Formula 1 Discussion - And favourite driver?

But he hasn't been in a lesser car and out-performed it, which leads me to presume he's not actually that good.

He won a race in the car that finished 7th (8th if McLaren hadn't fucked up and got banned) in the championship.

Lewis did very good in a lacking Mclaren in that one year the Merc was bad

And scored less points in his seasons alongside Button than Button did.

Kimi made that Lotus win a race in Bahrain all that time ago

He came 2nd in Bahrain in 2012 and won Abu Dhabi that year in Bahrain Grosjean was 3rd and this was a car that made 4th in the constructors championship with Grosjean playing bumper cars. In 2013 he came 1st in Aus and 2nd in Bahrain but again in a car that was pretty handy coming 4th again in the constructor's championship (fun fact it was Kimi's performance clause in the contract that pretty much bankrupted the team).

and yet he can't seem to be able to do that.

Well again look at Monza all those years ago. A lot of people like to use these "one offs" where the situation falls to an unusual driver/team and they win the way they want. Driver they like? It was pure skill. Driver they don't like? It was luck.

That red bull was the perfect car for him, and he shone in that and I am sure that if you put a driver equal to him in that same car he would have won

Of course it was, you build a car for your main driver's style. You can say that second part about literally every driver ever, if you put a driver equal to them in the same car they would have had a similar result.

he moment the car isn't what he likes, he cannot get ahold of it

Again, literally every driver. They all have a preferable balance, style etc and when it's off they drop right back.

his racecraft has always been poor

Bullshit. I could name clumsy mistakes by every driver, ever. Lewis on button in Canada and on Albon in Brazil.

The rest of your post is unsupported opinion based on nothing but personal biases so no point trying to argue it factually on those.

The main problem with current F1 is mainly that of there's no real way to stop a snowball effect of a team getting their engine right in 2014 and then proceeding to ride that high to 2020

The bullshit of the engine tokens fucked this period in F1. When Ferrari were dominant, then when red bull dominated all the teams could copy and develop to catch up the with the engines it was homogenisation and no more development so they froze who was fastest and who wasn't. Do whatever you want to your car you ain't making up for the bhp deficit because it essentially became an engine formula.
 
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But he hasn't been in a lesser car and out-performed it, which leads me to presume he's not actually that good.
So, the fact he didn't have to drive a bad car before means he's a bad driver throughout his career? You are aware of how little sense that makes, I hope.
It's a ridiculously arbitrary way of measuring a driver's abilities and would mean that the best driver in the world would have no way of proving himself to you unless he steps into a Haas and squeezes a couple podium places out of them.
No matter how good a driver is, when a car is slow in the corners, slow in the straights and the strategists fuck up, he won't be able to perform.

And just for shits n giggles: How exactly do you think did Vettel get cockpits in these cars in the first place? He reached 8th place in his first full season in Torro Rosso, where his teammate ended up ranked 17th and both Red Bull drivers being on 11th and 16th place.

the list of examples of someone in inferior equipment doing well during Seb's career goes on - and yet he can't seem to be able to do that.
Well, partially cause (as you just said yourself) he never even had a "chance" to do that (well, at least as long as you continue to disregard season '08).
And in current years Ferrari, I doubt anyone could either. Leclerc had a few decent races in the beginning with full support and backing by the team, but the gap to the other teams has widened in the past weeks and both Vettel and Leclerc are pretty consistent in that they reach lap-times within half a second of one another and struggle to remain in the top 10. This qualifying, we got a fine example of Ferrari's bad strategists when they send out Vettel and he ended up not even reaching Q2, cause he was stuck in the middle of a large group and then during the race itself, we saw their completely fucked aero-balance when Leclerc crashed (like we couldn't tell before their balance was atrocious). And just for good measure, the car lacks in top speed and it suffered a total brake failure, too.

Vettel has been abondoned by his team and got little to no support, so there's no help coming from there either.
Hell, in Silverstone, they let him drive in a bad chassis and then threw him right under the bus with their pitstop orders. They gave him two short stints on hard tyres and one long on soft, while Leclerc got a one-stop strategy. With Leclercs crash this race, which looked exactly like Vettels spin in Silverstone, I wonder if bad balance was an issue there, too. At least Vettel prevented a crash with (I think) Albon.
In Spain, Vettel asks the pit crew if he can continue on his tyres or if he needs to stop, they don't give him an answer for a couple laps and then go "can you continue on these tyres?". The team is clearly bidding their time with him and just waiting for his contract to end, doing the bare minimum of work with him.

