#Comicsgate - The Culture Wars Hit The Funny Books!

[Mister Dongs]

Based if true.

 

[FROG]

That was back when the movement looked like it could be a real thing. Now they're resigned to being an outrage grift first and foremost.

ComicsGate? What exactly has changed for the worse? We've got bigger, better talent, we're still criticizing the culture the way we always did, and SJWs have largely given up trying to stop us. Lots of money is still being generated for creators, although joining us still means being blacklisted.

Sincerely asking...what do you mean?

Famous fence-sitter Perch lets slip that he is blacklisted from CG, having seen DMs where "people on the crowdfunding side" have warned people not to be friends with Perch because they won't promote their projects

https://youtube.com/watch?v=jX731pYy4bs:497

I haven't seen anyone talk like that.

A few of us were annoyed by that one video that Shane Davis efapped, (which was dissected by Dongs a few pages back) but Perch doesn't really get brought up very much in private, and nobody seems to be angry with him as a commentor beyond a few bits of his commentary which get discussed briefly and then quickly forgotten.

Is he fishing here to see if his associations with the Wes/Ernst/Lim group have caused him to be "blacklisted" elsewhere?

Maybe he'll show the DMs.

 

[TheCosmicWarrior]

Is he fishing here to see if his associations with the Wes/Ernst/Lim group have caused him to be "blacklisted" elsewhere?

Maybe he'll show the DMs.

I'm wondering if it's another Ernst gayop. Perch and I were friendly and then he made a video with a "rumor" that I had beef with him, which I've never said anything of the sorts. Sounds like they're up in his DMs doing the same shit they always do behind closed doors.

 

[Gar For Archer]

ComicsGate? What exactly has changed for the worse? We've got bigger, better talent, we're still criticizing the culture the way we always did, and SJWs have largely given up trying to stop us. Lots of money is still being generated for creators, although joining us still means being blacklisted.

Sincerely asking...what do you mean?

Comicsgate’s only customer base are retards still invested in culture war bullshit in Current Year+n. Its core business model is everything wrong with mainstream comics times ten.

The reason Marvel and DC are dying can basically be boiled down to 3 factors:

1. Comic books are sold almost exclusively in niche shops that normies at best don’t know exist, and at worst think are visited exclusively by neckbearded manchildren who haven’t showered in a week.

2. Comic books have turned from a cheap form of entertainment to an expensive collector’s product.

3. The people in charge care more about politics and drama than telling good stories.

Crowdfunding shrinks the audience even further by requiring you to put money up front for a product you might not receive for years, are an even worse price-to-value than the already horribly overpriced mainstream comics, and it goes without saying that the real selling point of Comicsgate for the vast majority of its supporters is the YouTube shit, because that’s all they have to entertain them while waiting for late books.

Maybe you still think you’re selling comic books, and that people are buying Cyberfrog because they think it’s a great story and can’t wait to read the next installment in 10 years, but honestly all the comics are nothing more than YouTuber merch that appeals only to the people who care about you as a creator, and is bought not for the value of the end product itself, but to show support for a creator they like. Not implying that this is a bad business model - it’s clearly working out for you. But at some point you gotta admit that comic books aren’t the real product that Comicsgate supporters come for.

Also maybe consider that with the oncoming recession, many customers will have to rethink their purchases of $20-30 comic books that give them maybe an hour’s worth of entertainment a year after the hype is gone, when they can continue to consume the YouTube drama for free.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

Comicsgate’s only customer base are retards still invested in culture war bullshit in Current Year+n. Its core business model is everything wrong with mainstream comics times ten.

The reason Marvel and DC are dying can basically be boiled down to 3 factors:

1. Comic books are sold almost exclusively in niche shops that normies at best don’t know exist, and at worst think are visited exclusively by neckbearded manchildren who haven’t showered in a week.

2. Comic books have turned from a cheap form of entertainment to an expensive collector’s product.

3. The people in charge care more about politics and drama than telling good stories.

Crowdfunding shrinks the audience even further by requiring you to put money up front for a product you might not receive for years, are an even worse price-to-value than the already horribly overpriced mainstream comics, and it goes without saying that the real selling point of Comicsgate for the vast majority of its supporters is the YouTube shit, because that’s all they have to entertain them while waiting for late books.

