Games Journalism General

[Next Task]

But internet autists can't get a foot in the door of a multinational corporation to grill them on their business practices, or talk to an executive about laws on monetization of kids games. That sort of thing requires a real reporter and not some glorified blogger working for gizmodo.

This is what I want. I mean, yes, I want no more mention of GamerGate, reviews that talk about the game and gameplay rather than representation and whether it's woke enough, reviews done by people who have at least some ability to play games and don't whine, or worse lie, about how much and how well they've done with a game. I don't want leaks of rumours about upcoming games, TMI about the writers' life, especially their sexual predilections, or articles that only exist to castigate the reader.

But really, the only place games journalists can actually do a job that properly earns them the right to be considered journalists is in dealing with the corporations that release the games fairly. EA releases a good game? Report that. Crunch is ruining lives? Report that. Predatory practices, like microtransactions, bugged releases, eternal DLC and the move to try and get gamers to lease a game they're playing rather than own it outright when they buy it? Report that.

@sophnar0747, your Zoe Quinn article is actually a good example of the sort of thing that games journalism should be and so rarely is. I don't want to hear what some random Twitter person thinks about - well, anything, but especially not their outrage about games. I'd rather hear how she hasn't produced a game and never will, not about whatever new shiny thing has briefly brought her attention. I'd rather hear about the intent and development of Cyberpunk 2077, not how a few morons misinterpreted an in-game advertisement as the latest proof gamers are evil. I'd rather know about the actual new Smash Bros. characters (and I don't even play it) than what characters someone wants to have in the game, and will be upset if they aren't.

tl;dr: Don't be corrupt. Do actual reporting. Review like you actually enjoy what you do. Interview or quote people who matter. Cultivate personality in your writing without inserting yourself into every article. Don't scold, condescend or lecture your audience. Let games be fun, and escapism, and just not that big a deal.

 

[sophnar0747]

@sophnar0747, your Zoe Quinn article is actually a good example of the sort of thing that games journalism should be and so rarely is.

Thanks for reading and enjoying it. I really am trying to do my best here. I know I had a few stumbles early on, most notably falling too far on the reactionary end of things for a time, but I'm now working hard to deliver quality work and thorough investigations. I think I've had some solid work this year, I'm especially proud of my Blake Harris and Laura Dale exposes'. Hopefully my content only grows stronger now that I'm venturing out on my very own and am solely independent.

 

[Next Task]

I'm especially proud of my Blake Harris and Laura Dale exposes'. Hopefully my content only grows stronger now that I'm venturing out on my very own and am solely independent.

I don't know your early work. But I think the Farms in general supports people like Quinn, Dale and co. being exposed as the lying, hypocritical lolcows they are. Both have threads after all.

I know I'm happy to see the truth about the scumbags who get involved with gaming or gaming journalism, but it's something I personally enjoy, not something I think is mandatory for the form, if that makes sense.

 

[The_wandering_nibler]

Please watch this:

Man you need to write a short summary of these things. This seems interesting enough though I cant remember the last time I listened to a podcast longer than 1 hour. Maybe a few timestamps as well. Thanks tho.

In relation to this thread, is it somehow to point out a good games journalist? But he's interviewing such an obscure figure over an obscure game though...Im jumping through it a bit and he's a bit arrogant too tho.

 

[NOT Sword Fighter Super]

Man you need to write a short summary of these things. This seems interesting enough though I cant remember the last time I listened to a podcast longer than 1 hour. Maybe a few timestamps as well. Thanks tho.

In relation to this thread, is it somehow to point out a good games journalist? But he's interviewing such an obscure figure over an obscure game though...Im jumping through it a bit and he's a bit arrogant too tho.

It's worth the time if you're doing yardwork or something.

 

[The_wandering_nibler]

Ye but like, I jumped into the middle now and they are bitching and arguing about why their negotiations about booking a time failed. Though one of them brings up good points about paying for beta testing as opposed to being payed and stuff like this, they both seem like amateurs.

 

[DoofComoose]

Gaming journalism as a whole needs giant internal changes they do not want to make. When people like Dunkey call them out they would rather all sperg on twitter though than admit there are problems, or be like "WE CANT CHANGE THIS IS JUST THE WAY IT IS". If the entire system is shit then you need to rework it.

 

[robobobo]

Zoe Quinn was and should have always remained a literally who, it was some journalists' faults that she got enough name recognition to be in a position to scam people on Kickstarter in the first place. There should be a certain threshold of relevance before a journalist writes about a dramacow, or else it's just free publicity for a shitty person. Unfortunately there are way too many thirsty writers out there; places like oneangrygamer will guarantee that free publicity for any nobody who runs up and yells stupid shit about the patriarchy or racism.

