General GunTuber thread

[Puff]

On the WWSD lower, I'd like to point out the the spergs, the lower receiver was based on was a good product. This is entirely manufacturing fuckups. A machining company thinks they can do injection molding and fucks it all to hell. Good job.
Hire an expert next time.

 

[JJLiautaud]

Mark Serbu just dropped a couple of clarifications and comments regarding the KB mess

RN 50 Accident Preliminary Analysis

This is a short video I felt I needed to put out to correct some of the false information that's been flying around on the internet.Here's a link to the RN-5...

www.youtube.com

 

[wopirish]

So a fake slap round with some incorrect or excessive powder. Actually fairly interesting possibility that there would be counterfeit slap's circulating given their rarity and high price point. Would explain some of the accuracy issues KB was having earlier with them.

Regardless it all seems to boil back to shooting ammo with an unknown origin/storage conditions.

Interesting to see what turns up when the remains get sent in.

 

[durdledoor]

I think in the videos he said that you need to keep your warranty in a safe space because you might need it, but the company he says is good at returns, probably if true because they have so many
At 2k rounds before a major failure its a gun largely destined to be in transit
I would have thought 80k might be a sort of reasonable figure for an ak part failure
Then he goes on to say its the softest shooting AK he's had and that its accuracy is good, assuming of course you're not on round 1,999 and a few other damage limitation comments
The company seems unconcerned by the criticism but don't appear to want to address the actual problem

 

[wopirish]

I think in the videos he said that you need to keep your warranty in a safe space because you might need it, but the company he says is good at returns, probably if true because they have so many
At 2k rounds before a major failure its a gun largely destined to be in transit
I would have thought 80k might be a sort of reasonable figure for an ak part failure
Then he goes on to say its the softest shooting AK he's had and that its accuracy is good, assuming of course you're not on round 1,999 and a few other damage limitation comments
The company seems unconcerned by the criticism but don't appear to want to address the actual problem

From even a cursory glance the internet is flooded with people bemoaning their exceptionally slow and spotty customer service.

Really any weapon should not have a parts failure anywhere near the 5 digit range. I'll fucking spend the extra money to get proper ak parts where it isn't a constant gamble on whether or not i lose fingers and my eyesight on that range day due to shoddy QA and my family can keep shooting the rifle for the next 100 years.

PSA seems like a company that always coasted by on being the cheaper entry-level firearm manufacturer that makes its money from people who don't know any better about model/weapon specific information. The covid and riot sales have only made it easier for them to make more money as the market pool has expanded so much.

Didn't that commie in texas that got clapped by the army furry last year have a PSA or am I mistaken on that?

 

[Shaka Brah]

From even a cursory glance the internet is flooded with people bemoaning their exceptionally slow and spotty customer service.

Really any weapon should not have a parts failure anywhere near the 5 digit range. I'll fucking spend the extra money to get proper ak parts where it isn't a constant gamble on whether or not i lose fingers and my eyesight on that range day due to shoddy QA and my family can keep shooting the rifle for the next 100 years.

PSA seems like a company that always coasted by on being the cheaper entry-level firearm manufacturer that makes its money from people who don't know any better about model/weapon specific information. The covid and riot sales have only made it easier for them to make more money as the market pool has expanded so much.

Didn't that commie in texas that got clapped by the army furry last year have a PSA or am I mistaken on that?

I dunno about the furry but you're spot-on about PSA. Their main product has always been bargain-basement AR lowers and parts kits. That's nearly impossible to fuck up and keeps them in the market despite their constant state of failure because people are always looking for ARs at a low price. And being constantly in demand means they don't need to try at all in order to remain in business.

 

[Club Sandwich]

actual 74

i've had to replace a few broken FP's in AKM pattern rifles over the years, mostly to rifles that see a lot of rounds in theatrical production or for range rental. the 74's seem to peen at the FP tail from the hammer striking it prior to breaking near the rear third, and that seems to happen at around the 7k mark. the few genuinely broken FPs i've examined were in short barreled AK's of some description (classic Krinks, AKS-74U clones, that one weird Romat 308 shorty that InterArms imported back in the 90's, et c) and they were sheered near the middle from brittle fatigue failure (high round count, hard steel, high pressure) around the 3-4k mark. the longer barreled hunting varieties like the VEPR and ones that are lower pressure like the Saiga 12, seem to be easier on fire control parts.

I would have thought 80k might be a sort of reasonable figure for an ak part failure

as per the AKM's maintenance manual (albeit the one i have is Ukrainian, not Russian) the action spring should be inspected for length and changed if less than 415mm (note that the AKS and AK-47 will vary slightly). the first expected parts breakage would likely be the tail of the bolt carrier after 10-20k rounds depending on bolt carrier velocity from the barrel length on that AKM. the AK-74 has very similar entries in its maintenance manual, although the measurements are a little different.

 

[White Devil]

@Club Sandwich , just curious, are you talking about rifles with a firing schedule akin to something like Battlefield Las Vegas has? Because that's a highly abnormal firing schedule far removed from real world use, and more so from the hobbyist perspective. While I may be an AK fanboy, I won't deny that these rifles aren't impervious to all things like their reputation suggests.

