Fallout series

[CWCissey]

The thing about NCRfags is that the majority of the time they think that in a post-apocalyptic world like that of Fallout, the best route is to go with the governmental system that led to the Great War in the first place.

A bloated democracy is probably not the best way to bring order to a wasteland with super mutants, raiders and allsorts of mutated beasties.

You need a strong leader with an iron fist and a plan.

That's why the House always wins, baby.

 

[Burned Man]

.
That's why the House always wins, baby.

Unless someone opens up his tube and coughs at him. Or the post office loses his mail.

 

[CWCissey]

Unless someone opens up his tube and coughs at him. Or the post office loses his mail.

Goddamn Lefties m8.

 

[Whatsup bud?]

You think playing as a ghoul or synth would ever be an option? Or is the rad immunity too op?

 

[Violence Jack]

I love Caesar's Legion because it's the epitome of "wait and see" outsiders have the choice of buying into Caesar's ideal of Hegelian Dialectics. But the main foot soldiers of the Legion are indoctrinated into dying for this idea that might not even work it adds a tragic irony and an "ends justify the means" spin to them. The cultural genocide of tribals is just the cherry on top. But the real kicker is that Caesar's Legion are the underdogs they just utilize unsavory methods to quickly accrue numbers and power. They're an almost brilliant bad guy faction. But the thing is they could be more grey with just a bit of effort. It's clear that Obsidian really wanted to make them black (they force the slave women to carry tons of bags for some reason--so evil guys!!!) when i think there was a lot of potential for a more balanced faction that runs on harsh methods meant for a wasteland.

 

[ChucklesTheJester]

You think playing as a ghoul or synth would ever be an option? Or is the rad immunity too op?

Ghoul? Unlikely that would require bethseda to care enough to make it balance, and we already know they never will do that over dumbing it down.Also require them adding more dialogue for NPCs, and even making some quests more complex, which would never happen.

Synth? HAHAHA, They can hardly even write a plot that isn't just Fallout 3 But reversed, at best if they ever did, it just be purely cosmetic thing.

 

[Whatsup bud?]

Ghoul? Unlikely that would require bethseda to care enough to make it balance, and we already know they never will do that over dumbing it down.Also require them adding more dialogue for NPCs, and even making some quests more complex, which would never happen.

Synth? HAHAHA, They can hardly even write a plot that isn't just Fallout 3 But reversed, at best if they ever did, it just be purely cosmetic thing.

Maybe different origin choices for a human than. Start off BoS or scavver or vault dweller

 

[ChucklesTheJester]

Maybe different origin choices for a human than. Start off BoS or scavver or vault dweller

Thats also a problem, it require them to put effort into the story. If 4,and 76 taught ya anything it's Bethseda hates effort.

 

[c-no]

this shit will never not annoy me

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One has to wonder: how was independent New Vegas even Libertarian BS that relies on gangsters and cannibals?? Whole point of that arc was rebelling against two major powers for whatever reason there was from the players perspective. And the NCR can't really be objectively good unless you compared them to the atrocities of the Legion. Without Caesar and the Legion, one could see NCR at best being rife with incompetent leadership in the form of Kimball wanting his biggest general to take over Hoover Dam and New Vegas to a massacre such as Bitter Springs, which in turn was also a result of incompetence from the military intelligence of the NCR. And I doubt any of the casinos will actually back the player beyond just being one of the major power houses in the Strip itself that would be worse like everything else if it wasn't for an army of robots with a unicycle wheel and a tv screen to uphold the peace.

What does become groanworthy over this is the "whatabouist" claim. Whole point of it was to pretty much just show you how bad the Legion is when you visit Caesar and showing you how much NCR struggles to be an effective force against tribals in pre-war sports gear and makeshift machetes despite the fact the NCR managed to overrun the BOS at Helios, which granted was just throwing more soldiers until the brotherhood had to retreat. Part of Caesar's reason for having a Legion was pretty much him seeing how NCR wasn't much of a democracy when it's first president was re-elected well into old age that she was more of a queen than a president in his eyes.

I never got the feeling you had to sympathize with Caesar's Legion. What they do is morally unsound, but there is a sense of logic to what they do. It is a very cold and inhumane kind of logic, but the entire ideology built an empire in the past. And I imagine in the eyes of some versions of the Courier, in order to bring stability to the Wasteland, you got to do what you feel "is best" for the people of the Wasteland.

Really all of the factions in New Vegas had major pros and cons. You had very good reasons to support and not support each faction. None of them were really "the good guys". That's what helped the game stand the test of time and made it so fondly remembered by people.

I think the biggest problem with a lot of people is that they like to project their personal beliefs and values into the game and really aren't able to separate themselves from it and just try and look at things from the perspective of someone in a world where civilization as we know it died and is trying to rebuild itself. No, clearly if you side with Caesar's Legion, you are clearly a bad person IRL and not someone who is simply playing a video game set in a fictional world.

