Inactive Elliot Rodger - The Supreme Gentleman

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Satan said:
You can't possibly look at this guy's permanent duck-face and not instantly think "total gaywad". Denial ain't just a river in Egyp, just sayin'. :roll:
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He just doesn't know how to use his eyes and his lips. It makes him look like a total creeper.
 
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Satan said:
There's a bit of truth in both sides of the argument, I feel. On the one hand hand, just "giving up" on having a love life and romance altogether is just plain old defeatism and nothing good ever came of defeatism. That shit has to die.

On the other hand, when it is clear a girl has absolutely zero attraction towards you, to continue pursuing her and other girls just like her is of course a futile effort. One that will only yield success if first, you take a good long objective look at yourself in the mirror, realize your own flaws and imperfections and seek out to improve yourself. Then try again with renewed vigor, this time with a much better chance of success. It's a matter of reality vs. expectation, as much as it is one of attitude.

When a sports team always plays in the exact same formation, using the exact same tactic, and loses every single match it plays... does the coach just give up on playing, or does he call his players together, gives a motivational speech and discusses a new strategy for the next match?
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Exactly. Human relationships grow and develop, it's their very nature. Saying it's not worth trying again, ever is just as foolish as saying you expect life to always end like movies and TV. They're both equally poor views to have on the topic.

FWIW, I honestly do think there is an extremely self-destructive tendency in women to desire men who (in the long run) are very poor choices of mates. This is something noted by Nice Guys, but I think they tend to misunderstand the cause and effect of it, and underestimate their own ability to change the situation. OTOH, I think there is an equally self-destructive tendency in men to fixate on a woman who, for whatever reason, will never be available to them. Humans as a species tend to believe things will work out the way we want them to, in the future, even when logic dictates that it ain't gonna happen.

I think everyone could maybe take a look at our culture and learn some lessons to correct some of the less pleasant aspects of it, but so far the arguments I've seen are too broad and fail to address the nuances between each sex.
 
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ChurchOfGodBear said:
FWIW, I honestly do think there is an extremely self-destructive tendency in women to desire men who (in the long run) are very poor choices of mates. This is something noted by Nice Guys, but I think they tend to misunderstand the cause and effect of it, and underestimate their own ability to change the situation. OTOH, I think there is an equally self-destructive tendency in men to fixate on a woman who, for whatever reason, will never be available to them.
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When you say women who "will never be available to them", what do you mean? I think the common problem among men is desiring mates for nothing more than how hot society says they are. Maybe some women are stupid and choose shitty guys, but it's just as common for some dipshit guy to say "I want a cheerleader!" without even knowing why he's supposed to want her, or what he should be looking for at all in a mate.
 
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Alec Benson Leary said:
When you say women who "will never be available to them", what do you mean?
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I mean women who are just plain off the books. Women who are married. Women who aren't into guys. Women who have made it clear you don't interest them. There are all sorts of reasons when it might become clear this is a case of "not gonna happen" that have nothing to do with if a girl is in your league or not.
 
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Alec Benson Leary said:
When you say women who "will never be available to them", what do you mean? I think the common problem among men is desiring mates for nothing more than how hot society says they are. Maybe some women are stupid and choose shitty guys, but it's just as common for some dipshit guy to say "I want a cheerleader!" without even knowing why he's supposed to want her, or what he should be looking for at all in a mate.
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The reason so many guys want the cheerleader could be influenced by teen sex comedy type of movies, but blaming them entirely isn't going to explain stuff like this. As far as people like Mr. I-Toss-Coffee-At-Girls-Out-Of-My-BMW, the number one reason people do stuff like this is because they know that no matter how it turns out, they will become famous (or infamous) and be remembered by everyone. It's very profitable for the mainstream media, and it sells papers and ad space is at a premium at these times, because they know that everyone is watching and they want all the juicy details.

But I for one am sick of the guy already, it was fun debating/discussing him, but I don't even think his name deserves to be mentioned. If I post here again, I'll refer to him as Mr. BMW. Fuck that guy, and fuck the media for making celebrities out of these douchebags.
 
ChurchOfGodBear said:
FWIW, I honestly do think there is an extremely self-destructive tendency in women to desire men who (in the long run) are very poor choices of mates. This is something noted by Nice Guys, but I think they tend to misunderstand the cause and effect of it, and underestimate their own ability to change the situation. OTOH, I think there is an equally self-destructive tendency in men to fixate on a woman who, for whatever reason, will never be available to them. Humans as a species tend to believe things will work out the way we want them to, in the future, even when logic dictates that it ain't gonna happen.
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When people are dating, they want to have fun.

/thread?

I don't know, I think it's that simple. When I was younger, I was a very serious person, and though I never vocalized it I almost certainly thought that every encounter could potentially lead to a date, which could potentially lead to a relationship, on to marriage and sitting in sweaters next to a fire on snowy New England nights. Scary shit.

I guess I needed Date-Ed? After a few relationships (read: flings that I virtually forced into becoming relationships), I got it. Maybe it's common among people who don't date in high school, but I didn't understand that most young people are just looking to have fun, not "mates" in the biological sense, and I didn't really get it until I became one of them.
 
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Artard said:
but I didn't understand that most young people are just looking to have fun, not "mates" in the biological sense, and I didn't really get it until I became one of them.
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That's actually a really good point to bring up. A lot of loveshies think they're supposed to be seeking out their eternal soul mate at 18, and that everyone else is supposed to have the same priority.
 
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CätPärty said:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...er-castle-misogyny-entitlement-and-nerds.html
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I'm going to be honest, I pretty well agree with the guy, I just don't think it's explicitly tied to Nerds, and I know several "Nice Guys (tm)" who would not consider themselves such.