 

[Club Sandwich]

@Club Sandwich , just curious, are you talking about rifles with a firing schedule akin to something like Battlefield Las Vegas has? Because that's a highly abnormal firing schedule far removed from real world use, and more so from the hobbyist perspective. While I may be an AK fanboy, I won't deny that these rifles aren't impervious to all things like their reputation suggests.

i specifically mentioned that they are theatrical rifles or for range rentals that i've sold and sometimes see again for refurbishment. pins and rivets can mushroom or deform over time, some odd calibers may have an installed bullet guide that may need re-riveting. carrier tails peen, the piston roll pin can loosen and drag, receivers crack, trunions crack or deform, et c.

the AKM is not a 100,000 round rifle. it has a maintenance schedule and over time parts will deform and/or break and need replacement. it is unlikely that a sports shooter would reach these sorts of round counts since few people shoot their gun enough to get there for decades.

 

[S.C.U.D.]

I would have thought 80k might be a sort of reasonable figure for an ak part failure

80k is when receivers start to fail, other parts can fail before that but no part should be failing at the round count of that PSA AK. There's an ARfcom thread that talks about AK failure round counts from REAL AKs. There was also a similar but more in-depth thread I read on AKfiles a long time ago but I can't find it right now.

 

[XM193]

From even a cursory glance the internet is flooded with people bemoaning their exceptionally slow and spotty customer service.

Really any weapon should not have a parts failure anywhere near the 5 digit range. I'll fucking spend the extra money to get proper ak parts where it isn't a constant gamble on whether or not i lose fingers and my eyesight on that range day due to shoddy QA and my family can keep shooting the rifle for the next 100 years.

PSA seems like a company that always coasted by on being the cheaper entry-level firearm manufacturer that makes its money from people who don't know any better about model/weapon specific information. The covid and riot sales have only made it easier for them to make more money as the market pool has expanded so much.

Didn't that commie in texas that got clapped by the army furry last year have a PSA or am I mistaken on that?

Garrett Foster - confirmed PSA AK variant.

I guess PSA appeals to beta-males looking to impress their paraplegic partners.

 

[White Devil]

Shitty US made AK, check.
Plastic gun with gamer cuts in the slide, check.

 

[Krinkler1984]

Shitty US made AK, check.
Plastic gun with gamer cuts in the slide, check.

Fucked around and found out, check and check

 

[Cold Root Beer]

New update from Serbu on the RN-50 Saga. He says that the 85k was a ballpark, but based on the computations it would have actually had to have been over 161.5k PSI to shear the threads.

 

[UVB-76]

New update from Serbu on the RN-50 Saga. He says that the 85k was a ballpark, but based on the computations it would have actually had to have been over 161.5k PSI to shear the threads.

Already posted above.
Someone on /k/ used load development software and even a full load of pistol powder would only reach 143k PSI.

Of course, we can't validate the Ukrainian guy's calculations but it would seem the other failure mode where gas leaks into the cap is more likely because then it only takes 36k PSI to shear the threads.

 

[HumptiDouji]

gamer cuts in the slide

That perfectly describes those awful riced out pistols you see these days, it's exactly like horrible Gamer™ mice and peripherals, where there's sharp angles, lights, and 'speedholes' inexplicably placed all over them, because a 13 year old will think that it's really cool.

Already posted above.
Someone on /k/ used load development software and even a full load of pistol powder would only reach 143k PSI.
View attachment 2164296
Of course, we can't validate the Ukrainian guy's calculations but it would seem the other failure mode where gas leaks into the cap is more likely because then it only takes 36k PSI to shear the threads.

Cool software. Assuming it was some insane load with a case full of pistol powder, the case itself would have to fail at such a ridiculous pressure such as this, right? Thus gas would come out and into the threading, right?

 

[UVB-76]

Cool software. Assuming it was some insane load with a case full of pistol powder, the case itself would have to fail at such a ridiculous pressure such as this, right? Thus gas would come out and into the threading, right?

Yeah even that SIG Fury case with the steel case head is only meant for 80k PSI. Brass definitely fails at that point.

 

[HelpingNoone]

I would have bet on ammo being the cause from the beginning.

Mark points out there are no cuts in the sabot. It just seems like a lot of effort to counter-fit a round. I just can't imagine some Fudd doing that in his garage. Someone would go through the trouble of building a mold, color-matching the resin, but then saying fuck it and loading it with pistol powder. I am seeing a lot of pictures of similar looking ammo.

And if they just replaced bad power and reloaded; why even do that if you're gonna sell it? Just sell the round with degraded powder?
If it counter-fit. Theres a lot more out there from a google image search...

I'm sure Mark uses raw stock thats traceable, but it still might be worth doing an analysis on the steel. In last few years there has been a huge issue with counter-fit supplies of steel and aluminum coming from China. Pretty easy to fake a certification, especially when a lot of those companies are in bed with the CCP government. Pass some steel through a few sources and the record becomes cloudy, especially for a boutique firearm shop.

It's fun hypothesizing but a lab could test this all pretty quickly.

 

[HumptiDouji]

A lot of effort, sure, but I'll remind you that SLAPs go for like $100/rd, so if you do just a few dozen counterfeits, that's a lot of money.

 

[S.C.U.D.]

I'm sure Mark uses raw stock thats traceable, but it still might be worth doing an analysis on the steel. In last few years there has been a huge issue with counter-fit supplies of steel and aluminum coming from China. Pretty easy to fake a certification, especially when a lot of those companies are in bed with the CCP government. Pass some steel through a few sources and the record becomes cloudy, especially for a boutique firearm shop.

It's fun hypothesizing but a lab could test this all pretty quickly.

I've read some horror stories about Chinese steel, I read a post on /pol/ years ago from a guy who worked with companies that bought steel in bulk and his one piece of advice was to never ever buy from China.