Disco Elysium - Insane Drunken Cop Simulator RPG GotY 2019

[Berrakh]

None of what you wrote is particularly "deep" though. It's all very surface level. and kinda funny how every character has to be thrown into a certain political category as if we all have to land some particular place on a political compass the same way D&D inspired games hand out political alignments.
But what exactly is the core belief and message of Disco Elysium? What is its actual depth?
Most common interpretation of the story is that it's about the weight and danger of clinging unto the past, coping with nihilism, and the evils of the Coalition of Nations which is imposing free market capitalism upon Revachol and keeping it destitute and rotting.
It's not woke, it's-
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Which isn't inherently bad. I've played leftist games before. But what really prevents me from liking Disco Elysium is how much I disliked Harry and Kim. And every time some self hating, substance abusing, hedonist, perpetual adolescent points at Harry and goes "me! he is literally me!" I recoil in disgust.
The politics isn't particularly deep either just because it mocks wannabe revolutionaries with blue hair and loathing for their parents. It's the exact same opinions you could get from any episode of the chapotraphouse podcast or visiting https://www.reddit.com/r/stupidpol/.

Also, the game is too obsessed with irony to be confused for woke. It's more like ironic communism. Irony in this case meaning... rolling your eyes while you do it anyway.
I did like how it made either Dasha or Anna (probably Dasha but they sound the same) into a literal whore.

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]

Oh my god, the SPEEDFREAKS DONKS shoes light up when you take steps! I love these dumb things!

Sorry, found out about the sorta-secret mission you can gets that let’s you get these babies.
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[Slap47]

Yikes, okay.
I see that you're not going to respond to any other points and are just going to be upset about the fact that I'm not agreeing to that the game or the fanbase in general subscribe to your idea that a character like Gary is supposed to not just be a pitiable victim of the society built by the free market coalition. I think the game makers genuinly believe racism is evil, and that racism comes from society like with Gary, or from upbringing and consuming racial supremacist media like with measurehead.
So count to ten if you feel tempted to throw around more insults or accuse me of not having played the game just because I don't feel tempted to praise the writings of Kurvitz and his love for alcohol abusing wrecks like himself

Also, the game is too obsessed with irony to be confused for woke. It's more like ironic communism. Irony in this case meaning... rolling your eyes while you do it anyway.
I did like how it made either Dasha or Anna (probably Dasha but they sound the same) into a literal whore.

The fandom of the game is ostensibly leftwing. Go to the Fandom wiki pages for Inframaterialism and Communism and you will see defenses of Lysenkoism (Stalin was just trying to raise hope during hard times) and The Great Leap Forward. However, that's irrelevant. Who cares what Reddit thinks? The game is clearly anti cancel-culture and social-fascism. In DE leftwing communists are best friends with the extreme-right and that is represented as a wholesome good. "A good man despite his ramblings" is how Gary is summarized and Rene isn't going around killing people like a certain somebody.

The game is anti-racist and the developers are anti-racist. In-game being racist is bad for your relationships and actually doing your job well. However, in real life most conservatives and even most of the far-right is anti-racist. The most prevalent form of 21st century far-right nationalism is a "place for every race" and their ideal is that these places respect each other instead of trying to conquer each other. Most of the far-right refuses to identify as racist and masks their racism as being patriotic (Fuentes, RamZPaul, and Sargon want the US+UK to be 70% white, but are not white nationalists, etc.) Even this form of racism is not even a left or right idea. The most successful ethnostate of this kind in history is North Korea. Regardless, the game does not discuss this kind of racism, and I think the game was hinting at the rise of actual fascism in a sequel. Revachol is very liberal and very Weimar - especially if the Coalition go through with their inflation plan discussed by Joyce in her failed final check.

 

[Übertroon]

The fandom of the game is ostensibly leftwing. Go to the Fandom wiki pages for Inframaterialism and Communism and you will see defenses of Lysenkoism (Stalin was just trying to raise hope during hard times) and The Great Leap Forward. However, that's irrelevant. Who cares what Reddit thinks? The game is clearly anti cancel-culture and social-fascism. In DE leftwing communists are best friends with the extreme-right and that is represented as a wholesome good. "A good man despite his ramblings" is how Gary is summarized and Rene isn't going around killing people like a certain somebody.

The game is anti-racist and the developers are anti-racist. In-game being racist is bad for your relationships and actually doing your job well. However, in real life most conservatives and even most of the far-right is anti-racist. The most prevalent form of 21st century far-right nationalism is a "place for every race" and their ideal is that these places respect each other instead of trying to conquer each other. Most of the far-right refuses to identify as racist and masks their racism as being patriotic (Fuentes, RamZPaul, and Sargon want the US+UK to be 70% white, but are not white nationalists, etc.) Even this form of racism is not even a left or right idea. The most successful ethnostate of this kind in history is North Korea. Regardless, the game does not discuss this kind of racism, and I think the game was hinting at the rise of actual fascism in a sequel. Revachol is very liberal and very Weimar - especially if the Coalition go through with their inflation plan discussed by Joyce in her failed final check.

