Disco Elysium - Insane Drunken Cop Simulator RPG GotY 2019

Lemmingwise said:
It certainly was a goal of the designer to take a kind of politically neutral position, he says in interviews that perhaps he went too far with it
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I did get the sense that there was some intention to be neutral, you could pick paths that were clearly more politically aligned with some ideologies more than others. But if you looked deeper you'd find that it really wasn't all that neutral any more than just having the options. The way it treated the capitalist pathway was essentially "you're selfish and only care about money you get a bonus to income" as if that's what a capitalist actually believes and isn't just a socialist strawman. It wasn't at all hard to discern the political leanings of the creator. Maybe it was something they couldn't help and they don't actually understand other viewpoints, wasn't my idea of "neutral" though. I knew as soon as I got to the strike area in the beginning and all the characters that wanted the strike to end were stupid assholes and the strike organizer character was a cool dude with cool ideas that this game wasn't going to be neutral.

Edit: please forgive me for double posting I'm not a forum person and didn't realize I couldn't delete.
 
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Akashic Retard said:
I did get the sense that there was some intention to be neutral, you could pick paths that were clearly more politically aligned with some ideologies more than others. But if you looked deeper you'd find that it really wasn't all that neutral any more than just having the options. The way it treated the capitalist pathway was essentially "you're selfish and only care about money you get a bonus to income" as if that's what a capitalist actually believes and isn't just a socialist strawman. It wasn't at all hard to discern the political leanings of the creator. Maybe it was something they couldn't help and they don't actually understand other viewpoints, wasn't my idea of "neutral" though. I knew as soon as I got to the strike area in the beginning and all the characters that wanted the strike to end were stupid assholes and the strike organizer character was a cool dude with cool ideas that this game wasn't going to be neutral.

Edit: please forgive me for double posting I'm not a forum person and didn't realize I couldn't delete.
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The game treats all ideologies as strawmen, Marxists are treated as whiney pseudo intellectual fags, Fascists are treated as unfuckable psychopaths, Capitalists are treated as cutthroat extortionists, and Centrism(tm) is literally presented as an enlightened religious belief.

I do agree that the game was largely crafted with a fundamentally Marxist lens, but it's also self aware that the game is self indulgent and pretentious. It shouldn't be taken seriously, and a core focus of the game is that behind every ideologue is a broken person.
 
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I'd be more concerned with the political themes if a sequel happens, since there's a far higher than normal chance they'd shoot their wad on condemning wrongthink. Of course, perhaps it didn't bother me because in all my playthroughs I do my best to avoid dumb political shit.

I don't know how a sequel to this game could work though, as the skill system as presented seems like a unique trait of Harry's fractured mind, and his story is pretty well concluded. Klaasje could make an interesting protagonist, but I'm not sure I want to hear her story bad enough to risk souring the game's memory with a shitty continuation.
 
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Peasant said:
I'd be more concerned with the political themes if a sequel happens, since there's a far higher than normal chance they'd shoot their wad on condemning wrongthink. Of course, perhaps it didn't bother me because in all my playthroughs I do my best to avoid dumb political shit.

I don't know how a sequel to this game could work though, as the skill system as presented seems like a unique trait of Harry's fractured mind, and his story is pretty well concluded. Klaasje could make an interesting protagonist, but I'm not sure I want to hear her story bad enough to risk souring the game's memory with a shitty continuation.
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Honestly the best route they can go is to wrap to an entirely new character, free of any links to the first game. Maybe a subtle nod here and there acknowledging the changing situation in Revachol, but otherwise in its own self-contained story.

That's, of course, assuming they managed to keep this quality of writing up, something which is always an open question.
 
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Berrakh said:
This game just isn't that deep. It was praised by pseuds literally just for having the right politics.
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Agreed the politics aren't deep. But the game rewards an intuitive player with hunches on whether there's more to discover story-wise. Sometimes they pay off in regards to the case and sometimes they don't, but they're usually worth following up on. There's an instance on day 2 that's beautifully paid off on day 3 by way of an emotional gut-punch.
 
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Violence Jack said:
Agreed the politics aren't deep. But the game rewards an intuitive player with hunches on whether there's more to discover story-wise. Sometimes they pay off in regards to the case and sometimes they don't, but they're usually worth following up on. There's an instance on day 2 that's beautifully paid off on day 3 by way of an emotional gut-punch.
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Yeah that's true. I think people are making conflations. "It has a good relationship to the player and politics...the politics are therefore deep."
 