Maybe you still think you’re selling comic books, and that people are buying Cyberfrog because they think it’s a great story and can’t wait to read the next installment in 10 years, but honestly all the comics are nothing more than YouTuber merch that appeals only to the people who care about you as a creator, and is bought not for the value of the end product itself, but to show support for a creator they like. Not implying that this is a bad business model - it’s clearly working out for you. But at some point you gotta admit that comic books aren’t the real product that Comicsgate supporters come for.

Also maybe consider that with the oncoming recession, many customers will have to rethink their purchases of $20-30 comic books that give them maybe an hour’s worth of entertainment a year after the hype is gone, when they can continue to consume the YouTube drama for free.

I think you nailed it with the merch part. The branded beanie caps and hoodies are interchangeable now with the books as fundraising tools instead of being add-ons for what used to be the main feature. Hell super-chats are better value now, they're immediate and at least your existence is acknowledged (sometimes).

 

[Rupin]

I think you nailed it with the merch part. The branded beanie caps and hoodies are interchangeable now with the books as fundraising tools instead of being add-ons for what used to be the main feature. Hell super-chats are better value now, they're immediate and at least your existence is acknowledged (sometimes).

these superchat attention seekers are just as bad as Twitch streamer simps.

 

[FROG]

Comicsgate’s only customer base are retards still invested in culture war bullshit in Current Year+n. Its core business model is everything wrong with mainstream comics times ten.

The reason Marvel and DC are dying can basically be boiled down to 3 factors:

1. Comic books are sold almost exclusively in niche shops that normies at best don’t know exist, and at worst think are visited exclusively by neckbearded manchildren who haven’t showered in a week.

2. Comic books have turned from a cheap form of entertainment to an expensive collector’s product.

3. The people in charge care more about politics and drama than telling good stories.

Crowdfunding shrinks the audience even further by requiring you to put money up front for a product you might not receive for years, are an even worse price-to-value than the already horribly overpriced mainstream comics, and it goes without saying that the real selling point of Comicsgate for the vast majority of its supporters is the YouTube shit, because that’s all they have to entertain them while waiting for late books.

Maybe you still think you’re selling comic books, and that people are buying Cyberfrog because they think it’s a great story and can’t wait to read the next installment in 10 years, but honestly all the comics are nothing more than YouTuber merch that appeals only to the people who care about you as a creator, and is bought not for the value of the end product itself, but to show support for a creator they like. Not implying that this is a bad business model - it’s clearly working out for you. But at some point you gotta admit that comic books aren’t the real product that Comicsgate supporters come for.

Also maybe consider that with the oncoming recession, many customers will have to rethink their purchases of $20-30 comic books that give them maybe an hour’s worth of entertainment a year after the hype is gone, when they can continue to consume the YouTube drama for free.

"ComicsGate's only customer base is..." (proceeds to denigrate an active customer base that spends thousands of dollars on comic books, toys, t-shirts and merch from ComicsGate creators.)

Sorry, but that can be done with nearly any niche hobby, from railroad train collectors to sports fans.

The point is that there IS an audience for what we're doing. It's definitely on us to keep them occupied, entertained, interested and spending money on us. But they're here.

CYBERFROG is doing great as a brand. I'm not sure what percentage are buying because they like my Youtube, my activism or the stories, but we've always made it clear that we don't care, and it's none of our business. If the product is appealing the customer will keep coming back.

Crowdfunding vs. the recession is going to be tough. We'll see how it goes.

I think you nailed it with the merch part. The branded beanie caps and hoodies are interchangeable now with the books as fundraising tools instead of being add-ons for what used to be the main feature. Hell super-chats are better value now, they're immediate and at least your existence is acknowledged (sometimes).

The main feature is the IP. It's ownership over our own "BATMAN" or "SPIDER-MAN" and making toys and clothing is fun. The truth is, there isn't very much money in it compared with comics. I do it because I want to do it.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

"ComicsGate's only customer base is..." (proceeds to denigrate an active customer base that spends thousands of dollars on comic books, toys, t-shirts and merch from ComicsGate creators.)

Sorry, but that can be done with nearly any niche hobby, from railroad train collectors to sports fans.

The point is that there IS an audience for what we're doing. It's definitely on us to keep them occupied, entertained, interested and spending money on us. But they're here.

CYBERFROG is doing great as a brand. I'm not sure what percentage are buying because they like my Youtube, my activism or the stories, but we've always made it clear that we don't care, and it's none of our business. If the product is appealing the customer will keep coming back.