 

[Smaug's Smokey Hole]

But he's interviewing such an obscure figure over an obscure game though...Im jumping through it a bit and he's a bit arrogant too tho.

Dino Dini is a legend, smoothest balls in soccer.

To add something to the discussion. MMA is in a similar position in that it has been a form of enthusiast press requiring no more credentials than being a fanboy. When I read @sophnar0747 asking what games journalists should be writing of I thought of Mike Russell of Realfightstories doing actual journalism about MMA and how confused it made mma journalists, this wasn't pushing product or selling wolf-tickets.
There's a particular snippet he posted, transcribed from a a big sites Podcast, that I'll post towards the bottom because it's very familiar.

Anyway, Russell wrote a series of articles with tons of research exposing a promoter/manager and high profile figure called Ali Abdel Aziz and his shady background. It's some insane shit.

Spoilered because this is off-topic. Read if bored.

Spoiler

Some of the basics of Aziz that Russell unearthed, there's more, much more.

In September 2001, just days after 9/11, a young Egyptian national is flagged trying to sneak into the United States via Colorado using a falsified passport.

Ali Abdel Aziz, AKA Ali Ibrahim, AKA Ali A. Aziz, AKA Alaa Abdel Aziz, told investigators that he was an Olympic judoka who came to Colorado to train at the Olympic Training Center (OTC) in Colorado Springs, and to make money to send back home to his ailing mother.

He wasn’t concerned about [his family] welfare when he contacted Twilight in America author Martin Mawyer in the fall of 2010 and spilled his guts about his involvement as a high-ranking member and NYPD and FBI informant of suspected terrorist organization, Muslims of America.

After he was exonerated by that Colorado jury, the U.S. Attorney’s Office (USAO) re-arrested Abdel Aziz, who had been under homeland security surveillance since his release. In between arrests he was photographed by federal agents in the constant company of known members of Muslims of America. Abdel Aziz told Mawyer he taught the group unarmed combat, Arabic, and how to read the Qaran.

He also told Mawyer that this was all merely a coincidence that the group he was teaching were all members of an extremist group, and that he had no clue at the time that his new crew was on law enforcement watch lists.

For starters, Abdel-Aziz never competed at the Olympics in 1996 like he claimed. In fact, he had never competed at any Olympics at all. He used the lie as a cover to explain to authorities why he was flying into the location of a Muslim sect with extremist ties with a forged document and an imaginary identity.

Even the fight career of Abdel Aziz was a facade, whose primary purpose was to hide the exorbitant amount of money he was being paid to spy for the NYPD.

“I was fighting and I sold cars on the side. The cars were just to maintain my cover. They told me go start a car dealership,” he explained to Mawyer. “They told me to start fighting in fights, you know? I’d make a minimum $ 30,000 in the fights.”

One of my NYPD sources who would not go on the record, but told me he would testify to these facts in court, said this is categorically false and that Abdel Aziz bought the used car dealership on his own accord and brought a senior MOA officer on as equal partner.

Link to site if anyone is interested in the full articles. Yes, the official site is on internet archive.

Real Fight Stories - Real, honest, and balanced stories from the world of combat sports.

Real, honest, and balanced stories from the world of combat sports.

web.archive.org

Mike Russell transcribed this from a sites podcast

Spoiler: MMAJunkie’s John Morgan and Cold Coffee explain how MMA journalism works

John Morgan(MMA journalist): Uh, I’ve had some people ask why I’m not jumpin’ on it. Um…Can’t. Can’t verify most of those stories to be honest with you.I…I…I…I’m sorry, I don’t have CIA sources, and FBI sources, and uh… Really there’s just no way for me to do it. And I can’t… With that level of… With that level of what’s being said and the accusations that are being made, I can’t just throw it out there and be like, “A report said…” That opens up USA Today to lawsuits and things like that, and it’s certainly something we can’t touch.

Cold Coffee(MMA journalist): Then you start looking like one of those rags that literally is just trying to throw a headline out there to get some clicks, get some doing whatever, and if anything else that’s what I think I pride myself working with an organization that doesn’t jump on the bandwagon — doesn’t jump to that stuff. And it’s not a matter of protecting a friend or doing whatever. You just don’t want… You’ve got to be reputable. You gotta know your shit.

....

Cold Coffee: You know, when you have the coverage that as many people read on [MMA]Junkie and talk about what’s said, that anything you could say can and would be used against you…

John Morgan: Yep.