Honestly, if one really tried to project beliefs and values, they may as well not bother trying to play other paths in the game. Why bother going for a Legion run if one really does have to get so buggered by the Legion, especially if they don't bother playing Caesar like a fiddle.

 

[vertexwindi]

You think playing as a ghoul or synth would ever be an option? Or is the rad immunity too op?

I don't see what being a synth would bring to the table because they're supposed to be indistinguishable from humans, but Ghouls would be rad. The immunity and potentially not having to eat/drink(?) would be sweet (though I still have no idea if that was canon or not), but you'd have to deal with a weaker body, having NPCs shoot you on sight and/or discriminate against you, that kind of thing.

 

[BALLZ-BROKEN]

It would also be cool if you could play as a super mutant. You'd be immune to radiation and disease, and have higher strength and damage resistance, but that would be balanced by not being able to use most types of armor and smaller weapons.

Of course, this will never happen because Bugthesda seems to hate the idea of starting multiple play throughs. You're just supposed to create one character, and play for hours and hours of doing radiant quests until you get bored of the game or your save gets corrupted. They also hate the idea of story telling through quests. Todd even says this himself, "Just give 'em the quest!" In a good RPG, you would be able to learn about the world and the people that inhabit it while you do the quest, while in a bad one, the quests are just pointless busywork. They should've called Fallout 4 "McGuffin Hunter 2015".

I wonder if all the radiant quest bullshit was done as a way to acclimate or train players into accepting Fallout 76 and the whole live service grindfest. Both gameplay loops are exactly the same: You go somewhere, kill enemies / loot garbage, and return to base to improve it and your equipment. Except in F76, the base you put so much effort in might not be there when you log out so you get all the enjoyment of building it again! (Unless you pay $100 a year for their exclusive membership, Fallout worst!)

 

[byuu]

I wonder if all the radiant quest bullshit was done as a way to acclimate or train players into accepting Fallout 76 and the whole live service grindfest.

Bethesda has been trying to make procedurally generated quests work for a while.
Even Oblivion had repeatable quests, they just didn't call them "radiant" yet (but they did call the scripted NPC schedules "Radiant AI").

I don't know why they keep trying with this utterly retarded idea. No one likes meaningless quests without any interesting writing behind it.

 

[vertexwindi]

Bethesda has been trying to make procedurally generated quests work for a while.
Even Oblivion had repeatable quests, they just didn't call them "radiant" yet (but they did call the scripted NPC schedules "Radiant AI").

I don't know why they keep trying with this utterly exceptional idea. No one likes meaningless quests without any interesting writing behind it.

I remember Bethesda bragging that some of those radiant quests in FO4 could turn out good enough that players would mistake them for regular quests. My only thoughts were that that doesn't speak of the quality of the radiant quests, but of the regular ones.

 

[Overcast]

One has to wonder: how was independent New Vegas even Libertarian BS that relies on gangsters and cannibals?? Whole point of that arc was rebelling against two major powers for whatever reason there was from the players perspective. And the NCR can't really be objectively good unless you compared them to the atrocities of the Legion. Without Caesar and the Legion, one could see NCR at best being rife with incompetent leadership in the form of Kimball wanting his biggest general to take over Hoover Dam and New Vegas to a massacre such as Bitter Springs, which in turn was also a result of incompetence from the military intelligence of the NCR. And I doubt any of the casinos will actually back the player beyond just being one of the major power houses in the Strip itself that would be worse like everything else if it wasn't for an army of robots with a unicycle wheel and a tv screen to uphold the peace.

What does become groanworthy over this is the "whatabouist" claim. Whole point of it was to pretty much just show you how bad the Legion is when you visit Caesar and showing you how much NCR struggles to be an effective force against tribals in pre-war sports gear and makeshift machetes despite the fact the NCR managed to overrun the BOS at Helios, which granted was just throwing more soldiers until the brotherhood had to retreat. Part of Caesar's reason for having a Legion was pretty much him seeing how NCR wasn't much of a democracy when it's first president was re-elected well into old age that she was more of a queen than a president in his eyes.


Honestly, if one really tried to project beliefs and values, they may as well not bother trying to play other paths in the game. Why bother going for a Legion run if one really does have to get so buggered by the Legion, especially if they don't bother playing Caesar like a fiddle.

That was also a thing. You could sabotage Caesar's surgery and even convince the Legion that there was nothing you could have done. Or, if you were really an asshole, you could sell Arcade and make him Caesar's doctor to save him that way. For a game that was placed under such a ridiculous deadline, so much was packed into this game.

But yeah, Caesar made really good arguments regarding the NCR and how it handled things. Dude himself is a very intelligent individual and you can see where he's coming from a lot of the time. Which just makes it all the more apparent that without him, the Legion would be a bunch of aimless savages.