Crowdfunding vs. the recession is going to be tough. We'll see how it goes.


The main feature is the IP. It's ownership over our own "BATMAN" or "SPIDER-MAN" and making toys and clothing is fun. The truth is, there isn't very much money in it compared with comics. I do it because I want to do it.

You need to decide what your product is. Books with novel characters and a good story or... you. The people still buying your books while saying they don't care how many years late it's going to be are buying you, not the book. They're donating to the cause not buying Cyberfrog.

 

[FROG]

You need to decide what your product is. Books with novel characters and a good story or... you. The people still buying your books while saying they don't care how many years late it's going to be are buying you, not the book. They're donating to the cause not buying Cyberfrog.

The product is here on my eBay store. People who buy from here are buying because they like CyberFrog and the ALL CAPS COMICS branding. Probably. https://www.ebay.com/sch/cyberfrog9/m.html?item=115227027542&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.m3561.l2562

Helping me make the product through crowdfunding investments could be done because the IGG backers like me, CyberFrog or support ComicsGate in general. All of those reasons are great. I definitely need to make books faster, both to please my customers and backers, and because I'd make more money.

In any case, it's terrific and I'm grateful.

 

[Gar For Archer]

"ComicsGate's only customer base is..." (proceeds to denigrate an active customer base that spends thousands of dollars on comic books, toys, t-shirts and merch from ComicsGate creators.)

Sorry, but that can be done with nearly any niche hobby, from railroad train collectors to sports fans.

The point is that there IS an audience for what we're doing. It's definitely on us to keep them occupied, entertained, interested and spending money on us. But they're here.

CYBERFROG is doing great as a brand. I'm not sure what percentage are buying because they like my Youtube, my activism or the stories, but we've always made it clear that we don't care, and it's none of our business. If the product is appealing the customer will keep coming back.

Crowdfunding vs. the recession is going to be tough. We'll see how it goes.


The main feature is the IP. It's ownership over our own "BATMAN" or "SPIDER-MAN" and making toys and clothing is fun. The truth is, there isn't very much money in it compared with comics. I do it because I want to do it.

My point isn’t that you’re not running a lucrative grift - it’s self-evident that you’re one of the more successful YouTubers in the media-grievance sphere. My point is that it’s clear now that Comicsgate is no longer about making and selling good stories as a substitute to the floundering mainstream comics market, but rather about selling YouTube shows where viewers can get their political views affirmed by their internet daddies as a substitute to the retarded mainstream comics “community”.

 

[FROG]

My point isn’t that you’re not running a lucrative grift - it’s self-evident that you’re one of the more successful YouTubers in the media-grievance sphere. My point is that it’s clear now that Comicsgate is no longer about making and selling good stories as a substitute to the floundering mainstream comics market, but rather about selling YouTube shows where viewers can get their political views affirmed by their internet daddies as a substitute to the retarded mainstream comics “community”.

It's both of those things. ComicsGate was already selling YouTube shows where viewers can get their political views affirmed by their internet daddies as a substitute for the mainstream comics "community" when I got here.

In fact, those OG-CGers are mad that ComicsGate, in their opinion, has become more about selling comics than whining about them. So if you're right, WTF are Capn Cummings and Englentine mad about?

I've been making comic books for 30 years. Calling what I do a "grift" is an insult, and I know that it's your intention to insult me. But I tell you that I'm 100% sincere about this culture war and also see this as an opportunity for me to tell a very big story that I've had in my mind since 2010. I hope people are supporting me because they want to read it, but if they're only doing it because they hate SJWs too, that's okay. As long as I get to tell this story.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

It's both of those things. ComicsGate was already selling YouTube shows where viewers can get their political views affirmed by their internet daddies as a substitute for the mainstream comics "community" when I got here.

In fact, those OG-CGers are mad that ComicsGate, in their opinion, has become more about selling comics than whining about them. So if you're right, WTF are Capn Cummings and Englentine mad about?

I've been making comic books for 30 years. Calling what I do a "grift" is an insult, and I know that it's your intention to insult me. But I tell you that I'm 100% sincere about this culture war and also see this as an opportunity for me to tell a very big story that I've had in my mind since 2010. I hope people are supporting me because they want to read it, but if they're only doing it because they hate SJWs too, that's okay. As long as I get to tell this story.