Cold Coffee: You know, so, you gotta be smart about it. Just some of the stories you started to tell me just a second ago just blew my mind. You know, about the CIA shit and spy stuff.

John Morgan: It’s crazy.

Cold Coffee: I mean like how the fuck do you try to fact check something like that? I mean, how do you find out about that shit?

John Morgan: Yeah. I’ll be the first to admit I’m just a lowly MMA reporter, man. I do not know how you get Pentagon sources.

The kill shot:

[Editor’s note: During a brief Twitter exchange with Canadian MMA reporter and Parting Shots Podcast co-host Carlin Bardsley, Morgan admitted he had not read the book written largely about Abdel Aziz’s testimony about how he became an NYPD/FBI informant after being arrested twice for flying into Colorado with a stolen Egyptian passport.]

 

[sophnar0747]

I don't follow MMA at all, but that was an interesting read nonetheless, thanks for that @Smaug's Smokey Hole

 

[Smaug's Smokey Hole]

I don't follow MMA at all, but that was an interesting read nonetheless, thanks for that @Smaug's Smokey Hole

The MMA wasn't really important, it's just that both the vidya and punchya press came from the same place and grew to be something similar to each other and this was an event I remembered where someone did sports journalism and it caught every "mma journalists" by surprise, they didn't know what to do or how to respond. It was also written in a way that outsiders can enjoy, like a real article.

For vidya, this is a pretty good video in a journalistic style, it's about the Dragon Quest music, the first couple of minutes is like any other youtube video but then it gets interesting with old contracts and licensing, intentionally bad music, ornery old men etc.

Why the Music in Dragon Quest XI is So Terrible | Past Mortem [SSFF]

Dragon Quest's music begins and ends with one man: Koichi Sugiyama. We take a deep dive into who Sugiyama is and what his stranglehold on Dragon Quest music ...

www.youtube.com

 

[BrokenWokenBespoken]

Gaming journalism as a whole needs giant internal changes they do not want to make. When people like Dunkey call them out they would rather all sperg on twitter though than admit there are problems, or be like "WE CANT CHANGE THIS IS JUST THE WAY IT IS". If the entire system is shit then you need to rework it.

People forgot that media has been consolidated long ago. The only reason why Niche and OAG exists is because they are allow to wallow in their insignificance as they can change NOTHING

These 6 Corporations Control 90% Of The Media In America

www.businessinsider.com

So the gaming rags can spout shit and get away with it because they dont do an actual dent to losses at their worst while guys like Orselli makes less than welfare from Niche Gamer. It is the painful truth but honest journalism doesnt work on empty stomachs

 

[The_wandering_nibler]

Dino Dini is a legend, smoothest balls in soccer.

Well he may have been one but his new game, the one flashing during that whole podcast was an abysmal failure.

 

[ProfDongs]

For vidya, this is a pretty good video in a journalistic style, it's about the Dragon Quest music, the first couple of minutes is like any other youtube video but then it gets interesting with old contracts and licensing, intentionally bad music, ornery old men etc.

Why the Music in Dragon Quest XI is So Terrible | Past Mortem [SSFF]

Dragon Quest's music begins and ends with one man: Koichi Sugiyama. We take a deep dive into who Sugiyama is and what his stranglehold on Dragon Quest music ...

www.youtube.com

I don't know if this is me being obtuse but I don't really understand what the guys politics in regards to revisionism have to do with the music. The stuff about him with regards to copyright and all of that makes sense in the context of this, but his ideas on the war seemed extremely out of place.

 

[robobobo]

I don't know if this is me being obtuse but I don't really understand what the guys politics in regards to revisionism have to do with the music. The stuff about him with regards to copyright and all of that makes sense in the context of this, but his ideas on the war seemed extremely out of place.

You heard her, it made him "gross", because young people apparently can't find another adjective to use, ever. Because holy shit, a guy who was a ten year old kid in WWII has rose-colored glasses about his country's shitty behavior in that war, who could've guessed. I don't consider it an invalid criticism of the man in general that he's a revisionist kook and the Japanese version of a Holocaust denier, but it's completely irrelevant to this particular issue.

 

[Smaug's Smokey Hole]

I don't know if this is me being obtuse but I don't really understand what the guys politics in regards to revisionism have to do with the music. The stuff about him with regards to copyright and all of that makes sense in the context of this, but his ideas on the war seemed extremely out of place.

What robobo said but I found it interesting that he was a denier on top of everything else. It's the story progression, why is the music crummy, then it rolls forward and all kinds of things gets dragged up that paints a picture of this strange person insisting on using inferior versions of music in the games he composes for so he can sell CDs with the non-bad versions or whatever sub-par villain scheme he's running. It's funny.