Technically I would argue that the Chinese People's Republic is the most successful ethnostate, I recognize it's actually very diverse ethnically, but that they've basically forced everyone to pretend they're Han Chinese, but yes, I agree that post WWII the idea that racism is inherently evil has been the prevailing thought, not just in the left wing, but also in the right wing, and I did notice that in Disco Elysium being racist is often the singular flaw given to the right wing characters in the game

 

[Slap47]

>be game thread on KF
>have people discuss the game in a thoughtful matter
>devolves into political sperging
Every fucking time

Spoiler: Spoiler

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]

I find it hilarious that the end of the homo-sexual underground thought is Kim flatly stating he’s gay just so Harry will stop obsessing pondering about the sexuality of everyone.

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

Wtf is that comparison? The games are nothing alike and are both, frankly, terrible mysteries for different reasons (HR breaks a core mystery commandment, DE doesn't give you all the tools to know who dunit on account of him being a character outside the plot). HR main characters also aren't cops (I did like the autistic cop in the game though), while DE main character is barely a cop.

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]

Wtf is that comparison? The games are nothing alike and are both, frankly, terrible mysteries for different reasons (HR breaks a core mystery commandment, DE doesn't give you all the tools to know who dunit on account of him being a character outside the plot). HR main characters also aren't cops (I did like the autistic cop in the game though), while DE main character is barely a cop.

It’s comparing how a murder mystery story where “choices matter” is told in a good way (DE) and bad way(HR).

And the girl and guy solving the murder in HR were both cops.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

It’s comparing how a murder mystery story where “choices matter” is told in a good way (DE) and bad way(HR).

And the girl and guy solving the murder in HR were both cops.

No, the girl in HR is a journo, you are thinking of Fahrenheit. There is an fbi guy solving the case and the detective who's the killer.

Also I'm not sure you can say DE has choices matter besides having the partner die and some epilogue narrative and your squad summarising your playthrough. You will find the killer anyways since he isn't affected by any of your choices, while HR he is a main character that can die. It's still a ridiculous comparison since HR has far more big scenes while DE is practically a Visual Novel.

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]

No, the girl in HR is a journo, you are thinking of Fahrenheit. There is an fbi guy solving the case and the detective who's the killer.

Also I'm not sure you can say DE has choices matter besides having the partner die and some epilogue narrative and your squad summarising your playthrough. You will find the killer anyways since he isn't affected by any of your choices, while HR he is a main character that can die. It's still a ridiculous comparison since HR has far more big scenes while DE is practically a Visual Novel.

Oh right. Well, HR still had two “cop-like” characters.

As for why compare the two, the video explains it in the intro.

 

[Rich Evans Ayypologist]

the video explains it in the intro.

I neither believe he has looked nor will look at the video.

Urick's comparison on storytelling, character motivation, and general narrative and presentation choices is all pretty spot-on, but the segment on political themes affirms the game went over his head. In speaking of the Sunday Friend as obstructionist, painting him as "someone maintaining the status quo" deals mostly with the immediate and misses the metanarrative threads of his being a comment on bureaucracy and government in general. His calling the game "sympathetic" to communism continues to baffle me.

Firstly, the suggestion that laypeople from Estonia have nostalgia for communism ignores that country's entire post-soviet history and culture to the point where it's a genuinely gut-busting statement. Secondly, the suggestion that the Deserter is a tragic figure presented for the audience to sympathize with suggests he never unlocked the paths where you learn the guy was a pervert peeping on women in the whirligig, running drugs for the corrupt union, and generally sitting on the island for decades doing nothing but raging impotently. He's absolutely projecting what he wants to read on a character whose in-game presentation is primarily pathetic, whose waxing poetic about the 'communist glory' gets thoroughly trotted out as desperate cope and borderline mental illness in the final confrontation.

To suggest the game is somehow inseparable from its "communist sympathies" is to express extreme naivete and borderline cluelessness - confusing postmodernism (all ideology is empty and futile) with communism (ideological belief in the eventual overthrow of capitalism by the something-next) is what I'd expect of someone with a high-school grasp of this shit. It's definitely worth the watch for his takes on how the story is told and presented, and the fact that David Kage is a complete hack, but the political section is better off skipped.

 

[Übertroon]

Wtf is that comparison? The games are nothing alike and are both, frankly, terrible mysteries for different reasons (HR breaks a core mystery commandment, DE doesn't give you all the tools to know who dunit on account of him being a character outside the plot). HR main characters also aren't cops (I did like the autistic cop in the game though), while DE main character is barely a cop.

I'm not surprised that the essay has a 15 minute segment devoted towards politics where Heavy Rain has little to no mention lol
My dude probably made this video just to sperg about fictional suxism.