The car is bad, the team doesn't support him, but somehow he's supposed to wrestle that car all the way to the podium or else he's a bad driver? Seems fair.

his racecraft has always been poor, think Istanbul with Webber, and Brazil last year with Charles to name but two, and he continues to show no real skill or ability in the car despite being one of the more experienced driver, meanwhile old man Kimi is still managing to show glimpses (I'm not going to argue he's still got it, mind), Perez is still always there or thereabouts and again the list continues.
And to point out how bad he is, the best you can come up with are two crashes, almost ten years apart. As @Coccxys has said: You can point out bad calls and mistakes by any given driver. Vettel isn't perfect, no one ever claimed he'd be, but this is -quite frankly- very petty.

Old man Kimi has not scored a single point in this season. He's an amazing driver (which is why I take a bit offense to you calling him timid in an earlier post) but how exactly has Kimi outperformed his bad car? He's a living example that a good driver can't magically make a car go faster by willpower and skill alone.

I don't even think the surname will generate as much buzz as everyone is expecting, because before you had to actually care enough to look into who was up-and-coming to find out who might be the next Hill, Schumacher, Prost, whatever.
I should have been more specific: I was talking from a German point of view. The surname will generate a lot of buzz here. For a short time, at least.

The excitement for him was had the moment all the media pounced on him senselessly because they wanted to be able to say they could interview a Schumacher, not because he was a really quick and cool upcoming prospect and/or a driver with a story to tell like Billy Monger for example.
I dunno, I think once he made the jump into F1, that will also give him a boost internationally. The buzz that surrounds him right now isn't "Someone named Schumacher in a Formula series" alone, it's always dangling that insinuation before our eyes that he will go into F1 and kick ass.
The buzz always frames it in a way that he will be a future F1 driver (and maybe champion).

And on that note: I would like to see him win an F1 title, dunno if he will be able to, but it would be neat. There's also a german female F3 driver, would like to see her in Formula 1 one day... As long as she doesn't go full Danica Patrick on us.
 
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Perez out of racing point at end of season. Got to be Vettel surely, Stroll has lost it if he's getting rid of Perez and his sponsorship for anyone other than a previous champion.

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I'd be worrying if I was in Latifi's position. Perez without a drive, a bucket of sponsorship money and new owners who might like the idea of a seasoned driver to help develop the 22 car.
 
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Perez out of racing point at end of season. Got to be Vettel surely, Stroll has lost it if he's getting rid of Perez and his sponsorship for anyone other than a previous champion.

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I'd be worrying if I was in Latifi's position. Perez without a drive, a bucket of sponsorship money and new owners who might like the idea of a seasoned driver to help develop the 22 car.
Are there any reasons given? Perez is a decent driver and he's ranked 11th even though he missed two races. His results were pretty consistent. If this is Vettels new ride... I dunno. Would be interesting to see if Vettel can pull off something in a different car, but I don't expect any miracles, either from the car or from Vettel.

And for that matter, as silly as it might sound: Having a team named Aston Martin in F1 is kind of neat... even if it's just the name.
 
No reason given. Just an announcement on twitter by Perez. Probably getting out ahead of racing point's official announcement.

Hiring Vettel has one major advantage, Aston Martin's 2nd biggest market is Germany. Plus Toto is part owner of Aston Martin and has been pushing for Vettel to be in that car for a while.
 
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No reason given. Just an announcement on twitter by Perez. Probably getting out ahead of racing point's official announcement.

Hiring Vettel has one major advantage, Aston Martin's 2nd biggest market is Germany. Plus Toto is part owner of Aston Martin and has been pushing for Vettel to be in that car for a while.
If that car performs well, it might be pretty neat to see Vettel change there... How are the odds they give Hülkenberg another shot? I think they were quite satisfied when he took over for Perez...
Wonder how this will all turn out.
 
It could be making way for Hulk, hell Lawrence could be sticking his other kid in the car. There isn't any mention of a replacement except for rumours and speculation. Like I say this originated from a tweet by Perez which forced racing point into an "official statement" they also posted on twitter.
 
It has to be Vettel. There would be no reason to announce something like this so early, except for maybe something in Perez's contract stipulates a certain date for termination or buyout. I just don't think they would announce something so early. Plus Ottmar drove Vettel to the petrol station and that was probably to finalize the terms! HAHA

LOL, maybe its Hamilton! That would be rich!
 
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It is indeed Vettel. I wonder if Perez forced their hand on making the announcement or if he was just getting out ahead of them.

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It is indeed Vettel. I wonder if Perez forced their hand on making the announcement or if he was just getting out ahead of them.

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My thought is that they were willing to let him go out on his own terms and let him make the announcement given that he initiated a process that saved the entire team and allowed them to become the contenders they are today. Shame, but writing was on the wall as soon as the combo of Vettel leaving and the RP being a potential podium finisher became clear. Those two combined sealed Checo's fate. If the RP sucked or AM weren't coming in, Vettel would not have considered going to them.

It will be a step down for Perez now, no matter where he goes. The best scenario would be to replace Albon, but that of course will not happen. So, its either Alfa or Haas, neither an inviting scenario.
 