But other than that, I think he's pretty close to hitting the nail on the head. My main issues with the "Nice Guy (tm)"

1. The laziness. Good fuck, the laziness. I mean, one consistent theme in their moaning is that girls don't come to them. They never have to make the first step. The expectation is that the girl will navigate their byzantine emotions, realize he loves her, simultaneously fall for him, and throw herself upon him.

2. The hatred, not just of women, but other men. It becomes a Chris-like quality. Every guy who isn't them is a "Jerk", especially any guy who has more romantic success than them. It's like the Daniel Stackhouse thing. To their sitcom-esque view of the world, you are unwittingly a villain simply by essence of being more successful than they are.

A lot of Elliots racism, for example, seemed to have it's root in this. "Waaaaah! The black had sex with a blonde girl and I didn't! Waaaaaah! He's a liar!" "You Asians are all liars! Those pictures of you with white girls are fake! Ugly Asians can't get white girls! Only the Superior Half-White Uber-Gentleman can get a white girl!"

3. In connection to the above - The way they treat their life as though it's a fucking sitcom (See - Men becoming "Jerks" or just generally villainous by essence of being luckier with women than they are. Massive bonus points if said woman is the object of the Nice-Guys affections. Also see - Themes discussed in the article, where the boyfriend becomes an obstacle to be overcome.)

4. The fact that a good 75% of their woes comes from their own inaction. This is demonstrated very well in.....

http://www.theniceguycomic.com/comics.htm - The Nice Guy, a painfully annoying Webcomic on this very theme.

I mean, some day I should just go through this fucking Comic and count how many stips revolve around "Oh, I should tell her how I feel. Oh, I chicken out for some reason. Curse my luck."

It also demonstrates what I think is a delightful hypocricy in the self-proclaimed title of "Nice Guy" that these folks place upon themselves.

"Oh, I'm having a great time with this girl. I am romantically interested in her, I am such a nice guy I would be so good to he- did she just say Boyfriend? I'm just going to tune her out now. "Hey Bitch, you're paying your own bill, yeah?" Ain't gonna buy that skank dinner if she ain't gonna ride my dick. God, why do women only go for jerks?"

So I'd say I don't take any issue with the jist of the article, just it's focus on "Nerds." I've seen plenty of plane jane mousy men who don't qualify as a nerd by a long shot doing the same thing.
 
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ChurchOfGodBear said:
FWIW, I honestly do think there is an extremely self-destructive tendency in women to desire men who (in the long run) are very poor choices of mates. This is something noted by Nice Guys, but I think they tend to misunderstand the cause and effect of it, and underestimate their own ability to change the situation.
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Possible, the problem here is that (As I touched on in my other recent post here) for many Nice Guys (tm) any man who isn't them is a poor choice.
 
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I'm gonna put this here:

http://markmanson.net/school-shootings

It's the first piece I've seen that actually calls out how every group wants to use this shooting to attack whoever their scapegoat of choice happens to be.

I read the princess-in-another-castle article too. I'm not sure how "nerdy" is supposed to be defined in this context. I guess this is their way of referring to loveshies, a group with whom they probably weren't previously familiar. The article does a wonderful job of illustrating the loveshy entitlement problem without doing a single thing to indicate how exactly that's supposed to be connected to a murderous psychopath.
 
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Alec Benson Leary said:
I read the princess-in-another-castle article too. I'm not sure how "nerdy" is supposed to be defined in this context. I guess this is their way of referring to loveshies, a group with whom they probably weren't previously familiar. The article does a wonderful job of illustrating the loveshy entitlement problem without doing a single thing to indicate how exactly that's supposed to be connected to a murderous psychopath.
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That's what I couldn't stand about the article- the severe lack of focus or cohesion. Is a "nerd" a video game geek, loveshy, or just someone who can't match his belt to his shoes? And if the problem is how the media portrays relationships, are we to fault the media, the people who watch them, or the culture that created both? Where would be a good place to start?

The entire piece read like it was more of a revelation to the author than to the audience. And it was way too long for the relatively minor point it tried to make.
 
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Cwckifan said:
Sorry Atropos, folks who kill innocents are always, ALWAYS crazy. That's not a judgement, it's a law
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Insanity is only a legal term. It has no bearing on mental illness. Mental illness is not "insane". Don't lump these things together. It's lazy, inaccurate, and very insulting to the vast majority of the mentally ill that don't do these things.

DykesDykesChina said:
I'm still amazed by the fact that he did absolutely nothing to make his dream come true. His Narcissistic
Personality Disorder was so strong that it didn't occur to
him that he might have to become active (talking to girls
etc.), the world was supposed to cater to his wishes with
him just sitting around. When it didn't, he became
murderous.

Again, WOW.
:cryblood:
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I think I've mentioned this elswhere, but it seems less like Narscissistic Personality Disorder and more like Histrionic. Narscissistic Disorders tend to try to be subtle, but him throwing drinks at people implies an active attempt to make a scene, which is more in line with Histrionic Personality Disorder.
 
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jharwel1 said:
Insanity is only a legal term. It has no bearing on mental illness. Mental illness is not "insane". Don't lump these things together. It's lazy, inaccurate, and very insulting to the vast majority of the mentally ill that don't do these things.
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Just because you're mentally ill does not mean you are insane, but if you are insane, you are most certainly mentally ill.
 
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Satan said:
Quite the Patrick Bateman. But skinnier, faggier. He does manage to pull the "I come a little bit whenever I see my own face" act off quite well, though.


I say check out his YouTube before all of his weird ass videos get taken down. There's some very cringeworthy and creepy material in there.

https://www.youtube.com/user/ElliotRodger
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Ladies and gentlement, may I present to you, the next Tomgirl....if he was alive. Thank god OPL never knew or saw any of this guys videos.
 
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