. A lot won't even get caught because they use methods to avoid detection and don't interact with others/share files. Can't speak on North America but a lot of people are getting caught using torrent services with no VPN or a VPN willing to hand over their information, these aren't complicated people like the ones running networks and rings on TOR that involve people all over the world doing the worst things you can imagine.

In Europe we are already having problems figuring what exactly to do with all of these people, prisons would be overloaded instantly if we threw them all in there and recent studies show there are issues when you put a bunch of people all into this in the same place and they suddenly have a ton of contacts when they get out lol. Treatment can possibly be successful, not in the case of Chris I imagine because there are so many other elements but even then a sex offender has to be managed outside of prison. Unfortunately they can't be watched 24/7 unless the court agrees to allow certain software to be installed on their computer and getting anything like that done in Europe is a pain (trying to convince a court to ban internet use is even more complex). It's the same kind of software that some schools use that detects certain things if people try to look at porn or other things and can be useful to monitor what kind of life a person on probation or getting treatment is living. In some cases you're just banging your head against a brick wall with somebody who can't or won't stop offending. In many cases they don't even move on to what we call "contact offences" they just won't stop downloading CP and being dragged back to court.

But back to the original thing you asked, they are always out there and you'd never pick them out. There are some patterns but for the most part they are normal people, they are getting younger, gone are the days where it was the domain of the sexually frustrated retiree. Many tend to be guys in their 20's,30's and 40's who live isolated existences and spend most of their time at a computer. Anime with a particular focus on lolicon stuff and childish games like Minecraft, Fortnite and Nintendo games are common hobbies with people I deal with and as we see in regular Youtube and tournament scandals. So by that notion several people who use this site are probably watching it as are some people you know. So sleep well tonight.
 
Guys, he’s not getting institutionalized. He lived his whole adult life as an emancipated adult, and they’re not going to take that away and throw him into the funny house for fucking Barb.

Sorry, that’s the way the cookie crumbles.

(Especially after most of the asylums were closed down.)

It’s very unlikely he’ll get institutionalized. He is not violent, nor is he incapable of providing basic needs for himself. But more importantly, he won’t get locked up because Virginia’s mental hospitals are fucked right now.

Here’s information on the state of Virginia’s psychiatric institutions from July 2021 — less than one month ago:


Virginia orders 5 state mental hospitals to stop taking new admissions amid staffing crisis​


By Jenna Portnoy
July 9, 2021 at 8:17 p.m. EDT

The Virginia commissioner in charge of behavioral health on Friday closed five of the state’s eight adult mental health hospitals to new admissions, a step she said is necessary to protect workers amid unprecedented staffing shortages.

The pandemic exacerbated overcrowding and inadequate staffing at the state’s psychiatric hospitals, which are required to admit some of the most challenging and often violent patients under involuntary detention orders.

Calling the situation an “immediate crisis,” Alison Land, the commissioner of Behavioral Health and Developmental Services, said about 30 percent of positions that directly support patients are vacant, with 108 people having resigned over the past two weeks, citing long hours and lack of safety.

Workers who left during coronavirus outbreaks early in the pandemic were able to get better paying, less stressful jobs elsewhere and have not returned, she has said.

“The result is a dangerous environment where staff and patients are at increasing risk for physical harm and where effective treatment to help patients recover is much harder to deliver,” Land wrote.

There are on average 4 1/2 incidents or injuries to employees or patients every day across state psychiatric facilities, with 63 serious injuries since July 1, she said.

New admissions are closed at Catawba Hospital, Central State Hospital, Eastern State Hospital, Piedmont Geriatric Hospital and Western State Hospital, Land wrote in her letter, while Northern Virginia Mental Health Institute, Southern Virginia Mental Health Institute and Southwestern Virginia Mental Health Institute can continue to accept patients.

The letter comes as state lawmakers prepare to convene for a special session in August to decide how to spend the first tranche of more than $4 billion — Virginia’s share of American Rescue Plan Act money — to help the economy recover and make investments for the future.

Gov. Ralph Northam (D), a pediatric neurologist, will propose devoting a “significant amount” of the federal funding to increasing salaries, hiring workers and taking other actions to ensure the well-being of patients and employees at the mental health hospitals, spokeswoman Alena Yarmosky said.

Lawmakers have been meeting for weeks to come up with proposals for how to use the money for mental health and have discussed staff bonuses, expanding loan forgiveness programs in exchange for working in an underserved area and funding crisis centers as alternatives to emergency rooms and jails for people in crisis.

State Sen. Creigh Deeds (D-Bath), chairman of the Joint Subcommittee to Study Mental Health Services in the Twenty-First Century, supported the ideas but noted that the pandemic money is one-time funding. He hoped lawmakers would come up with a long-term strategy to boost salaries in the special session.

“We are in a desperate situation,” he said. “I get why admissions had to be closed. I’m frustrated and saddened by it, but we’ll do what it takes to fix the issue.”

Anna Mendez, board president of the nonprofit advocacy group Mental Health America of Virginia and executive director of the Charlottesville affiliate, Partner for Mental Health, attributed the bed shortage, in part, to years of inadequate funding of community-based mental health services leading to an overreliance on inpatient treatment.

Virginia should “double its mental health care spending, bringing it into to the top 10 in the nation, so that our commonwealth can better support its residents with mental illness and crises like these can be prevented in the future,” she said.

The Commonwealth Center for Children and Adolescents, which treats minors in Staunton, has a 57 percent job vacancy in direct patient care positions, which has caused the 48-bed facility to go down to just 18 beds, Jaime Bamford, the medical director at CCCA, said.
The center has seen increased aggression, suicidal thoughts and attempts, and psychosis as well as substance abuse and other behaviors among its patients, exacerbated by the isolation and stress of the pandemic, she said.

“It’s a really critical time for CCCA in providing safe supervision for the children in our care,” Bamford said in an interview Friday.

A report by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention released last month found across the United States, adolescent girls’ visits to emergency departments for suicide attempts increased by about 50 percent from the early months of 2019 to the same period this year.

A spokeswoman for Land did not respond to a request for comment on whether Land’s letter exempts the state psychiatric hospitals from a rule that says the facilities must provide the “bed of last resort” for involuntary detention if a bed cannot be found elsewhere.

Land has said the rule allowed private hospitals to decline the most challenging cases because the public hospitals had no choice but to admit them. Since the rule went into place in 2014, she said, daily admissions at public hospitals increased from about 4 to more than 18.

Northam last summer signed an executive order pausing the rule because of the pandemic, but the order expired on June 30 after the coronavirus state of emergency lifted.

In her letter, Land called on private hospitals to admit more challenging cases given the dire staffing shortages at the public facilities.
In response to the letter, Julian Walker, a spokesman for the Virginia Hospital and Healthcare Association, said bed shortages mean people with acute psychiatric needs wait in emergency departments for hours or days, delaying care to other people.

“The challenges of this have ripple effects that can be felt across the continuum of care throughout the public health and private health system,” he said.

Private hospitals are facing similar challenges, such as staffing shortages — meaning it wouldn’t be safe for them to take in certain patients, either, Walker said.

“We continue to see an increase in demand for these services . . . and this situation unfortunately may get worse before it gets better,” he said.[/quote)
 
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