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My thought is that they were willing to let him go out on his own terms and let him make the announcement given that he initiated a process that saved the entire team and allowed them to become the contenders they are today. Shame, but writing was on the wall as soon as the combo of Vettel leaving and the RP being a potential podium finisher became clear. Those two combined sealed Checo's fate. If the RP sucked or AM weren't coming in, Vettel would not have considered going to them.

It will be a step down for Perez now, no matter where he goes. The best scenario would be to replace Albon, but that of course will not happen. So, its either Alfa or Haas, neither an inviting scenario.
I assume Gasly will get another shot at Red Bull, Albon hasn't performed well these past races and Gasly was pretty good.
It's always a shame seeing a good driver being handed down to lesser teams.
 
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It will be a step down for Perez now, no matter where he goes. The best scenario would be to replace Albon, but that of course will not happen. So, its either Alfa or Haas, neither an inviting scenario.

I've seen speculation today about him going to Williams, replacing Latifi. I'm not sure how long Latifi's contract is for, though. The amount of sponsorship that Perez brings to the table (as well as his skills) has to make him an attractive driver for any team, surely?
 
It will be a step down for Perez now, no matter where he goes. The best scenario would be to replace Albon, but that of course will not happen. So, its either Alfa or Haas, neither an inviting scenario.
I could see him perhaps swapping cars entirely, maybe go do FE (lol) or IndyCar perhaps, FE I think would be a bad move, but with how IndyCar does it all American like with everything running on sponsorship before anything else - leading to Max Chilton and Markus Ericsson driving there - his money is a fairly good basis to get in on it.
 
I could see him perhaps swapping cars entirely, maybe go do FE (lol) or IndyCar perhaps, FE I think would be a bad move, but with how IndyCar does it all American like with everything running on sponsorship before anything else - leading to Max Chilton and Markus Ericsson driving there - his money is a fairly good basis to get in on it.
No driver should be subjected to driving FE.
Every race looks exactly like this.
Well, minus the lasers...
 
FE was a reasonable idea until they let pops decide that "the kids these days need their social medias so let's let them vote on who gets extra speed. Oh and they like their video games so let's copy that popular racing game my son liked when he was 8, I think it was called mario karts". Like seriously I think DRS is an artificial gimmick I'm sure as hell not going to watch that shit.
 
FE was a reasonable idea until they let pops decide that "the kids these days need their social medias so let's let them vote on who gets extra speed. Oh and they like their video games so let's copy that popular racing game my son liked when he was 8, I think it was called mario karts". Like seriously I think DRS is an artificial gimmick I'm sure as hell not going to watch that shit.
I think the only reason anyone cares about Formula E is that it's far cheaper to watch than F1 and it's got a lot of corporate support since we live in the age of performative politics as advertisement. It's also substantially cheaper than F1 so that's why there's more manufacturers there.
 
I think the only reason anyone cares about Formula E is that it's far cheaper to watch than F1 and it's got a lot of corporate support since we live in the age of performative politics as advertisement. It's also substantially cheaper than F1 so that's why there's more manufacturers there.
More importantly than it being cheaper, it is a series running at a catastrophic loss because it pays for everything, including the teams to entry, so it's profitable for the teams - even privateers - until the series crashes in a tonne of debt, and they get chased for it somehow later on.
 
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FE was a reasonable idea until they let pops decide that "the kids these days need their social medias so let's let them vote on who gets extra speed. Oh and they like their video games so let's copy that popular racing game my son liked when he was 8, I think it was called mario karts". Like seriously I think DRS is an artificial gimmick I'm sure as hell not going to watch that shit.
I watched exactly one race and what really dumbfounded me was that boost area thing, that drivers have to use a certain number of times. The "boost" area was off to the side in a chicane, meaning that by leaving the race-line the driver would lose 3 or 4 places and the boost would then maybe allow him to win back 2 or 3 at best. During the entire race, I have not seen a single driver profit from that boost, the best they could hope for was to overtake all the cars that passed them while they picked up the boost - and that barely happened either, using the boost was always a disadvantage.
If it wasn't mandatory, it would be best to simply ignore it, cause the little bit of more power barely buys you back the time you lose for picking it up. And that's not even the worst and most asinine thing about it: When you go for the boost and the safety car comes out, the timer for the boost continues. I've watched so many drivers wasting their boost behind a safety car in that one race, I couldn't even fathom how you'd come up with a botched race mechanic like that, even when you would attempt to make it shit on purpose.
And then came the fan boost. I knew about it beforehand, but damn, is that silly in the race.

The only thing that did seem interesting was watching the energy-level of the battery in realtime and to see the drivers reach the finishing line with like 1 or 2 percent of their power left... but then again, I think if we'd get a realtime fuel gauge for F1, we'd pretty much see the same thing.

FE sounded interesting when it was created, but it is incredibly boring to watch and the race mechanics are absolutely asinine. I'd rather watch a championship of carrera races then this garbage.
 
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