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A sequel would definitely need to be completely separate from the first’s city and characters, given that that hole in reality hidden in the church is literally going to swallow the city in about 30 years time.
 
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SteelPlatedHeart said:
A sequel would definitely need to be completely separate from the first’s city and characters, given that that hole in reality hidden in the church is literally going to swallow the city in about 30 years time.
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it wouldn't be too far out that the sequel would actually be chronologically a prequel, likely Revachol during the commune/the final days before it's fall. I'd imagine many will take it too seriously, it really shouldn't be taken seriously.

I think the world building/lore is really great, all the states feel real and legitimate without it aping too much off real history (like many are inclined to do). Sure, there are tonnes of allusions to colonialism, the paris commune, and the contemporary world, but they're handled in their own ways.

It all feels very genuine and inspired.

the flag for the Suzerainty of Revachol is beautiful by the way, often alt history/historical fiction make hideous puke flags.
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vulgar said:
Sure, there are tonnes of allusions to colonialism, the paris commune, and the contemporary world, but they're handled in their own ways.
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The most interesting part of Pillars of Eternity II was its setting and allusions to colonialism, to me -- but the writers fucked it up and handled it with all the grace of a drunken bull shitting in a china shoppe, making it ultimately toothless and stupid.

Personally, though? I don't know if I necessarily want a sequel. I like the little nougat that is this self-contained story in this self-contained world, and Harry's unique circumstances provide a certain tone that would be hard to replicate. I easily think in this setting you could tell such a wildly different story, but I worry that they'd be pressured to try to recreate the lightning in a bottle and just re-tread Harry's basic story.

In my ending, Kim very seriously thinks about joining Harry's squad and everyone sticks up for the washup. I managed to skip all instances of Harry getting caught up in thinking about his ex, as I didn't dial the second phone number, threw away the locked thing in the clipboard at volition's urging, and didn't stop to sleep on the communist island. It was as if he really managed to turn a wholly new leaf. It felt like the kind of bowtie ending that's just perfect closure for everything.
 
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Rich Evans Apologist said:
The most interesting part of Pillars of Eternity II was its setting and allusions to colonialism, to me -- but the writers fucked it up and handled it with all the grace of a drunken bull shitting in a china shoppe, making it ultimately toothless and stupid.

Personally, though? I don't know if I necessarily want a sequel. I like the little nougat that is this self-contained story in this self-contained world, and it Harry's unique circumstances provide a certain tone that would be hard to replicate. I easily think in this setting you could tell such a wildly different story, but I worry that they'd be pressured to try to recreate the lightning in a bottle and just re-tread Harry's basic story.
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I feel the same way, but I was under the impression that they were making a sequel/new game set in the same universe.

I would prefer if they left it where they left it, and it would be even more impressive if they built such an elaborate and nuanced geopolitical situation for a one off. It's a lot more respectable that way.
 
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SteelPlatedHeart said:
A sequel would definitely need to be completely separate from the first’s city and characters, given that that hole in reality hidden in the church is literally going to swallow the city in about 30 years time.
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The only real way to make a sequel in the same universe is to go with a Sunless Sea type game where you have more of a global map of the world and can explore the various tech and lore around it, even play your preferred politics in some way. Though I guess the board game in-game is already something like that. Continuing with the same characters is the worst fucking idea because the multiple ways it can end will make it a case where the writers need to write multiple different game plots to fit it all, plus the characters and the overall setting are already known. Maybe a new cast can work but it will likely feel like a lazy imitation of the first game.
 
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vulgar said:
I feel the same way, but I was under the impression that they were making a sequel/new game set in the same universe.

I would prefer if they left it where they left it, and it would be even more impressive if they built such an elaborate and nuanced geopolitical situation for a one off. It's a lot more respectable that way.
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According the ZA/UM, the setting was a tabletop setting that the producer worked on for close to a decade. Even had a book or two written for it apparently. It most certainly didn't come out of nowhere for this game, and I can understand why they would want to explore more of it.
 
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Kane Lives said:
According the ZA/UM, the setting was a tabletop setting that the producer worked on for close to a decade. Even had a book or two written for it apparently. It most certainly didn't come out of nowhere for this game, and I can understand why they would want to explore more of it.
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well, that makes sense. I remember that you explore the ruined office of a tabletop/rpg company in Disco Elysium with a lot of meta references.

There was so much background lore/info to this universe I wasn't sure if was just creating the illusion of depth or if it was truly THAT big. Naturally it's too much to make only a single game out of, I suppose I'll look forward to more of it.
 
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