Note that she didn't come to the conclusion that all his music have always been bad retroactively because of wrongthink and that loses them a ton of SJW points.

 

[Judge Dredd]

Weird question, but as someone who writes about gaming, its culture, and all of the assorted nonsense that occurs within journalism about those subjects, I'm curious, what do you want out of the medium as a whole? I'm sure most of us agree that the incestuous and unethical bullshit that happens with writers who act as more of a political activist than a gaming enthusiast need to go, but that aside, what do you want out of game journalism as we head into 2020?

I know I'm late, but I want to answer this because I've not seen my opinion represented here.

My initial answer is the same as what most people here have said. No politics, talk about the game, etc. One minor difference is I think review scores can work even with a large writing staff. Review scores became corrupted due to abundance of shill sites using 7.5 as code for "This game is bad but we were paid to give the game a good review", and when SJWs realized that they could punish developers of "problematic" games and get clicks by giving good games bad scores.

But even though I have fond memories of gaming magazines and still read Retro Gamer on occasion, I don't think a return to that style would work these days.

I don't think I can really articulate what I want outside of pointing to retro YouTubers like LGR and Snes Drunk and saying I want those but for new stuff, or pointing to the glory days of Giant Bomb and Consolvania and saying I want more of that, but that isn't really helpful and is just more nostalgia.

One of the things that is lacking is games journalism these days is news, but I wonder if there's any worthwhile news to be had at all. I remember old E3s where you'd have the big press conferences, but then the rest of E3 was journalists walking around the halls trying all kinds of weird and bizarre games. You would think we'd be in a golden age for that stuff with high quality internet video being common, but E3 is barren now.

Then there's the middle market. Games journalists are too triggered by anything even remotely sexual to review anime games, too stupid and inept to cover anything with a bit of complexity, too click driven to cover anything niche, too connected to a small clique of no talent indies to give others a fair shake, and won't cover massive failures because they are in the pocket of AAA publishers.

This is where indie game journalists should swoop in and actually do games journalism, but what is there left to cover? There's no Front Mission, no Armored Core, no Deadly Premonition, nothing that would fall under that umbrella of weird, complex, or quirky. Where's this generations Parasite Eve or SOS: Final Escape equivalent? They don't exist as far as I'm aware. Everybody who cares about Earth Defense Force knows about EDF 5. Everybody who cares about Zoe Quinn's kickstarter game knows it's a scam that's never going to be finished. And indie game journalists don't have the connections to get more than boilerplate PR answers if they try to follow up on games that disappeared like Scorn or the Mek-Fu controller, or uncover why high profile games were such a disaster.

I don't see a place for them to go outside of being a news aggrigator and doing reviews, but if they do that, why I should I pay attention to them instead of the dozens of YouTubers who do the same thing?

I'm honestly convinced that not just video game culture, but niche/geek fandom in general needs clubhouse rules and standards of conduct to follow, as well as codes of behavior and mores to adhere to.

Video game fandom or "gamerdom" isn't just filled with politicized bullshit and SJW fauxgressive misaimed garbage, it's also filled with smelly and unpleasant socially backwards dipshits who play the bitter incel inclusive exclusive nerd supremacist angle and hate everyone who isn't "like them" who garners a minute modicum of interest in their hobby. That alone spawned the mutant troon monster that is the SJW Anti Gamergate beast, clear up that cesspool first. This coming from a guy who likes anime and manga enough to want codes of conduct for manga and anime enthusiasts who want to dabble and even one day perhaps draw in the style without going full on weeaboo otaku.

That exists because around 2010 geek media went mainstream. I remember David Gallant once said he only because a game developer because he wanted to be like some cool guys he met. I may have linked this article before, sorry if I have, but it describes what happened fairly well.

Geeks, MOPs, and sociopaths in subculture evolution | Meaningness

How muggles and sociopaths invade and undermine creative subcultures; and how to stop them.

meaningness.com

 

[BrokenWokenBespoken]

I know I'm late, but I want to answer this because I've not seen my opinion represented here.

My initial answer is the same as what most people here have said. No politics, talk about the game, etc. One minor difference is I think review scores can work even with a large writing staff. Review scores became corrupted due to abundance of shill sites using 7.5 as code for "This game is bad but we were paid to give the game a good review", and when SJWs realized that they could punish developers of "problematic" games and get clicks by giving good games bad scores.

But even though I have fond memories of gaming magazines and still read Retro Gamer on occasion, I don't think a return to that style would work these days.