I suspect most of them are mad because they lack the personalities to be on-air grenade throwers. They wanted to draw shit and tell stories not piss off the right people so other people throw dollar bills at them. You're good at that. Others are better at their chosen craft.

I call it a grift because you offer no solutions, just more grenades to keep your base perpetually pissed off so they'll send you more money instead of actually doing something productive with it. Rush Limbaugh was much the same. The guy died worth a billion dollars and his movement immediately collapsed because he refused to invest one cent into actual grassroots action while he was alive. Instead he bought a third Gulfstream. How many warehouses are you up to?

 

[Gar For Archer]

It's both of those things. ComicsGate was already selling YouTube shows where viewers can get their political views affirmed by their internet daddies as a substitute for the mainstream comics "community" when I got here.

In fact, those OG-CGers are mad that ComicsGate, in their opinion, has become more about selling comics than whining about them. So if you're right, WTF are Capn Cummings and Englentine mad about?

I've been making comic books for 30 years. Calling what I do a "grift" is an insult, and I know that it's your intention to insult me. But I tell you that I'm 100% sincere about this culture war and also see this as an opportunity for me to tell a very big story that I've had in my mind since 2010. I hope people are supporting me because they want to read it, but if they're only doing it because they hate SJWs too, that's okay. As long as I get to tell this story.

Drawing comics ain’t the grift, and I would never put down anybody for exercising their creativity - not even Chris Chan. I respect you (and any CG creator who’s actually gone out of their way to make a book) a hell of a lot more than the Fandom Menace retards who do nothing but bitch about Star Wars etc. while consoooooming the same shit they’re railing against.

But how is YouTube NOT grifting? There is nothing inherently creative about going on air and bitching about drama while occasionally shilling your CG buddies’ books. There’s marketing a product, and there’s having that “marketing” BECOME the product itself. There’s nothing wrong with doing it and it’s clearly doing great for business, but that doesn’t make it not a grift.

 

[FROG]

I suspect most of them are mad because they lack the personalities to be on-air grenade throwers. They wanted to draw shit and tell stories not piss off the right people so other people throw dollar bills at them. You're good at that. Others are better at their chosen craft.

Their chosen craft being secretly throwing grenades at ComicsGate creators via retarded proxies. We're not passive aggressive like that, no.

Drawing comics ain’t the grift, and I would never put down anybody for exercising their creativity - not even Chris Chan. I respect you (and any CG creator who’s actually gone out of their way to make a book) a hell of a lot more than the Fandom Menace retards who do nothing but bitch about Star Wars etc. while consoooooming the same shit they’re railing against.

But how is YouTube NOT grifting? There is nothing inherently creative about going on air and bitching about drama while occasionally shilling your CG buddies’ books. There’s nothing wrong with doing it and it’s clearly doing great for business, but that doesn’t make it not a grift.

YouTube is DEFINITELY a grift. I can't believe I get paid to do it, because I enjoy it so much. It's like having a job in radio like Howard Stern or Adam Carolla, but it was just handed to me.

Honestly, I can't defend it as anything other than a grift, except that aside from when I'm joking, I mean what I say. I'm not trying to find what the audience wants to hear and match it but with ferocity, like others do. I offer my opinion and I hope it makes people laugh. And it's the engine via which I can sell my comics, which is the main objective.

Though sometimes I enjoy doing YouTube more than drawing. One is lots of fun, the other is often a painful struggle.

 

[Newman's Own]

I have to wonder if Smiller waits till now to make his infamous tweet, is it really a big deal at all? Hell was it really a big deal then?

It's a big deal in the same way gun crime is a big deal to Democrats and overspending is a big deal to Republicans.

It's just a political lever to be exploited without a care for the actual issue.

Miller was a little to independent in his expression and this was the lever used to nudge him back in line.

when CG was trying to present itself as a centrist alternative

ComicsGay: The Joe Biden of independent comics.

ComicsGate? What exactly has changed for the worse? We've got bigger, better talent, we're still criticizing the culture the way we always did, and SJWs have largely given up trying to stop us. Lots of money is still being generated for creators, although joining us still means being blacklisted.

Sincerely asking...what do you mean?

Nothing changed for the worse unless you consider people no longer believing the club is a "moovement".

It might have been a movement. Tides seem to be changing right now in the culture war and shifts are happening in popular culture.