It's a testament to how well realized and how well written the characters and factions of New Vegas are. It tells me that the guys behind the game had stories they really wanted to tell since trying to make and then canning Van Buren.

 

[c-no]

Bethesda has been trying to make procedurally generated quests work for a while.
Even Oblivion had repeatable quests, they just didn't call them "radiant" yet (but they did call the scripted NPC schedules "Radiant AI").

I don't know why they keep trying with this utterly exceptional idea. No one likes meaningless quests without any interesting writing behind it.

Far as radiant quest go, I wouldn't mind them if they at least made you go through a dungeon or put more variety into it like Daggerfall did. Instead of telling me another settlement needs help, why not have me repeat a quest such as hiding out in a merchant's shop and gunning down whatever group of thieves there are or why not have me at least do a radiant quest in the form of escorting an NPC to safety, with said NPC actually being able to hold a fight to show the game isn't tipped to being unbalanced in scaling tougher enemy npcs.

 

[Oddjob OTP]

They sort of do that though, when a settlement needs help you get sent off to clear the Auto Plant again, or one of a half dozen other dungeons you've already cleared six times. The problem is the pool for each settlement is very small and individual settlements ask for help too frequently. It would work out better if the smaller settlements were removed, the game asked you to save the same settlement less frequently and there was actually a benefit to having more then one settlement.

 

[BALLZ-BROKEN]

It's not that radiant quests are inherently bad; it's just that it's a cheap and easy way of inflating game play time. They're like the fuckin' mad libs of script writing: Go to [LocationName] and kill [EnemyType] and retrieve [ItemName] for [FactionName]! Only mad libs are actually fun.

The radiant quest locations should be in places that the player wouldn't normally go to, and they should feel like they're there organically. Like the bounty tacked in Diamond City, or how you randomly find bodies with notes on them. Only in my game, they sometimes don't work and they just say I stashed the ... at ... . And make the reward actually worth something; I'm not going halfway across the map and clearing a dungeon for some shitty pipe rifle worth 50 caps! And please, please, please don't have a NPC whose sole purpose is to dispense these things!

 

[Burned Man]

I love Caesar's Legion because it's the epitome of "wait and see" outsiders have the choice of buying into Caesar's ideal of Hegelian Dialectics. But the main foot soldiers of the Legion are indoctrinated into dying for this idea that might not even work it adds a tragic irony and an "ends justify the means" spin to them. The cultural genocide of tribals is just the cherry on top. But the real kicker is that Caesar's Legion are the underdogs they just utilize unsavory methods to quickly accrue numbers and power. They're an almost brilliant bad guy faction. But the thing is they could be more grey with just a bit of effort. It's clear that Obsidian really wanted to make them black (they force the slave women to carry tons of bags for some reason--so evil guys!!!) when i think there was a lot of potential for a more balanced faction that runs on harsh methods meant for a wasteland.

It might have helped of we got to see some settlements or places in Legion control that weren't a military camp. That's also a point in the Legions favor however when you notice how often the NCR has you patching up holes in their lines or removing non-Legion thorns in their sides while the Legion never has you go past the fort because they made sure there weren't any problems back there.

 

[vertexwindi]

A lot of the NCR quests' solutions also involve you simply bribing whoever is being a pain in your ass.

 

[Fluke]

Personally I've always felt Caesar's Legion was the most likely to achieve it's goal of uniteing the Wasteland because NCR was run by merchants only interested in enriching themselves

Exuse me we call them bankers you fucking antisemite and them running the ncr is a conspiracy theory they only run entertainment and the media nothing else.

The infuriating part isn't the histrionic criticism (never mind that slavery has been an element of Fallout since the first fucking game); the infuriating part is Avellone's spine of linguine in the face of that criticism.

Why didnt he just ignore it tough? What is there to gain by responding to random twitter spergs crtisisin the writing of whats regarded as the most well written rpg of all time.

And what I don't get is that the rumor going around is that Zenimax wants to go public, but isn't it obvious to investors that this corporate policy of charging $60 for a half finished game and then charging extra for the fun bits isn't working? EA lost, what, $4 billion dollars? Ubisoft issued a don't panic letter to investors, and Activison-Blizzard are getting nastygrams from Clowngress for Hong Kong. Or maybe that's their strategy. Zenimax is gonna tell potential investors that "Hey, all these big companies are losing money; we're the only ones that are making money!" (and by making money I mean losing the least money, the "cleanest dirty shirt" if you will).

Maybe that would be good for zenimax tough, maybe we would finally see some heads roll uptop in betshedas and zenimax management.
I could honestly imagine Todd howard in a Elon musk esk postion where he tricks diffrent kind of retards to buy betsheda stock.