I don't think I can really articulate what I want outside of pointing to retro YouTubers like LGR and Snes Drunk and saying I want those but for new stuff, or pointing to the glory days of Giant Bomb and Consolvania and saying I want more of that, but that isn't really helpful and is just more nostalgia.

One of the things that is lacking is games journalism these days is news, but I wonder if there's any worthwhile news to be had at all. I remember old E3s where you'd have the big press conferences, but then the rest of E3 was journalists walking around the halls trying all kinds of weird and bizarre games. You would think we'd be in a golden age for that stuff with high quality internet video being common, but E3 is barren now.

Then there's the middle market. Games journalists are too triggered by anything even remotely sexual to review anime games, too stupid and inept to cover anything with a bit of complexity, too click driven to cover anything niche, too connected to a small clique of no talent indies to give others a fair shake, and won't cover massive failures because they are in the pocket of AAA publishers.
View attachment 851450
This is where indie game journalists should swoop in and actually do games journalism, but what is there left to cover? There's no Front Mission, no Armored Core, no Deadly Premonition, nothing that would fall under that umbrella of weird, complex, or quirky. Where's this generations Parasite Eve or SOS: Final Escape equivalent? They don't exist as far as I'm aware. Everybody who cares about Earth Defense Force knows about EDF 5. Everybody who cares about Zoe Quinn's kickstarter game knows it's a scam that's never going to be finished. And indie game journalists don't have the connections to get more than boilerplate PR answers if they try to follow up on games that disappeared like Scorn or the Mek-Fu controller, or uncover why high profile games were such a disaster.

I don't see a place for them to go outside of being a news aggrigator and doing reviews, but if they do that, why I should I pay attention to them instead of the dozens of YouTubers who do the same thing?


That exists because around 2010 geek media went mainstream. I remember David Gallant once said he only because a game developer because he wanted to be like some cool guys he met. I may have linked this article before, sorry if I have, but it describes what happened fairly well.

Geeks, MOPs, and sociopaths in subculture evolution | Meaningness

How muggles and sociopaths invade and undermine creative subcultures; and how to stop them.

meaningness.com

For news to work it would require a very airtight staff where information is tightly monitored and insiders taken care of quickly. With big companies like HBO having their final season of GoT leaked out and predicted accurately. News means very little these days as all it takes is one industry insider to blow things wide open.

As for your issue with coverage, remember that of the middle market. The anime fanbase goes the other way, the only time people comment on games on Niche and Gematsu is when it is sexual content getting hit by the Californian boogeyman or having to be "civil" in FPS. The well is poisoned thanks to Sony's tightening regulations and every discussion is going to devolve to screaming. So there is another reason why anime games don't get coverage is community manager having to moderate a shitty debate. This is purely from a business point of view and no company is going to hire a socially inept gamer despite their perceived competence over the intellect.

As for Politics itself, it is the only thing that keeps them here and if they have to be lobotomized further they would just quit and go back to supporting the local antifa community and be even more waste of oxygen. Companies these days can't just care for an journalist's pursestrings but nods that they respect their opinion and has taken steps to demonstrate their efforts at social change.

 

[Smaug's Smokey Hole]

I don't think I can really articulate what I want outside of pointing to retro YouTubers like LGR and Snes Drunk and saying I want those but for new stuff, or pointing to the glory days of Giant Bomb and Consolvania and saying I want more of that, but that isn't really helpful and is just more nostalgia.

There was an old magazine that I used to read that had a good concept when it came to reviews(Famitsu-lite basically). First there was the review text with pictures and what the game was, how it worked, standard stuff, then there was two textboxes for scores. The person that wrote the review then explained in ~1000 characters why he gave it a 0-10, then there was another box where someone that didn't write the review wrote his own ~1000 character opinion of the game and gave it his own independent score. They weren't weighed against each other, the one who wrote the review set the final score but there was always a second opinion.

This lead to Earthbound being given a 9 by one reviewer and a 4 by the other, both jRPG fans, and they explained their reasoning very well. Looking back at when that game came out, how sales weren't great, how divisive it was, it made sense especially in retrospect. The point was never to have a dissenting voice but to have another reviewer that was a fan of the same genre giving his/her opinion on it, a second opinion. Oddly enough women reviewing games seemed more common and not particularly noteworthy back then.

 

[DoofComoose]

How do you guys feel about Super Bunnyhop?

Media Literacy and Game News

UPDATE: Oh God dammit there's typos. Special thanks to Jason Schreier (Kotaku,) Josh Harmon (EGM,) and Crash Course on Media Literacy: https://www.youtube.co...

www.youtube.com

The guy keeps from pushing politics in his videos. He believes some stuff I very much disagree with but never tries to push anything onto you.