As for Heavy Rain, it's a flawed game, but I enjoyed it when it came out, and I think it's curious that so many of the "games should be art" crowd dismiss it and not acknowledging that as much of a mediocre writer David Cage is, his projects helped pave the way for more story driven games. In a sort of way games like Heavy Rain walked so that Last of Us could run. David Cage's projects were Sony's first projects into narrative driven video games, and they made money, so they continued to approve more projects. Now personally this hasn't been all too positive for me, I kinda dislike how much the big publishers now just want to make video games that want to be movies, but it's interesting how David Cage keeps being the game journo punching bag.

I think the conclusion part of the video made it clear how ridiculous the premise is though. It's just 10 minutes of talking about David Cage being a shit writer and nothing to do with comparing Disco Elysium with Heavy Rain. It just goes "this game good, this game bad"
The writing in Disco Elysium is clearly better, but Heavy Rain has some really memorable moments that you just can't emulate in Disco Elysium. The moment where the father has to cut off one of his fingers and then try to evade the cops after mutilating himself is more visceral and stressful than anything Disco Elysium can do.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

Oh right. Well, HR still had two “cop-like” characters.

As for why compare the two, the video explains it in the intro.

Not really, the criteria mentioned is being a police game where the choices matter. Neither game is a police game and only in HR the choices really matter. A more apt comparison will be DE with any political rambling game with Bioware level choices (I guess Arcanum and other old RPGs). It just sounds like lazy Cage bashing with a game considered too good to criticize.

Also it gets really annoying that people argue what the devs really meant when the vast majority of the players sense the game was pro left. The game is post modern so you can 100% call death of the author on it.

 

[Oilspill Battery]

Wtf is that comparison? The games are nothing alike and are both, frankly, terrible mysteries for different reasons (HR breaks a core mystery commandment, DE doesn't give you all the tools to know who dunit on account of him being a character outside the plot). HR main characters also aren't cops (I did like the autistic cop in the game though), while DE main character is barely a cop.

What's the core mystery commandment HR breaks?

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

What's the core mystery commandment HR breaks?

The criminal must be someone mentioned in the early part of the story, but must not be anyone whose thoughts the reader has been allowed to follow.

Incel Commie is a character that, at best, is implied to exist. He is never introduced or mentioned to the player until reaching the last island. Technically you can also argue he is a Chinaman and that the space bug living next to him is a Supernatural phenomena that excuses some parts of the plot.

 

[Oilspill Battery]

Incel Commie is a character that, at best, is implied to exist. He is never introduced or mentioned to the player until reaching the last island. Technically you can also argue he is a Chinaman and that the space bug living next to him is a Supernatural phenomena that excuses some parts of the plot.

I am aware that disco elysium does this and its one of the parts I heavily dislike about it, I'm asking about HR since I haven't played it.

I don't think dros is a chinaman though, he's just a bitter incel and his motivation is spite. Its not that outlandish. The bug is mostly self discovery as well as for the most part it doesn't really affect the plot either. It accelerated Dros insanity but he was already unhinged and it only appears after the case is solved.

Disco elysium already fiddlefucks with rules 2 and 6, but only barely, Harry has supernatural powers but they don't help with the case in any tangible way and most of the time he ignores their input thinking them to be schizophrenia.

I think the only time harry actually uses shivers to help with the case is when he discovers the entrance to the building that the lesbo is hidding in after he's already decuded she's somewhere in it, but iirc you can find a way around that without using shivers.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

I am aware that disco elysium does this and its one of the parts I heavily dislike about it, I'm asking about HR since I haven't played it.

Oh sorry, also the very first one (and seventh). The old detective character is actually the murderer with his internal monologue written to lead the player to think he tries to figure the mystery rather than cover up evidence.

In HR defence it's not as bad as most of those twists are, especially as there are other characters to cover up different viewpoints.

 

[1988 prick]

Played and finished the game and honestly I don't get the hype.

started out as a low IQ muscle head without any expectations and honestly I felt like I made the right choice
Because I never thought in a Mystery-solving game I would be getting imaginary friends that help me solve a crime.
Normally these games test your problem solving skills but I noticed that some of the rolls are actually hand feeding too much info. not to mention even if I figured out why, my character is jsut too dumb to know and I am forced to smoke and play dress up.
personal preference but I quickly adapted.

though what I truly hate are the political or hippy character's taht never shut up
I swear the more political or hippy they are the worse they are, all I want for them is to keep it short and shut up. I literally licked Evrart's and Cuno's boots and wanted to spend more time with them for how simple they are.

for the story honestly its ok.
It started out really strong and many of the characters are unique and lovable in their own way but mostly the side characters and Kitsuragi. alot of the main story character's are just annoying or just don't have much and as it slowly progresses.

the message on politics or the political belief that everyone is sperging on.
I honestly don't get it and I don't see it, I just see it as "le political compass: The Video Game"

Finally one of it's biggest strength is story telling and the flavor texts from your imaginary friends are what kept me from sitting through walls of texts and the story, heck its one of the few things that made me consider a 2nd play through and play around with the RPG stats.

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]