Communsim vs facism - which one would you live under

[DICKPICSRUS]

These ideologies are both pretty terrible in their own right.
If I had to choice I'll have to pick communism mostly because the figure of fascism were lunetics in their own right.

 

[millais]

fascism bc if i'm going to have to live under an authoritarian regime that denies me basic civil liberties and human rights, I better at least be able to keep most of my stuff

 

[Elwood P. Dowd]

Depends upon the sort of fascism you're talking about, or how you define it. F'rinstance I've seen Singapore under Lee Kwan Yew described as fascist. Assuming his regime meets the definition (and I'm not fully sure if it does) I think I'd rather live there, or in a regime like it, than in any of the state-socialist regimes that ever existed. Hungary under Admiral Horthy also comes to mind.

 

[TrannyLindsayLohan]

Fascism. Actually within shouting distance of economic sanity and usually has awesome uniforms.

 

[Woodcutting bot]

I don't like starving, so probably fash

 

[DuskEngine]

F'rinstance I've seen Singapore under Lee Kwan Yew described as fascist.

You've been talking to some real dumbasses then

 

[Sperglord Dante]

It's all the same shit. Communism, fascism, national socialism or whatever is just oppressive demagoguery with slightly different flavors of bullshit ideology.

 

[Daughter of Cernunnos]

Communism.

 

[Grog]

There have been many types of communism and fascism depending on the country where they were applied, for example Germany's National Socialism differed from Francisco Franco's version of fascism: the first sought to slowly replace the existing vales and religion of Germany for a more nationalistic, unified culture, while in Spain fascism took an ultra-catholic form and catholicism was inseparable from the state.

Communism is mostly anti-religious but in Cuba religious organization were at the very least allowed to exist (although they couldn't join the communist party). There's also the difference between what is the "internationalist" vision of communism and other, more nationalistic approaches (North Korea).

Fascism and old communism weren't all that different from a modern perspective, but if I had to choose between the modern version of communism, which is chicken shit that just mutates into Sharia law over time, or fascism, I would choose fascism in a heartbeat.

 

[KillaClown1488]

The trouble with this discussion is how poorly "fascism" is defined in modern political discourse. Many people use it to describe politicians who use force to accomplish goals that they personally find disagreeable (Bush is Hitler, Obama's Hitler, Trump is Hitler, etc.). People call Antifa's tactics fascist when, in fact, using political violence to silence your opposition isn't a tactic specific to fascism- communists have also used it quite a lot. In fact, political movements who were neither communist nor fascist have also used violence to disrupt the gatherings of political opponents.

If on the other extreme, you could make the argument that Fascism per se only ever exited in Mussolini's Italy, in the sense that it was the only political party explicitly identifying as Fascist (or Fascismo) to actually be in control of government.

To the end of answering this question in a meaningful way, let's get a more useful definition of what fascism is and how it fits into a greater political picture.

Fascism should be understood as a non-Liberal (notice the capital L there) reaction to leftist social agitation. Leftism (as such) pushes social reorganization from a whiggist moral framework, that is to say, a linear view of social progress, wherein

fuck it im bored

 

[cumrobbery]

Probably fascism but they're both shit imo

 

[Elwood P. Dowd]

You've been talking to some real dumbasses then

Why? I don't think it meets all the criteria (hell I'll freely admit I'm not 100% sure what all the criteria to call a state fascist would even be), but it meets a great many. As in:

Supreme leader idolized to the point of a personality cult: Check
Means of production remain largely in private hands: Check
Criticism of the state and its leader dealt with harshly: Check

Fails:

Idolization of the military/Military ideals: So far as I know, no
Some bizarre fetishization of an idealized past: Probably not, but Lee did push some sort of neo-Confucianism, IIRC

Note that stuff like racial purity isn't inherent to fascism. It wasn't a factor for the first decade of fascism in Italy (there were even Jewish fascists elected to Parliament at one point, Mussolini essentially did a complete about-face on this) , and never was in places like Spain under Franco and Portugal under Salazar. It was in Hungary, but only after Horthy was overthrown in 1944 and the Arrow Cross loons came to power. Croatia was basically doing what they always do: hating Serbs, not sure how racial they got beyond that.

The inevitability of territorial expansion pushed by National Socialism, Italian fascism and Japan under Tojo is also unique to those regimes. They were certainly the three largest regimes, but I think you'd be hard-pressed to say that this is a fundamental characteristic of whatever it is you'd call fascism.

 

[nad7155]

These ideologies are both pretty terrible in their own right.
If I had to choice I'll have to pick communism mostly because the figure of fascism were lunetics in their own right.

I would pick death.

 

[DuskEngine]

Criticism of the state and its leader dealt with harshly: Check

Singapore suppresses freedom of speech, but not nearly to the extent that more authoritarian states do. It's a multi-party democracy (albeit one where the opposition has the deck stacked against it) and while the press is stifled, it is possible to publish critical articles in major papers, though it does take some measure of balls to do so. So authoritarian but not nearly totalitarian.

Means of production remain largely in private hands: Check

It's more social democratic than capitalist per se (80% of Singaporeans live in public housing built by the government) but yeah. Then again the Nazis also expanded public welfare programs.

That being said another feature of fascism seems to be a desire for autarky and that's quite unthinkable in tiny, resource-starved Singapore.

Idolization of the military/Military ideals: So far as I know, no

They actually do have mandatory military service and an emphasis on maintaining a strong force but that's more pragmatic survivalism considering the neighbourhood they're in than jingoism.

Some bizarre fetishization of an idealized past: Probably not, but Lee did push some sort of neo-Confucianism, IIRC

China also has the whole Confucian thing going on and it's not nearly fascist. What fascism has is reactionary nationalism and, again, as a multi-ethnic breakaway state whose entire prior history consisted of being a backwater fishing village, that's not really viable for them.

Note that stuff like racial purity isn't inherent to fascism.

It's possible to be fascist without being as rabidly ethnonationalist as the Nazis yeah, but I doubt any fascist government would willingly abet mass immigration and make racial harmony and freedom of religion core values. It goes against the whole idea of organic nationalism that fascists like.


EDIT: besides all that a hitler youth cut wouldn't really be a good look for @OtterParty anyway

 

[ZeCommissar]

It depends on the brand of fascism, if it's like nazism where there is a superior race and all the others are second-class citizens or dead, then I would NOT live under it.

If it's just a centralized totalitarian government, then fascism.

 

[Vocaloid Ruby]

Well If I pick Facism I get sexy military uniforms and torture devices. On the other hand if I pick Communism I just get those things but I don't own them. Facism is win, win.

 

[feedtheoctopus]

Guess.

 

[Alec Benson Leary]

This is a weird question because our site observes hundreds of crazy people who think they are communist, actually behave fascist, and would be annihilated by either group if our society achieved such a miserable extreme.

 

[Un Platano]

Fascism is better because it's the more balanced of socially oppressive governments. Communism is in the top left of the political compass meme, while fascism is close to top center if not slightly right of it. Medieval deus vult governments are what occupies the top right. Extremes are always bad on that chart, and fascism at least avoids one of them compared to communism.

 

[TowinKarz]

Fascism, at least it bills itself upfront as a brutal way to move forward.

Communism does the same thing, but, adds the insanity of insisting that it isn't and is, in fact, only a temporary phase that would be done away with if only the "subversives" hiding in the populace could be weeded out......