But CG is a non-factor in the culture war and will continue to be anon-factor because no one outside of ComicsGate knows or cares about ComicsGate. If CG was going to have an impact it would have happened three years ago. It didn't and it never will.

my activism

"Those damned essjaydubyas wrecked (insert character here). To fight them buy my RibbitCoin sticker collection."

LoL

making toys and clothing is fun. The truth is, there isn't very much money in it compared with comics.

Now this is interesting. Comics are comparatively labor intensive for the creator (Some creators average a page every two weeks or less) and therefore a single product can take forever to turn over.

Merch is how indie bands survive, some YouTubers make the lions share of their money on merch drops (some make millions) and should be very lucrative if you do it right.

Did you make a booboo sourcing the toys you raised several hundred K for?

 

[Gar For Archer]

Their chosen craft being secretly throwing grenades at ComicsGate creators via retarded proxies. We're not passive aggressive like that, no.


YouTube is DEFINITELY a grift. I can't believe I get paid to do it, because I enjoy it so much. It's like having a job in radio like Howard Stern or Adam Carolla, but it was just handed to me.

Honestly, I can't defend it as anything other than a grift, except that aside from when I'm joking, I mean what I say. I'm not trying to find what the audience wants to hear and match it but with ferocity, like others do. I offer my opinion and I hope it makes people laugh. And it's the engine via which I can sell my comics, which is the main objective.

Though sometimes I enjoy doing YouTube more than drawing. One is lots of fun, the other is often a painful struggle.

I believe you when you say that for you the comics are the #1 objective. But I’d be willing to bet that for the vast majority of CG supporters, the YouTube drama is their main draw, and that they’d be just as happy to throw money your way in the form of beanies or T-shirts or mugs and could take or leave the comics themselves.

It's a big deal in the same way gun crime is a big deal to Democrats and overspending is a big deal to Republicans.

It's just a political lever to be exploited without a care for the actual issue.

Miller was a little to independent in his expression and this was the lever used to nudge him back in line.


ComicsGay: The Joe Biden of independent comics.


Nothing changed for the worse unless you consider people no longer believing the club is a "moovement".

It might have been a movement. Tides seem to be changing right now in the culture war and shifts are happening in popular culture.

But CG is a non-factor in the culture war and will continue to be anon-factor because no one outside of ComicsGate knows or cares about ComicsGate. If CG was going to have an impact it would have happened three years ago. It didn't and it never will.


"Those damned essjaydubyas wrecked (insert character here). To fight them buy my RibbitCoin sticker collection."

LoL


Now this is interesting. Comics are comparatively labor intensive for the creator (Some creators average a page every two weeks or less) and therefore a single product can take forever to turn over.

Merch is how indie bands survive, some YouTubers make the lions share of their money on merch drops (some make millions) and should be very lucrative if you do it right.

Did you make a booboo sourcing the toys you raised several hundred K for?

tbf, I don’t imagine that @FROG is moving tens of thousands of Cyberfrog action figures. Simple shit like T-shirts and mugs you could still make an easy profit on even with an order in the low hundreds, but for a custom action figure you’d need a pretty large production run to make any real profit over the upfront cost of the tooling.

 

[Newman's Own]

tbf, I don’t imagine that @FROG is moving tens of thousands of Cyberfrog action figures. Simple shit like T-shirts and mugs you could still make an easy profit on even with an order in the low hundreds, but for a custom action figure you’d need a pretty large production run to make any real profit over the upfront cost of the tooling.

It can be done if you raise hundreds of thousands of dollars, which he did.

It's easy to make a booboo sourcing things out though and get taken for a ride by those who seemed to be the best option when the estimates came in.

 

[FROG]

It can be done if you raise hundreds of thousands of dollars, which he did.

It's easy to make a booboo sourcing things out though and get taken for a ride by those who seemed to be the best option when the estimates came in.

Nah, the action figures are fine.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

Nah, the action figures are fine.

Metric? Communist.

 

[COMMI3 MARK]

But how is YouTube NOT grifting? There is nothing inherently creative about going on air and bitching about drama while occasionally shilling your CG buddies’ books.

I like to think my shows are creative.

I'm not trying to find what the audience wants to hear and match it but with ferocity, like others do. I offer my opinion and I hope it makes people laugh.

I actually prefer it when the audience disagrees with me but still laughs at my hot take. Those lols are the sweetest and most delicious.